Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Diamond tool f-smash, bair and fair are wicked fast and strong. Fair in particular feels like a way better Mario fair with disjoint.

If I went back in time and told 12 year old me that Banjo, Steve, Ridley, K. Rool and quite possibly Geno would be in Smash one day, I think he'd lose his mind.

 

[GenoToto]

Without a doubt, Steve is probably the wackiest, funniest, and most entertaining DLC fighter I've encountered to date, next to my actual Ultimate main, Banjo. He's quick, he's snappy, his build mechanic leads to actual hilarity in-game, and I basically just spent the last four hours constantly playing this character with friends. What an actually delightful time. I love how they turned out.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Lmfao the announcer saying "Enderman" is so freaking surreal. Idk if hearing him say Geno is gonna be able to top this

I still can't get over Xander Mobus saying Banjo & Kazooie. It's been a year, but it's still surreal to hear.

 

[NintendoKnight]

I guess I can put my impressions of Steve here.

Of all the DLC characters, which I've enjoyed a whole bunch (yes that includes Byleth, I find him pretty fun while I've seen Joker as the least fun of the DLC—though still somewhat fun), I have to say, I'm kinda disappointed with Steve overall. He didn't excite me when he was announced, and I don't find his gameplay enjoyable. Even worse, I hate fighting him; he's so annoying.

Comparing all of Smash's DLC (combining Sm4sh and Ultimate), Steve is my least enjoyed character of all of them. I've never actually been disappointed with a character addition before, so this feeling is new to me.

Now, other than that, I had my first Geno dream this morning (which is strange for me, since I don't dream all that much anymore). Two guys were exchanging something in this dark warehouse (and I was there, it had nothing to do with Smash) and suddenly a flying wooden hand shoots into view from behind me, snatches the object, and returns to the source which is Geno. I then freak out that he's in Smash and, in a strange moment of lucid realization, figure out that i'm in a dream. So I was trying to convince myself that Geno had been confirmed in reality, too, so that I wouldn't be disappointed when I woke up.

Needless to say, I was disappointed when I woke up. But hey, what can you do, yeah?

It also doesn't help that I haven't slept well these last couples days. Hopefully tonight will do me better.

COME ON GENO! LET'S GOOOO!

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Didn't know if anyone posted this here yet, it's speculative and fun so I figured I'd drop it here in case nobody else did. What's your thoughts Genobros?

I just saw it and I thought the video was kind of stupid. He wrote everyone off besides Geno and Hayabusa for either being a western character, female, from a certain genre, or something else. None of these things really reflect these characters' chances.

 

[Geno Boost]

Just remember that the Geno Boost does increase both Offense and Defense if you can get the timing right. If not, it will only be for Offence.

That’s my job

 

[MisterMike]

I just saw it and I thought the video was kind of stupid. He wrote everyone off besides Geno and Hayabusa for either being a western character, female, from a certain genre, or something else. None of these things really reflect these characters' chances.

Well that's kind of the point, though. He turns the averages amongst the characters into an objective framework, and then judges them based on said framework. Obviously they aren't going to reflect a character's actual likelihood of getting in because we have no definitive way of knowing who will get in or for what reason they were included.

 

[gzmee]

Long story short: Geno was probably the E3 headliner and we siked ourselves out because everyone insisted there was no way in hell he would be an E3 reveal, let alone the "Big Reveal." With Steve out of the way, Nintendo's sloooooooowly now going into the major E3 announcements so hopefully we don't have to wait longer than probably a month.

yall underestimate how big of a reveal steve would have been if he was shown at e3. the dude literally broke twitter when he was announced
im still pretty sure that min min was planned to be released around march-may instead of june before The Incident started, and steve and geno were gonna be a dual e3 reveal like hero and banjo were, with steve being the hero (mainstream appeal/money maker. yes hero is mainstream there are countries other than america) and geno being the banjo (fan favorite pick/probably exists to make sure smash twitter doesnt go to nintendo hq and start throwing things because of the first reveal)
sources: dude trust me

 

[Honest Slug]

Steve is a massive 5head character from what I've played so far. Might take a year for us to really know his place in the meta.

And lol still no Ganon buffs. Poor guy.

At least if Geno is a rush down type char he'll have a good match-up against Steve.

 

[KoopaSaki]

I'm gonna take a break from speculation for awhile guys. I'll just leave my two cents and say that I think Geno just may be our next character given the timing of the 35th anniversary of mario and all, not to mention the Banjo situation last year. Wish me luck to become one of the best animators on YouTube!

 

[Theguy123]

View attachment 289192

Pictured: Me being kept awake at night by pure rage that Geno could have been the E3 2020 headliner and revealed on the memey AF 6/9/2020 if it wasn't for a once in a century global pandemic.

I know we want geno but if Geno and minecraft were shown off at e3 then Steve would’ve been the headliner.

 

[Theguy123]

Nintendo thought Palutena was E3 material.

Nintendo thought Cloud was random Direct material.

i don’t blame them with thinking cloud was a random direct material. Everyone was getting sick of the sword fighters and fire emblem characters. They probably thought that having another sword fighter be revealed at e3 would outrage everyone.

kinda felt sorry for them though because they revealed cloud off who’s basically a sword fighter and everyone was happy and then they showed corrin Off as one of the last dlc characters and he/she was unique with a sword and they nearly got their head taken off them.

 

[Snoop_nogg]

i don’t blame them with thinking cloud was a random direct material. Everyone was getting sick of the sword fighters and fire emblem characters. They probably thought that having another sword fighter be revealed at e3 would outrage everyone.

kinda felt sorry for them though because they revealed cloud off who’s basically a sword fighter and everyone was happy and then they showed corrin Off as one of the last dlc characters and he/she was unique with a sword and they nearly got their head taken off them.

I really don't understand the Smash fandom sometimes.

"Too many swords! Too many Fire Emblem characters! Too many Mario reps! Too many Links!"

Just be happy this is the hugest roster ever, with a variety of play styles, and it's not quite M.U.G.E.N. level ridiculous.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

And lol still no Ganon buffs. Poor guy.

I'm sad to hear about that too. At least Bowser Jr. got buffs in this latest patch. Jr. needed it.

 

[Mizzle]

i don’t blame them with thinking cloud was a random direct material. Everyone was getting sick of the sword fighters and fire emblem characters. They probably thought that having another sword fighter be revealed at e3 would outrage everyone.

kinda felt sorry for them though because they revealed cloud off who’s basically a sword fighter and everyone was happy and then they showed corrin Off as one of the last dlc characters and he/she was unique with a sword and they nearly got their head taken off them.

Are you serious? You really think them revealing Cloud at E3 would've outraged everyone because "muh anime swordsman"? Cloud is a gaming icon. Final Fantasy VII is one of the most highly regarded JRPGs ever and many considered it a "must-have" title of the PSX. He's one of, if not the, most well-received third-party characters to be added to Smash. Nintendo knew it was a big deal.

 

[RetroBro]

i don’t blame them with thinking cloud was a random direct material. Everyone was getting sick of the sword fighters and fire emblem characters. They probably thought that having another sword fighter be revealed at e3 would outrage everyone.

kinda felt sorry for them though because they revealed cloud off who’s basically a sword fighter and everyone was happy and then they showed corrin Off as one of the last dlc characters and he/she was unique with a sword and they nearly got their head taken off them.

Yeah I just think it's the fact that Cloud is an icon of the PS1 and was thought to be impossible as he marked Square and Nintendo's parting in business. If you go and read about it FF7 is one of the main reasons Square and Nintendo stopped dealing with each other.

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Steve is a massive 5head character from what I've played so far. Might take a year for us to really know his place in the meta.

And lol still no Ganon buffs. Poor guy.

At least if Geno is a rush down type char he'll have a good match-up against Steve.

Lol they didn't buff Ganon but they buffed Sonic.

God help us

 

[Paraspikey]

I know we want geno but if Geno and minecraft were shown off at e3 then Steve would’ve been the headliner.

They both would of been pretty big headliners.
Steve is from the biggest game in the industry and Geno is the biggest Smash request in Smash history not yet included.
Both for different reasons, but both pretty big headliners none the less.

 

[7NATOR]

Smash 4 DLC was more Segmented that Smash Ultimate's DLC, as they didn't sell the Smash 4 character all at once until all of them had Come out already. I assume they didn't deliberately intricately decide the Order in which every Character would come out and such, which is Why Cloud might not have been E3 (Ryu, and Roy Returning, along with them both and Lucas releasing that day were hype enough though). they also weren't gonna delay all DLC to Next year to have Cloud at E3

Them in 2014 with Having Pac-Man behind closed doors was the Weirdest thing they ever done. Since then they seem to take E3 Reveals more seriously

 

[Fatmanonice]

I know we want geno but if Geno and minecraft were shown off at e3 then Steve would’ve been the headliner.

Apparently not if Steve was 77 and not 78. I get what you're saying but I'm referring to who they would have closed off E3 with. For example, Hero was the bigger deal in the grand scheme of things. Super elusive copyright, enormous legacy franchise, Sakurai managed to get permission to bend a ton of hardset rules with their inclusion, etc but people cared a lot more about Banjo in the grand scheme of things. I could honestly see Geno being similar because of the long history of the character in the Smash fanbase as well as their reputation as a "never-ever." Yes, objectively Steve versus Geno, Steve is the bigger deal which is why I've been hard pointing out the fact that Steve was meant to be the opening act of E3 2020.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Lol they didn't buff Ganon but they buffed Sonic.

God help us

Lmao! Poor Ganonny. He doesn't get the buff but Sanic does and get's to go "SCATMAN!!!" All over the place lol!

 

[Theguy123]

Are you serious? You really think them revealing Cloud at E3 would've outraged everyone because "muh anime swordsman"? Cloud is a gaming icon. Final Fantasy VII is one of the most highly regarded JRPGs ever and many considered it a "must-have" title of the PSX. He's one of, if not the, most well-received third-party characters to be added to Smash. Nintendo knew it was a big deal.

i never said Nintendo didn’t know it was a big deal and I never said revealing cloud at e3 would cause an outrage.

I said NINTENDO PROBABLY assumed revealing cloud at e3 might of caused a backlash because at the end of the day he’s another swordsman with not enough things to make him stand out. The backlash for fire emblem sword characters and characters who had a sword was pretty high back then.

I never stated it would, I said Nintendo might of thought. There’s a huge difference. You either didn’t read my post or just saw a part of it and decided to criticise it.

 

[YsDisciple]

The Belmonts got some decent buffs too. I did notice that on the patch notes for some of the characters with flurry jabs, they made it so their attacks don't get "neutralized". Does that mean that if their flurry attacks make contact with an opponent's attack (i.e. another flurry or physical attack), the flurry isn't blocked/nullified?

 

[Dukefire]

The Belmonts got some decent buffs too. I did notice that on the patch notes for some of the characters with flurry jabs, they made it so their attacks don't get "neutralized". Does that mean that if their flurry attacks make contact with an opponent's attack (i.e. another flurry or physical attack), the flurry isn't blocked/nullified?

Maybe if the attack isn't stronger when clashing.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Nice Onizuka avatar Dukefire . I just recently finished watching that show for the first time a few weeks ago and I loved it.

 

[Dukefire]

Nice Onizuka avatar Dukefire . I just recently finished watching that show for the first time a few weeks ago and I loved it.

Thanks.

Also for some of the flurry attacks not being blocked/nullified. Then it could end up like this in Smash 4. (Well, maybe not exactly like that result.)

Spoiler: Video from Lythero

 

[domriver]

I still can't get over Xander Mobus saying Banjo & Kazooie. It's been a year, but it's still surreal to hear.

Im with you there. Along with King K Rool and Ridley can't get enough listening to it. jeje Im still listening to Megaman and Sonic and Bayonetta. lol

 

[Firox]

Can I just say how hilariously stupid the balance adjustments were with this patch?

Smash players: "Sonic and Ness are broken online. If the pandemic keeps up, those two need to be nerfed."

Nintendo: Buffs Sonic and Ness

Nice troll, Pretendo. Ignore Ganondorf, Lil Mac, Doc Mario and tons of others, but by all means, buff Sonic the menace. That's just what we needed. At least Ice Climbers got some well-deserved buffs. It's about time.

 

[Deleted member]

Can I just say how hilariously stupid the balance adjustments were with this patch?

Smash players: "Sonic and Ness are broken online. If the pandemic keeps up, those two need to be nerfed."

Nintendo: Buffs Sonic and Ness

Nice troll, Pretendo. Ignore Ganondorf, Lil Mac, Doc Mario and tons of others, but by all means, buff Sonic the menace. That's just what we needed. At least Ice Climbers got some well-deserved buffs. It's about time.

absolutely the reason I think this is probably the worst patch Ultimate has ever seen. These two characters make online absolute hell to experience and yet they not only got buffed, they got multiple buffs. We don't need a new fighter that badly if this is the "balance" that's coming with them.

 

[Heoj]

Can I just say how hilariously stupid the balance adjustments were with this patch?

Smash players: "Sonic and Ness are broken online. If the pandemic keeps up, those two need to be nerfed."

Nintendo: Buffs Sonic and Ness

Nice troll, Pretendo. Ignore Ganondorf, Lil Mac, Doc Mario and tons of others, but by all means, buff Sonic the menace. That's just what we needed. At least Ice Climbers got some well-deserved buffs. It's about time.

Bruh, ngl, personally I really liked this patch. Sonic and Lucario buffs are what Ive been dying for.

absolutely the reason I think this is probably the worst patch Ultimate has ever seen. These two characters make online absolute hell to experience and yet they not only got buffed, they got multiple buffs. We don't need a new fighter that badly if this is the "balance" that's coming with them.

Wow, honestly, i hard disagree. At least for me I only occasionally run into sonics and they arent annoying at all. Ness i straight up never see.

 

[Peepo T. Skeleton]

Ness i straight up never see.

Wait you never see any Ness players? Can I play whatever game you're playing? Lol

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I'm a bit conflicted when it comes to Steve. I love half of his design and dislike the other. I’m actually really good at the resources management half. Or at least better than I expected. The part I hate about his design is the block placing. It’s such an integral part of his kit. Because of his low jump and air speed, he has to rely on placing blocks to avoid attacks. But placing blocks with him feels so wrong. It was executed in such a strange way that it interrupts the flow of battle or causes you to buffer a move due to Ultimate’s huge buffer window.

Basically, block placing is a mess in my opinion. The rest of his kit revolving upgrading gear was satisfying. It felt great finally getting diamond and upgrading my gear to crazy powerful levels. Forward aerial and down aerial are highights of the moveset for me. But I don't see him becoming a main.

 

[Kremling Kommander]

Can I just say how hilariously stupid the balance adjustments were with this patch?

Smash players: "Sonic and Ness are broken online. If the pandemic keeps up, those two need to be nerfed."

Nintendo: Buffs Sonic and Ness

Nice troll, Pretendo. Ignore Ganondorf, Lil Mac, Doc Mario and tons of others, but by all means, buff Sonic the menace. That's just what we needed. At least Ice Climbers got some well-deserved buffs. It's about time.

It’s almost funny how the last patch was so good and basically gave what many people wanted; buffs to various mid and low tiers such as Falco and K Rool, as well as overall fixes to moves.
And then they do a near-180 in this patch and buff characters that were already good and hated by most competitive players, while also ignoring bad characters.
I’m still salty that they buffed Ness and didn’t touch Lucas

 

[ctt4lfecw]

Apparently not if Steve was 77 and not 78. I get what you're saying but I'm referring to who they would have closed off E3 with. For example, Hero was the bigger deal in the grand scheme of things. Super elusive copyright, enormous legacy franchise, Sakurai managed to get permission to bend a ton of hardset rules with their inclusion, etc but people cared a lot more about Banjo in the grand scheme of things. I could honestly see Geno being similar because of the long history of the character in the Smash fanbase as well as their reputation as a "never-ever." Yes, objectively Steve versus Geno, Steve is the bigger deal which is why I've been hard pointing out the fact that Steve was meant to be the opening act of E3 2020.

I

Apparently not if Steve was 77 and not 78. I get what you're saying but I'm referring to who they would have closed off E3 with. For example, Hero was the bigger deal in the grand scheme of things. Super elusive copyright, enormous legacy franchise, Sakurai managed to get permission to bend a ton of hardset rules with their inclusion, etc but people cared a lot more about Banjo in the grand scheme of things. I could honestly see Geno being similar because of the long history of the character in the Smash fanbase as well as their reputation as a "never-ever." Yes, objectively Steve versus Geno, Steve is the bigger deal which is why I've been hard pointing out the fact that Steve was meant to be the opening act of E3 2020.

I believe it!

 

[Deleted member]

I'm a bit conflicted when it comes to Steve. I love half of his design and dislike the other. I’m actually really good at the resources management half. Or at least better than I expected. The part I hate about his design is the block placing. It’s such an integral part of his kit. Because of his low jump and air speed, he has to rely on placing blocks to avoid attacks. But placing blocks with him feels so wrong. It was executed in such a strange way that it interrupts the flow of battle or causes you to buffer a move due to Ultimate’s huge buffer window.

Basically, block placing is a mess in my opinion. The rest of his kit revolving upgrading gear was satisfying. It felt great finally getting diamond and upgrading my gear to crazy powerful levels. Forward aerial and down aerial are highights of the moveset for me. But I don't see him becoming a main.

Block placing needed to be his Down B so bad that it isn't even funny. Having it be neutral B is just asking to get missed inputs.

 

[Firox]

Bruh, ngl, personally I really liked this patch. Sonic and Lucario buffs are what Ive been dying for.




Wow, honestly, i hard disagree. At least for me I only occasionally run into sonics and they arent annoying at all. Ness i straight up never see.

Lucario definitely needed buffs but Sonic is infamous for being broken online since the inherent lag makes some of his moves (glares at homing attack) virtually unreactable. If you aren't annoyed by his buffs, that's most likely due to a conflict of interest. Obviously the Sonic players are overjoyed.

As for Ness, are we playing the same game here? Ness is INCREDIBLY common online. I'm not just talking about Elite Quickplay either. Tournament mode is especially inundated with them. More so than Lucas and at least 40% of the cast. His priority and disjoints were already stupid as all hell, but now his dash attack can kill easier and his Dair spike is more accessible. Meanwhile, Lucas continues to be ignored. Not sure what the reasoning is behind it.

 

[YsDisciple]

Heads up fellas. News on the Super Mario Bros. themed Super Smash Bros. Ultimate tournament may be on the way. Although I'd expect news to actually come around early November since we got the October open starting on the 24th.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[Deleted member]

Lucario definitely needed buffs but Sonic is infamous for being broken online since the inherent lag makes some of his moves (glares at homing attack) virtually unreactable. If you aren't annoyed by his buffs, that's most likely due to a conflict of interest. Obviously the Sonic players are overjoyed.

As for Ness, are we playing the same game here? Ness is INCREDIBLY common online. I'm not just talking about Elite Quickplay either. Tournament mode is especially inundated with them. More so than Lucas and at least 40% of the cast. His priority and disjoints were already stupid as all hell, but now his dash attack can kill easier and his Dair spike is more accessible. Meanwhile, Lucas continues to be ignored. Not sure what the reasoning behind it.

I can step away from a selfish "yes please buff my main" mindset for a moment and say that Lucas is fine as he is, and the real crime here is that Ness was already a little too powerful and needed to be toned down. I too want to play whatever version of Ultimate these guys are playing that has no wifi Ness because not being able to punish his moves thanks to input delay turns him from brainless asshole into an unstoppable nightmare.

 

[Firox]

I'm a bit conflicted when it comes to Steve. I love half of his design and dislike the other. I’m actually really good at the resources management half. Or at least better than I expected. The part I hate about his design is the block placing. It’s such an integral part of his kit. Because of his low jump and air speed, he has to rely on placing blocks to avoid attacks. But placing blocks with him feels so wrong. It was executed in such a strange way that it interrupts the flow of battle or causes you to buffer a move due to Ultimate’s huge buffer window.

Basically, block placing is a mess in my opinion. The rest of his kit revolving upgrading gear was satisfying. It felt great finally getting diamond and upgrading my gear to crazy powerful levels. Forward aerial and down aerial are highights of the moveset for me. But I don't see him becoming a main.

I agree with this assessment 100%. Ironically, I find the block placement of all things the most clunky part of his moveset. I'm probably using him wrong or something, but I find myself almost never resorting to block placement. I spend most of my time farming upgrades and using my iron for Dair and Minecart. The blocks use up resources that I feel are better used elsewhere and they break so easily that they hardly hinder my opponent.

 

[CopperKoopa]

So maybe we've beaten this to death, but back on the topic of Geno: what does everyone think his playstyle is going to be?

No duh he will have timed hits if he gets in, but what other factors will come into play? Will he be footsy, rushdown, zoner? All 3 make sense. I can't imagine him being anything else.

Personally (and like I said waaaaaaaaay back in the thread), I think he's going to be an odd blend of up-close to mid-range burst hits, some mid-range projectiles with lots of knockback but low damage, and a bunch of AOE attacks as part of his specials. He'd be quick and peppy, floaty but a low jumper, maybe Ness height and weight, and due to the sheer amount of disjointed attacks he would be hard to close distance on. However, his major weakness would be his quicker attacks needing to be done somewhat up close or mid range and his bigger, AOE attacks having some lag to setup or cooldown. Basically, Geno would do really well against fighters who want to close the gap quickly (Sheik, Lucina, Mac), fighters who are somewhat slow attackers (Min Min, Hero, Shulk), and maybe even fighters who try to camp since Geno could get in close to push them out or hit them from a distance to close out an area of the stage. I'd imagine him not doing very well, however, against heavyweights due to low power and some lag to his attacks. I also could see a momentum character, like Cloud or Joker being a good matchup since Geno could stymy them for a while but really couldn't stop them from building up power (Steve or Olimar may fall into this camp too, I don't know).

I also had the super unpopular idea that Mallow would be part of his moveset cough as one of his specials, part of his Final Smash, and part of his taunts/victory poses. I still think it's a distinct possibility, especially if every DLC fighter that isn't named Min Min has "brought a friend." (Terry's stage counts, I swear . Maybe Spring Man does for Min too? It was a theory for a while that all the DLC would have "buddies")