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Grand Old Thread: League of Legends!

NO-IDea

NO-IDea

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Apr 26, 2009
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Zak Swagger said:
That, and it honestly feels like top lane is the most unstable. If you fall behind at mid, you can still probably come back with smart plays and engages because you're typically dealing with skillshots and spells. At top, if you get fb'd or jungle camped for a bit and fall behind in farm...it's generally a LOT harder to come back from, in my experience.

Like, if you're behind at mid, you can at least usually use spells from decent range to farm. At bot, you can obviously just rely on your support and play extra safe. But top, if you're both melee...like, damn. Hate that feeling.

Last night for instance, I was Riven and I was fighting a Wukong. I find that matchup STUPID easy, except the enemy had a Xin and they were purple. So after I knew he got red buff and was coming top, I had to cut myself off from farm for a bit and fell way behind, and Wukong won the lane after that ~20 farm. I guess I should ask you guys, what could I have done there? Xin with red makes it really hard to just hophophop away, and Wukong had ignite.
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We discussed this already. Don't blow 835 on HoG if you're Riven.
 
Tmacc

Tmacc

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Zak Swagger said:
That, and it honestly feels like top lane is the most unstable. If you fall behind at mid, you can still probably come back with smart plays and engages because you're typically dealing with skillshots and spells. At top, if you get fb'd or jungle camped for a bit and fall behind in farm...it's generally a LOT harder to come back from, in my experience.

Like, if you're behind at mid, you can at least usually use spells from decent range to farm. At bot, you can obviously just rely on your support and play extra safe. But top, if you're both melee...like, damn. Hate that feeling.

Last night for instance, I was Riven and I was fighting a Wukong. I find that matchup STUPID easy, except the enemy had a Xin and they were purple. So after I knew he got red buff and was coming top, I had to cut myself off from farm for a bit and fell way behind, and Wukong won the lane after that ~20 farm. I guess I should ask you guys, what could I have done there? Xin with red makes it really hard to just hophophop away, and Wukong had ignite.
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I know exactly what you mean...falling behind top, ESPECIALLY IN THE FIRST FEW LEVELS, makes it super hard to have good trades, and if the opponent is any good, they will push that advantage hard. At that point, you have to simply out play them or get help from your jungler.

In that situation as Riven when you expect a gank, I'd say stay on the side of double bushes top as much as possible and save your CDs for escaping rather than any harass. Riven has some of the best escape abilities, including an AOE stun...so if you stay on the side of the upper two bushes, you have enough time to make a pretty easy escape.

This is augmented by the fact that Wu and Xin will try to use their gap closers...as soon as they use them, just W, then E and Q away. I don't think you really need to deny yourself any farm or exp in that situation.
 
DallasPhat

DallasPhat

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Mar 23, 2008
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Planking Gnes While He Watches Invincible Youth
NO-IDea said:
I'll discuss with them tonight. We should make it weekly Imo.

Winner gets to rename loser's region's social thread.
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Lmfao that's a legit bet. Yeah just tell me what's up, also add me my ign is dphat.
Also instead of draft tourney I was thinking about hosting a region tourney.
I think cali vs tx would be a hype 5v5 in league.
:phone:
 
Coney

Coney

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NO-IDea said:
You misunderstand. He just played bad. Ignore his excuses.
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Which is why I'm asking what I should have done differently? Obviously I played bad, that's why I lost a positive lane, just wanted to know if there was another answer, because playing passive wasn't working. Couldn't trade with Wu with CDs because Xin was perpetually top for the first five levels.

I mean, considering how often I lose when it isn't my fault, when I feel like I have part in a loss I'm going to find out exactly wtf I did wrong.

DallasPhat said:
Noid talking like he plays LoL.
Why is everyone from md/va so bad at this game?

:phone:
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WOW NOW I'M NEVER PLAYING WITH YOU
 
F

fkacyan

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Joined
Mar 15, 2008
Messages
6,226
If it's not Dphat (When he's not trolling), Jpak (See previous parens), Mogwai, Zac, Dekar, or some of the other Tx players, just ignore them because they're fishing for hits.

Yes, this does generally apply to myself.
 
NO-IDea

NO-IDea

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Tmacc said:
I know exactly what you mean...falling behind top, ESPECIALLY IN THE FIRST FEW LEVELS, makes it super hard to have good trades, and if the opponent is any good, they will push that advantage hard. At that point, you have to simply out play them or get help from your jungler.

In that situation as Riven when you expect a gank, I'd say stay on the side of double bushes top as much as possible and save your CDs for escaping rather than any harass. Riven has some of the best escape abilities, including an AOE stun...so if you stay on the side of the upper two bushes, you have enough time to make a pretty easy escape.

This is augmented by the fact that Wu and Xin will try to use their gap closers...as soon as they use them, just W, then E and Q away. I don't think you really need to deny yourself any farm or exp in that situation.
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Here's what happened:

We're blue side.

Riven got a lvl 2 gank from Noct straight from blue and blew Wu's flash. Riven proceeded to get first kill (not fb) in the lane on Wu.

Later, Riven gets ganked by Xin (with or without red, I don't recall) and trades kills when they turret dive.

Then, after some dueling, Wu barely scrapes a kill off of Riven due to a misplay.

Then, Wu gets babysat by Xin with red buff. Wu freezes lane in middle and farms maybe 2-3 waves of CS during this time.

Also important to mention, at some point before the babysitting, Riven, after getting Wriggles and Ninja Tabi, buys a HoG.

I was Soraka with CV during this time and we had vision when Xin would come top and when he started babysitting.


So many mistakes, both item build, dueling and farming that occurred. While I agree that in the last scenario, Riven couldn't venture out to farm or gain experience, it was all the blunders before that cost him the lane. He has no right to complain.

He should have begun dominating the lane after the first kill, while warding his lane. Which he did. But he shouldn't have died from the gank because he saw it coming. He shouldn't have lost the 1v1 duel. He shouldn't spend 835 on a HoG, especially when behind, especially on a champion where the value is health is superseded by AD. Could have easily been DBlades and Pots just to establish lane dominance and destroy Wu if he couldn't farm enough for BF sword.

Riven vs Wu = ez win for Riven.

Zak better see this. Tried to tell him last night, but he was upset after loss.
 
Coney

Coney

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NO-IDea said:
Here's what happened:

We're blue side.

Riven got a lvl 2 gank from Noct straight from blue and blew Wu's flash. Riven proceeded to get first kill (not fb) in the lane on Wu.

Later, Riven gets ganked by Xin (with or without red, I don't recall) and trades kills when they turret dive.

Then, after some dueling, Wu barely scrapes a kill off of Riven due to a misplay.

Then, Wu gets babysat by Xin with red buff. Wu freezes lane in middle and farms maybe 2-3 waves of CS during this time.

Also important to mention, at some point before the babysitting, Riven, after getting Wriggles and Ninja Tabi, buys a HoG.

I was Soraka with CV during this time and we had vision when Xin would come top and when he started babysitting.


So many mistakes, both item build, dueling and farming that occurred. While I agree that in the last scenario, Riven couldn't venture out to farm or gain experience, it was all the blunders before that cost him the lane. He has no right to complain.

He should have begun dominating the lane after the first kill, while warding his lane. Which he did. But he shouldn't have died from the gank because he saw it coming. He shouldn't have lost the 1v1 duel. He shouldn't spend 835 on a HoG, especially when behind, especially on a champion where the value is health is superseded by AD. Could have easily been DBlades and Pots just to establish lane dominance and destroy Wu if he couldn't farm enough for BF sword.

Riven vs Wu = ez win for Riven.

Zak better see this. Tried to tell him last night, but he was upset after loss.
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Okay but like, when was I ever complaining? I get I made bad decisions and lost my lane because I made mistakes and played too cautiously. I don't think anyone in the thread cares, just wanted some opinions on one specific scenario and that was it, because I'm trying to find any options I didn't consider. Get the stick out of your ***.
 
NO-IDea

NO-IDea

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Zak Swagger said:
Okay but like, when was I ever complaining? I get I made bad decisions and lost my lane because I made mistakes and played too cautiously. I don't think anyone in the thread cares, just wanted some opinions on one specific scenario and that was it, because I'm trying to find any options I didn't consider. Get the stick out of your ***.
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Chill.

You explained to them a scenario where really there was no option. From where the farm was and where Xin was hiding, you couldn't approach. You just have to sit it out and wait, where then their jungler would fall drastically behind our jungler.

We'd make it up by having better jungler (lvl and farm-wise) and far stronger dragon control. In fact, we did get the first 2 dragons in that game. That makes up for the CS differential.

What you explained to them isn't why you lost your lane.

And I post the same way I talk to you on skype. What is this "stick up your ***" nonsense. Be a man. We're FNB, I will tell you what's up when you need it. And I want us to become better players so when we scrim losers like TX, we win.
 
Coney

Coney

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NO-IDea said:
Chill.

You explained to them a scenario where really there was no option. From where the farm was and where Xin was hiding, you couldn't approach. You just have to sit it out and wait, where then their jungler would fall drastically behind our jungler.

We'd make it up by having better jungler (lvl and farm-wise) and far stronger dragon control. In fact, we did get the first 2 dragons in that game. That makes up for the CS differential.

What you explained to them isn't why you lost your lane.

And I post the same way I talk to you on skype. What is this "stick up your ***" nonsense. Be a man. We're FNB, I will tell you what's up when you need it. And I want us to become better players so when we scrim losers like TX, we win.
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So that was it, just play super defensive top. I just got TOO defensive and didn't take CS, I get that. I don't respond to condescension well.
 
PhantomX

PhantomX

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Yeah... I think you guys would have had a much easier time if you got 16char to go Tiger Udyr, Mogwai. Like.. there is NOTHING Riven can do to Tiger Udyr, and Xin doesn't jungle so fast that Tiger Udyr can't keep up. Would have been a good choice.

But yes, at top if you are against Wu w/ a camping Xin, and you suspect getting camped, stay near your top bushes and try to CS while keeping an eye on enemy aggression. Since Riven wins that matchup he should rarely, if ever, engage on you. If he starts setting up for a charge, start running to your tower/into bush, so you are far enough away to make it hard for Xin to instajump you.

The matchup is hard enough in Riven's advantage that a 20 CS difference shouldn't lose it for you, and if Xin is camping top, your jungler should be applying pressure to mid/bottom or grabbing objectives/buffs.

@Thio - Ryze loses to gap closing top laners, and many of them can rush double null mantle (wits, hex, or mercs) and ruin him.
 
D

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i usually just go for cs blow flash when they gank -> lane pushes in ur favor --> free cs --> get flash again when it actually matters

very suboptimal but when jungler refuses to help u top after u hard leash them blu nothing you can really do
 
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