Data Invincibility and armor list

[Z3N1TH]

Captain Falcon has some invincibility on his Falcon Punch startup. Or something. I've had moves pass straight thru him while it was charging.

 

[Cherubas]

I haven't extensively tested it, but as a Bowser Jr main I can tell you that his spinout has some kind of armor/invincibility. I'm guessing Heavy Armor. I've gone through some things with it.

 

[Zelkam]

I tried to test it better with the motion sensor bomb method from Zelkam and I could go through them sometime.. but then I remembered I had to wait for it to make the activation sound and then I always got hit. There might be a very specific position somwhere from midde to the end of his sideB where he teleports (and can't get hit), but I'm not sure.

So I went back and retested this with the motion sensor bomb in training just to be sure that I hadn't been using the illusion before the bomb was primed and I was still able to get it to work 100% of the time. The window is very small, it's doesn't start until Fox starts moving and it's over before he makes it even a quarter of the way through.

Also, I started up a game against a cpu Pikachu and managed to do an illusion through his thunder jolt. I then saved the replay, recorded it with my camera, and discovered something interesting when I slowed down the video.

It would seem that Fox gets intangibility, not invincibility, from his Illusion.

While I was viewing the video frame by frame I could see that Fox passed right through the thunder jolt and then it was the illusion that clashed with it. At normal speed it happens so fast that it looks like Fox himself cancels the thunder jolt, that's why I thought it was invincibility before.

Here's the video that shows it at normal speed, slowed down, and then the single frame:

 

[Shaya]

Note: Feet

Nearly all characters seem to have disjointed/invincible feet. This was the case in Brawl and remains the case here.
Basically they don't like including heels/toes with hurtboxes (so no perpendicular stuff to their legs).

I know that hitboxes will not hit megaman in neutral on the ground that don't reach far enough for his legs but overlap the toes.
Rosalina has no hitbox for her feet or the legs near her feet either, she's floating off of the ground even if her animation shows her feet touching it.

 

[Cherubas]

So I went back and retested this with the motion sensor bomb in training just to be sure that I hadn't been using the illusion before the bomb was primed and I was still able to get it to work 100% of the time. The window is very small, it's doesn't start until Fox starts moving and it's over before he makes it even a quarter of the way through.

Also, I started up a game against a cpu Pikachu and managed to do an illusion through his thunder jolt. I then saved the replay, recorded it with my camera, and discovered something interesting when I slowed down the video.

It would seem that Fox gets intangibility, not invincibility, from his Illusion.

While I was viewing the video frame by frame I could see that Fox passed right through the thunder jolt and then it was the illusion that clashed with it. At normal speed it happens so fast that it looks like Fox himself cancels the thunder jolt, that's why I thought it was invincibility before.

Here's the video that shows it at normal speed, slowed down, and then the single frame:

Out of curiosity, what's the importance of making a distinction between intangibility and invincibility as it was described in the original post? All the other differences are worth noting. You'll want to know whether you're going to take damage or not, you'll want to know whether you can be knocked out of the move or not, but in what scenario would it be important to know this distinction? It seems like the end result of Fox's illusion would be the same whether he were "intangible" or just invulnerable according to the first post. I'm not a pro at this game so sadly I'll need it explained to me.

 

[Zelkam]

Out of curiosity, what's the importance of making a distinction between intangibility and invincibility as it was described in the original post? All the other differences are worth noting. You'll want to know whether you're going to take damage or not, you'll want to know whether you can be knocked out of the move or not, but in what scenario would it be important to know this distinction? It seems like the end result of Fox's illusion would be the same whether he were "intangible" or just invulnerable according to the first post. I'm not a pro at this game so sadly I'll need it explained to me.

I think JamietheAuraUser summed it up quite nicely in one of his earlier posts

Mr. Game & Watch's Up Smash has true invincibility rather than the standard intangibility. They're distinct in Smash Bros. Intangibility means the attack passes right through your location without registering a hit. Invincibility means the attack hits and does no damage, symbolized by a little white circle effect on hit. If your intangibility ends while the hitbox is still there, you'll get hit. The same is not true of invincibility.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Throws I believe have intangibility for the first few frames.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Note: Feet

Nearly all characters seem to have disjointed/invincible feet. This was the case in Brawl and remains the case here.
Basically they don't like including heels/toes with hurtboxes (so no perpendicular stuff to their legs).

Very likely why Yoshi still has invincibility on his Usmash for his feet then.

 

[Doval]

Out of curiosity, what's the importance of making a distinction between intangibility and invincibility as it was described in the original post? All the other differences are worth noting. You'll want to know whether you're going to take damage or not, you'll want to know whether you can be knocked out of the move or not, but in what scenario would it be important to know this distinction? It seems like the end result of Fox's illusion would be the same whether he were "intangible" or just invulnerable according to the first post. I'm not a pro at this game so sadly I'll need it explained to me.

The difference is that attacks connect against truly invincible opponents, but not against intangible opponents. Consequences of this is include the attacker suffering hit lag, projectiles may disappear or detonate, Link's d-air will bounce off, and Mega Man's Crash Bomber will still stick.

The "intangibility" qualifier on ZSS is redundant because practically all moves listed are intangible. It can falsely give the impression that her Flip Jump somehow works differently.

 

[Nabbitnator]

Not sure if someone has said this but palutena's shield only blocks projectiles similar to links only when she is dashing forward.

 

[Dr.Peace]

You'll have to excuse my miss type, it is from his mid air side B right when it finishes.
He seems to become invulnerable to attacks for a few frames is what I saw, though you may be right with his hurt box changing positions from it.

 

[Shaya]

Marth (and I'd assume Lucina)'s Dolphin Slash don't have frame 1 invincibility any longer; it's frames 4-6 only. Hitbox comes out on 5 still.

Same for both air and ground.

 

[SonicZeroX]

Does Warlock Punch really have super armor? Because I feel like I get hit out of it a lot. Seems much more like Heavy Armor than Super Armor.

 

[Resyndicated]

Bowser Junior's SideB has at least heavy armor when he slides. When driving normally, he has no armor at all.

 

[Luigi player]

Captain Falcon has some invincibility on his Falcon Punch startup. Or something. I've had moves pass straight thru him while it was charging.

I tried to test this, but I always got hit out of it.

Does Warlock Punch really have super armor? Because I feel like I get hit out of it a lot. Seems much more like Heavy Armor than Super Armor.

Yes, definitely. I've let bob-ombs walk into me while using it. It has Super Armor very early during the move (it starts at like frame 5 or something), and until that black effect goes into his hand, so during the actualy punch he does not have it anymore.

 

[SonicZeroX]

During the windup though I get hit out by smash attacks all the time. Did you try at different %s? Also I'm not sure if it has any armor if used in the air.

 

[Luigi player]

During the windup though I get hit out by smash attacks all the time. Did you try at different %s? Also I'm not sure if it has any armor if used in the air.

Yeah I didn't get any knockback while having more than 200%. Didn't test the aerial version...

Btw I updated the first post some. Didn't unclude all the invincible parts, because I still dunno what to do with them.

Edit: alright I've tried to do it with the aerial version and it didn't work. I'm guessing he doesn't have any SA then.
Edit2: and if he lands during it he still doesn't gain any SA. So you only have it if initiated on the ground. (added this to the OP now)

 

[SonicZeroX]

Huh interesting. I guess that's why I kept getting hit out of it. Kinda hurts its usability though since jumping into Warlock/Falcon Punch lets you land it a bit easier (I mean not that these moves were that useful in the first place).

 

[Virgman]

Falco's down smash has either invincibility or super armor.

 

[Doval]

Falco's down smash has either invincibility or super armor.

Falco's legs were invincible during D-smash in Melee. I doubt he has full body invincibility but it's worth checking the legs specifically.

 

[Luigi player]

I've just added Ganondorfs sideB. It seems he only has superarmor if he uses it grounded and has someone in his grab.
He can "freeze" aerially, but only if his opponent is getting hit in his hand (his opponent has superarmor).

 

[dean.]

king dedede has invincibility during his custom up special 'rising dedede'; for about 1/5 of his ascent maybe? also seems to have brief super armour after this. he also has super armour during his custom down special 'armoured jet hammer', during the charge. the custom up special 'quick dedede jump' seems to have super armour all through the ascent and descent.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Ganon's second custom up special, Dark Fists, has superarmor on the start-up.

Ganon's normal flame choke has super armour while grabbing the opponent (sometimes this can take effect in 1v1s against characters like Villager, Tink, Link, etc)

 

[Shaya]

Does ganon take damage or is it like all throws in this game where you have invincibility?

 

[Sinister Slush]

Since I do not have the game until the 21st, can you test the DJ a bit more since it lasts even after the ascending ends along with testing fsmash too.
I forget if we were always able to fsmash bombs or not without getting hurt cause before packing up my wii after buying the wii u, all I did with brawl was just try to survive as long as I can hitting bombs in training and I believe I used to get hurt hitting them.

So trading the fact Fsmash completely whiffs for possibly invincibility I'll take anyday I guess.

https://vine.co/v/OeA3YuUwm9Y

 

[Luigi player]

Does ganon take damage or is it like all throws in this game where you have invincibility?

He only has superarmor.

 

[Novaseer]

I finally got every custom move! I have a pretty big list of moves after testing every one of them!

Note: If unspecified, the invincibility is near the startup of the move, and works both in the air and on the ground.

Note2: Not included are counters, grabs, super armor, body part invulnerability, and the invincibility during teleports when a character is completely vanished.

Note3: I know there's a difference between invincibility and intangibility. I'm too tired from testing to sort which move is which right now.

Kirby
Up 3

Lucina
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Marth
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Pit
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Dark Pit
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Samus
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Sheik
Up 1 (before she disappears)
Up 3 (before she disappears)
Down 1
Down 2
Down 3

Zelda
Neutral 1
Neutral 2

Pikachu
Down 1 (when the bolt hits him)

Donkey Kong
Up 1 (in the air only)
Up 2 (in the air only)
Up 3 (in the air only)

Game and Watch
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Yoshi
Up 2

Mario
Up 1

Luigi
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3
Side 1 (When the charge releases, regular and misfire)
Side 2 (When the charge releases, regular and misfire)
Side 3 (When the charge releases, regular and misfire)

Swordfighter
Up 1

Brawler
Down 2

Gunner
Up 2 (on the ground only)

Meta Knight
Down 1 (before he disappears and after he reappears)
Down 2 (before he disappears and after he reappears)
Down 3 (after he reappears)
Up 3

Little Mac
Side 1 (only on the ground)
Side 2 (only on the ground)
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3

Fox
Down 2

Falco
Side 2 (before and during the dash)

Lucario
Down 2

Jigglypuff
Down 1
Down 2
Down 3

Rob
Up 1 (only on the ground)
Up 2 (only on the ground)
Up 3 (only on the ground)

Villager
Neutral 1
Neutral 2
Neutral 3

Pac-Man
Side 1 (when he eats the big pellet)
Side 2 (when he eats the big pellet)
Side 3 (when he eats the big pellet)
Down 3

Megaman
Up 1
Up 2
Up 3
Up-Tilt

Sonic
Side 1
Side 2
Side 3 (during the entire dash! Must be released while Sonic is on the ground. Turnaround and jump cancel the invin.)
Up 1
Up 2 (at the start of each spring)
Up-Smash

Palutena
Down 3

Zero Suit Samus
Down 1

Wii Fit Trainer
U-Smash

Charizard
F-Smash (right when he strikes)

Uncertain
Fox down 1 & down 3
ZSS down 2 & down 3
Gunner down 1
Pikachu down 3

 

[Shaya]

I may be insane, but the amount of occasions its happened has me pondering. I think Sonic's fair may also have invincibility on it.

 

[Green Spiny]

Has anyone tested Palutena's bair and dash attack any more? I haven't done so extensively, but while playing I recall them canceling out and damaging anything they collide with. I'm curious if they can trump the Warlock Punch (for example), and if they affect attacks from behind.

 

[icraq]

Throws I believe have intangibility for the first few frames.

did you ever confirm this? i'm under the impression you're correct, just from being grabbed as rosa and trying to break the grab with luma. but i've yet to really find a way to prove it.

 

[Shaya]

Play doubles, you'll notice.

 

[Rakurai]

Bowser Jr. has super armor during his side B, but only if attacks hit the clown car instead of him.

 

[icraq]

Play doubles, you'll notice.

sadly i rarely have the opportunity to play doubles.

however, assuming this is confirmation of intangibility in the throwing animation i'll just say thanks for letting me know!

 

[Big O]

Has anyone tested Palutena's bair and dash attack any more? I haven't done so extensively, but while playing I recall them canceling out and damaging anything they collide with. I'm curious if they can trump the Warlock Punch (for example), and if they affect attacks from behind.

I tried testing both both attacks and my conclusion is that they actually both have (tangible) invincibility frames. Most of the moves in this thread are actually intangibility rather than invincibility. Technical semantics aside, the key difference here is that moves will hit you, but they wont do anything (same as the star item's effect).

I tested it by dash attacking the wrong way vs Samus fully charged shots and missles. In both cases they hit me and nothing happened. I also tried using back air and got the same results. It seems like the more anyone looks into her the more ridiculous she gets...

@ Shaya I also looked into Sonic's Fair and couldn't find any evidence to support it having invincibility (intangible or otherwise).

 

[many37]

I think Kirby's side B has some super armor when fully charged. Also Boswer Jr. 's side B has some form of super armor as well.

 

[Luigi player]

I tried testing both both attacks and my conclusion is that they actually both have (tangible) invincibility frames. Most of the moves in this thread are actually intangibility rather than invincibility. Technical semantics aside, the key difference here is that moves will hit you, but they wont do anything (same as the star item's effect).

I tested it by dash attacking the wrong way vs Samus fully charged shots and missles. In both cases they hit me and nothing happened. I also tried using back air and got the same results. It seems like the more anyone looks into her the more ridiculous she gets...

@ Shaya I also looked into Sonic's Fair and couldn't find any evidence to support it having invincibility (intangible or otherwise).

Yeah her dash attack and bair can beat out so many moves, but she doesn't flash, so it shouldn't be invincibility... hmm. :/

I guess Bowsers upsmash can also be listed in the "other" section, since it's probably about the same as GaWs upsmash blocking hitbox (just ultimately better).

 

[Masonomace]

@ Luigi player Sup thanks for this thread btw so anyways, Shulk's 2nd Custom Special called Back Slash Charge (BSC) has SuperArmor frames during his entire duration when airborne, even during the start-up. Video below for reference:

http://youtu.be/qUy2BEtszlQ?t=5m4s

From 5:04 - 5:09 is a good example.

Also I believe Decisive Monado Arts & Hyper Monado Arts have invincibility for that short window of time like the regular Monado Arts does too, but I can't test to confirm that for sure.

 

[Lavani]

Here's a bunch of stuff. Some stuff might've already been mentioned in replies, I'm mostly just looking at the first post for reference.


-Jabs, ftilt, utilt, dtilt: Arms intangible
-fsmash: Legs intangible
-usmash: "Shell" intangible; his hurtbox is kind of pancaked on the ground during this
-dsmash: Left and right sides of the shell are intangible


-Wings and tail: always intangible, even when used for attacks (utilt/usmash for wings, ftilt/bair for tail)


-usmash: Leg intangible.


-upB: invincibility starting from the first active frame


-upB: invincibility doesn't actually begin until the first active frame (same as Mario); confirmed with walking Bob-ombs hitting me out of the startup before the hitbox comes out.


-dsmash: Legs intangible. Amusingly this isn't the case for Sonic's even though it's a similar animation.


-dtilt: Tail intangible.
-utilt: Arms intangible.
-fsmash: Hands intangible. Not his full arm, but there's enough to be able to fsmash a Bob-omb safely.


-dsmash: Feet intangible.
-usmash: Feet intangible.


-upB: Intangible when she starts flashing before the teleport.


-usmash: Legs intangible
-fsmash: Head invincible(/intangible?)
-uair: Tail intangible


-Utilt: Head intangible
-Rising Dedede (upB 2): Brief invincibility during early active frames, transitions to superarmor for the middle of the jump like the default upB.
-Armored Jet Hammer (downB 2): Superarmored for entire charging animation.


-Dash attack, bair: Invincible during active frames. For what it's worth, you can dash attack a fair distance into a Smart Bomb explosion, while bair doesn't get you very far in at all. Both can be used in the middle of 4 Bob-ombs with 0% taken.


-Utilt: Tongue intangible (always intangible?)


-Duck: Intangible for every attack except ftilt.

 

[KERO]

Finally decided to test this out, and it appears true.

The ending lag of Greninja's uncharged Water Shuriken is completely immune to grabs, but it can still be hit by normal moves. The same applies to Shifting Shuriken, but I can't test Stagnant Shuriken cause the damn computer never uses it, so if someone could test that for me, that would be great. That said, the grab immunity is really strange. I wouldn't be surprised if the patch took care of this. Charged Shuriken end lag can still be grabbed at least.

 

[Big O]

Finally decided to test this out, and it appears true.

The ending lag of Greninja's uncharged Water Shuriken is completely immune to grabs, but it can still be hit by normal moves. The same applies to Shifting Shuriken, but I can't test Stagnant Shuriken cause the damn computer never uses it, so if someone could test that for me, that would be great. That said, the grab immunity is really strange. I wouldn't be surprised if the patch took care of this. Charged Shuriken end lag can still be grabbed at least.

Hmmm this is very strange. I wonder if any other moves have this "ungrabable" property. I always thought grab immunity on certain moves would be a cool concept. Maybe we'll find other moves like it.