Marth Q&A-Ask your questions here!!

[IrArby]

Aesir, your sig is win-n-a-bottle, I loled heartily.

 

[halcyon.days]

So... Marth dittos... I am HORRIBLE at them.

One thing that I have the most problem with is...

I'm hanging on the edge, and my opponent is, obviously, on the stage. He's too far for an edgehop nair/fair/etc. but if I try to wavedash or something of the sort I get fsmashed/grabbed...

Wtf do I do? Edgehop and just airdodge sideways?

 

[Sybawave]

You can still get on the edge regularly lol this is sometimes risky but depending on who it is you are playing it is good...just press R and roll on or just tap toward the stage to get on normally...Don't jump...worst idea ever lol but yeah the other good idea is too LedgeHop AirDodge or this one...LedgeHop Counter XD this works...sometimes <_< this is a REALLY risky move though...you'll get away with it a few times but hopefully enough to scare him from attacking again...

Ok do this in a Marth ditto. 0% Fthrow > Uthrow > Utilt > ****

This combination actually works pretty well...Fthrow > Fthrow > Fthrow and end it there...

Then next life since they will DI away to avoid that then just Fthrow > Fthrow > Fsmash and it shall be a tipper....there are many ways to punish with Fthrow lol

O yeah, Marth is bad against DK on Green Greens...unless they really suck lol if that DK knows what to do then you are screwed

 

[Heart Break Kid]

You can DI forward throw pretty easily. I prefer up throw and if they jump out you can try and chase. If they fthrow you in a ditto just DI down and away and you can regrab them. Like a 45 degree angle on your joystick. When they throw at low percents.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

mm i like...fthrow fthrow nair --> keep going

 

[elvenarrow3000]

If they're spaced out, you can ledgehop waveland back to bait out something and then ledgehop nair/fair.

You should be able to ledgedash while fully invincible though, unless Cactuar is wrong about that.

 

[halcyon.days]

I don't use this that much but I want to incorporate it more into my game.

Let's say my opponent is shielding. I fair their shield, then dash through them and pivot grab. How does spacing play into this? I'm assuming I can't hit them with the tip, otherwise they'll see the fact that I'm going got try to run through them. But if I go too close won't I just get shield grabbed from when I fair?

I'm also assuming this will only work with a really late fair (ie. right before I land from a short hop)?

 

[KosukeKGA]

...Why would you F-air their shield in the first place? --- Sybawave, do tell your DK on Marth tidbit on Green Greens, please.

 

[I.B]

If they fthrow you in a ditto just DI down and away and you can regrab them. Like a 45 degree angle on your joystick. When they throw at low percents.

iirc, M2K says you can't grab before they can regrab you, but it's definitely escapable.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

Thats probably true, I think its because the person who throws doesnt Dash far enough to regrab. When I see Cactuar play M2k he just fthrows then DD away then regrab so m2k grabs nothing. Nothing ever wrks on M2k in marth dittoes anyway.

Also you guys are wack for not coming to BWNY.

 

[halcyon.days]

...Why would you F-air their shield in the first place? --- Sybawave, do tell your DK on Marth tidbit on Green Greens, please.

Well let's say you're approaching with fair, but you mis-space and hit their shield. There, happy?

 

[KosukeKGA]

Work on your spacing, then. That's how it "plays into this".

That is more important than something situational and risky.
---
Any competent player can shieldgrab you from a poorly spaced F-Air.

 

[I.B]

Thats probably true, I think its because the person who throws doesnt Dash far enough to regrab. When I see Cactuar play M2k he just fthrows then DD away then regrab so m2k grabs nothing. Nothing ever wrks on M2k in marth dittoes anyway.

Also you guys are wack for not coming to BWNY.

I don't wanna be wack.

At least Raynex has a chance of going still.

 

[Sybawave]

If they are shielding then just get up regularly...remember you can also land perfectly onto the stage and do and standing attack that way. But work on your spacing since that shouldn't happen <_< you can just do an empty LedgeHop onto the stage too

Green Greens...I was playing MouffromdaSouf (if anyone has heard of him) and he CPs that place vs Marth

It has a low ceiling for early Grab to Uair kills.

And since it is so small Marth has trouble spacing against a big target like DK. And DK is sturdy so early tippers and things won't kill him too easy

If Marth is on either of the 2 smaller land masses then DK can just either Grab him, jump off the side and throw him into the blastzone or he can shield whatever you are trying to hit him with and then just JC UpB which is considerably strong.

And I'm not sure about this one but he either threw me into a bomb or he touched it and we both died but he said he tries to do it but always messes up so I am guessing you can have that happen to you too

 

[RaynEX]

I don't wanna be wack.

At least Raynex has a chance of going still.

I'm 100% confirmed to go now.

HBK I thought your ride failed or something?

 

[elvenarrow3000]

So uh. What's the hitbox on the reverse Dolphin Slash?

 

[Dark Sonic]

In front of Marth and a little bit behind him (not much at all). The "sweetspot" is just hitting with the opening frames of the attack (before Marth leaves the ground) and has a decent amount of knockback. The direction they are sent depends on how far in front of you they were when you hit them (it sends them more horizontally when you hit closer to the tip).

 

[KyloWinter]

Critique my marth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HBzz9DppQM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp3bASgyUfw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZBW2KW9e4Q

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Match three.

Don't randomly fsmash. Especially at low percents. Even if you hit, you don't get anything out of it, and if you miss you can get comboed pretty badly.

I would advise swapping out nairs for fairs, as they're harder for Falcon to break through. Just sayin'.

Dash attacks? I dunno, in general, I would try to use smaller swipes to break through Falcon's guard instead of going immediately into a big attack. Also, you might consider replacing some of the jabs with Dancing Blades. Your choice, do as you see fit. It just seems like at the moment you're not getting anything at all out of your jabs.

Don't panic and try to even the percent quickly. Also, play closer to the edge where Falcon doesn't have so much mobility.

You need to edgeguard way more aggressively. Run off with fairs and bairs which can lead into dairs, and dtilt aggressively to choke off avenues of recovery.

EDIT: Dark Sonic, thanks for the help, but I was really looking for a pic =P

 

[JonaDiaper]

Critique my marth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HBzz9DppQM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp3bASgyUfw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZBW2KW9e4Q

that falcon was toooo sexy, you didnt deserve the second match, but he was soo sexy that he had to kill himself.
but you did pretty well against him, he looks like hes a beast but you were able to hang. good stuff.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

good critique yo

 

[JonaDiaper]

yea im sorry, but that smeesh dude is realllyy good

 

[JBM falcon08]

Jona = too good.

Yeah, Ian you need to work on your spacing. also on large levels like fd you need to kinda camp him out with dash dancing, retreating nairs(preferably) or fairs work as well.

You missed sooo many edgeguarding opputunities, missing those oppurtunities makes it look as if you weren't in control at all of the match which you were alot, but you just missed those edgeguards.

Also when your grabbing and your near the ledge, ALWAYS d-throw, don't try to go for combos, go for the gimp, marth's edgeguarding since m2k has improved marth's metagame is ridiculous, take advantage of your oppurtunities better.

Don't move around so much with marth, when you do that you become way vulnerable as marth has alot of openings when he isn't well spaced out and playing defense until he gains control.

Overall you have improved, Good stuff.

Smeesh is a beast, that dude just SDs too much.

 

[KosukeKGA]

Ian...Stop N-Airing so much.

It's so predictable. It's like your only approach or w/e...Mix it up.

 

[Nyaaa]

Ian sucks.

 

[KosukeKGA]

...

He just needs to refine his technique more and he'll be another decent Marth player.

 

[Clone Z]

Marth Dittos

Need help on a grab game. Everytime I go uthrow, he just DIs up and I don't get a chance to hit him. Do I have to be gay and techchase after a dthrow?

Also, I just need some general pointers (again), mainly a shield-pressure game.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Uthrow depends on percentage. I generally uthrow on non-fastfallers at forty or lower, because past that it becomes difficult to get additional hits on them. Techchases are always an option.

General pointers... I dunno, space yourself out and dashdance. Use the fair to beat out nairs...

Why would you shield pressure instead of grabbing?

 

[JonaDiaper]

cuz breaking shields is hilarious

 

[KosukeKGA]

Marth Dittos

Need help on a grab game. Everytime I go uthrow, he just DIs up and I don't get a chance to hit him. Do I have to be gay and techchase after a dthrow?

Also, I just need some general pointers (again), mainly a shield-pressure game.

In a Marth ditto, whenever you U-Throw, expect a jump to escape. Punish and hit them afterward.

Marth does not need to shield pressure since his character revolves around grabs. If you want to do something like that, play Sheik or Peach.

 

[ArcNatural]

Marth does not need to shield pressure since his character revolves around grabs. If you want to do something like that, play Sheik or Peach.

What? Please explain this statement. How does Marth NOT have a good shield pressure when the underlying fact about Marth is if you space correctly you can't be shield grabbed. I don't know about you but this leads to a lot of shield pressure situations.

I'm pretty sure that our definitions for shield pressure are different and your thinking in terms of Falco or Fox pillaring. But I do think you need to clarify your statement. What do you define shield pressure to be?

 

[Clone Z]

Thing is it's a Marth Ditto, that means you're up against someone with good spacing. Idk about you, most of the time, I can't get close enough to grab the guy. I guess that's what I mean.

btw, does anything beat fair or is it that good?

 

[KyloWinter]

In a marth ditto, if you don't tip your attacks you will get hit with a Fair, its that simple. Also, Bair will always result in you getting hit with a Fair. Also, don't throw Fsmash randomly. Try and keep him above you and don't get outspaced.

 

[Teczer0]

Fair beats fair.....

Don't let your opponent approach you with fairs... just CC grab or shieldgrab if you can (Watch out for low fairs because you can't shieldgrab those).

If you upthrow throw out an uptilt. If it hits great just keep swiping the marth.

If it misses that means the marth had to double jump out of it. Use that fact to your advantage and chase him down...... like a marth...

 

[KosukeKGA]

My definition of shield pressure is draining the shield enough so that you can poke at their feet or head or something. Otherwise, you force them to either run away or to take the hit whilst they're holding their shield up.

Yeah, we have different definitions.
---
Just look at Pink Shinobi. That kind of shield pressure.

 

[IrArby]

Thats more like shield stabbing IMO. By "run away" do you mean roll? I would define shield pressure more along the lines of forcing them to choose between a more limited set of what are usually more punishable options than if they were standing, DD, etc.

 

[KosukeKGA]

By running away, rolling or jumping out of shield, yes, you limit their options. That's what I mean.

It's like a Falco shining and D-Airing you're shield and, for instance, a Marth must weave around him by rolling, WD'ing OoS, etc.

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Or you could just grab him.

Speaking of which, how much shieldstun does being in lightshield add?

 

[IrArby]

Wait, lightshielding adds shieldstun? Son of a *****!

@elvenarrow3000. Assume your facing a Falco and he dairs your shield (and you neglect to Shield DI away) he then L-cancels, shines, and JCs the shine to a grab. Is it possible for you (Marth) to shieldgrab him after the shine but before the Falco can grab you (shieldstun taken into account) or do you just have to hope that you've DI'ed far enough away to be outside of his grab range?

I would ask in the Falco forums but someone tried to tell me that JCGrab out of a Shine wasn't a good tactic so . . .

 

[ArcNatural]

By running away, rolling or jumping out of shield, yes, you limit their options. That's what I mean.

It's like a Falco shining and D-Airing you're shield and, for instance, a Marth must weave around him by rolling, WD'ing OoS, etc.

In this regard, Marth has a really good shield pressure game. He doesn't really have a lot of shield stab options besides maybe Dtilt. But his spacing definitely can force bad decisions from opponents that get caught in shield. Especially near the edge.