I know, haha. I found that image at the end of a GameXplain video and that's literally the best quality image (yet alone the ONLY image) I could find.
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Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior
- Thread starter PsychoIncarnate
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KoopaSaki
Smash Ace
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
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- 559
I’d appreciate it if I could see your take on this guys. This came from my buds on the Isaac thread. It’s discussion on the square rep.
Burr.
Smash Cadet
i still really believe that Geno is the most likely DLC candidate because,again,he is easier to add than any of the other square characters that mught be in the game so do not lose hope.
If Sakurai just barely got Cloud in the base roster just imagine the nightmare Nintendo would have to go through for getting Sora or a Dragon's Quest character.
So instead of wasting time and money for negotiating for another character,why not use the rights they already have for Geno? It would be dumb to spend a ton more money on a character instead of just using a character you can already use. Besides,with Sora being a Disney character it would be bad for Nintendo to advertise Disney in their game because they are going to become theme park competitors soon with Super Nintendo World or whatever it's called being built at Universal Studio theme park. Dragon's Quest from what i hear is Legal hell so with that ontop of Square Stinginess,it's just not worth it to go through the hassle when you already have a character to use.
Don't completely lose hope,our chances are high.
If Sakurai just barely got Cloud in the base roster just imagine the nightmare Nintendo would have to go through for getting Sora or a Dragon's Quest character.
So instead of wasting time and money for negotiating for another character,why not use the rights they already have for Geno? It would be dumb to spend a ton more money on a character instead of just using a character you can already use. Besides,with Sora being a Disney character it would be bad for Nintendo to advertise Disney in their game because they are going to become theme park competitors soon with Super Nintendo World or whatever it's called being built at Universal Studio theme park. Dragon's Quest from what i hear is Legal hell so with that ontop of Square Stinginess,it's just not worth it to go through the hassle when you already have a character to use.
Don't completely lose hope,our chances are high.
paper roxy
Smash Ace
"geno doesnt benefit them at all" is the stupidest thing ive ever heard lol. they basically dont do anything with geno and itd be easy money for them to make geno dlc
Burr.
Smash Cadet
i mean,let's be honest Geno hasn't been relevant at least to the general public. He won't profit as much as Sora or DQ but saying that Geno wouldn't benefit them at all is just dumb. Geno would definitely benefit them because im sure many smash fans that have supported Geno would instantly buy the DLC fighter's pass or just Geno's fighter pass. he has been a highly requested character for the past decade and im sure he would sell well.
TBone06
Smash Ace
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Even though I don't feel good about the spirit situation, at the very least, we know they have the ability to use him. I don't think any other Square rep is as easily attainable, but I always had the feeling spirits deconfirmed characters. But if Cloud isn't in WoL, then maybe other DLC characters wouldn't be in WoL, meaning the Spirit really means nothing. Geno is still the easiest Square character to get.
I'm not giving up hope, but my hope definitely took a big hit.
I'm not giving up hope, but my hope definitely took a big hit.
D
Deleted member
Guest
This is entirely opinional, they don't have any reason to believe that, unless they don't want him or are unaware why he would benefit Nintendo
Sovereign Trinity
Smash Ace
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"Geno doesn't benefit them at all"
This makes me want to facepalm so hard. Have they forgot about the paid DLC and amiibos? That's how Square gets benefit from Cloud in Smash 4, in fact, they still are right now for the ones who are buying his character from Smash 4 and the amiibos. Also, Cloud and Geno are both 100% Square property, that means they get benefit instead of the profit going to Disney or Armor Project. Also, Dragon Quest isn't likely due to Armor Project and the composer being very difficult to negotiate with, just like the FF7 composer; same goes for Crono from Chrono Trigger.
If Geno is being made for paid DLC and gets an amiibo, both of those profits will go directly to Square. End of discussion.
paper roxy
Smash Ace
i mean, geno is pretty relevant with the snes classic selling super well and how popular mario rpg when it was only on the snes
Necro Toad
Smash Apprentice
I don't know if all these emotions are driving me crazy, but I noticed something curious:
1- Apparently some character was removed from the game (z92) and from what we can deduce he would be a character from Nintendo and not third parties.
2- Geno's and Mellow's spirits are considered Mario characters (the same way that Geno's Mii outfit was).
3- According to PolarPanda's source no one knows any thing about DLC so don't trust anyone.
4- Vergeben don't have any good news about DLCs since that "Square Rep talk", what can confirms the PolarPanda's warning about nobody knows anything about DLC.
5- Vergeben has also been very cautious about leaking something related to Smash Ultimate, but on the same side he seems very sure about Square Rep beeing on of the DLC characters.
So you've probably already understood my point, but anyway:
What if Geno was the removed character from the game and that's how Vergeben knows about him, even don't knowing any other DLC characters? Nintendo put Geno as a Mario character anyway. Also apparently he was already been removed from the game before (Brawl or SSB4 I don't remember the speculations exactly).
I know this is not a really strong theory but what reasons would Nintendo have to take a character out of the game so lately that he already was registered in the game's codes? I seems that the character was in development, at least, for it to be added to the final code of the game. And so why not release it? I can't imagine Nintendo having reasons for that and throwing in the garbage so much effort in a game that was developed in such short time. But in other hand a character that is also controlled by Square is another story, I can see this happening.
Maybe the situation was like: "Square has been so slow and is controlling every detail related to it's characters in the negotiations that Sakurai has to start developing it's 2 reps even don't knowing exactly all the details and when one of then (Geno) was pushed to DLC than Sakurai halted he's development until the game was ready but he's ID was already in the game."
Something like this, just an example.
1- Apparently some character was removed from the game (z92) and from what we can deduce he would be a character from Nintendo and not third parties.
2- Geno's and Mellow's spirits are considered Mario characters (the same way that Geno's Mii outfit was).
3- According to PolarPanda's source no one knows any thing about DLC so don't trust anyone.
4- Vergeben don't have any good news about DLCs since that "Square Rep talk", what can confirms the PolarPanda's warning about nobody knows anything about DLC.
5- Vergeben has also been very cautious about leaking something related to Smash Ultimate, but on the same side he seems very sure about Square Rep beeing on of the DLC characters.
So you've probably already understood my point, but anyway:
What if Geno was the removed character from the game and that's how Vergeben knows about him, even don't knowing any other DLC characters? Nintendo put Geno as a Mario character anyway. Also apparently he was already been removed from the game before (Brawl or SSB4 I don't remember the speculations exactly).
I know this is not a really strong theory but what reasons would Nintendo have to take a character out of the game so lately that he already was registered in the game's codes? I seems that the character was in development, at least, for it to be added to the final code of the game. And so why not release it? I can't imagine Nintendo having reasons for that and throwing in the garbage so much effort in a game that was developed in such short time. But in other hand a character that is also controlled by Square is another story, I can see this happening.
Maybe the situation was like: "Square has been so slow and is controlling every detail related to it's characters in the negotiations that Sakurai has to start developing it's 2 reps even don't knowing exactly all the details and when one of then (Geno) was pushed to DLC than Sakurai halted he's development until the game was ready but he's ID was already in the game."
Something like this, just an example.
childishgamgeno
Smash Journeyman
I’ll be honest, I don’t like the way this looks. Mostly because the Mii Costume would’ve been a better fit for this fight and I said Mega Man as a joke. This makes me feel more like he couldn’t secure Geno, which makes the SE Rep talk confusing. If there’s already a “Geno’s in through spirits” section, it makes if hard for me to see why put effort in putting in Geno OTHER than just to please us.
However, playing Devils Advocate to devils advocate, like I said earlier, based on the list of spirits if they all go down like this, and spirits reconfirm then NO ONE is getting in cuz that’s over 1000 spirits. Also DLC could totally change up the game and render past decisions moot. Nothing is set is stone and now I’m more on the Spirits don’t deconfirm train, but this still worries me
Geno would do them favors in my opinion because of his immense popularity not only in America, but also in Japan. He’s a highly requested character (I would argue more so than Chrom and Dark Samus) and I can’t name a SE rep (other thank Sora) more requested. Dragon Quest characters and other FF characters are potentially good ideas, but this is new due to the news of an SE rep.
ALSO: Geno is the only SE Rep directly tied to Nintendo which makes me always think he has an edge up.
Nier: A, while plausible, and a popular game, doesn’t feel super viable to me in comparison to Sora or Geno or even another FF character. Especially if HEAVY HITTER CLOUD had trouble getting in and in a RETURNING ROLE I think it’s more difficult to get 2B. Unless they are more willing to budge on a newer character. But newer characters don’t seem plausible to Sakurai. And remember, JC from Nintendo says that Nintendo hears us, and the source from yesterday say they pay for fan reactions. Also, 2B just showed up in Soul Calibur so idk
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PsychoIncarnate
The Eternal Will of the Swarm
Actually, lol, Mallo is a confirmed spirit as well
So this game has Mallo and Mallow
Fatmanonice
Banned via Warnings
Main taking away points:
-Dragon Quest is owned by Armor Project, not Square Enix.
-All of Dragon Quest's music is separately liscensed by Koichi Sugiyama, infamous for being very vocally anti LGBT and denying Japanese war crimes.
-Dragon Quest characters have never appeared in games that Square Enix didn't publish or develop.
-Dragon Quest is overwhelmingly more popular in Japan with an estimated 93% of the series' sales being from there.
-Dragon Quest was never released on the Wii or Wii U Virtual Console in any region and none of the games were on the NES or SNES Classic either aside from a very limited Shonen Jump edition of the NES Classic that was a Japanese exclusive.
-The last Nintendo exclusive was a Rocket Slime spin-off in 2011 for the DS. There were three games in this series and all but one were Japanese exclusives.
-Dragon Quest has no immediately recognizable characters to a global audience except Slime.
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OptimisticStrifer
Smash Champion
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- 2,403
I wonder what
PolarPanda
has to say about this....
PolarPanda
has to say about this....bardbowman
Smash Apprentice
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- 165
There’s literally no other way SE could ever make any money off of Geno unless it involves Nintendo. And given how well Geno has fared in polls and such, they know that it’d be an impressive amount.
Conversely, there are countless ways they could make lots of money on the rest of their IP that don’t necessarily require Nintendo.
That’s how I see the “literally no benefit” issue.
Conversely, there are countless ways they could make lots of money on the rest of their IP that don’t necessarily require Nintendo.
That’s how I see the “literally no benefit” issue.
PolarPanda
Smash Ace
Actually.. one of NoA's most liked tweets of this entire year was the 22nd anniversary SMRPG post that included #TeamGeno. He and his game are definitely still VERY remember and respected by Nintendo. Compare that to how much SNES classic outsold expectations and SMRPG was on it (not even Chrono Trigger was). That, and SMRPG was one of the best selling VC games on Wii and Wii U. I wouldn't say it's relevant in the sense that it's getting a new game, but everytime it's been available to the public in the last 5 years, it's gotten a lot of attention.
PsychoIncarnate
The Eternal Will of the Swarm
He posted earlier. He had no new newsI wonder what
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
And two playable Roys.
Sigran101
Smash Master
Is it confirmed he's the one who did it?
Mellowy Yellow
Smash Lord
This spirits crap is Nintendo's best attempt at making me want to despise them, holy ****
PolarPanda
Smash Ace
About the spirit debacle?I wonder what
I don't think spirits mean anything. The spirits were clearly chosen by the development team, whereas the pool of dlc fighters were chosen by Nintendo, not the Smash team. I feel like the spirit list is unrelated.
Piranha Plant I'm pretty confident was a Sakurai decision. At least, that's the way I took it. In that case, it makes sense he has no spirit since he was chosen by the Smash team.
About the mii costume cut? Now that's mysterious. It could be alluding to a promotion into a playable fighter. Perhaps it's a hint. As we all know, all third party mii costumes were cut. But Geno's a special case. The heihaichi and lloyd irving mii costumes being gone makes sense considering they have no spirits. The mega man and sonic mii costumes being gone is ok since they have playable fighters. HOWEVER, they clearly COULD use Geno considering he's a spirit, but they deliberately cut his. For whatever reason, I feel like it means something. In a positive way.
Nintendo didn't choose the spirit list, that was the Smash team... Let's wait and see what we get for DLC fighters since they are different groups of people.
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RingJ5
Smash Ace
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You forgot one important point about the composer: Not only is he a terrible person personality-wise, he’s ridiculously stingy when it comes to licensing his music, as well. Best example is the fact that the Western PS4 release of the newest game got literal MIDI files of his orchestral compositions, while the original Japanese one included the full performances, apparently so he could sell separate album CDs or some other dumb reason like that.
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Sovereign Trinity
Smash Ace
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One thing to tell you is that Sora is a Disney rep, and a DQ character would be an Armor Project rep.
It's one thing to think about how difficult it must've been to put Cloud in the game, so I'm not sure if Nintendo is up for getting someone even more expensive than Cloud, which would be someone like another FF rep, Sora (Disney), Lara Croft, a DQ character (Armor Project), a NieR character, etc., but because Geno and Mallow seemed to be the easiest and least difficult to get, and since they already have the rights to use them in the game, I can see one of them being upgraded to a newcomer as DLC. Hopefully there is a Square rep coming for DLC, and remember that Square likes having their characters show up as DLC, so I still have hope for a Square character as DLC. I don't think Square will let Nintendo get away with having Cloud being in for free, they'll want something else for benefit, too.
About a NieR character showing up for Smash, I don't see it. 2B just showed up as DLC in Soul Calibur VI and NieR is only on PlayStation and Xbox, so I don't see a NieR character making it in. However, a NieR character would be very interesting in Smash Brothers.
Hmm, I don't think I can see it. Do you think you could underline the outlines that could show Baby Rosalina so I could see it better?
Something like this, for example?
http://prntscr.com/lmmo0t
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
If my favorite character was always getting shafted by their rightsholders and getting called irrelevant by stuck-up members of the Smash community for over 10 years, I'd be pretty pissed.
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
Ravioko
Smash Journeyman
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Believe me, I get that.
But as someone who is almost constantly lurking on this forum, just about every post from them is just...angry swearing, talking about how Square Enix and Nintendo are the worst companies of all time.
I get being upset but it just spreads negativity and makes people - myself included - not really want to contribute to discussion. Plus, on top of even that, just seems really childish.
No clue. Lol. That's why I'm trying to absolutely confirm or deconfirm the picture as Mallow. If it is Mallow, I've never seen an official image of him screaming like that so I'm trying to see if it's a new render of him or not Mallow at all.
Fatmanonice
Banned via Warnings
Christ... That's bad. You can't do that for a game like Smash that's probably going to outsell Brawl. The PS4 NA release of Dragon Quest XI sold roughly 80k but globally Ultimate will be estimated to sell several million... in its first week.
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
I'm honestly scared how people might react if Geno doesn't turn out to be DLC.
Sovereign Trinity
Smash Ace
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And a Final Fantasy character is out of the question. It's common sense, really:
-The FF7 composer doesn't want to cooperate with Sakurai or Nintendo, so we still only have two music tracks; he's strict, too, even when Square wants something from him, he has a hard time negotiating with Square.
-The FF7 composer is taking a hiatus, he has been since September, so I wouldn't expect to be getting anything Final Fantasy or Chrono Trigger related. (I'd be surprised if we did.)
-If Cloud was already difficult to get in, then I doubt Nintendo would be up for getting another Final Fantasy character; Sakurai would do the same and not go through the trouble of getting ANOTHER one. And what's the point in getting another FF character if we can't have any new remixes or rips from Final Fantasy? The FF7 composer won't allow it. Yeah, I just don't see it, same with Crono because the FF7 composer also composed for Chrono Trigger.
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
Super Mario RPG's composer has already done music for Smash.....
KirbyWorshipper2465
Smash Legend
Yeah. Man's talented, but eeeeeep. Lord knows how many folks in Japan barely stand working with the guy, Horii has the patience of a saint.
People giving up support for all SE characters forever. Even Bub.
The best part is she's very easy to work with, too.Super Mario RPG's composer has already done music for Smash.....
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OptimisticStrifer
Smash Champion
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Part of me wonders if we get some other Square rep, do we boycott that rep or do we make an effort to buy it so SE continues to see the worth in investing in Smash? Thoughts?
Grunky Peep
Smash Journeyman
We just hope for a second Fighter Pass.
RingJ5
Smash Ace
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I straight-up will not buy the Square rep if it turns out to be yet another anime swordfighter, with the only exception being a Sora that actually includes heavy Disney representation.
If it’s a DQ protagonist, Chrono, or a Sora that’s as divorced from Disney as they can possibly make him, I’m out, and will just wait for the next character.
domriver
Smash Lord
Id take it!I actually like the idea ofPsychoIncarnate of having Geno and Mallow as a tag team, like Pokemon Trainer. That would be sweet!
Wow - very interesting! Minecraft Boss hmmmm..
Sovereign Trinity
Smash Ace
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Yoko knows we love her work, and she's a great negotiator with Nintendo. She's much better than a composer who acts like some spoiled brat that doesn't want to share a piece of their cookie.Super Mario RPG's composer has already done music for Smash.....
If it isn't someone we wanted, then I'm not buying. They can be smart and listen to the Smash community instead of worrying about which character they own gives them the most business. Ironically for them, it would be Geno since 90% of the Smash community wants him, we have been for almost two decades, and they would do anything to get their hands on the Geno amiibo and his paid DLC character.
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