Kong Kollege: Diddy Kong Tactical Discussion

[Seagull Joe]

I'm making a word document for all available low percent guaranteed combos from side b, uthrow, and dthrow. I'm taking into account Dthrow is fully DI'd down. I'm done the first ten characters. I should be done the others by Friday at latest I think. Depends if I'm busy. Gonna train with Junebug tomorrowz.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

I'm making a word document for all available low percent guaranteed combos from side b, uthrow, and dthrow. I'm taking into account Dthrow is fully DI'd down. I'm done the first ten characters. I should be done the others by Friday at latest I think. Depends if I'm busy. Gonna train with Junebug tomorrowz.

Thanks , I know most of the guarantees off of up throw and side b, but down throw I don't really use much and it seems like you junebug and boss use it frequently. Is there any reason to use down throw over up throw followups at early percent in most matchups? Dthrow seems only good at like 80%-110% into fair

 

[MoosyDoosy]

Some basic combos I can just do without worrying much? I've been mostly using reads and banana setups since everyone I know sucks at teching bananas.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Seagull , hate to ask, but since you have a training partner, can u see if this combo really works on dk and the like or if d.i can break you out of it. Needs one platform(like battlefield or lylat your position is under it.) up throw short hop monkey flip, up tilt, turn around grab. From there I think its possible to break out of a repeat , but can lead to an upb followup at the worst. If it doesn't work sorry to waste your time, if it does, great new way to follow up on the large characters.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Question, I wasn't here for some of the original discussion. What are some of the bread n butters that the character has. Like combos off nair and dair starters. Hoping to find some combos for higher percent kills mainly. I realize that character weight and d.I matter, but hoping to get new ideas out of asking

 

[Soft Serve]

Andddd Done

I want to try to make a vid every week or two, showcasing smaller quirks and MU exploits. hopefully quality of my videos get a bit better over time.

Edit: Whats important to note is that opponents can buffer a roll away from anything that starts with a z-drop on shield first, IF the z-drop is on top of the shield (bounces up) instead of on the side (just keeps falling). If you net a footstool then item and up-b follow ups are guaranteed, but the punishes that stem from that aren't as tripping is tech-able. I would have thrown in some tech chases but I was doing most of it by myself, holding down shield (set to a) on my classic controller with my foot.

@ Seagull Joe hows the spreadsheet coming? I think thats really interesting and I always love knowing options. Maping things out M2k style is pretty effective.

 

[Praxis]

Good vid showing a lot of basic stuff, but I feel I'd be remiss if I didn't point a few things out.

A lot of these don't actually do damage or do very little but net the trip. Keep in mind that dthrowing a namer under someone's shield, for example, trips but does zero damage. None of the opponents in this video actually etched the trips- if they had, the followups would have been guessing games, not guaranteed, in most cases.

Also, in all the footstool videos you can visibly see the opponent's shield come up before your dsmash or grab hits them in most cases...I think jab is the only real guarantee...?

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

True but some followups seem to work, such as footstool to up b, and it appears there is just enough time to get a land and grab from footstool. I agree it would be nice to see a few instances where they tech the footstool for oki options.
Also important to note, While the banana trip chains do not do damage, it does do enough shield damage to get some virtually guaranteed dash attacks, and fighting a diddy without your shield is never fun.
the down throw banana just seems like part of a 3way guessing game. By itself not impressive, but with his side b and z drop nair followups it becomes a legit option that is quick and punishes shield.
The only shield followup not discussed were the banana in hand monkey flip followups. From experience, ( nonslap aka jump off head) glide toss down is the best option cause it leads to smash attacks, early percent chain grabs, or just good positioning. but there are plenty of dirty options that can be done. If your willing to make a hard read or two.

 

[Soft Serve]

Good vid showing a lot of basic stuff, but I feel I'd be remiss if I didn't point a few things out.

A lot of these don't actually do damage or do very little but net the trip. Keep in mind that dthrowing a namer under someone's shield, for example, trips but does zero damage. None of the opponents in this video actually etched the trips- if they had, the followups would have been guessing games, not guaranteed, in most cases.

Also, in all the footstool videos you can visibly see the opponent's shield come up before your dsmash or grab hits them in most cases...I think jab is the only real guarantee...?

The goal of the set ups are to force the opponent out of shield and into a trip in a way that wasn't side-b or running up and grabbing. Most of these eat up side-steps for breakfast so they are especially useful against people who side-step on wake up or try to side-step your tech chase grabs often. There are no guarenteed punishes after a trip but they do put them into a situation that you can tech chase in, which is better than them just rolling away from you imo. AGT down is probably the best option because it lands you right in front of them and following after that is stupid easy.

Of the 2 punishes in the beginning of the clip, yeah the marth could have tech'd the trip and not gotten f-smashed if he knew what was coming. Same with the footstools to smash/grab, succeeding with them depends on the opponent's reaction speed. the Diddy knows what he is going for and the timings, and if he uses them sparingly (because times to use them don't even come up that often) and just puts them on his tool belt you can catch people off guard with the frame traps and set-ups.

The mental game is important too, if you get something like this off every once in a while it gets in the opponent's head that shielding is not safe. The pressure that diddy puts out is a lot harder to deal with if you're consciously trying to not shield as often for fear of getting punished

Footstool>WL jab combo is probably guaranteed on like Jiggs. Upsmash comes out frame 5 while we have a 4 frame jab so its not that much of a difference.

Footstool>up-b is hella guaranteed though. pretty tight timing but its a link.

@ Searing_Sorrow because side-b jump does dmg and is an attack, it is DI able and not as guaranteed as an actual footstool. They don't really do that much shield dmg either if the opponent is okay with just rolling away.

I think I'm going to get some footage of glide tossing to clank a banana with a projectile, then re-AGTing the banana at the opponent next time I play with byrd. I was going to get it on Samus, Ivy, Pika, snake (maybe? not sure how grenades will interact) Mario (iffy, fireball cooldown is short). I'll try Rob's gyro and Shiek needles. Can you clank out Wolf's blaster? any other projectiles I'm missing?

 

[MoosyDoosy]

Lucas and Ness. Btw I hate Ness. His PK Fire is super annoying and it's a guaranteed hit if you're trapped in it. Any tips for him? He isn't really a threat for me, but he's just generally annoying.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

You guys are overcomplicating this.

 

[Seagull Joe]

I feel like I leveled up from playing Junebug in dittos Thursday. He taught me a bunch (Mostly stuff with Dair to extend combos and force the opponent into horrible situations). I taught him about our guaranteed Uair>Uair>Uair combos. I hope I'm ready for SKTAR PM. I entered brawl too, but I haven't played since like Apex lmao. I think I'm gonna get wrecked for lack of playing in brawl.

Edit: Got a new cpu today and am in the process of installing netplay and getting a network adapter. I should be joining netplay by Wednesday .

 

[Soft Serve]

I mean maybe short turn I'm making things more complicated than they need to be. There are other options that cover similar situations. But in a long term view, If PM has a long life spam, micro-situations and understanding all the options available to you that are applicable in those situations and how to gain advantage from each possible moment by playing completely optimally is something thats really important. I don't think I'd ever truly reach that level of play but I want the options documented in the chance that PM does have that long of a life span. Maybe I'm just thinking like a melee player but knowing 100% of your options and how they work exactly is vital.

Stuff like z-droping bananas eating up side-steps is really applicable to general situations, and its something I realized while i was trying to work out these options.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

I feel like I leveled up from playing Junebug in dittos Thursday. He taught me a bunch (Mostly stuff with Dair to extend combos and force the opponent into horrible situations). I taught him about our guaranteed Uair>Uair>Uair combos. I hope I'm ready for SKTAR PM. I entered brawl too, but I haven't played since like Apex lmao. I think I'm gonna get wrecked for lack of playing in brawl.

Edit: Got a new cpu today and am in the process of installing netplay and getting a network adapter. I should be joining netplay by Wednesday .

Good luck in tourney. Diddy dittos are a little weird to me. Ironically one of the characters diddy can't recover well against is diddy. Too easy to hit up b with upb. Shoot even side b beats out upb if they overshoot. Diddy vs diddy equals 2-4min match

 

[Praxis]

Just took a respectable third at our regional yesterday, but I felt like I could have taken second. I could use some critiques. At the very least the last two sets.


Winner's quarters (vs G&W):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=8h26m15s

Winner's semis (vs MK):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=9h6m40s

Winners finals (vs Mewtwo): (I start this on game 3 because I mostly win games 1-2 through his inexperience with the MU)
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=10h0m30s

Losers finals (vs Marth):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=10h32m01s

This is my first time ever fighting a good Melee Marth, so I don't know where to DI a lot of his stuff including throws and it shows. Definitely need some help here.

 

[Hashtag]

I feel like I leveled up from playing Junebug in dittos Thursday. He taught me a bunch (Mostly stuff with Dair to extend combos and force the opponent into horrible situations). I taught him about our guaranteed Uair>Uair>Uair combos. I hope I'm ready for SKTAR PM. I entered brawl too, but I haven't played since like Apex lmao. I think I'm gonna get wrecked for lack of playing in brawl.

Edit: Got a new cpu today and am in the process of installing netplay and getting a network adapter. I should be joining netplay by Wednesday .

Diddy's dairy is like falcons. It's perfect for tech chase punishes and extending combos.

 

[onehunna]

I've been loving the gimping potential Diddy has, but mostly I've been relying on stuff like banana toss > dash attack > down air, and I'm looking to mix it up. What are some of your guys' favorite gimp setups?

 

[DeFish]

I've been loving the gimping potential Diddy has, but mostly I've been relying on stuff like banana toss > dash attack > down air, and I'm looking to mix it up. What are some of your guys' favorite gimp setups?

Up-b spike makes me giggle every time I do it. Some recoveries (Falcon, Mario, Luigi, Kirby, Sonic, etc.) are incredibly vulnerable to it, and I feel like it does a lot to give the Diddy player momentum when it happens.

Side-b footstool spikes are fun too, especially if your opponent thinks they're going to come out and spike you while you're recovering. This also sets up nicely for up-b spikes, so mix up your recovery and you may get a bonus stock off of your opponent.

Bananas/peanuts also do funny things to people offstage. Peanuts have insane knockback scaling, and hitting someone with a peanut while they're trying to recover will often either screw up their recovery completely, or set you up for an easy ledgehog. I've gotten in the habit of firing a few peanuts off stage whenever I knock my opponent off because of how great it is when they connect.

 

[DiSQO_BuNNY]

@ Soft Serve yes in a long term POV its overcomplicated. This is a game of rock paper scissors. But with these zdrop to footstool to blah blah blah, you're making it rock paper scissors dynamite cockroach modern warfare 18. All you need is the trip, the grab, or the sideB. That's it. You can get fancy when you become prominent at simpler things, but if you start practicing techy flashy stuff without a good basis understanding, you're gonna overload your brain and negate the ability to choose options quickly and clearly

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Just got a few good ideas from the video, and if they work, I will have a lot of fun in the tourney next month. Running glide toss down bananas and zdrop back air pivot grabs.
BTW, seagull did you ever finish that document up upthrow or side b or down throw follow ups.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Just got a few good ideas from the video, and if they work, I will have a lot of fun in the tourney next month. Running glide toss down bananas and zdrop back air pivot grabs.
BTW, seagull did you ever finish that document up upthrow or side b or down throw follow ups.

I've been busy. I'm almost done it. I have 7 characters left. I'll try to get it completed this week. Tuesday I won't be able to nor Friday. I'll see if I can Wednesday or Thursday. I've been working on my graduate stuff, with gf, or training with peepz.

 

[DeFish]

Have any of you guys gotten to play against a good Yoshi? I've been struggling a lot against the dinosaur lately, it seems like my bananas are completely useless against the side-b and nair, and when I try to get in for fisticuffs I seem to get outranged/prioritized.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Have any of you guys gotten to play against a good Yoshi? I've been struggling a lot against the dinosaur lately, it seems like my bananas are completely useless against the side-b and nair, and when I try to get in for fisticuffs I seem to get outranged/prioritized.

You don't challenge 's stuff. You just jump above him and throw bananas down.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Only fought one good one, but i basically took him back to brawl till i forced him to over commit and punished with side b to dair or regrab depending on which was better. once he is offstage, it is really easy to hit through his armor with upb, but at early percent focus on getting the early juggles with up throw or projectiles, cause till about 60% that double jump cancel nair is omnipotent. Yoshi's side b is a terrible move however and wouldnt really be used much, i think even diddy's command grab may even beat that out it has such low priority. But if it doesn't, its pretty easy to lame him out, as long as you avoid that punish game, yoshi has pretty good combos on diddy.

 

[Praxis]

Have any of you guys gotten to play against a good Yoshi? I've been struggling a lot against the dinosaur lately, it seems like my bananas are completely useless against the side-b and nair, and when I try to get in for fisticuffs I seem to get outranged/prioritized.

I haven't played him with Diddy (saving that for tournament surprise) but we have a really good Yoshi locally on our PR. I've figured out all kinds of anti-Yoshi stuff and have been beating him in friendlies with Marth/Ganon. We keep missing each other in our tournament brackets and he doesn't make it to fight me, but I beat him consistently in Melee/Brawl as well (he plays all three games).

Here's a few tricks.

First, his side-B is safe on shield. He will cancel his egg roll with B and jab your shield faster than you can drop shield and do anything on stage. So if he hits your shield, don't try to punish. Just hold your shield (unless you think he's going to grab) and focus on escape options.

Second, his side-B in the air has no hitbox. Side-B only has a hitbox on the ground. Side-B also takes away his jump. If you see a Yoshi use side-B in the air (and I've seen them drop on people with side-B, scaring them in to shielding), it's an illusion. If you attack OOS on reaction before he lands you will knock him out and maybe even send him offstage without a jump.

Don't challenge nair. Let it whiff and punish.

Use footstool option selects when he's recovering (I bound my footstool to Y). Essentially, press footstool and then attack or jump the next frame. If you succeeded in footstooling, you footstool him, if you miss, the game ignores that input and does the other button you pressed. If you footstool Yoshi out of his second jump, he falls even if he was supposed to have super armor.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Just took a respectable third at our regional yesterday, but I felt like I could have taken second. I could use some critiques. At the very least the last two sets.


Winner's quarters (vs G&W):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=8h26m15s

Winner's semis (vs MK):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=9h6m40s

Winners finals (vs Mewtwo): (I start this on game 3 because I mostly win games 1-2 through his inexperience with the MU)
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=10h0m30s

Losers finals (vs Marth):
http://www.twitch.tv/breadnbuttergames/b/531818877?t=10h32m01s

This is my first time ever fighting a good Melee Marth, so I don't know where to DI a lot of his stuff including throws and it shows. Definitely need some help here.

To start with, could you politely tell the G&W to take tap jump off so that his upb will stop eating his jump so he will live longer. Also according to g&w thread when i asked for assistance, on a lot of the cast g&w up throw leads to a parachute so it will help him.
Ok now for the actual marth matchup. Marth is still a good character and will pretty much go even with nearly anyone. With that being said, diddy can annoy the living he.ck out of him.
For the one you were playing, his banana game looked very lacking since he didnt know how to use marth's really good glide tossing, so i would have strongly recommended laming him out through fd. On a counter pick stage, greenhill zone is probably in marth's favor. As you know, if you miss the correct d.i on marth's throws it leads to a painful forward smash,that can kill very very early. It would help to have a melee background on this, but you do not want to get grabbed near the ledge!!! With that being said, the combo d.i and knowing the proper way to d.i his grabs come with time. He always wants to hit with the tip, so use that spacing to wave dash back and throw out a peanut or two. Against marth you want to either stay on top of him and sufficate him with pressure (fox) or outrange him and captilize on his mistakes by gimping him(ddd). Diddy has the ability to do both with projectiles and a good juggle game.

 

[Praxis]

Same videos on YouTube instead of Twitch, in order of most help needed to least:
vs Marth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgTn4PmP5HY&index=3&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs Mewtwo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mK920nUZNGM&index=5&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs MK:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BHCZBjiBls&index=9&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs G&W:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0sbGJfkqRA&index=12&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

To start with, could you politely tell the G&W to take tap jump off so that his upb will stop eating his jump so he will live longer. Also according to g&w thread when i asked for assistance, on a lot of the cast g&w up throw leads to a parachute so it will help him.
Ok now for the actual marth matchup. Marth is still a good character and will pretty much go even with nearly anyone. With that being said, diddy can annoy the living he.ck out of him.
For the one you were playing, his banana game looked very lacking since he didnt know how to use marth's really good glide tossing, so i would have strongly recommended laming him out through fd. On a counter pick stage, greenhill zone is probably in marth's favor. As you know, if you miss the correct d.i on marth's throws it leads to a painful forward smash,that can kill very very early. It would help to have a melee background on this, but you do not want to get grabbed near the ledge!!! With that being said, the combo d.i and knowing the proper way to d.i his grabs come with time. He always wants to hit with the tip, so use that spacing to wave dash back and throw out a peanut or two. Against marth you want to either stay on top of him and sufficate him with pressure (fox) or outrange him and captilize on his mistakes by gimping him(ddd). Diddy has the ability to do both with projectiles and a good juggle game.

He actually CP'd me to FD game 2, I suppose I should have kept going back there.

Can you give me any direction as far as how to DI those throws? I don't really have a Marth to practice with so I won't be able to get this down until next time I fight Chip, and I don't want to lose 3-4 more stocks to getting fsmashed on a ledge at 40% with the wrong DI.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

Same videos on YouTube instead of Twitch, in order of most help needed to least:
vs Marth:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgTn4PmP5HY&index=3&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs Mewtwo:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mK920nUZNGM&index=5&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs MK:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BHCZBjiBls&index=9&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV

vs G&W:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0sbGJfkqRA&index=12&list=PLF0c0-Q1H--ZDG4t-4AW5kNubVexXfChV




He actually CP'd me to FD game 2, I suppose I should have kept going back there.

Can you give me any direction as far as how to DI those throws? I don't really have a Marth to practice with so I won't be able to get this down until next time I fight Chip, and I don't want to lose 3-4 more stocks to getting fsmashed on a ledge at 40% with the wrong DI.

Its easiest to say dont get grabbed near the ledge at early percent but I won't because the range is just stupid. At early percent, from like 0-10% marth can chain grab diddy. This means that there is nothing you can do about it anyway. So if you cant stop it till then, your better off holding straight up to better d.i the tipper. While I havent had that situation occur as diddy(it happened many times in melee), the general way to d.i forward throw after that is down and away from marth. It becomes a d.i trap with back throw if I remember correctly, because the d.i for that one is away from marth in the opposite direction.
The good thing is as a diddy main, you can pretty much destroy his lack of oos, and switch between melee and brawl pretty easily. Its pretty good to go ahead and pull out two bananas each time you get a kill, since if he waste time to pick it up, he is wasting his invincibility. and if he picks up the banana, Marth becomes a near non-threat, since he loses the main things he had going for him in disjointed hitboxes, and a freakishly large grab range.
Whenever this marth learns how to play with items better it gets a little harder, but the only thing he was doing was throwing them back at you, so i assumed his item game was bad. The great thing about fighting marth is if you live past 70%, your probably living to very high percent due to having too much damage to be comboed into his tippers.
Aside from that, some of the movement was really creative and I will probably end up stealing that later. The only other thing that may help you in the future is that peanut gun is better to do than offstage up b on marth and roy, (and falco side b) because the timing is really strict, and the punishment for missing is usually a dair for your trouble.
But seriously tell the game and watch to get rid of tapjump, it makes his recovery harder to read, and cost him like 4 stocks in two matches lol.

 

[Praxis]

Hah

Its easiest to say dont get grabbed near the ledge at early percent but I won't because the range is just stupid. At early percent, from like 0-10% marth can chain grab diddy. This means that there is nothing you can do about it anyway. So if you cant stop it till then, your better off holding straight up to better d.i the tipper. While I havent had that situation occur as diddy(it happened many times in melee), the general way to d.i forward throw after that is down and away from marth. It becomes a d.i trap with back throw if I remember correctly, because the d.i for that one is away from marth in the opposite direction.
The good thing is as a diddy main, you can pretty much destroy his lack of oos, and switch between melee and brawl pretty easily. Its pretty good to go ahead and pull out two bananas each time you get a kill, since if he waste time to pick it up, he is wasting his invincibility. and if he picks up the banana, Marth becomes a near non-threat, since he loses the main things he had going for him in disjointed hitboxes, and a freakishly large grab range.
Whenever this marth learns how to play with items better it gets a little harder, but the only thing he was doing was throwing them back at you, so i assumed his item game was bad. The great thing about fighting marth is if you live past 70%, your probably living to very high percent due to having too much damage to be comboed into his tippers.
Aside from that, some of the movement was really creative and I will probably end up stealing that later. The only other thing that may help you in the future is that peanut gun is better to do than offstage up b on marth and roy, (and falco side b) because the timing is really strict, and the punishment for missing is usually a dair for your trouble.
But seriously tell the game and watch to get rid of tapjump, it makes his recovery harder to read, and cost him like 4 stocks in two matches lol.

Lol I'll let the G&W know! So, what you're saying is that when you fear a tipper, you want to DI fthrow up but bthrow away?

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

once you get past the 10-20% mark, and you believe they are going for forward throw, d.i down and away from marth. if you believe they are doing back throw,d.i going toward marth. Most of the ledge tippers marth players get come from subconciously fearing getting hit by forward smash and trying to d.i toward the stage on the throw. the problem is that gets you sweet spotted and makes you die slightly faster than no d.i at all. Since marth's grabs vary by fall speed and percent, someone with marth on diddy may be able to explain more

With that being said, I am facing a problem. Last tourney I went to, my controller gave out midmatch and my y button stopped working all together. Now where a second jump button doesnt matter, this is a problem for me cause I had it as a shield button.( I know I am wierd 3shields no tap jump) y-wavedash r-block/roll l-glidetossing. I was wondering what is a good way to get a new gamecube controller. And
With the exception of roll less wavedash more(y button issue in this match), where are some areas I can improve in general playstyle. Don't really need it so much on the link matchup anymore, but just general fundamentals to add to the repertoire and boost speed. Only practice I can do till tourneys are on computers. And the only thing I added since then was sh z drop bair >pivot grabs, side b lock on a few characters, and Running down glide toss. Only important to note things I got from watching the video is that diddy's chain grab does not work as well on slants, so go for a different followup, link's up b is a spike stronger than captain's nipple, and projectiles are five times harder to ps when there is a slant on the stage, so I should always ban lilat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t-Uc99TKDc

 

[ThatGuyYouMightKnow]

"Stuff like single naner locks and two naner locks don't work because of banana teching."

There is a new form of banana locking in this game that only needs one. In my mind it's a true lock because there is 0 possibility of actually getting out harm-free. You WILL get hit one way or another.

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

"Stuff like single naner locks and two naner locks don't work because of banana teching."

There is a new form of banana locking in this game that only needs one. In my mind it's a true lock because there is 0 possibility of actually getting out harm-free. You WILL get hit one way or another.

Oh not refering to naner locks in that since, though i did it well in brawl, i mean few characters like ganon that are so big and heavy that if you got a banana in hand you can side b slap, waveland slightly back, toss banana side b slap waveland pick up repeat till they d.i correctly. Just a cheap way to add damage on some characters when their at mid percent. The likelihood that someone has seen the gimmick before is low, so it has worked a few times.

 

[Soft Serve]

June did really damn good tonight.

@ Seagull Joe That lab work you and june put in with what is guaranteed off of throws went along way in his set vs K9. June definitely had optimal follow ups for every set up and made the most of every punish

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

June did really damn good tonight.

@ Seagull Joe That lab work you and june put in with what is guaranteed off of throws went along way in his set vs K9. June definitely had optimal follow ups for every set up and made the most of every punish

The matches on youtube.

 

[Seagull Joe]

June did really damn good tonight.

@ Seagull Joe That lab work you and june put in with what is guaranteed off of throws went along way in his set vs K9. June definitely had optimal follow ups for every set up and made the most of every punish

June doesn't lab, but he listens to anything I tell him that's guaranteed lmao. Dair is secretly 's best move. Shhhhh.

 

[Praxis]

June doesn't lab, but he listens to anything I tell him that's guaranteed lmao. Dair is secretly 's best move. Shhhhh.

I'm really, really waiting excitedly for your elaborations, bro.

 

[SpiderMad]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeLklmmYyNk&feature=youtu.be

 

[Searing_Sorrow]

June doesn't lab, but he listens to anything I tell him that's guaranteed lmao. Dair is secretly 's best move. Shhhhh.

Worse kept secret ever lol. Its basically a combo starter like nair that meteors into a second meteor offstage. And not as cc prone

 

[Seagull Joe]

I'm really, really waiting excitedly for your elaborations, bro.

Uthrow>Dair works on a lot of characters. That's why.

 

[DeFish]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeLklmmYyNk&feature=youtu.be

I guess I know what to practice next.

@ Seagull Joe At what percentages does that become unsafe, generally?