Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Leakers can't get "all information" at once. Having one set of costumes doesn't mean they know every set either.

The fact they even know one set alone is important to their credibility.

They can easily know more than one set, while not knowing every set. That's extremely regular with leaking. Look at how little Verge knew in the end. He knew some stuff obviously, but there's quite a few bits he was never leaked about.

That likewise doesn't mean all of the Mii Costume Leaker's information is legitimate either. They can get leakbaited too. Once again, look at Verge, who got leakbaited by the Minecraft information, and a ton of people who got leakbaited about Star Fox Racing. This happens quite often. The lack of information is nothing similar to getting it outright wrong. And once should always look at the context of why it was wrong.

 

[QQS]

7-20-20 will still be the 7th month, the 7th DLC, Fighter #77 and the puppet from the Legend of the 7 stars. On that day I expect a double reveal: Geno and Crash. The Knight deluxe costume. Also big news like Breath sequel + Metroid Prime 4. It’s about time for Geno and Crash. Throw us some food, Nintendo. After the reveals we can happily wait until September for the downloads in Smash.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I might sound dumb asking this but what do you mean by “one asked to be quiet” do you mean like a premium costume or a huge fan favourite. If so is there a possibility the one for square is Geno or have you been specifically told it’s not Geno.

Of the four, only one has decent Smash demand but it's widely agreed that they would all be great surprises and it was recommended to keep them a secret. Also, no, the Square one isn't Geno or Sora according to Mii Costume Guy.

 

[TTF]

Leakers can't get "all information" at once. Having one set of costumes doesn't mean they know every set either.

The fact they even know one set alone is important to their credibility.

They can easily know more than one set, while not knowing every set. That's extremely regular with leaking. Look at how little Verge knew in the end. He knew some stuff obviously, but there's quite a few bits he was never leaked about.

That likewise doesn't mean all of the Mii Costume Leaker's information is legitimate either. They can get leakbaited too. Once again, look at Verge, who got leakbaited by the Minecraft information, and a ton of people who got leakbaited about Star Fox Racing. This happens quite often. The lack of information is nothing similar to getting it outright wrong. And once should always look at the context of why it was wrong.

It's a pretty clever way of hiding the big secrets. Though I'm still salty that Star Fox Racing wasn't a real thing, that sounded like it would've been awesome!

 

[Powerman293]

People who assumed Star Fox Grand Prix was real on the spot like Kyle Bosman make me laugh.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

Leakers can't get "all information" at once. Having one set of costumes doesn't mean they know every set either.

The fact they even know one set alone is important to their credibility.

They can easily know more than one set, while not knowing every set. That's extremely regular with leaking. Look at how little Verge knew in the end. He knew some stuff obviously, but there's quite a few bits he was never leaked about.

That likewise doesn't mean all of the Mii Costume Leaker's information is legitimate either. They can get leakbaited too. Once again, look at Verge, who got leakbaited by the Minecraft information, and a ton of people who got leakbaited about Star Fox Racing. This happens quite often. The lack of information is nothing similar to getting it outright wrong. And once should always look at the context of why it was wrong.

yes thats maybe true, but it makes me doubt that he didn’t get any of the mii costumes that came with Min Min (Ninjara, splatoon divas, Heihachi or Vault Boy). We always have to tempered our expectations and take everything with grain of salt.

 

[7NATOR]

I have to say it, because i've been thinking it

Regarding what Papagenos said and how it's speculated it's related to Legacy XP, One thing I have to say is that Geno has never had an Official 3D Model. Ridley, Waluigi, Metal Sonic, and Shadow have been in games with 3D Models. Geno hasn't, so if he officially gets into Smash that will be the 1st time he will have 3D Model

That could be more reason to why if the Mod was only taken down for 1 character (and it wasn't done for Ridley), It was because you don't want the first time a character gets a nice 3D Model shown up by a Mod, and don't want to deal with those legal implications

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

yes thats maybe true, but it makes me doubt that he didn’t get any of the mii costumes that came with Min Min (Ninjara, splatoon divas, Heihachi or Vault Boy). We always have to tempered our expectations and take everything with grain of salt.

I don't see how this remotely affects it. It looks way more like he only has some sets of information, but not all. I'll believe something's up when he gets information actually wrong, which so far has yet to be the case.

It's a pretty clever way of hiding the big secrets. Though I'm still salty that Star Fox Racing wasn't a real thing, that sounded like it would've been awesome!

Indeed. But yeah, companies throw out leakbait a lot. It's typical and makes sense. They don't want leakers in general. Unfortunately leabkait is no less believable than the real information. There's often no way to verify what is real and what is not from each other anyway. Especially as even the most credible of leakbaiters can easily be given false information by the company. The fact Star Fox Grand Prix was actual leakbait means it was real information given by the company itself. This also means that people believing it were logical, since it was actual insider information too. It was intentionally put there to trick people, but that at least means they had credible people worth trusting to believe their data on. That's a lot better than people making up information outright to fool others. Better the company that does it overall, since that also means that the people who get caught in the end are still credible. Of course, they may never get caught, which also means they're reliable till then.

When it comes reliability, leakbait helps, not hurts. It only increases credibility in the end. Just it also can create worse problems for those leakers in question, due to being easier to be caught.

 

[YsDisciple]

I'm still thinking about that Octopath Traveler spirit event. It still feels like such a random, sucker-punch event. Truly unexpected. Despite the ongoing info "drought" due to there not having been a full-length Nintendo Direct since... September 4th, 2019..., there have been some eye-catching announcements within the past couple of months (in no particular order).

• Paper Mario: The Origami King
• The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel IV
• Ys IX: Monstrum Nox
• Bloodstained: Curse of the Moon 2
• Azure Striker Gunvolt 3
• Ys Origins
• Donkey Kong Country for the SNES NSO Library
• Kingdom Hearts: Melody of Memory

Only to say a few. Hmm... come to think of it, there's quite a good number of good RPGs coming to the Switch.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

There's where I'm hung up because I'm not super confident in a fourth Kid Icarus or third Mother rep if we were using the Amiibo rereleases as a sole predictor. Kirby is possible but my hang up is that, if Lolo happens, I don't see them doing Bandana Dee and vice versa. Waluigi and Geno works a pretty nice loophole because Geno's a Mario character but owned by Square while Bandana Dee and Lolo are both owned by HAL. It's also kind of head scratcher because Kirby hasn't been rereleased yet but Dedede and Metaknight have. I suppose they could just "DO IT AGAIN" but then it calls into question why they waited on others like the Kid Icarus characters.

How about Pikmin reps? Heard anything in regards to Pikmin?

 

[JoscarGamma]

There's where I'm hung up because I'm not super confident in a fourth Kid Icarus or third Mother rep if we were using the Amiibo rereleases as a sole predictor. Kirby is possible but my hang up is that, if Lolo happens, I don't see them doing Bandana Dee and vice versa. Waluigi and Geno works a pretty nice loophole because Geno's a Mario character but owned by Square while Bandana Dee and Lolo are both owned by HAL. It's also kind of head scratcher because Kirby hasn't been rereleased yet but Dedede and Metaknight have. I suppose they could just "DO IT AGAIN" but then it calls into question why they waited on others like the Kid Icarus characters.

If you’re not using amiibos to predict the franchises you mentioned, the one idea I haven’t seen brought up yet for this theory would be BotW2. Sakurai has brought up BotW Zelda twice recently, and if we speculate that they’ll promote upcoming games for their main franchises, we’ll, then you have:

Waluigi
Dixie
BotW 2
Sora

they’d be ending with their most popular franchises (Mario, DK, Zelda) and a popular 3rd party (Kingdom Hearts). That’s not a bad way to end

 

[MattX20]

If you’re not using amiibos to predict the franchises you mentioned, the one idea I haven’t seen brought up yet for this theory would be BotW2. Sakurai has brought up BotW Zelda twice recently, and if we speculate that they’ll promote upcoming games for their main franchises, we’ll, then you have:

Waluigi
Dixie
BotW 2
Sora

they’d be ending with their most popular franchises (Mario, DK, Zelda) and a popular 3rd party (Kingdom Hearts). That’s not a bad way to end

Again, we shouldn't underestimate the Kirby series popularity if we discuss bonus characters. And to be honest, I can't see any 3rd party characters as a mere bonus, Sora especially given how much licensing would factor in

 

[7NATOR]

3rd Party characters could work as Bonuses, but really only if they come from a Represented Franchise. a Character like Shadow, Tails, Knuckles would work well because they technically don't need to come with New stages or Music (though more music would be appreciated), because they aren't representing new Franchise.

And I also concur that Kirby shouldn't be underestimated

 

[Lionfranky]

Is there any reason SE would refuse to lend Geno? I'm just asking. It seems easy money. Why would they be reluctant to do it whem they aren't going to capitalize on Geno anyway?

 

[MisterMike]

I have to say it, because i've been thinking it

Regarding what Papagenos said and how it's speculated it's related to Legacy XP, One thing I have to say is that Geno has never had an Official 3D Model. Ridley, Waluigi, Metal Sonic, and Shadow have been in games with 3D Models. Geno hasn't, so if he officially gets into Smash that will be the 1st time he will have 3D Model

That could be more reason to why if the Mod was only taken down for 1 character (and it wasn't done for Ridley), It was because you don't want the first time a character gets a nice 3D Model shown up by a Mod, and don't want to deal with those legal implications

>One thing I have to say is that Geno has never had an Official 3D Model.
Geno's official render for SMRPG: Am I a joke to you?

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Is there any reason SE would refuse to lend Geno? I'm just asking. It seems easy money. Why would they be reluctant to do it whem they aren't going to capitalize on Geno anyway?

The one argument on this I've seen commonly brought up is that Square Enix would likely rather have another character in Smash that would be more "relevant" and "beneficial" for them, like 2B or Lara Croft... which falls flat on its face when you remember that Square Enix isn't in charge of picking the Fighters Pass characters.

Instead, according to Sakurai at least, Nintendo is doing the picking, and considering that they keep re-releasing Super Mario RPG (which essentially requires Square Enix's permission, and it also implies that they know the game is popular enough to justify doing so), as well as also picking the characters for the previous pass (meaning Joker, Banjo, and Terry were their choice, not Sakurai's or anyone else's), I think Geno getting in through Nintendo's choice isn't as far-fetched as some would believe.

 

[Chad K Rule]

Geno has never had a 3d model? What about his Mii outfit in smash 4 surely that leaves them with a lot to work with.

 

[Griselda]

I know it should go without saying that harassing people over having an idea and being wrong is bad, but I'd still just like to personally say for the record that, in the case that none of Fatman's theories pan out and he was wrong with all of his predictions, I'm not going to blame him or turn on him over it.

 

[7NATOR]

>One thing I have to say is that Geno has never had an Official 3D Model.
Geno's official render for SMRPG: Am I a joke to you?
View attachment 277740

But that's more like Art, like an ingame model that can be moved around and such, certainly not like a model in Smash or Games nowadays

Geno has never had a 3d model? What about his Mii outfit in smash 4 surely that leaves them with a lot to work with.

But it's more a costume though and not a Model though. If it was something like Sans or Cuphead or Vault Boy, maybe. but as it was in Smash 4 it's not much of a model. Stuff in that costume could be repurposed, but the costume itself not like a model

 

[Fatmanonice]

If you’re not using amiibos to predict the franchises you mentioned, the one idea I haven’t seen brought up yet for this theory would be BotW2. Sakurai has brought up BotW Zelda twice recently, and if we speculate that they’ll promote upcoming games for their main franchises, we’ll, then you have:

Waluigi
Dixie
BotW 2
Sora

they’d be ending with their most popular franchises (Mario, DK, Zelda) and a popular 3rd party (Kingdom Hearts). That’s not a bad way to end

If Zelda managed to snag another character, I feel like it would be Skull Kid. Just like Waluigi and Dixie, there's so much history there and if Nintendo was going to gut punch the Mii Costume glass ceiling, it would be with him or Isaac.

 

[MattX20]

If Zelda managed to snag another character, I feel like it would be Skull Kid. Just like Waluigi and Dixie, there's so much history there and if Nintendo was going to gut punch the Mii Costume glass ceiling, it would be with him or Isaac.

Isaac would be a very well received pick and as long as he came with a few remixes like his iconic battle theme, it would go over well enough

 

[Chad K Rule]

But that's more like Art, like an ingame model that can be moved around and such, certainly not like a model in Smash or Games nowadays



But it's more a costume though and not a Model though. If it was something like Sans or Cuphead or Vault Boy, maybe. but as it was in Smash 4 it's not much of a model. Stuff in that costume could be repurposed, but the costume itself not like a model

Well most of him is there atleast, and I do feel making his puppet body function is important enough to make it helpful for development.

 

[RingJ5]

I see. While I do think you're being a little overambitious, it is just theory-crafting, as you said above! I would love a lot of those choices, but I remain skeptical.

I do, however, have to disagree with your idea of Sora being a bonus character. Even if he had a poultry amount of content, I truly don't think Sora would appear without a stage and a few music tracks.

A bonus character totally could come with a couple extra tracks or something, however there’s a very important distinction to be made here.

Fighter’s Pass characters have to come with a character, stage, music, and Spirit Board. Bonus characters don’t have to come with anything else, which is important when you have a character so intrinsically tied to a fourth-party company. Sure, you could argue that there’s enough original characters and such to fill out a full Challenger Pack, but I’d consider that equivalent to us finally getting Geno... except entirely stripped of any remote reference to the Mario series down to his star being replaced by a nondescript “orb”.

It’d just be really weird representation that could easily be avoided by making it just the character without any other mandatory inclusions.

 

[Enigma735]

>One thing I have to say is that Geno has never had an Official 3D Model.
Geno's official render for SMRPG: Am I a joke to you?
View attachment 277740

Eh I would argue that model isn't very good since he is in an awkward stance that literally EVERY SMRPG character has. It also doesn't best represent his personality or abilities in anyway and its just kinda boring. Now if he were to get a Smash render, it would be a WHOLE different story since Sakurai loves to represent the characters as well as he possibly can just on the artwork alone.

 

[Chad K Rule]

Eh I would argue that model isn't very good since he is in an awkward stance that literally EVERY SMRPG character has. It also doesn't best represent his personality or abilities in anyway and its just kinda boring. Now if he were to get a Smash render, it would be a WHOLE different story since Sakurai loves to represent the characters as well as he possibly can just on the artwork alone.

*cough, kid Icarus for the nes*

 

[AdamBel731]

The one argument on this I've seen commonly brought up is that Square Enix would likely rather have another character in Smash that would be more "relevant" and "beneficial" for them, like 2B or Lara Croft... which falls flat on its face when you remember that Square Enix isn't in charge of picking the Fighters Pass characters.

Instead, according to Sakurai at least, Nintendo is doing the picking, and considering that they keep re-releasing Super Mario RPG (which essentially requires Square Enix's permission, and it also implies that they know the game is popular enough to justify doing so), as well as also picking the characters for the previous pass (meaning Joker, Banjo, and Terry were their choice, not Sakurai's or anyone else's), I think Geno getting in through Nintendo's choice isn't as far-fetched as some would believe.

As you said, Nintendo is picking the DLC. But I would also like to bring up how Sakurai has approached SE every single time for a character of their's to be in Smash. SE has yet to request a fighter themselves. And if they were to ask for one themselves, it wouldn't replace Geno I don't think. If Sakurai wants Geno, he'll likely get him and the SE requested character. SE isn't going to turn down Geno for the the fighter they request because the company could just give Nintendo both characters and get even more money. Basically, it is unlikely a character is going to replace Geno by SE's hands.

A bonus character totally could come with a couple extra tracks or something, however there’s a very important distinction to be made here.

Fighter’s Pass characters have to come with a character, stage, music, and Spirit Board. Bonus characters don’t have to come with anything else, which is important when you have a character so intrinsically tied to a fourth-party company. Sure, you could argue that there’s enough original characters and such to fill out a full Challenger Pack, but I’d consider that equivalent to us finally getting Geno... except entirely stripped of any remote reference to the Mario series down to his star being replaced by a nondescript “orb”.

It’d just be really weird representation that could easily be avoided by making it just the character without any other mandatory inclusions.

I suppose you have a point. If Sora was a bonus he could ditch the Spirit board. I could see that. However, I think every 3rd party franchise introduced to Smash in a playable fashion is pretty much required to have at least a stage and a few music tracks. Sora may be tricky to acquire, but I definitely don't see him coming with no stage of music representation.

Eh I would argue that model isn't very good since he is in an awkward stance that literally EVERY SMRPG character has. It also doesn't best represent his personality or abilities in anyway and its just kinda boring. Now if he were to get a Smash render, it would be a WHOLE different story since Sakurai loves to represent the characters as well as he possibly can just on the artwork alone.

I said the exact same thing the other week! (I don't know if you saw or not.) I think for a game so full of emotion and character, that the official renders of the characters are kinda lifeless. As such, I feel as if the renders give a bad impression of the game's charm and character. Geno looks one step away from t-posing.

 

[Enigma735]

I said the exact same thing the other week! (I don't know if you saw or not.) I think for a game so full of emotion and character, that the official renders of the characters are kinda lifeless. As such, I feel as if the renders give a bad impression of the game's charm and character. Geno looks one step away from t-posing.

I have seen that post and that was the post that gave me inspiration to write about that lol. I also agree 100%.

 

[Fatmanonice]

So, fun little tidbit from the Waluigi thread: not only does he turn 20 this year but his birthday? July 21st.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mar...ennis is a sports,in Europe later in November.

Can you imagine if we got Geno and Waluigi for Waluigi's 20th birthday?

 

[Vector Victor]

While franchises shouldn't be given slots for the sake of getting one, Zelda is FAR overdue for a new rep. The last one was Toon Link in Brawl, and as a clone! Zelda rakes in money just on name alone. The fact that its been over ten years since a new character is insanity.

 

[T2by4]

So, fun little tidbit from the Waluigi thread: not only does he turn 20 this year but his birthday? July 21st.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Tennis#:~:text=Mario Tennis is a sports,in Europe later in November.

Can you imagine if we got Geno and Waluigi for Waluigi's 20th birthday?

>we went from 7 theory to wah theory LITERALLY one day later

 

[Griselda]

While franchises shouldn't be given slots for the sake of getting one, Zelda is FAR overdue for a new rep. The last one was Toon Link in Brawl, and as a clone! Zelda rakes in money just on name alone. The fact that its been over ten years since a new character is insanity.

My vote is for Darunia. Why..?

..Because, you see, Darunia would be a good addition to the roster as he'd be a unique Zelda character that isn't just another incarnation of Link, a Death Mountain stage would be pretty great, but Darunia would also be the perfect character to represent Smithy. Even more so than Dedede. If Darunia got in, he'd probably bring his Darmani's Ghost alt color from Hyrule Warriors. Compare:

 

[RingJ5]

As you said, Nintendo is picking the DLC. But I would also like to bring up how Sakurai has approached SE every single time for a character of their's to be in Smash. SE has yet to request a fighter themselves. And if they were to ask for one themselves, it wouldn't replace Geno I don't think. If Sakurai wants Geno, he'll likely get him and the SE requested character. SE isn't going to turn down Geno for the the fighter they request because the company could just give Nintendo both characters and get even more money. Basically, it is unlikely a character is going to replace Geno by SE's hands.


I suppose you have a point. If Sora was a bonus he could ditch the Spirit board. I could see that. However, I think every 3rd party franchise introduced to Smash in a playable fashion is pretty much required to have at least a stage and a few music tracks. Sora may be tricky to acquire, but I definitely don't see him coming with no stage of music representation.


I said the exact same thing the other week! (I don't know if you saw or not.) I think for a game so full of emotion and character, that the official renders of the characters are kinda lifeless. As such, I feel as if the renders give a bad impression of the game's charm and character. Geno looks one step away from t-posing.

Music tracks, sure. A stage is a bit more sketchy of a proposition, because of how faithful and cameo-filled Ultimate’s stages have been so far. Still, I’d give Sora a great chance at showing up as one of these bonuses, but to get a bit back on topic, I have a ridiculous suggestion for you all.

It’s July 20th. The Direct opens up with Sakurai, out of nowhere. He talks about how they had two major choices for another Mario rep, and had an incredibly difficult time choosing between them. Introducing the trailer, he mentions that he hopes that everyone will be happy with the choice that they’ve made.

The trailer starts, and it’s a huge, losing battle against Dharkon. Everyone is there, including ATs. Just when things seem to be going bad... a charging sound is heard. The camera cuts to Geno, who is charging a huge Geno Beam aimed right at Dharkon. Everyone takes cover... only to cut to Waluigi, who just got out of his AT. Excited to help, Waluigi serves a tennis ball right at Dharkon... which bounces off it harmlessly and lands directly on Geno, comically knocking him right off a cliff. With things looking bad, Geno’s Star suddenly flies out of the doll and starts to posess... Waluigi himself, who suddenly gains the classic Geno hat and cape. The splash screen finally appears as WALUIGENO joins the fight.

How would you react?

 

[Let Geno Smash]

View attachment 277754
>we went from 7 theory to wah theory LITERALLY one day later

Dude, you literally just post the same on twitter, even having the same Spongebob gif

 

[T2by4]

Dude, you literally just post the same on twitter, even having the same Spongebob gif

Yup. Cause I think it's a funny gif. Totally unrelated, and I have no other way to use it. Also I share what ya'll post because this thread is an absolute ride.

 

[super88cloud]

Of the four, only one has decent Smash demand but it's widely agreed that they would all be great surprises and it was recommended to keep them a secret. Also, no, the Square one isn't Geno or Sora according to Mii Costume Guy.

Smash Splash: He never asked for this. Adam Jensen joins the fight.

 

[OptimisticStrifer]

Fatmanonice if Lolo got in Smash, how would they even play? I have a hard time getting a grasp on them lmfao.

Also how do you feel about Isaac's chances rn? I feel WAH and Dixie and Rex feel like plausible picks, but I can't understand who the fourth would be. There's a lot of options.

 

[T2by4]

Fatmanonice if Lolo got in Smash, how would they even play? I have a hard time getting a grasp on them lmfao.

Also how do you feel about Isaac's chances rn? I feel WAH and Dixie and Rex feel like plausible picks, but I can't understand who the fourth would be. There's a lot of options.

Yeah speaking of rex, they've gotta be a lock at this point right? I would feel so bad for the XB fans if they didn't get their rep at this point especially since sakurai had to apologize the first time around.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Yeah, Lolo's weird but like Game and Watch and Ice Climbers I see Sakurai looking at him and being like "I will MAKE people LOVE you." Plus, it's kind of spitballing anyways because me and one of Mii Costume Guy's in-betweens agree on him being a possible retro pick based on [explanation redacted]. Plus this could be all be false. We just know that there's technically (in the most literal sense) 4 slots left after Season 2. One could be filled. All could be filled. None could be filled. It's that sort of thing and I'm entertaining it even more because of a number of things including Papagenos doubling down on the Waluigi/Geno stuff.

 

[TTF]

While franchises shouldn't be given slots for the sake of getting one, Zelda is FAR overdue for a new rep. The last one was Toon Link in Brawl, and as a clone! Zelda rakes in money just on name alone. The fact that its been over ten years since a new character is insanity.

If Zelda got a new rep, my choice would be a three way tie:
- Impa. More original choice
- Linkle. Can be considered another copy of Link, but she could use her crossbows or boots to have a different move set.
- Groose. Can't think of a proper move set on hand, but I can just imagine him as being the Dan Hibiki of Smash.

 

[valkiriforce]

Whenever a new Geno supporter posts in the thread:

(sorry I'm just kinda bored waiting lol)