"IT'S UP TIEM!" The Dayton, OH social, strategical, and sometimes empty thread

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

God Kais!!

omg whenever you guys do that i always want to follow suit XD

well im for making the weeklies + only unless a tourney is near or there is some reason to NOT play a better game...

 

[Paradigm]

Fizz I also main Zerg. For the swarm!

Wakka it's nice to know I'm not the only person who feels this way. You guys host some stuff with enough of a heads up and I'll most likely be there.

If we're Braw+ all the time, then I don't need a new character, do I? Back to ZSS lol. I'd much prefer we play some Melee, however.

Also I find your sig... amusing.

 

[fromundaman]

Am I the only one who still enjoys Brawl?

campy marth is not the way to go, actually

super aggro marth shuts down all options if played correctly

in kirby i might have to play a bit more campy but i think if i play with aggro mindset i will do MUCH better

campy marth is much easier but is less effective...i want to play a very effective marth...so i need to switch!

also tbh beegs isn't that good =_=~

I dunno... he's still the best Marth I've played against so far (though I didn't play against Xysin).

Meh, I obviously don't know much about Marth, so what exactly do you mean by super aggro Marth?

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

I <3 brawl
I <3<3 brawl+
melee is ehh.. having to flick the c stick 7 times to get one f-smash pisses me off way too much (plus a couple other things i dont like), and i joined too late. Im going to stay out of competitive melee
my marth is still pretty good and i cam play both styles, we can test this out sometime.

 

[Paradigm]

melee is ehh.. having to flick the c stick 7 times to get one f-smash pisses me off way too much

buffering ruined you, lol

 

[wakka444]

buffering ruined you, lol

LOL my thoughts exactly xD

 

[Fizzle_Boy]

Agreed !

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

well im a big fan of buffering

 

[clowsui]

I dunno... he's still the best Marth I've played against so far (though I didn't play against Xysin).

Meh, I obviously don't know much about Marth, so what exactly do you mean by super aggro Marth?

Xisin is the best defensive Marth hands down. I'm some weird aggro/defensive variant...aggro and defensive should be applied carefully to the correct situations of course but generally marth can play one style only the whole match and get away with it. marth is one of the purest characters in brawl that relies at the top level solely on skill with spacing, control, traps, prediction etc. as opposed to characters like MK who at the top level can use stupid spacing destroyers like tornado

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=201500

super aggro marth = spacing always at tipper range with dtilt, fair, nair and mixing up the spacing by doing empty SH, full hops, standing aerials, retreating and approaching

played with consistent spacing this marth is ridiculously scary
there's only some characters this doesn't work against
Bowser
DK
Ganon (somewhat, weird match)
Ice Climbers
Ike (maybe?)
Dedede
Meta knight
Charizard
Snake a little bit

kirby has no options if marth plays at the range bceause it's kirby's worst range
even if you try and get in with aerials marth will have already swatted you away out of your optimal zone w/ any aerial
on the ledge this is even scarier because kirby has no options that can beat marth on the ledge, you have to trick him
for example you beat me occasionally on the ledge w/ final cutter...but it's certainly slow enough where if i didn't panic i could just PS and dtilt you to reset the situation
the aggro marth's weakness is that he has to always mix up b/c once he becomes predictable it's over...he also always has to commit to actions, your spacing has to be perfect and in general it requires a high degree of control
in the air, too kirby has to try and trick marth to release the juggle trap or the marth has to mess up. comparing this of course to characters like wario or MK, with the former having fantastic aerial mobility (greater than marth's) and the latter having high priority aerials.


defensive marth is less effective if played at the same top level of marth...just it's less risk for a lower reward.

once i stopped playing aggro v xisin i started losing, as a point of reference...aggro marth is ridiculous in the ditto if the other person plays defensive

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=201500

 

[Paradigm]

Clowsui, if you consider yourself good enough to properly apply that I'd like to see it work on my ZSS and ROB who both weren't on your list... actually maybe even Samus as well. I'm not saying you're wrong or can't do it so much as that I just have a hard time mentally picturing "marth shuts down all options" against them.. All three characters have at a spacing game I think could work against a Marth with proper zoning and aggro/defense.

Also I want to learn to do that stuff myself. I'm more of a defensive player... perhaps to much so.

Also also tomorrow I may have to leave smash early (like at 4:00PM or even 3:00PM), but I should still be there for a while.

 

[Earth_Swords_Man_009]

campy marth is not the way to go, actually

super aggro marth shuts down all options if played correctly

in kirby i might have to play a bit more campy but i think if i play with aggro mindset i will do MUCH better

campy marth is much easier but is less effective...i want to play a very effective marth...so i need to switch!

also tbh beegs isn't that good =_=~

Hahaha, well, I guess the fight goes on saying "Whos better?!?! Xisin or Beeg's". I may been out of the scene for a bit and yea I play a bit of a different Marth but that shouldn't conclude that I'm a bad Marth user. I can play campy on teams mainly. Most of the time, I have to play someone who I have to approach, for a good example, Snake.

FYI, I'm not upset at ya for speaking your mind. TONS of ppl have said things about Xisin and I. I'm not worried about it but I really just want to see where you think I'm that bad of a player. lol.

 

[clowsui]

your results are lacking, that's why

for someone who's supposed to be a good marth you don't have that many results

you also don't contribute much to marth boards/made any indication that you have a lot of marth knowledge

you don't have to post much to indicate strong playing but without wifi-god status or tourney results the lack of participation is odd

 

[Earth_Swords_Man_009]

I have results and I don't go to the Marth forums at all. lol.

I have been to a good amount of tourneys also my good sir. Placing the top 10 really isn't that bad at all I personally believe.

The Marth knowledge that I do have, little agree with. Trust me, I have posted and I just got flamed so I decided to give up on it.

For an example again, ITT doesn't contribute anything to the Sonic forums and they also say he's a bad Sonic when really, he's not a bad player at all. He's also increasing his game a lot in the last three months. It's pretty much the same thing I'm doing. Just reading on the Marth forums and see if I agree or disagree with the logic. Plain and simple.

I'm being completely honest on this too Clowsui. You seem like a cool guy and everything, so please don't let me lose respect for you man. T_T

 

[Paradigm]

you also don't contribute much to marth boards/made any indication that you have a lot of marth knowledge

If he tries to contribute but what he adds isn't worthwhile then it may be something to count against him, but not contributing at all is in no way indication that he isn't good. HOWEVER, if what you're trying to get across is that his postings can't be used to give him credit as a good marf (leaving only the other avenues like tourney results), you could have a point... it just didn't come across that way.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

Clowsui come down and play with us sometime

i got my wii back its bawrl tomorrow

 

[clowsui]

HOWEVER, if what you're trying to get across is that his postings can't be used to give him credit as a good marf (leaving only the other avenues like tourney results), you could have a point... it just didn't come across that way.

that's what i meant, sorry beegs if it came off wrong

also i would like to see these placings, posting them and proving me wrong would be of great help XD; i would shut up at that point

links to disagreements would also be helpful

also I thought ITT was respected o_O Guess I was wrong LOL

xisin posts OCCASIONALLY, at the very least...to show whether he agrees/disagrees/to provide input...sometimes there's disagreements but then he doesn't respond b/c he has other things and stuff. idk, it's not necessary to post, just difficult for me to judge your participation in community + application of theory if i can't tangibly see participation

not trying to be a douche at all, but i'm also gonna ask who did you beat in tourney b/c that also counts in evaluating how good you are =P

if you're going to be at the next circuit i'll play you for firsthand experience, i guess...i'm just not that convinced X3

 

[Earth_Swords_Man_009]

that's what i meant, sorry beegs if it came off wrong

also i would like to see these placings, posting them and proving me wrong would be of great help XD; i would shut up at that point

links to disagreements would also be helpful

also I thought ITT was respected o_O Guess I was wrong LOL

xisin posts OCCASIONALLY, at the very least...to show whether he agrees/disagrees/to provide input...sometimes there's disagreements but then he doesn't respond b/c he has other things and stuff. idk, it's not necessary to post, just difficult for me to judge your participation in community + application of theory if i can't tangibly see participation

not trying to be a douche at all, but i'm also gonna ask who did you beat in tourney b/c that also counts in evaluating how good you are =P

if you're going to be at the next circuit i'll play you for firsthand experience, i guess...i'm just not that convinced X3

All right. I'll have to look for the results. I'll also see if they aren't deleted also. >_>.

It's OK man and at least you are trying to get my point also. I appreciate that very much so.

The people I have beat have been Quivo, Nope, JoeS (when he was playing dammit!), Vidjo, ITT, and Lou. There are some others but I can't remember and it's not that big of a deal right?

I have had very good and close matchs with OS, Smash 64, Infern, and Kel. Those are three I know right off the top of my head that I lost to but were amazingly good match's. There are probably some others to mention but eh, I think you and I aren't TOO worried about this. lol.

I do think I'm going to the next circuit event. I think I have work off of it already also. If you want some friendly match's, I'm fine with that. I just hope you don't judge me off of just friendly match's good sir. I understand that you are not convinced also. I have a feeling you haven't heard much of me or see that much of me either. It seems the circuits you do go to, I'm not their and you are or vice versa.

One last thing, +10 for Gurren Lagann Clowsui.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

hey............................... shadup and come play <3

 

[Earth_Swords_Man_009]

It's a maybe Dj. I work most of the time you guys host these. T_T

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

what days are you off? i got thursday and friday free too. the weekend as well but sinclair isnt open sunday. Im sure if you get one day during the week off i can come play
*happy birthday to me =p*...well it was yesterday but whatever lol

 

[Earth_Swords_Man_009]

Im going to get fridays off soon. If you can get stuff going on that day then sure, I'll see what I can do.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

yea i can be there on a friday that you wanna come down and play i can be there from 11am till when sinclair closes at like 6 or 7

 

[Paradigm]

Scribs if you bring your wii tomorrow I can smash. I have a makeup test to take at about 10:00 and from what I understand it should take me about an hour so I should be there at about 11:00AM until 5:00PM, assuming you'll be there.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

my bro is gonna be in town ill see if he can come down too, ill give him a call tonight and i really dont think that showing up tomorrow should be a problem. I should be there about 11am

 

[fromundaman]

Hey Beegs, if you do end up going to these at some point, any chance you could shoot me a PM to pick me up on the way? (I think it's kind of on the way isn't it?) I'd pay for my share of gas obviously.

Also, Scribs, you need to get a tourny hosted in Dayton (even if it's just a house tourny.). I think there would be people willing to go down if you did.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

i have no where to run it even if i did
i do not want to go through nexus

 

[Paradigm]

LOL I'd love to see like 40 people crammed in the basement of building 8 crowded around the one TV. All of Dayton counterpicks dark levels 'cuz no one else will be conditioned to see on them. Tourney takes almost a week due to the lack of TVs. The winner is TOF because he's secretly pro and is just screwing with us.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

XD id quit if that happened lol

 

[Paradigm]

UGH

Something came up and I will not be able to smash tomorrow. Sorry \:

I've been missing a lot of smash lately >.< Next week seems clean for me, though: Smash64/Melee/Brawl/Brawl+/Smash4ReturnOfTheWavedash/etc it's all good, I guess. Some 'good' is better than others, though d:

 

[clowsui]

Clowsui, if you consider yourself good enough to properly apply that I'd like to see it work on my ZSS and ROB who both weren't on your list... actually maybe even Samus as well. I'm not saying you're wrong or can't do it so much as that I just have a hard time mentally picturing "marth shuts down all options" against them.. All three characters have at a spacing game I think could work against a Marth with proper zoning and aggro/defense.

Also I want to learn to do that stuff myself. I'm more of a defensive player... perhaps to much so.

Also also tomorrow I may have to leave smash early (like at 4:00PM or even 3:00PM), but I should still be there for a while.

i'm not good enough to apply it well...i plan on being the first aggressive marth in MW
closest i've seen is omegaxf

ZSS it works because you're always putting her in a bad position on the approach unless you're in whip range for grabs/whip tip, but you can easily land and shield and resume pressure. she also doesn't really have reliable options off ledge vs. marth, esp. if he stands a bit aways from the ledge. flip jump gets up b'd on block as does ledge attack, ledge hop paralyzer is not very good, drop hop uair is your best bet but i can just JC after shieldstun and nair you in the lag (just in case you can AD). fighting marth on the ledge is super gay LOL

ROB it works except you have to make sure you're always on him and if the gyro comes out then you take it for yourself OR toss it off the ledge (force him to make one again) so that you can exert stage control freely...staying on top of rob means he can't use laser, the only option that outranges marth's tipper options on the ground. OOS i think jc fair might beat out my fair but i dunno, ROBs are easy to scare into shield for a free shieldbreaker because if they're not reactively SD-DSmashing they're looking for shieldgrabs or laser punish...very few robs abuse his quick FTilt OOS, which is how they'll mostly be getting % marth spacing himself properly can avoid spotdodge dsmash unless rob likes to extend his hurtbox and get smacked by fair...plus dsmash is easy to sdi out of. the very tip of fsmash might outrange too but throwing out random fsmashes is inadvisable

Samus it works really well...you just have to stay on the ground and PS a lot of stuff. Or you can just platform hop. Platformed stages like BF work...YI works well vs. Samus too. SV and FD are no-nos b/c they force you into yomi-2 games with samus where you run in and PS to beat the projectile but she grabs to beat the shield...but yomi-3 may occur where you spotdodge the grab or you may just choose a less advisable yomi-1 step of AD'ing through projectiles as marth. Samus gets ***** on the ledge v. Marth, she has no reliable options once she's on the ledge. Ledge hop missile, if shielded, is a free dtilt...LHAD can be pivot grabbed...proper distance neutralizes ledge attack option...ledge jump gets you naired or faired for the reset...actually all I have to do is wait beneath the rightmost platform on BF and if you fly up past the platform I don't have to do anything because any way you try and escape you will be punished...you have to trick me on the ledge with your already bad options LOL

aerial wise all of these characters are beat out by marth's superior range and speed (every attack of marth's in the air is ridiculously fast cept dair...dair and uair and bair have a lot of lag but the latter two are mixups USUALLY, unless you're juggle trapping). it's always a guessing game vs. marth in the air with these characters, unless I'm underestimating ZSS' fall speed and she can FFUair me with her good vert mobility >__> ROB's AD is pretty good though but NAir and UAir (if I guess right) should work

 

[Paradigm]

I really appreciate that in depth response... that really helps me picture what you're talking about much better.

And again, just to make sure Skwibzzz see's it: I will *not* be there tomorrow.

 

[clowsui]

R.O.B's angled upwards f-tilt beats everything Marth has in range except Shieldbreaker.

NVM I was wrong about ROB's range...most everything else still stands tho, you still have to go aggressive v ROB

 

[Paradigm]

Yeah, I thought ROB's ftilt would give Marth a lot of spacing trouble, but after reading your post I thought perhaps Marth's fair would be fast enough to beat it and decided to test it later.

I expected Marth would have trouble with ZSS due to the fact that she outranges him with the whip and simply won't engage (ie, run away) should he get in closer. Marth's not as fast as MK who can powershield the whip (even at its tip) and still have time to punish. Still, though, I may have been underestimating Marth's fair's speed. May be difficult to get away.

With Samus I had expected her dtilt *may* out range Marth's fair. It leaves her vulnerable if it doesn't land but it I thought it would be a good defense against an aggressive Marth. It worked quite well when I tried it against MK's, even. Her off-the-edge game is usually her fair, which I do expect Marth to out range.

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

i just seen that and im already here, theres a couple scrubs who are playing smash 64 though lol

 

[Paradigm]

Yeah I'm really sorry man I've been smashing soooo little lately I've been really looking forward to it ):

 

[clowsui]

the problem is if the dtilt is your only option vs marth then marth doesn't have to do aerials in front of you, the cross up is always a good option. in that situation where it's aerial vs. dtilt marth will win simply because at that point your only option has become "dtilt" and marth's options are "cross up fair" "empty short hop" "fair" "shieldbreaker mixup" "cross up nair" etc. marth's dtilt also has good range so maybe his dtilt beats samuses?

hmm i didn't have trouble getting past cr4sh and zss' range. i just played dumb and sloppy and didn't consistently adapt to him punishing my habits + i didn't punish him hard enough. consider that if you choose to commit to plasma whip if i shield the situation is reset to neutral or i have stage advantage b/c i forced towards the edge

 

[smash64]

Clowsui will **** any one that gets on his way.....i have spoken

 

[clowsui]

LOL eddy the problem is i need to get my gameplay up to this level of thinking

edit: after reading up on zss vs marth zss can make it difficult for marth to get in but if marth plays defense and lets her come into the optimal range it's MUCH harder than if he approaches and attacks.

 

[Paradigm]

if marth plays defense and lets her come into the optimal range it's MUCH harder than if he approaches and attacks.

ZSS won't get anywhere near Marth or pretty much anyone else. Like Marth she loves zoning, except her zone is at the tip of the whip. ZSS won't go into Marth's optimal range willingly. Marth has to be the one on offense.

That's actually a large part of why I find ZSS boring and have been talking about changing mains.

 

[Paradigm]

wtf no doublepast bad smashboards