Links to the Past - A P:M Link video & discussion thread

BigHairyFart · Feb 10, 2014

Anaky said:
Hi how do I play against Fox

1.) Get shined.
2.) Die.

Xinc · Feb 11, 2014

I have a quick question. I've heard of Link's bomb wave gliding. Can someone explain how and why it should be used?

BigHairyFart · Feb 11, 2014

Wave gliding? Never heard of it, what is it? You sure you don't mean Aerial Glide Toss?

Player -0 · Feb 11, 2014

I remember someone being glad that the Smash community is glad it's becoming independent with its names...

For example: Some people supported wavedashing being called sliding. One such person was glad that Brawl the brawl AT was called glide tossing and not wavedash throw or something...

It's just ironic.

cmloe · Feb 15, 2014

What are some good stages to play on with link. I personally think lylat cruise is pretty good for him since the platforms are low enough for you to use up-tilts when the opponent is on the platform but i want to hear what you guys think.

NickRiddle · Feb 15, 2014

Every stage is good for Link.
Characters he can combo better you want to take to platform stages.
Characters he can't combo you want to take to open spaces so he can camp.

BigHairyFart · Feb 16, 2014

I hate Lylat Cruise, but I see what you're saying. Personally, my favorite for Link is either Pokemon Stadium or Pokemon Stadium 2. The platforms are at the perfect height to chain aerials and boomerang hits all the way across the stage.

cmloe · Feb 16, 2014

NickRiddle said:
Every stage is good for Link.
Characters he can combo better you want to take to platform stages.
Characters he can't combo you want to take to open spaces so he can camp.

alright, thanks for the help!

cmloe · Feb 16, 2014

BigHairyFart said:
I hate Lylat Cruise, but I see what you're saying. Personally, my favorite for Link is either Pokemon Stadium or Pokemon Stadium 2. The platforms are at the perfect height to chain aerials and boomerang hits all the way across the stage.

Yeah im not to fond of lylat cruise either but i just thought i might be a good stage for him. Thanks for the input man, i have a tourney tomorrow so i was just trying to think of stages that would put it a little in my favor.

BigHairyFart · Feb 16, 2014

No problem. In fact, I just got back from my first ever tourney, so I got to see how Link handles in a real match, not just against the AI. I recommend staying away from Yoshi's Story, I feel that it's too small to properly zone other characters with.

cmloe · Feb 16, 2014

BigHairyFart said:
No problem. In fact, I just got back from my first ever tourney, so I got to see how Link handles in a real match, not just against the AI. I recommend staying away from Yoshi's Story, I feel that it's too small to properly zone other characters with.

Alright thanks for the tip man! I also feel that fountain of dreams isnt a good stage for link but that might be just me. I feel like its alot easier for link to die there since the blast zones are smaller.

NickRiddle · Feb 16, 2014

BigHairyFart said:
No problem. In fact, I just got back from my first ever tourney, so I got to see how Link handles in a real match, not just against the AI. I recommend staying away from Yoshi's Story, I feel that it's too small to properly zone other characters with.

But Yoshi's is amazing.

BigHairyFart · Feb 16, 2014

cmloe said:
Alright thanks for the tip man! I also feel that fountain of dreams isnt a good stage for link but that might be just me. I feel like its alot easier for link to die there since the blast zones are smaller.

I don't like FoD for any of my characters because the platforms always seem to be in the worst possible place at the worst possible time.

Apollo Ali · Feb 16, 2014

Alright, I got some videos that I can share.

Apex 2014 Apollo Ali vs. ShadyPenguinn (pools, on stream!) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jm_nnt6udE
Apex Friendlies vs Zhime and Blink (im messing around a lot in this match) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJFahj34wNA
Mass Madness vs Darc (2.6b, I switch to Lucas second match) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baGM6757x60

In the Zhime, Darc and Blink matches, I have little to no matchup experience vs Blink, Zelda, ZSS. I included the Darc one because I have no idea how to deal with ZSS at all, even though its from 2.6

BigHairyFart · Feb 16, 2014

The tournament I just went to was said to be recorded, but I haven't seen any of them yet. I think I heard someone say that Strong Bad was doing the recording/streaming, but it's not showing up on his Youtube or Twitch channel.

Fortress · Feb 16, 2014

Just a random friendly match from the other day that got recorded. Made some pretty dumb slipups, and missed some good KO opportunities, but, eh.

Problem2 · Feb 17, 2014

My advice for stages is that you want the largest stage possible that Link can still control space from almost any corner of the stage. (ie, if I'm on the left side of the stage, I can still reasonably control everything on the right side of the stage with my projectiles)

I think there is a point where stages are too big and Link loses his ability to corner his opponent. Stages like Dream Land, Skyworld, and Dracula's Castle are stages that can grant the opponent too much room to escape your projectiles. (In particular, really high platforms make a good escape for people playing against Link). On the other hand, depending on the match-up, you still don't want to go to really small stages, but I don't think small stages are as big of a problem as stages that are too large.

Link is a mid-range fighter who wants a mid-sized stage to perform well.

Deleted member · Feb 20, 2014

cmloe said:
What are some good stages to play on with link. I personally think lylat cruise is pretty good for him since the platforms are low enough for you to use up-tilts when the opponent is on the platform but i want to hear what you guys think.

like what NickRiddle said, Link is good on all of the stages, but it's all based on match ups. an example is battle field, it's a good stage for you, unless you're playing somebody like meta knight.

Apollo Ali said:
Alright, I got some videos that I can share.

Apex 2014 Apollo Ali vs. ShadyPenguinn (pools, on stream!) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jm_nnt6udE
Apex Friendlies vs Zhime and Blink (im messing around a lot in this match) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJFahj34wNA
Mass Madness vs Darc (2.6b, I switch to Lucas second match) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baGM6757x60

In the Zhime, Darc and Blink matches, I have little to no matchup experience vs Blink, Zelda, ZSS. I included the Darc one because I have no idea how to deal with ZSS at all, even though its from 2.6

nice matches

Fortress · Feb 23, 2014

Here's a game of mine from a couple of nights ago.

Player -0 · Feb 23, 2014

Fortress said:
Here's a game of mine from a couple of nights ago.

Your movement seems very choppy, for a few seconds you'll start doing things like you're nervous/excited then you'll pause a couple moments between follow ups. After each of his various F-Smashes you can probably WD OoS and Dash attack punish, you seem to only retreat or go for a grab.

Fortress · Feb 23, 2014

Yeah, I'm pretty sluggish with Link. OoS up-B is ***** and I can never do it correctly for whatever reason.

I feel like this one went a lot better for me in terms of how quickly I was moving (skip about halfway through for the second game).

HarryTheChin · Feb 24, 2014

Chiforce of Links (ya know, since we're from Chicago. CHI-CITY HYPE!!!

Lazarond · Feb 24, 2014

im Lazarond!!! and yes i kno i suck.... :/

Fortress · Feb 24, 2014

Lazarond said:
im Lazarond!!! and yes i kno i suck.... :/

I don't know, your Link does some things that I don't that I'm going to have to start doing, like, that double dash attack.

ITALIAN N1NJA · Feb 24, 2014

I'm the 1% with no footage. My bad. I'm still pretty new around the community. Plus I don't have a capture card nor do I stream. Not a fan of online either since it seems laggy most of the time. Thanks for the tag though. We're the Hylians of Chicago.

Lazarond · Feb 24, 2014

wut double dash thing??? mario kart!?!?! :0

SoggyEagle · Mar 2, 2014

@

Lazarond What do you suppose can be done about Falco's laser pressure, per this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=quRBj3f42GQ (vs Kels)

SoggyEagle · Mar 2, 2014

Anything I should work on in these match ups?

Player -0 · Mar 2, 2014

SoggyEagle said:
Anything I should work on in these match ups?

Vs. Zelda: I think you should space your moves better and use the full extent of your sword/zair. Zelda doesn't really have anything she can do if you Zair at her from a mid range (I think), she can WD OoS and then go for a Fair or something but you should be ready for that. Just stay in her face but out of her range. You should only be hitting Zair at the end so you get the second hit.

When she teleports you can sometimes see where she'll teleport depending on how the camera moves. If the camera zooms out then see which way it allows you to see and then chase if the camera zooms in then I would suggest staying in shield and if she wavedashes from the teleport then retreating Nair/Bair OoS. For the Din's just Jab them, it's faster than boomerang.

Vs. Samus: I'm not sure about this. If the Samus is recovering with Zair then you can do a slow fall Nair to knock her off and then DJ Nair them away or for a stagespike. Be careful about this though. If the Samus is hanging from down low with Zair don't forget that they can cancel their Zair into an Up-B too, if they do this be ready to tech this or you might be able to Nair/Dair them out of this.

Overall: You seem to approach with a run -> SH -> Boomerang so you end up on top of them. I wouldn't advise this because I think OoS game can destroy this. Work on your AGT's, you screwed up a couple times with this. You back off sometimes and go for uncharged/partially charged arrows sometimes, I think staying somewhat close and pressuring with Zair/Fair if your boomerang is out is the better option but that's a player decision.

ITALIAN N1NJA · Mar 2, 2014

SoggyEagle said:
Anything I should work on in these match ups?

Hey dude. If I had a small tip for you it'd be this. Don't always rely on the boomerang for zoning. Don't randomly throw it around. It's good especially when it comes and hits an opponent from behind or you angle it upwards and start a combo. But if you use it too much it becomes easily predictable. You play a pretty solid link. Just work on your efficiency with your projectiles a bit. Don't be afraid to throw out SH Fairs or Zairs at the proper range. Also try using the AGT for recovery or dodge tethering. It blocks gimping and you could hit down and up b right away out of it to rid of the edge guard as you make your way up.

BigHairyFart · Mar 2, 2014

SoggyEagle said:
Anything I should work on in these match ups?

Hylian Shield too OP. Also, learn to bomb jump/sweetspot the ledge when recovering. The bomb jump alone can take Link's recovery from one of the worst in the game to one of the best. Also, you seem to prioritize neutralizing Zelda's fireballs with your own attacks. While not a bad idea, the first priority should be to reach/hit Zelda, not to disable Din's Fire. Usually, it's faster to just go around it, but if you're against a good Zelda(which this one wasn't), there will likely be a wall of fireballs right where you need to go. In that case, it would be best to just attack through them, but that didn't really happen in your vid.

NickRiddle · Mar 2, 2014

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iLkqTp2RUs

Me vs. my friend Rexx's Fox.
Please help me stop being bad.

Player -0 · Mar 2, 2014

NickRiddle said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iLkqTp2RUs

Me vs. my friend Rexx's Fox.
Please help me stop being bad.

Please tell your brother to stop owning me, I just wanted to make it somewhat far in winners bracket....

I don't even have any videos of me getting wrecked :l...
___________________________
I think Link's Nair might trade with Fox's and if you do a retreating Fair then you might be able to catch the Fox doing a SHFFL Nair approach (You can also retreat and then pivot grab). You can also Jab to stop Fox's Firefox (7:53, you could've pivot grabbed too).

Don't forget that you can Crouch out of a run so you can Run -> Crouch -> F-Smash in either direction using C-Stick (7:45), that way you don't have the skid animation.

On Fox out of dash attack we have Up-Tilt, Up-Smash, Up Air (Higher percents), (Maybe Dair?), Nair and maybe Fair (12:52 was asking for a Fair so badly)

You can Nair Fox out of his Side-B (you can do this with his illusions too) for edgeguards, don't always boomerang.

Don't boomerang so close to the Fox, try to space with Fair and Zair and then mix that up with stuff (like rush in dash attack if they're close).

Personally I would never use arrows unless they're recovering, and even then you need to make sure they can't illusion you for a free way onstage (You did it very nicely at 14:25). Remember sometimes you just need to edgehog, if you have time and don't want to mess up you can jump off the stage backwards (or jump then throw a boomerang backwards) and Zair to the ledge), an example of when you should've done this: (15:37).

I don't think you should Up Tilt on shield, I saw you do it multiple times and I don't think it's safe at all.

When your opponent is on a platform, go for Up-Smashes, Up-Airs, or Up-Tilts and pressure them from below (Like Marth). If you jump through the platform with a Nair there's a good chance it'll get shielded and they get off the platform for free.

Sorry if some of this stuff seems utterly useless

Lazarond · Mar 2, 2014

so falco vs link is bad match up for link... but neutral air outta shield ive been told is they key outta falcos pressure :0

BigHairyFart · Mar 2, 2014

N-Air solves everything for Link.

ITALIAN N1NJA · Mar 2, 2014

Praise the almighty sex kick!

Fenrir VII · Mar 3, 2014

I don't think Falco Link is terrible. Laser pressure is hard, but sh or fh lets you get out a 'rang, to stall the lasers. Otherwise, powershield, hylian shield (sometimes), or just camping out on a platform are good alternatives.

You can combo him as well as he can combo you (or at least close), and Link just poops on Falco's recovery options.

You definitely need to know the matchup, but it's not horrible. (I actually think it's slightly in Link's favor)

Ps, I apparently have some vids coming soon. I'll post when they show up.

Hylian · Mar 3, 2014

Lazarond said:
so falco vs link is bad match up for link... but neutral air outta shield ive been told is they key outta falcos pressure :0

Only if he backs off. Link has a 6 frame jumpsquat and nair takes 4 frames so you are looking at 10-11 frames if you are frame perfect and that is not enough to get out of falco pressure. Link doesn't have a way to deal with fox or falco pressure on his shield unless they back off themselves or mess up tech skill.

Lazarond · Mar 3, 2014

wow hylian.... so wut does he do???? :0 oh and hylian did u hear bout me getting 2nd at the indianapolis tournament?!?! ^.^

Hylian · Mar 3, 2014

Lazarond said:
wow hylian.... so wut does he do???? :0 oh and hylian did u hear bout me getting 2nd at the indianapolis tournament?!?! ^.^

I did not, good stuff!

Also, he does nothing. Link has no options against proper spacies pressure, he can only roll and spotdodge both which get punished. What he has going for him is many character do have options against spacies pressuring their shields so they are trained to back off after a point to bait something. You need to pay attention to the drift and as soon as they pull back jump OOS with a nair or a rang. Most spacies won't just stay on your shield because they aren't technical enough or aren't aware of how slow Link is OOS but the ones who do are the ones you will feel hopeless against :/.

Links to the Past - A P:M Link video & discussion thread

Salty Supreme

Smash Lord

Salty Supreme

Smash Hero

Smash Cadet

#negativeNick

Salty Supreme

Smash Cadet

Smash Cadet

Salty Supreme

Smash Cadet

#negativeNick

Salty Supreme

Smash Journeyman

Salty Supreme

Smash Master

Smash Champion

Deleted member

Guest

Smash Master

Smash Hero

Smash Master

Smash Ace

Smash Apprentice

Smash Master

Smash Ace

Smash Apprentice

Smash Journeyman

Smash Journeyman

Smash Hero

Smash Ace

Salty Supreme

#negativeNick

Smash Hero

Smash Apprentice

Salty Supreme

Smash Ace

Smash Master

Not even death can save you from me

Smash Apprentice

Not even death can save you from me

Information

Network