Match-Up Chart (Outdated); please refer to the new chart.

[P. O. F.]

I really don't know much about the Samus VS Fox match up generally....because I dont play either of those characters.

But speaking from an outsiders point of view and from speculation I can see an argument for Samus beating Fox. Definitely.

 

[ChivalRuse]

i dunno, from what we've heard from the actual DK mains who play samus on a somewhat regular basis, the matchup is most likely dk > samus. iirc chivalruse you don't play either character.

i'm not knocking your opinion, but you did ask for opinions of good dk mains and we kind of have them now. yet you still disagree. are you waiting for a comprehensive post from mexican himself?

I play DK mostly for fun, so my opinion's probably worthless. Rather than have DKs and Samuses tell us that the match-up is so-and-so, I kind of like to hear reasons, you know?

 

[SleepyK]

right, but mexican and njz' posts detail why they think the matchup is in dk's favor.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Yeah. I mean, I guess if they say so, it's so. Lol.

Man, now I'm gonna be, like, searching DK vs Samus on youtube all night.

 

[SleepyK]

i understand if you want them to go more in depth about their reasons, but since they've tested said reasons in tournaments against good samuses with dk, i would think that their reasons are solid.

 

[ChivalRuse]

they've tested said reasons in tournaments against good samuses with dk.

Hence my remark about 'Fro's Samus. But, yea, I see the point.

I mean, when DK has this, how can the match-up not be in his favor?

 

[SleepyK]

i think i should put that song on dk64 now.

 

[TheLifeRuiner]

his bair is pretty ********

 

[HugS™]

I've already made posts defending the more controversial match ups (Fox/Falco vs Samus) Which I feel are:
Samus > Falco
Samus = Fox

My other opinions are as follows:

Marth >> Samus
Sheik > Samus
Peach = Samus
Falcon = Samus
Jiggly > Samus
Samus > IC
Samus > Doc
Samus > Luigi
Samus < Link
Samus < DK
Samus < Ganon
Samus > Pikachu
Samus > Mario

I will only do a big write up on Falcon/Peach if it is considered too much of an odd opinion and someone tries to tell me otherwise. In other words, i need someone to say why falcon/peach ***** Samus so that I may correct them from my perspective.

I will not comment on other matches because the consensus is as I put it, or I do not know enough about the match up to say why I feel this way.

I could touch on Sheik Marth too I guess. Let me know.

 

[NJzFinest]

What do Samus players think about Samus vs YLink?

Samus < DK

Yay

 

[PEEF!]

I think that Falco<Samus is too controversial to just be assumed.

While I think Hugs has one of the upmost opinions on the MU, I think there needs to be more writeup on that. I didn't like the direct comparison of recovery to recovery and edgeguard to edgeguard. Recovery and edgeguard are both far less important for Falco than Samus.

 

[P. O. F.]

Samus beating Falco? I could see that too.

This threads cool.

 

[Megachuk]

I've already made posts defending the more controversial match ups (Fox/Falco vs Samus) Which I feel are:
Samus > Falco Totally disagree, just cuz ur good at the match that doesn't make it in samus' favor. And besides that, while i love you to death. YOU can't beat the best falco's in tournament. Perhaps a lucky W here and there but on average I don't think you could win. Many falco's that get beat by samus, simply don't know how to play against samus.

Samus = Fox technical **** in your face fox. samus = fox : Gay campy smart fox. Fox > Samus

My other opinions are as follows:

Marth >> Samus
Sheik > Samus
Peach = Samus close call, i'd give a slight advantage to peach, but for the most part = would be correct
Falcon = Samus Falcon > samus. Infact, thats a terrible matchup for samus. Falcon has teh knee and it kills samus quite early. Every aerial captain has goes through missiles. Captain's speed, power, and nipples are just too much for samus. It's winable, but not even
Jiggly > Samus
Samus > IC Samus >> IC
Samus > Doc
Samus > Luigi
Samus < Link
Samus < DK
Samus < Ganon
Samus > Pikachu eh, id say about equal actually
Samus > Mario

I will only do a big write up on Falcon/Peach if it is considered too much of an odd opinion and someone tries to tell me otherwise. In other words, i need someone to say why falcon/peach ***** Samus so that I may correct them from my perspective.

I will not comment on other matches because the consensus is as I put it, or I do not know enough about the match up to say why I feel this way.

I could touch on Sheik Marth too I guess. Let me know.

My post is within the quote ^^

 

[PEEF!]

Samus isnt >> than ICs anymore. Its really not that bad. Watch Fly vs HugS

As far as Falco<Samus, I agree that it should be =, but for the sake of facts, HugS has beaten Zhu a majority of their recent times playing, including the latest which was a pretty brutal beatdown.

 

[NJzFinest]

I agree.

Techy aggressive Fox = Samus.

Gay Fox > Samus.

Well... gay Fox > Super Smash Bros Melee.

 

[Shiri]

Although I generally disagree, with Mind Trick on many facets of this matchup...

...in his defense, Yoshi's DJC aerials allow him to stiffly change momentum not only at the time of the jump cancel, but also on the way down (specifically for most of the beginning of his fall, which is why you want to fastfall DJCs), so he can still approach and back off at the last second if Samus is employing wavedashing back.

Yoshi actually doesn't get beat by wavedashing back in this matchup, it's mostly wavedashing forward with the added danger of Samus' good CC and the fact that she can jab and tilt while sliding her magnetic @$$ across the floor. I have seen only two other American Yoshis do what they should do regarding Samus CC along with myself and after 60%, you can begin to lift her off the floor or at least force her to tech in place.

I give credit where it's due; most American Yoshis do not play this matchup correctly and more of the European ones do. I find that where the American Yoshis excel, though, is capitalizing on bad situations Yoshi can put Samus in (even though the general American playstyle puts her in those situations less often). Samus offstage has a very difficult time recovering and her platform game is also not good when Yoshi is in close proximity, in my experience.

Still a very very very bad matchup overall, but I think some of the non-Yoshis are citing some of the wrong reasons, although probably not maliciously so.

 

[Megachuk]

Samus isnt >> than ICs anymore. Its really not that bad. Watch Fly vs HugS

As far as Falco<Samus, I agree that it should be =, but for the sake of facts, HugS has beaten Zhu a majority of their recent times playing, including the latest which was a pretty brutal beatdown.

I can accept samus > ICs. I just really have fun in that matchup

i still dont see falco < or = samus. hugs is good at the matchup, that is all. you cant base falco < samus off two players. a gay falco will beat samus any day of the week. All zoo needs to do is learn the matchup/play gayer.

 

[Merkuri]

@Megachuck: By best Falco you mean Mango? Seriously? The difference skill between Mango and Hugs is astronomically, you can't cite their matches as proof of anything unless Hugs won those matches. And Hugs seems to have relatively easy time with other Falcos, have you seen his recent match with Zhu? Zhu is a better player than Hugs is and yet Hugs ***** him pretty badly.

 

[Megachuk]

everyone has there own opinions i guess. I just think that overall falco > samus.

perhaps...

falco > samus
hugs >> falco??

(come on falco's play gayer against samus, prove me right ****it!)

 

[Merkuri]

Well I remember reading that Hugs agrees that at the mid level Falco > Samus and at the top level Samus > Falco, that's probably why you feel as if it is in Samus' favor.

 

[Geist]

What do Samus players think about Samus vs YLink?

Yay

I find this matchup much easier than vs Link, but I'm not too experienced with it overall.
I'd say Samus > Ylink, open to change.

His recovery isn't near as good as link's and Samus isn't under constant pressure of getting grabbed and consecutively ***** by combos.
Samus can CC dtilt pretty much anything too.

Well I remember reading that Hugs agrees that at the mid level Falco > Samus and at the top level Samus > Falco, that's probably why you feel as if it is in Samus' favor.

I can generally agree with this, but I think Falco's advantage in mid level is very close to = if it is considered to be in falco's favor. General knowledge of the matchup can still go a long way in mid level matches.
Either way, I would be fine with Samus = Falco in the overall MU

 

[ChivalRuse]

Hugo's rundown proposes a significant number of changes be made to this chart, all of which I agree with (DK > Samus was the only one I had doubts about, but I think now I'm willing to accept it):

Samus << Sheik to Samus < Sheik.
Samus = Falco to Samus > Falco.
Samus < Marth to Samus << Marth.
Samus << Jigglypuff to Samus < Jigglypuff (which I strongly support).
Samus < Falcon to Samus = Falcon.
Samus = Doc to Samus > Doc.
Samus = Mario to Samus > Mario.
Samus > DK to Samus < DK.
Samus = Pikachu to Samus > Pikachu (which I am all for).

I'm strongly in favor of making these changes.

 

[otg]

I personally disagree with Falco < Samus, Doc < Samus, and Samus = Falcon.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Samus > Falco is by far the most iffy for me. I actually really want to hear a HugS writeup on that match.

Samus = Falcon isn't to controversial imo, especially since Falcon can't really combo from a grab. I feel it's 55-45 Falcon.

Also, otg, how do you fare against DJN/Alukard's Samuses, since you're representative of higher level Doc play?

 

[giuocob]

I'll definitely agree with Samus > Luigi.

 

[otg]

Samus > Falco is by far the most iffy for me. I actually really want to hear a HugS writeup on that match.

Samus = Falcon isn't to controversial imo, especially since Falcon can't really combo from a grab. I feel it's 55-45 Falcon.

Also, otg, how do you fare against DJN/Alukard's Samuses, since you're representative of higher level Doc play?

The only experience I have playing Alu's Samus is in teams, so I can't comment on that. As for DJN, all of our matches go down to the wire for the most part, but he probably wins more at the end of the day. We haven't played singles in a few weeks tho, I'll try and get more matches on him next time.

The big reason why I stand by Doc = Samus, is I'm 99% sure Hugs is a better play then waffles, yet waffles has beaten him in tourney the last few times they've played.

 

[MEXICAN]

Ok, on the DK vs samus matchup, Samus is another character that has some trouble getting passed dk's b airs. Its not as much of a problem now as it used to be because samus players have ways around it now. Wall of pain still works though, samus is tall enough to get hit by dk's up b on the ground, DK's b air will outprioritize just about all of samus's moves. This matchup is a lot about spacing and patience. DK has to try to lure samus into the air so he can punish her with b airs, and samus has to try to lure dk into committing to a move so she can wd back and do whatever move she feels like doing. Giant punch ***** as always...neither of them can combo very well but thats usually the case in most samus matchups. As much as it may surprise some of you, in this matchup, DK usually outlives Samus because of DK's weight and great horizontal recovery and if the DK player knows how to ledge tech consistently, samus is going to have a tough time edgeguarding him.

I've played some of the best samus players (Hugs, IHSB, and DARKMIKE), so i know the matchup pretty well, especially since DM is in my crew.

 

[BunBun]

DK is fat.

 

[Merkuri]

The big reason why I stand by Doc = Samus, is I'm 99% sure Hugs is a better play then waffles, yet waffles has beaten him in tourney the last few times they've played.

Sorry but I think you're mistaken here. If I remember correctly Waffles has never taken a set from Hugs in tournament, the last time they played was at CGC XVI where Hugs beat him in a semi-close set.

I also agree with Samus = Hugs, I just wanted point out HMW has not been beating Hugs.

 

[otg]

Sorry but I think you're mistaken here. If I remember correctly Waffles has never taken a set from Hugs in tournament, the last time they played was at CGC XVI where Hugs beat him in a semi-close set.

I also agree with Samus = Hugs, I just wanted point out HMW has not been beating Hugs.

I'm pretty sure Waffles beat him the last time they played, there are youtube vids of it and all.

 

[Mind Trick]

I guess if Shiri sticks to terrible terrible matchup (>>>), the middle way (>>) is acceptable
people havent seen a Yoshi camper yet though xD

 

[Merkuri]

I'm pretty sure Waffles beat him the last time they played, there are youtube vids of it and all.

YOU ARE WRONG!! Here are the matches from there most recent set. Hugs won.

Match 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6J6WREXZdKk&feature=related
Match 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTLoW-7oGY0&feature=related
Match 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G03JwDTVvdY

 

[ChivalRuse]

Moreover, HMW has arguably the best Doc vs Samus game right now, due to all his practice vs Darrell ...

 

[otg]

OMG, I was wrong? DEAR GOD, I have to go blow my brains out promptly. Good **** merkuri, without your amazing insight and skills, we would never know the truth. I feel so enlightened.

 

[FoxLisk]

OMG, I was wrong? DEAR GOD, I have to go blow my brains out promptly. Good **** merkuri, without your amazing insight and skills, we would never know the truth. I feel so enlightened.

pushing for how you think something is true over and over again and then getting sarcastic and uppity when someone proves you wrong very clearly doesn't earn you points with anyone. he wouldnt have had to make a big deal out of it if you had accepted you were wrong the first time.

 

[Merkuri]

pushing for how you think something is true over and over again and then getting sarcastic and uppity when someone proves you wrong very clearly doesn't earn you points with anyone. he wouldnt have had to make a big deal out of it if you had accepted you were wrong the first time.

Quoted for truth!!

 

[Divinokage]

pushing for how you think something is true over and over again and then getting sarcastic and uppity when someone proves you wrong very clearly doesn't earn you points with anyone. he wouldnt have had to make a big deal out of it if you had accepted you were wrong the first time.

I disagree, some of you take it too seriously.

 

[giuocob]

I disagree, some of you take it too seriously.

If you make a huge deal out of being right and you turn out to be wrong, you're going to look like an ***. No way around that.

 

[MEXICAN]

I just barely looked at the chart for the first time, and yeah...i gotta disagree with some of the dk matchups. Vs sheik, falco, peach, mewtwo, jiggs, luigi and possibly a few others, i have to disagree. Sheik and falco are >>> against dk for sure...try playing one of those characters with dk...its just stupid. lol. Vs luigi at THE VERY LEAST should be dk>luigi, its definitely not even. Jiggs isn't as bad as most people think, i barely lost to hungrybox at genesis. The set was 2/1 and all matches went to the last life. And vs mewtwo, this is based completely off of me losing to taj, but being that he's the best mewtwo player out there by far, and i may not be THE best dk player, but i'm definitely up there, i'd say its a pretty good reference for as far as metagame goes....lol, i was able to beat taj's marth but not his mewtwo...lol

 

[ChivalRuse]

Are you saying DK = Mewtwo or DK > Mewtwo? Because Mewtwo doesn't have the advantage, by any stretch of the imagination.