Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[Bl@ckChris]

so...if i shouldn't be using aerials to make sure he doesn't come close...then should i just kinda camp; wavedash/dashdance to stay a moving target until he approaches, and then CC jab and other reactionary measures to counter whatever i see is coming?

edit: nuts linguini...i was hoping you'd come to HERB 3 with some of florida. ah well. maybe i'll go to apex.

 

[-ACE-]

so...if i shouldn't be using aerials to make sure he doesn't come close...then should i just kinda camp; wavedash/dashdance to stay a moving target until he approaches, and then CC jab and other reactionary measures to counter whatever i see is coming?

You can use aerials but against some characters like Fox/Falcon you don't want to be doing them very close in, as it gives them a free approach. Both are insanely fast and you have to be ready for them to approach at any moment.

**** linguini I was hoping you might come to HERB 3 also.

 

[spider_sense]

You can use aerials but against some characters like Fox/Falcon you don't want to be doing them very close in, as it gives them a free approach. Both are insanely fast and you have to be ready for them to approach at any moment.

**** linguini I was hoping you might come to HERB 3 also.

Psh, who needs Guini when you MIGHT get me.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

most technical ganon ever

 

[-ACE-]

Psh, who needs Guini when you MIGHT get me.

Seriously you might come? DO IT

Dittos all day

 

[Skyshroud]

so...if i shouldn't be using aerials to make sure he doesn't come close...then should i just kinda camp; wavedash/dashdance to stay a moving target until he approaches, and then CC jab and other reactionary measures to counter whatever i see is coming?

edit: nuts linguini...i was hoping you'd come to HERB 3 with some of florida. ah well. maybe i'll go to apex.

Watch Linguini vs. Kels from *Pound* 4. Kels plays a real defensive fox (at least in that set). If you watch, note how Linguini usually fades back with his aerials (really hard to punish), or empty shorthops and then wavelands to get in range. Also, when approaching, remember to mix up the height. SFFLing is great, but throw in some quick double jumps to mess with them, and try wavelanding on platforms when possible.

Eh, I'm a nice guy, so here's the link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AltMcPeuI6U&feature=related

One key note that I've found from playing spacies: don't be afraid of lasers. You are going to get hit by them, and they will rack up damage, but an overly aggressive approach will add a rack up damage a whole lot more quickly. Remember, one good tech chase or edgeguard evens it right back up. (Notice how Linguini tries to pressure and then predict a roll with a stomp. if it hits, he's now even or ahead, and it's hard to punish.)

Take that with a grain of salt. I'm not the best person to take advice from, since I'm not good at this game (yet), but I try to learn stuff and share when I can. Hopefully someone good backs me up on this.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

watched that match. it all makes sense. i know i should be more patient, but wow...thats impressive patience. guess my usual training partner will just have to get used to me playing the matchup correctly instead of whiffing aerials and thinking L-canceling + jab will save everything.

he'll have to get over it. i'm looking to get better. thanks skyshroud. i think i've finally found the answer i was looking for after like the 5th time asking about the matchup (this time i just asked about spacing, which put it in most direct terms).

now i just have to truly understand it, and begin to apply it. that should only take a year or so, right?

 

[precision]

lolz.

wow this is a great thread. ganon boards are pretty elaborate and detailed.

im watching that kels match and ive never seen a gayer play style. like its not even the cool smart gay. its the "im a ****** and i suck ***** on the side of the venue" type gayness. especially first stock.

2nd stock- the reads to grabs were phucking obnoxious. good **** emilio.

 

[Divinokage]

Ya Linguini's defensive game is too good. =P

 

[spider_sense]

Definitely cannot stand campy foxes. I would have lost the game of patience right then and there.

Side note though - If you dash dance closely into fox it entices him to move out of his range and try to attack you.

 

[precision]

lol it intices him to run up shine > up smash at which point spider sense delivers a beautiful stomp on the head.

 

[spider_sense]

lol it intices him to run up shine > up smash at which point spider sense delivers a beautiful stomp on the head.

Get outta here you cwazy kid.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

when YL is spamming Dtilt, (which no good YL SHOULD do) Spam up+B! it outranges Dtilt! yay~

 

[ETWIST51294]

Can Ganon nipple spike?

 

[Bl@ckChris]

...moonwalk fair to the stage edge would be awesome. but if a nipple spike is what i think it is (a stage spike like...at the edge) then some runoff uairs i think would classify i think.

but i'm probably wrong lol

 

[ETWIST51294]

The top of Falcon's dair hitbox(nipples up lol) it's a spike. I was wondering if it was the same with Ganon.

 

[StealthyGunnar]

well ganon's dair hitbox goes up to his head, if that's what ur asking...

 

[-ACE-]

I'm pretty sure the dair can always be meteor canceled.

 

[ETWIST51294]

THANK YOU.

caps

 

[Divinokage]

Ya but people fail at it completely.. no players I have stomped were able to meteor cancel consistently. lol. There's always a way to trick people not to do it, and even if they try, it never works.

Also when I get stomped by Ganon, I fail too lol.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

yeah...once i learned that you have to reset the control stick before trying to meteor cancel, i got better at it. i still go up too early though...and once i hit up too early i have to go back to neutral in order to try again. i'm not usually fast enough to get two tries.

on another separate note, i got a tech jump bair the other day against a falco. it led to an edgeguard on the other side of the stage. i did like 20 tech jump uairs before i finally got the bair instead.

progress is fun.

 

[Dorsey]

Ace somehow daired me when I was WELL above him 2 nights ago. Getting stomped at ganon's head range is one thing, but i was more than a head over his head lol. Ridiculous.

I miss that meteor cancel all the time / I'm late with it... In a lot of situations like that my first thought is to walltech so i'll hesitate or not reset the stick.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

mmm.

question: is there anything ganon can do about falco's double laser off the ledge? i see it coming a lot in some of my opponents, but i can't figure out anything that i can do to counter it.

 

[-ACE-]

question: is there anything ganon can do about falco's double laser off the ledge? i see it coming a lot in some of my opponents, but i can't figure out anything that i can do to counter it.

I'd like to see what linguini says, but I like to stand there and jab lol. fulljump or dj bair have worked for me also, as well as dtilt sometimes.

Also, meteor canceling ganon's dair = eeeeasy

 

[RestInPeace]

I have problems against tech-chase loving Falcons. Help. I have my first tournament on Saturday (if I can get past parental johns), so help is much appreciated. The tournament is pretty hype.

 

[_Rocky_]

I don't play ganon but i am a falcon main and know the very basics of the matchup
i think you can jump out of all of falcons throws after 30% or so
also most people will be able to punish your tech rolls on reaction due to ganon's tech roll being slow, but they do need to read your neutral tech to punish it. keep that in mind but do not get predictable

most people here will probably give you much bettter advice tho

 

[-ACE-]

uthrow > knee is good on Ganon at like 80-120% or so, can't remember if it's still guaranteed for any DI (Magus). Uthtrow ***** since it isn't lagged by heavier characters (Ganon) like the dthrow is.

 

[_Rocky_]

uthrow > knee is good on Ganon at like 80-120% or so, can't remember if it's still guaranteed for any DI (Magus). Uthtrow ***** since it isn't lagged by heavier characters (Ganon) like the dthrow is.

my bad, should have specified

i think you can jump out of all of falcons throws to avoid teching after 30% or so

Didn't know uthrow knee worked on ganon btw, ty =o

 

[RestInPeace]

Falcon's Nairs are getting to me.

I just remembered reading somewhere that I should be grounded in this matchup, correct? Timing those angle-up FTilts are good, right? I tried doing that today, and I ended up using it after I landed with an aerial to cover up the space in case they try to approach.

Are there any other tips? I can edge guard consistently, so that's not a problem.

I would also like to know how it is possible to get grabs. Grabs are too good in this matchup, it leads to tech chases. And, I would like to know which throws you guys use at what percentages, still referring to Falcon. I saw Kage to UThrow at around 80% in that MM against Darkrain. Wouldn't it have been better to DThrow -> Aerial? Someone explain the whole throwing stuff to me. Thanks, Ganon boards.

 

[CluelessBTD]

Well, when you know a nair is coming just crouch cancel jab to ftilt at low percents.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

do you CC both hits, or just the first one and jab in between the hits?

i played with pp today and yesterday...and got ***** thoroughly. almost beat his luigi though...yeah...*continues to practice*

 

[CluelessBTD]

you should try to jab in between the two hits. It's possible.

 

[Bl@ckChris]

*sigh* i was afraid you'd say that. i've only done my first ever CC jab today. i think it was against like...pp's roy lol.

i've got such a long, long way to go...

 

[RestInPeace]

CC jab? How do you do that? I can't seem to get my jab out fast enough...

I just press down on the analog stick (not C Stick) and then release and press A, right? I release after I get hit, correct? I don't know why, but this is very hard to do even if I know the attack is coming. Am I doing something wrong or does it just require more practicing?

 

[Bl@ckChris]

i think the latter (more practicing...just like i need)...you can actually jab as you rise.

its like a ganon uppercut. i feel that rising jab should have a different animation...

 

[-ACE-]

Yeah, you'd want to CC to jab not grab. Grab can technically work with very good timing if he connects the 1st kick right when it first comes out, but it's usually not going to work.

If your controller is calibrated just right, you can CC jab by simply holding down & back and pressing A. With my current controller I need to plug it in/reset it while having the stick ever so slightly to the left (not really pressing it to the left but in the leftmost part of the 'wiggle' room in the neutral area of the stick). You can mash A with this method to make it easy and maintain your 'CC' while doing the jabs, so you can try to beat/outspace the 1st kick with a jab, and if it fails and the 1st kick gets you you'll still CC it and then you'll jab him between the kicks by continuing to press A.

If your controller doesn't work well with that method (you'll either turn around then down angled f-tilt or do a d-tilt), you could press and hold down then release it at the right time (after hitlag) then press A.

You could also try holding the control stick in a slightly compensated position for your controller, though it's a lot harder to position the stick quickly in that spot when you want it compared just pressing it into the diagonal notch of the controller and having it work right there.

Another way would be to hold down on the c-stick and you'll get the 'CC'/ASDI down to keep you grounded and can do the mashing A method, but you'd need to begin pressing it during another action or you'll d-smash obviously.

From a few pages back

 

[RestInPeace]

Alright, thanks. It means I'm just terribad.

 

[yummynbeefy]

i seem to be having problems wavelanding onto the stage from the ledge by a double jump anything to help with this

i can do it with most other characters

 

[Renth]

i seem to be having problems wavelanding onto the stage from the ledge by a double jump anything to help with this

i can do it with most other characters

you play street fighter, any street fighter in history of ever?

hit down ~> jump ~> roll to forward ~> R

Much like the Hadoken motion.

 

[spider_sense]

you play street fighter, any street fighter in history of ever?

hit down ~> jump ~> roll to forward ~> R

Much like the Hadoken motion.

Haha it's sorta like the quarter circle motion. Make sure you get up on the ledge first and then press L or R.