TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
Marko, no you cannot tech the lock at any point. DI is the only way to save yourself from it.
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Improved Sonic Footstool Combo
- Thread starter OFY
- Start date
MdrnDayMercutio
Smash Champion
Still feeling the sting I take it...
Even if your opponent does get good at escaping the lock via DI/smash DI/whatever it's called, its still a set up for the rather hard to hit with Fsmash. So if you can land it on them at 90%+ (which I assume it works at) its 9% or so damage from the set up, then maybe 4% if you only do two jabs followed by a (hopefully) lethal Fsmash. So even if you can't get a 30%+ damage jab lock you can still get an easy Fsmash so that seems worth it to me.
Trillion
Smash Ace
I second that. I hate ROB with a burning passion.
I love the improved jab lock combo, it's simply amazing. Very nice find. Way to go.
Boxob
Smash Champion
Lol I'll never be able to leave this board, and I sold Brawl D;
Ack, of course when I stop playing, something that makes Sonic amazing is discovered.
Ack, of course when I stop playing, something that makes Sonic amazing is discovered.
Anthinus
Smash Journeyman
I agree... I agree... I can never record stuff against KITO's ROB 'casue its super defensive, campy and heavy (the 2 stock matches lasts 5:00 mins). I don't loose often against it, but is annoying.
Thanks dude
I tested this stuff. Is useful and easy to do depending on the character... Against Mario, G&W, Ganny, (others) you just do the stuff. Against Marth, (others) you have to reverse your Up B or you'll can't jab lock after dair. Against Samus I could do it just once, When I FSJ she falls slowly and the spring hits her before reaching the floor... If I wait a bit after FSJ and let fall the spring, I hit her on floor with Dair... And If I wait a bit before Dair she stands up...
I think we have to test timing for different characters...
TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
Oh ye of little faith. YE BE BURNIN' IN DAMNATION NOW AIN'T YE?
-.-
Hooray for more character-by-character testing of very tedious stuff >.<
Anyways, it's ok to hit her with the dair because even if you can't jab lock you can still get a free aerial in afterwards. All said and done, that's going to be at least 35 damage you just did which is nice considering you finish the true combo with the momentum still very heavily in your favor (thus allowing for non-true comboing).
Dark Sonic
Smash Hero
You could also just turn around and jab when they land behind you, instead of being lazy and buffering your jabs during a jab lock.
And you guys should know that it's possible to control the direction that you set the jab lock in by changing the timing on the dair. If you delay both the up B and the dair a little bit each, you can land behind most characters when setting up the jab lock (without breaking the combo). This is character specific of course, since with some characters you already land behind them with the dair, and others then you don't have enough time to delay it and land behind them.
I think we should just make a list of characters that require you to reverse up B during this. And we can even have a second list of which direction you'd be setting the jab lock in on different characters (foward or backwards, so that you know which side of your opponent you'd want to be on before trying to set this up.)
I've been working on a list like this. But if you wait for me you won't have your list until next week (FAST1 takes priority over list making). But I'll still be working on it if nobody else wants to do it.
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
I can't do this, I think I suck at the Spring to Dair timing.
I'm getting really angry about it
I'm getting really angry about it
landing direction is based on their DI and placement from the spring.
Also, it seems there's an upper limit for this combo.
at around 30% or so, the spring will actually SAVE them from a jab lock (think the "stun" animation from Nana's F-air at 0%)
:[
Also, it seems there's an upper limit for this combo.
at around 30% or so, the spring will actually SAVE them from a jab lock (think the "stun" animation from Nana's F-air at 0%)
:[
InterimOfZeal
Smash Champion
So, I just spent about 2-3 hours practicing this. I can do it semi-consistently now when just doing it, but I'm having a harder time landing it in actual matches (just doing it against a lvl 9 CPU in training mode, since they dodge outta everything ASAP). It'll take some practice, and it's not a HOMG game-breaker for Sonic, but if you can land it once a match, it gives you about 40-50%, and sets up for some very nice edgeguarding. End it with a charged dsmash, srsly.
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
I did it once(in an online match) and was so shocked I messed up the jabs after 3 and Fsmashed them. It was for a kill though so no harm done I guess. XD
InterimOfZeal
Smash Champion
My bad, 39%, roughly. Actually, just got 40% off from the middle. Charged dsmash is win.
Just got 41%. Either way, use charged dsmash. Sets up soooooooo well for edgeguarding.
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
HOW charged on the Dsmash? Like a one second charge?
TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
I guess if you take into account the d-smash is faster to charge it might actually become a better option damage and knock-back wise for finishing your jab-lock.
InterimOfZeal
Smash Champion
Just until they're standing up, and can't shield.
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
I agree with Izzy on the Down Smash.
That move is too good, and underrated. It's not being used the way Sonic was designed. I still find it hard to believe that only .00000000001% of Sonic players are starting to understand how this stupid character is played.
That move is too good, and underrated. It's not being used the way Sonic was designed. I still find it hard to believe that only .00000000001% of Sonic players are starting to understand how this stupid character is played.
Browny
Smash Hater
downsmash > landing lag from an airdodge, thats about all i use it for, and it works practically every time.
meh, I started picking up on this again since I'm transitioning to offline play (;D more people to play with IRL at uni)
So, playing with my brother, I got him in a wall jab lock and he SDI'd behind me ;__;
Anyway, do you guys usually use single-jab walks for jab lock, or do you do double jabs?
`.`; I'm still working on it, but I think you might be able to pull double jabs off.
So, playing with my brother, I got him in a wall jab lock and he SDI'd behind me ;__;
Anyway, do you guys usually use single-jab walks for jab lock, or do you do double jabs?
`.`; I'm still working on it, but I think you might be able to pull double jabs off.
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
why were the vids removed
TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
So that no one would ever learn that Sonic has potential... we must keep this secret locked away... deep within the bowels of the earth...
Which is to say I have no idea.
Which is to say I have no idea.
JMan8891
Halfrican-American
Yea... cause i def missed it
Aura Power
Smash Apprentice
Its too obvious Sonic has potential how can we get better if these things are kept hidden? Frankly I'd love to have more than a >B + Fair combo I want to see this. Please......
@new people:
The original combo was side-B>footstool>fast fall N-air, and it was revised to that, which turned out to be inescapable if performed correctly under 30% on most characters.
It starts from there.
The original combo was side-B>footstool>fast fall N-air, and it was revised to that, which turned out to be inescapable if performed correctly under 30% on most characters.
KirbyandSonicrock14
Smash Ace
Um, did I miss anything guys. I been busy getting ready for my trouney.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
nothing extra that you try to learn now, will do you any good, because you wont have enuff mastery over it to use it against competitive opponents.
BTW, try to get vids of at least some of your matches, i want to see how good you really are, i just hope your brawl skill is better than your typing of the english language. i want to see your kirby and yoru sonic
BTW, try to get vids of at least some of your matches, i want to see how good you really are, i just hope your brawl skill is better than your typing of the english language. i want to see your kirby and yoru sonic
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
its actually really not that hard once your get the timing down.
the only real issue is the spring timing, cause depending on where the spring hits them you have to change the direction of your spring/dair
the only real issue is the spring timing, cause depending on where the spring hits them you have to change the direction of your spring/dair
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
Oh. I just tend to do the spring instantly. No wonder I can't get it to work most of the time. XD
So you spring RIGHT when they hit the ground from the fsj?
So you spring RIGHT when they hit the ground from the fsj?
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
well, yes and no
you want the spring to hit them during their bounce after hitting the ground and move them in the direction your facing.
the way the lock works is extending the hit stun during that bounce, so you want to use the spring as though it where essentially the first hit of the jab.
it makes things a lot easier to make the spring hit them in the direction your already traveling, but its possible to change directions. it's just really tricky
you want the spring to hit them during their bounce after hitting the ground and move them in the direction your facing.
the way the lock works is extending the hit stun during that bounce, so you want to use the spring as though it where essentially the first hit of the jab.
it makes things a lot easier to make the spring hit them in the direction your already traveling, but its possible to change directions. it's just really tricky
Terios the Hedgehog
Smash Hero
OH! So it's like catching them with a laser for laser locking. 'Cept with springs.
memphischains
Smash hhkj'
i guess you can put it that way
TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
Hm, could you potentially use the spring midway through the jab lock? Like, jab them one way across the screen, spring them, dair to the other side, and them jab them back the other way? I think that'd be funny...
InterimOfZeal
Smash Champion
That's an interesting idea.
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Funny=Yes
Awesome=Yes
Possible=?
If it is Possible=HARD and probably impossible to pull off at high level competitive gameplay..
InterimOfZeal
Smash Champion
If it's possible, it's not impossible at high level play.
TwinkleToes
Smash Lord
Cama, at that point in the lock, if you can use it against a noob it'd be no different than using it against a pro. That's the entire idea of a lock.
Once again... I am unable to actually test this... which makes me feel worthless. But I am actually beginning to think it'd be somewhat feasible.
Once again... I am unable to actually test this... which makes me feel worthless. But I am actually beginning to think it'd be somewhat feasible.
No.
One of the reasons why I never really put time to learn this before was because of this limit:
Around 30% and higher (eh, different for each char, but something like that), a spring will put them in the "ow" inescapable "stun" phase (like Dedede's d-throw, or Sonic's tipped D-tilt, Nana F-air under 40%... etc). So if you hit them with a spring after say, 25%, the spring will actually save them from the jab lock.
But hey, free 40 damage doesn't sound too bad `.`;