Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

Enigma735

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Wait, so why are people suggesting Steve was planned to be later in the Pass? I'm kinda lost.
 

Fatmanonice

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Whether Steve jumped the line one or two leads us to the same conclusion either way... There's at least one character who is all but confirmed "done" and is on hold until Nintendo decides to actually show it. In my opinion, this suggests the gap between Steve and this mystery character should at the very least be shorter than the time between Min Min and Steve.
 

Fatmanonice

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Wait, so why are people suggesting Steve was planned to be later in the Pass? I'm kinda lost.
New Sakurai Famitsu interview came out today saying Steve didn't even begin work until March and, according to Sakurai, wasn't delayed, meaning he came out in the timeframe he was intended to come out during. As we saw in the Fighter's Pass, Hero and Banjo began work in November/December 2018 meaning if Steve was really meant to be an E3 2020 reveal, he started work 4-5 months later than they did in order to be E3 2019 reveals. Obviously, a lot doesn't add up and it strongly calls into question if Steve was originally meant to be 77 to begin with.
 
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RetrogamerMax

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Whoa, these new theories sound like a 500 IQ Yugi-Oh! duel play. Hmm... then... does this mean Geno in Smash and Super Mario RPG port/remake for Christmas (potentially)? 🤔
Pharaoh/Geno fans: Check mate Kaiba/Nintendo! Game set and match!

Kaiba/Nintendo: As President of Kaiba Corp/Nintendo I declare this invalid!
 

MattX20

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If the interview regarding Steve is indeed accurate, that could potentially mean FP8 and FP9 are farther along in development than we initially surmised and chances are the former will be an end of year reveal/release
 

Enigma735

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Okay, I'm starting to understand it now. Honestly, I think Steve was probably planned for 8. I really don't think 9 was planned until Spring 2021 honestly but I'm 99% sure that this year's E3 was supposed to be a repeat of Banjo and Hero where two characters are revealed at E3, one with a summer release and the other a fall release. If Steve was always planned to release in the Fall, then its very possible that 7 was planned with a summer release and this character is most likely in a playable state now.

Now if this character is Geno, which I find pretty likely, then 7 theory lives on I guess.
 

RetrogamerMax

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If the interview regarding Steve is indeed accurate, that could potentially mean FP8 and FP9 are farther along in development than we initially surmised and chances are the former will be an end of year reveal/release
That's only if Nintendo will be kind enough to reveal FP8 this year. I feel like they won't as revealing the Fighter's Pass characters along with their plans is more important than announcing said characters at a reasonable pace.
 

Fatmanonice

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Yeah, but who’s to say that character was Geno?
The odds are definitely in his favor especially if insiders thought E3's replacement was supposed to be July 20th, only for Nintendo to not communicate this and leading to even bigwigs like Imran Khan getting juked.
 

ctt4lfecw

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The odds are definitely in his favor especially if insiders thought E3's replacement was supposed to be July 20th, only for Nintendo to not communicate this and leading to even bigwigs like Imran Khan getting juked.
I got a response from Fatman?! cues Wayne and Garth “We’re not worthy!” :geno:
 
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pinshadow

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New Sakurai Famitsu interview came out today saying Steve didn't even begin work until March and, according to Sakurai, wasn't delayed, meaning he came out in the timeframe he was intended to come out during. As we saw in the Fighter's Pass, Hero and Banjo began work in November/December 2018 meaning if Steve was really meant to be an E3 2020 reveal, he started work 4-5 months later than they did in order to be E3 2019 reveals. Obviously, a lot doesn't add up and it strongly calls into question if Steve was originally meant to be 77 to begin with.
Interjecting here, Sakurai didn't say Steve wasn't delayed, what he said was "Steve was also developed entirely during the COVID-19 pandemic, making development difficult", which carries the same implications since if Steve only started active development after stuff really starting shutting down, that's about March, giving us time-frame of about 5 months to the playable state we saw from the presentation recorded in August and 7 months to the final polished release, which lines up with how long certain characters have taken in the past.

It's annoying how much Steve being pushed to earlier in the Pass actually explains things since it's the kind of insane sounding stuff I like to avoid. A little odd that the first third-party character in Pass 2 is another Western character despite them being seen as very difficult before Banjo just last year? He wasn't meant to be 7. Why did it take so long just to see the next character if they were meant to be revealed in June? The actual number 7 got pushed back and Steve wasn't ready.

Of course that forces us to ask why the hell 7 would get swapped in the first-place, and if it wasn't development issues (given Min-Min and Steve were two of the hardest characters they've had to implement mechanics wise) then 7 would have had to have been tied to an announcement of some kind. Oh boy. I'm still not fully onboard with this even if I am the guy proposing it, again because basing theories off theories isn't the most stable method of speculation, but like, Steve not starting active development until the Pandemic hit is the most confusing factoid we've gotten in awhile.
 
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MattX20

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Interjecting here, Sakurai didn't say Steve wasn't delayed, what he said was "Steve was also developed entirely during the COVID-19 pandemic, making development difficult", which carries the same implications since if Steve only started active development after stuff really starting shutting down, that's about March, giving us time-frame of about 5 months to the playable state we saw from the presentation recorded in August and 7 months to the final polished release, which lines up with how long certain characters have taken in the past.

It's annoying how much Steve being pushed to earlier in the Pass actually explains things since it's the kind of insane sounding stuff I like to avoid. A little odd that the first third-party character in Pass 2 is another Western character despite them being seen as very difficult before Banjo just last year? He wasn't meant to be 7. Why did it take so long just to see the next character if they were meant to be revealed in June? The actual number 7 got pushed back and Steve wasn't ready.

Of course that forces us to ask why the hell 7 would get swapped in the first-place, and if it wasn't development issues (given Min-Min and Steve were two of the hardest characters they've had to implement mechanics wise) then 7 would have had to have been tied to an announcement of some kind. Oh boy. I'm still not fully onboard with this even if I am the guy proposing it, again because basing theories off theories isn't the most stable method of speculation, but like, Steve not starting active development until the Pandemic hit is the most confusing factoid we've gotten in awhile.
Like Fatman said earlier, no matter how you look at it, it all but implies FP7/FP8 was ready for ages and has yet to be revealed proper
 

ctt4lfecw

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I thought Steve was in development for 5 years though. You mean that was just negotiations? And they didn’t start work on him until March? But you know Sakurai just didn’t have Steve going on, he’s got the other characters getting worked on too. I still say if Geno is coming, that Sakurai probably got him around the time Hero was being worked on. So Square had one character per pass ala Microsoft with Banjo and Steve.
 

RetrogamerMax

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I thought Steve was in development for 5 years though. You mean that was just negotiations? And they didn’t start work on him until March? But you know Sakurai just didn’t have Steve going on, he’s got the other characters getting worked on too. I still say if Geno is coming, that Sakurai probably got him around the time Hero was being worked on. So Square had one character per pass ala Microsoft with Banjo and Steve.
No, it just took around 5 years to negotiate to get the rights to Minecraft in Smash.
 

Enigma735

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I thought Steve was in development for 5 years though. You mean that was just negotiations? And they didn’t start work on him until March? But you know Sakurai just didn’t have Steve going on, he’s got the other characters getting worked on too. I still say if Geno is coming, that Sakurai probably got him around the time Hero was being worked on. So Square had one character per pass ala Microsoft with Banjo and Steve.
I highly doubt Steve was actually being worked on before we even had Ultimate announced. My prediction is that negotiations for Steve lasted for 5 years, and actual development for Steve lasted for 2 or 3 years
 
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JoscarGamma

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Damn this is an interesting theory. Question is, would the original 7 and 8 get pushed back, or immediately follow Steve?

If insiders were theorizing Geno as 7, maybe he got pushed back towards the end of the pass for a reveal for e3 2021? (I’d hate to wait that long, but then again I’ve been waiting for years, so...)

or he is a stand alone announcement within the coming months. Isn’t speculation fun?
 

TheCJBrine

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I thought Steve was in development for 5 years though. You mean that was just negotiations? And they didn’t start work on him until March? But you know Sakurai just didn’t have Steve going on, he’s got the other characters getting worked on too. I still say if Geno is coming, that Sakurai probably got him around the time Hero was being worked on. So Square had one character per pass ala Microsoft with Banjo and Steve.
The 5 years thing was just talks between Mojang and Nintendo about potentially putting Minecraft in Smash.

It’s kind of crazy to imagine what they had to go through in terms of discussions with Steve. Not only did the Japanese Nintendo/Sora/Namco have to go through the American Microsoft multiple times but also the Swedish Mojang probably even more times. That’s 3 layers of translation that had to be had just about every conversation over the course of 5 years. Lmao what a nightmare.
They may have only had 2 layers of translation; Jens and Agnes speak English very well, and Mojang's higher-ups who don't do game development (that I know of; like the head of the studio and whoever) seem to speak English as well iirc.
 
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AugustusB

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Jumping in from my video game binge (I missed so many games!)

This is incredibly interesting, to say the least. Let's say that plans indeed changed for the order of fighter's pass 2. What would have caused the change, other than Covid? As pinshadow pinshadow mentioned one thing could be that there was an announcement to go with Fighter 7. Now, that may not be the case, but one thing that got my attention and others was the ever present teasing from credible insiders leading up to the 1st partner showcase. "SMRPG, ITS GREAT!! Hyuck hyuck!" The majority of people here and elsewhere are aware of rumors pertaining to SMRPG either getting a sequel or a remake.

I am just throwing that out there, but I am glad there is SOMETHING to speculate about now. Hope everyone is doing well.
 
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QQS

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In Christmas wishes come true for kids, mostly.
In Christmas 1997 I got SMRPG from my father. Now in Christmas 2020, Geno for Smash can be our gift; remembering the almost 25 years since he appeared, breaking the hearts of the kids here who played as Geno back in those days, and of course the new generations, or should I say Genorations?

Geno for Smash in December would be amazing, a Game Awards or Christmas Reveal, to a January download, almost close to his 25° birthday. It will come 100% playable + SMRPG to the NSO.

Please Santa Sakurai grant this final wish. I don’t know if I have such amount of tears to release when the reveals starts with his music, animations, stars, forests, puppets or Mario finding him. Or maybe Kirby or Rosalina also.

That teleport to 1997-1998 playing as Geno as a kid, will make the 30 years old me explode in happiness.

I don’t know in which CP, but Geno for Smash is a reality.
 

YsDisciple

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Guys... it just hit me. We are currently in the year that marks the SMRPG 24th Anniversary. Every Year, Christmas Eve falls on December 24th. Next year would mark the 25th Anniversary of SMRPG. December 25th is Christmas Day. Could Geno ACTUALLY have been moved for a more fitting and symbolic release in December within the time frame that transitions from SMRPGs 24th to its 25th Anniversary?🤯
 

StarLight42

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I don’t buy Steve being swapped unless it was a swap of 7 and 8. Steve was always E3. There’s no better character to reveal at E3. He broke twitter.

Also, here’s something to think about


Keep in mind that SMRPG2/Remake seems to be rumored right now and Geno in Smash would’ve been good promotion for that
 
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ForsakenM

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I don’t buy Steve being swapped unless it was a swap of 7 and 8. Steve was always E3. There’s no better character to reveal at E3. He broke twitter.

Also, here’s something to think about


Keep in mind that SMRPG2/Remake seems to be rumored right now and Geno in Smash would’ve been good promotion for that
That no longer makes any sense though.

If Steve had been always for E3, he would have started development as early as 2019, not as late as three months before E3. That's not enough time even if you consider how Steve is easy to port over because of all the programming work done for him, he would NEVER have been ready to film for a trailer for E3.

For my own two cents about this situation...

This is entirely plausible and always has been. I always thought it was a bit off when Sakurai was explaining how difficult it was to move to work from home and how his communication with companies got cut off and how progress would likely have to just halt, and then suddenly around a month later the whole team is back on track and has adjusted despite many other companies still having issues? I originally chalked it up to Japanese work ethic, but when you think about how they could have easily moved onto characters that needed less communication or were just easier to make progress on, it makes sense that suddenly they are on track again after deciding who to focus on.

And they made the right call, because with this pandemic, guess who is based in Sweden...you know, that country that never locked down? Guess what character also has ties to Microsoft, a company that has no reason to have the important persons at play locked away? And when you know they would take a long time to program in the first place? Yeah, bumping Steve up makes so much sense.

Think about it this way:

If Steve was meant to be a E3 reveal but got delayed, why did they wait until March to start development for him?

If Steve was meant to be a E3 reveal but got delayed, how in the hell did they squeeze themselves into that date for MineCon on shorter notice?

If Steve was meant to be an E3 reveal but got delayed, why is his trailer so less dynamic and feels like it got cut short with development time?

It's much more likely that since E3 was cancelled and everything got delayed, they took the opportunity to work on which characters they could until things opened up again, and Steve happened to fit the bill. So long as things are better now, it's likely that whoever was supposed to be at E3 will be who we get next. I think we should REALLY keep our eyes open in the coming weeks.
 

StarLight42

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I disagree. I seriously doubt Steve was 9 unless it was a Game Awards reveal or something. You don't reveal the biggest character in gaming in a standard Nintendo Direct.

I think what you're not accounting for is the fact that Smash Ultimate DLC development may have always planned to slow down a bit, and that's why Steve wasn't started until March
 

Mr. Peepee

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Well, at least we still have that Mii Costume being MIA. Without it, Geno’s chances would be severely lowered imo.
 

Fatmanonice

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I disagree. I seriously doubt Steve was 9 unless it was a Game Awards reveal or something. You don't reveal the biggest character in gaming in a standard Nintendo Direct.

I think what you're not accounting for is the fact that Smash Ultimate DLC development may have always planned to slow down a bit, and that's why Steve wasn't started until March
I disagree with your disagreement.

fatman_dance.gif


Anyways, Steve being 9 could have made sense if Steve was planned to be revealed around Minecon because the fall Directs are usually early to mid September anyways.
 
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Enigma735

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Either way, I don't think Steve possibly being saved for CP8 doesn't really change speculation considering most of us have already been guessing that Steve and CP8 cough Geno cough were planned for E3. I have no doubt in my mind that Steve was planned to be an E3 reveal considering Minecraft's popularity and the fact that Steve literally broke Twitter in half. However, I also think we were planned to get another reveal at E3 as we usually always have a double reveal at E3. And to speculate about Geno for a little bit, I think Steve kinda took the Hero slot of being a character from a widely popular game, and I think Geno easily fills the Banjo slot for being a character that isn't relevant, but has been kept relevant for being a popular and heavily demanded character for Smash. That's another big reason why I am hard betting on Geno being next, because considering Steve and 8 were going to be the E3 reveals, I have a great feeling the next character will also be pretty big just like Steve, but unlike Steve, being a major character for the more hardcore crowd of Smash fans like Ridley, K. Rool and Banjo.
 
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StarLight42

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Okay so apparently this whole “Steve was started in March” thing was an assumption made by a Sakurai column post that said Steve was developed during entirely the pandemic?

Yeah... i’m backing away from this theory now. That type of comment is very open to interpretation and Covid did hit Japan as early as January even if a state of emergency wasn’t announced until April

My stance is that Steve was always E3, 7 or 8. His release could’ve always been planned to be near Minecon. Banjo did release in September of last year after all.
 
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