Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[Garteam]

I hope this isn't seen as inflammatory, but I have finally come around to the idea of Geno thanks to the upgraded Mii Costumes.
They are a perfect way to get him in the game, in my eyes, allowing him to get an approximate time and love spent on a character, without dissuading those that see other legacy Square Enix characters.

The Mii costume upgrades, at least to me, seem to be the perfect entry way for Geno to get in as a pseudo-playable character (and no, I wouldnt call the regular costumes any bit of consolation, they are horrid cosplay nightmare machines that somehow trigger the uncanny valley despite being elaborate smiley faces).

I respectfully disagree for a few reasons:

• Mii Gunner's moveset really wouldn't be a great representation of what Geno can do. Their moveset is largely based on using sci-fi and modern technology, with the various plasma blasts, Grenade Launch, Bomb Drop, Gunner Missile, and the Echo Reflector demonstrating this. Geno by comparison, mixes his standard two-arm gunplay with magic, something that really can't be replicated in a Mii Fighter. Only Flame Pillar, Stealth Burst, and Absorbing Vortex could be construed as a magic attacks, and even those are animated in a various sci-fi way. As such, the role that fire arms play in Geno's moveset is less analogous to the role that swords play in Marth's moveset and more analogous to the role that swords play in Robin's moveset.
• Part of the reason Sans and Cuphead's Mii costumes went over so well was partially the surprise factor of seeing those two characters in particular join the game. Very few people would've guessed that Sans or Cuphead would be joining the battle in any form, so seeing a fully model costume for them with a bonus song was extremely pleasing. For Geno on the other hand, that genie's been let out of the bottle. Any surprise of "holy ****, Geno actually got in the game in some form" was spent on the Smash for Wii U and 3DS's costume. That possible surprise was further been nulled by Geno's spirit in Smash Ultimate's base game. As such, while a few people might appreciate the song and updated look of the costume, most would just be disappointed that Geno got the same consolidation prize as last time, just slightly repackaged.
• I'm not entirely sure I understand your point on "dissauding those that see other legacy characters", because support groups that ride in a similar category are going to be disappointed when a competing character gets in, no matter who it is. Master Chief and Steve fans were disappointed when Banjo and Kazooie got in, Nakoruru and Kyo fans were disappointed when Terry got in, and Edelgard fans were disappointed when Byleth got in.

 

[Lord Woomy]

It really is sad that detractors mostly just go for the irrelevancy angle, despite characters like Pit (who I actually do think no one cared about) and Banjo-Kazooie being in, despite ROB being in of all things (that thing was terrible).

Like, what more of a character do they want? More anime swordsmen? He's a freaking spirit who possesses a doll and shoots BULLETS (also stars and small cannonballs) FROM HIS ARMS, as well as robot-like rocket punches, magic (Blast, Flash), lasers (Beam, Blast), and can even TRANSFORM INTO A CANNON AND SHOOT SOME WEIRD-ASS SUN THING (Flash). I really don't understand. Is he too unique or something? Also Geno Whirl is basically Destructo Disc from DBZ.

Seriously, I'd kill to know what characters the detractors want instead, and man will I be royally pissed if it's just "well-known Shooty McShoot" or "well-known anime swordsman". (Edit: Not hating on Shooty McShoot or Anime Swordsman, see below post if you think I am)

Not to mention Ice Climbers, which had a singular NES game few people remembered, yet the Smash fandom still threw a collective tantrum when they weren't brought back for Smash 4.

 

[pupNapoleon]

I respectfully disagree for a few reasons:

• Mii Gunner's moveset really wouldn't be a great representation of what Geno can do. Their moveset is largely based on using sci-fi and modern technology, with the various plasma blasts, Grenade Launch, Bomb Drop, Gunner Missile, and the Echo Reflector demonstrating this. Geno by comparison, mixes his standard two-arm gunplay with magic, something that really can't be replicated in a Mii Fighter. Only Flame Pillar, Stealth Burst, and Absorbing Vortex could be construed as a magic attacks, and even those are animated in a various sci-fi way. As such, the role that fire arms play in Geno's moveset is less analogous to the role that swords play in Marth's moveset and more analogous to the role that swords play in Robin's moveset.
• Part of the reason Sans and Cuphead's Mii costumes went over so well was partially the surprise factor of seeing those two characters in particular join the game. Very few people would've guessed that Sans or Cuphead would be joining the battle in any form, so seeing a fully model costume for them with a bonus song was extremely pleasing. For Geno on the other hand, that genie's been let out of the bottle. Any surprise of "holy ****, Geno actually got in the game in some form" was spent on the Smash for Wii U and 3DS's costume. That possible surprise was further been nulled by Geno's spirit in Smash Ultimate's base game. As such, while a few people might appreciate the song and updated look of the costume, most would just be disappointed that Geno got the same consolidation prize as last time, just slightly repackaged.
• I'm not entirely sure I understand your point on "dissauding those that see other legacy characters", because support groups that ride in a similar category are going to be disappointed when a competing character gets in, no matter who it is. Master Chief and Steve fans were disappointed when Banjo and Kazooie got in, Nakoruru and Kyo fans were disappointed when Terry got in, and Edelgard fans were disappointed when Byleth got in.

I guess I'm being invited for my thoughts.

- As far as the gunner is concerned, from my point of view, visually, it was made for Geno. The Arm cannon is a common trope to some extent- Megaman, Samus, the queen herself- Rabbid Princess Peach, but visually, it's quite a fit for Geno. I know one of the big points Sakurai constantly brings up is body shape. He did this for Villager/Isabelle, he did it for echoes (as far back as Luncina), and from the beginning he has bolstered the value of a unique silhouette- not just in outspoken and direct statements about the value of a unique silhouette, or why Falco was chosen over Wolf). Above all of this, we have the iconic 'character approaching.' Sakurai loves his silhouette's. Of course- this is less about movement then why the frame could work.

May I ask, is this support thread on the idea that a Mii fighter Frame is by far not the problem of a Geno Mii Upgrade? That seems like common ground to say that the body of a Mii would fit Geno just fine.

---additionally, I think Cuphead was pretty widely speculated after Sans. Sans was a surprise not solely because of the character (though that was a part for sure), but because upgraded Mii costumes had never been broken, and this community as a whole has a difficult time imagining new or widely accepting new concepts. After we got Sans, after we got Banjo, after the creators of Cuphead told Sakurai in an open statement to use the character freely--- I'd say Cuphead was widely speculated... though I'm not going to go back and find all the posts I saw and wrote on it at the time.

 

[RedMachine123]

I guess I'm being invited for my thoughts.

- As far as the gunner is concerned, from my point of view, visually, it was made for Geno. The Arm cannon is a common trope to some extent- Megaman, Samus, the queen herself- Rabbid Princess Peach, but visually, it's quite a fit for Geno. I know one of the big points Sakurai constantly brings up is body shape. He did this for Villager/Isabelle, he did it for echoes (as far back as Luncina), and from the beginning he has bolstered the value of a unique silhouette- not just in outspoken and direct statements about the value of a unique silhouette, or why Falco was chosen over Wolf). Above all of this, we have the iconic 'character approaching.' Sakurai loves his silhouette's. Of course- this is less about movement then why the frame could work.

May I ask, is this support thread on the idea that a Mii fighter Frame is by far not the problem of a Geno Mii Upgrade? That seems like common ground to say that the body of a Mii would fit Geno just fine.

---additionally, I think Cuphead was pretty widely speculated after Sans. Sans was a surprise not solely because of the character (though that was a part for sure), but because upgraded Mii costumes had never been broken, and this community as a whole has a difficult time imagining new or widely accepting new concepts. After we got Sans, after we got Banjo, after the creators of Cuphead told Sakurai in an open statement to use the character freely--- I'd say Cuphead was widely speculated... though I'm not going to go back and find all the posts I saw and wrote on it at the time.

I talked about this yesterday:

If Nintendo really wanted to not make Geno a fighter and give us the Mii costume again they would have put him in the base game because they already got the rights to make him a spirit in the base game, why making him a spirit instead of giving us the Smash 4 Mii costume back? They even had the chance to give us an upgraded "Premium" Geno Mii costume when they negotiated with Square Enix to get Hero. Either he becomes a fully playable character or he stays as a shiny PNG, it wouldn't make sense to give us the Geno Mii costume now.

That seems like common ground to say that the body of a Mii would fit Geno just fine.

Yes, that's exactly why they made Chrom a Mii costume in Smash 4, because the body of a Mii swordfighter fits Chrom just fine and represents him very well.

Also, it's not that "only indie characters can be premium Mii costumes", none of the Smash 4 Mii costumes got upgraded, all of them got ported with any changes except some Mii costumes that are still missing, for example: Geno. But wait, now that I think about it, some Mii costumes from Smash 4 actually got upgraded...

 

[pupNapoleon]

I talked about this yesterday:




Yes, that's exactly why they made Chrom a Mii costume in Smash 4, because the body of a Mii swordfighter fits Chrom just fine and represents him very well.

Also, it's not that "only indie characters can be premium Mii costumes", none of the Smash 4 Mii costumes got upgraded, all of them got ported with any changes except some Mii costumes that are still missing, for example: Geno. But wait, now that I think about it, some Mii costumes from Smash 4 actually got upgraded...

I don't know if youre tone is bratty or if I'm just reading it that way- but if you think asking a question in earnest to the room about Geno's shape is the same as your comparison to Chrom, then clearly youre right, one of us is being a bit delusional about finding common ground. There's no reason for me to mention Upgraded Mii's obviously not existing until fighter pack 4, since you seem hell bent on arguing versus conversing, but I'll work harder to give you the benefit of the doubt.
How would Geno have been an upgraded Mii costume at that point at the beginning? For all we know, and all evidence suggests, it didnt exist early on. Hell, Sans really may have been testing ground, followed up with Cuphead, to see if the idea was well received.

Anyway, thanks for your input, even if I find the comparison to Chrom completely illogical and quite blatantly passive aggressive.

 

[RedMachine123]

I don't know if youre tone is bratty or if I'm just reading it that way- but if you think asking a question in earnest to the room about Geno's shape is the same as your comparison to Chrom, then clearly youre right, one of us is being a bit delusional about finding common ground. There's no reason for me to mention Upgraded Mii's obviously not existing until fighter pack 4, since you seem hell bent on arguing versus conversing, but I'll work harder to give you the benefit of the doubt.
How would Geno have been an upgraded Mii costume at that point at the beginning? For all we know, and all evidence suggests, it didnt exist early on. Hell, Sans really may have been testing ground, followed up with Cuphead, to see if the idea was well received.

Anyway, thanks for your input, even if I find the comparison to Chrom completely illogical and quite blatantly passive aggressive.

Sorry if I sounded rude, I didn't mean to, it's just my way of talking.

 

[Garteam]

I guess I'm being invited for my thoughts.

- As far as the gunner is concerned, from my point of view, visually, it was made for Geno. The Arm cannon is a common trope to some extent- Megaman, Samus, the queen herself- Rabbid Princess Peach, but visually, it's quite a fit for Geno. I know one of the big points Sakurai constantly brings up is body shape. He did this for Villager/Isabelle, he did it for echoes (as far back as Luncina), and from the beginning he has bolstered the value of a unique silhouette- not just in outspoken and direct statements about the value of a unique silhouette, or why Falco was chosen over Wolf). Above all of this, we have the iconic 'character approaching.' Sakurai loves his silhouette's. Of course- this is less about movement then why the frame could work.

May I ask, is this support thread on the idea that a Mii fighter Frame is by far not the problem of a Geno Mii Upgrade? That seems like common ground to say that the body of a Mii would fit Geno just fine.

---additionally, I think Cuphead was pretty widely speculated after Sans. Sans was a surprise not solely because of the character (though that was a part for sure), but because upgraded Mii costumes had never been broken, and this community as a whole has a difficult time imagining new or widely accepting new concepts. After we got Sans, after we got Banjo, after the creators of Cuphead told Sakurai in an open statement to use the character freely--- I'd say Cuphead was widely speculated... though I'm not going to go back and find all the posts I saw and wrote on it at the time.

While I definitely agree that Geno has the same frame and proportions as the Mii Gunner, there's still far more to making a character than just the frame. Mario, Ness, and Villager all share a body type and utilize punches and kicks, but there's so much more to their abilities that you could never have them share a moveset. Mario utilizes general atheletics and his variety of power-ups, Ness uses JRPG magic reimagined as PSI, and Villager uses household tools and objects repurposed as weapons. It's a similar deal with Mii Gunner and Geno. At a first glance, everything would look fine, but so much of Geno's individuality and appeal is stripped away, to the point where you really can't say it's a good representation of the character.

Regarding Cuphead's speculation and general premium Mii Costume speculation, I don't know if I was an anomaly or just have a terrible memory, but I really can't remember seeing any discussions of either of those topics going on. Most posts I remember from the time were just hype over the fact that Sans and Megalovania were effectively memed into the game. Surprisingly, there was little discussion over what this meant beyond "Mii Costumes can now bring songs with them", with little emphasis put on who would be getting this treatment. For Cuphead, maybe one or two people might've brought it up, but it definitely wasn't a popular or expected idea like Hollow Knight getting a premium costume is now. Plus, plenty of studios openly give their approval to Smash and most get nothing. The Doom devs, for example, have been very open about giving their approval to Doom in Smash yet nothing has happened. As such, Studio MDHR giving their public blessing really didn't catch the eyes of many people for more than a few seconds, because it's not really a new song and dance.

 

[pupNapoleon]

While I definitely agree that Geno has the same frame and proportions as the Mii Gunner, there's still far more to making a character than just the frame. Mario, Ness, and Villager all share a body type and utilize punches and kicks, but there's so much more to their abilities that you could never have them share a moveset. Mario utilizes general atheletics and his variety of power-ups, Ness uses JRPG magic reimagined as PSI, and Villager uses household tools and objects repurposed as weapons. It's a similar deal with Mii Gunner and Geno. At a first glance, everything would look fine, but so much of Geno's individuality and appeal is stripped away, to the point where you really can't say it's a good representation of the character.

Regarding Cuphead's speculation and general premium Mii Costume speculation, I don't know if I was an anomaly or just have a terrible memory, but I really can't remember seeing any discussions of either of those topics going on. Most posts I remember from the time were just hype over the fact that Sans and Megalovania were effectively memed into the game. Surprisingly, there was little discussion over what this meant beyond "Mii Costumes can now bring songs with them", with little emphasis put on who would be getting this treatment. For Cuphead, maybe one or two people might've brought it up, but it definitely wasn't a popular or expected idea like Hollow Knight getting a premium costume is now. Plus, plenty of studios openly give their approval to Smash and most get nothing. The Doom devs, for example, have been very open about giving their approval to Doom in Smash yet nothing has happened. As such, Studio MDHR giving their public blessing really didn't catch the eyes of many people for more than a few seconds, because it's not really a new song and dance.

I'm honestly not familiar enough with the Gunner's moveset to defend if it could be Geno's. Nor am I interested in a full debate, as I know that has little value in this thread. Hence why I wanted to see if the common ground could be found on the body type.

Now... Cuphead. I recall too many threads about what upgraded costumes were next. I remember googling it. Sure, it's anecdotal, as it's my experience, but I'm honestly shocked you don't recall it. I recall many popular ideas. Hatkid, Hollow Knight, Shovel Knight, Quote... there were a lot. Cuphead was on the shortlist.

One thing I will say about the Mii Upgrades, that I do believe is actually plausible with this new fighter implementation, would be if each one came with a single new move option for the fighting class, which would inherently be a signature move of the character. Maybe this will be implemented in the future- we could see Shovel Knight come with a sword hop, as an example.
Of course, this would make us expect a rounded amount of costumes (one new signature move in rotation for Gunner/Brawler/Sword).

 

[QQS]

Totally yes! I’m expecting Geno fully playable + The Knight as a costume (swordman/indie, makes sense). There is no point to make another Gunner and waste all the perfect moveset Geno has, making him a Mii again.

As many said before, there is no point for a Premium Costume Geno; in that case you could bring back the Sm4sh costume. On the other hand, it’s absurd bringing back the old costume given its demand and recognition; in this case the only thing I can see happening is a Challenger Pack complete for Geno (would love the #7), with 1 Stage and 2 or more songs. Also with his Classic Route, Boxing Ring Name (The Star Warrior), some Spirits, Kirby’s hat, Mario logo (like his spirit), etc.

Sakurai knows what he is doing and how Geno has been evolving since Melee (properly since Brawl). There is no point to repeat all the reasons we believe Geno is happening in this posts cause we already know them by memory. We know that there are enough solid reasons to make Geno playable; and enough good theories to still believe in him. It all adds up. “This is the Smash that will make everyone happy” and “fans will be pleased”. Just look how epic picks ended up playable now. People have left only Geno, Isaac, Sora and a few others in the “Global Request”.

He is coming playable, don’t tell me you didn’t know. Geno will get the spot and love he deserves, with a proper moveset with timed hits. Perfect moveset, new mechanics, perfect design for Smash. Solid link with Mario World, strong story attached between Square & Nintendo in those days and epic fan demand like Banjo-Kazooie, Ridley or King K. Rool. (And many others which I would be glad happening, like Crash mostly). I can see happening also Doomguy, Rayman, Waluigi, Chun-Li, a Namco one (Lloyd or Heihachi) or a Zelda one (hope it can be my boy Skull Kid, but I would be glad with any totally new Zelda pick).

Anyway, it’s just my theory. But give me only Geno and I will retire. Paid in full with him.

GENO GETS SMASH ON THE ROAD!

papagenos Fatmanonice TerminalMontage PsychoIncarnate

 

[pupNapoleon]

New question to the room (since I continually read that an upgraded costume has no point or is a waste of resources... which doesn't make sense to me but that's really not my point).

But here is the question:

Would the room honestly prefer no Mii costume to any mii costume? No Mii costume to an upgrade?
Obviously everyone here wants the character. But let's in this theoretical concept, take off that option.
What's the next best option?

 

[Heoj]

New question to the room (since I continually read that an upgraded costume has no point or is a waste of resources... which doesn't make sense to me but that's really not my point).

But here is the question:

Would the room honestly prefer no Mii costume to any mii costume? No Mii costume to an upgrade?
Obviously everyone here wants the character. But let's in this theoretical concept, take off that option.
What's the next best option?

In my opinion, i might prefer no mii at all if geno isnt playable, though it doesnt really matter at all since im anyways really confident in genos chances.

 

[Droodle]

I talked about this yesterday:




Yes, that's exactly why they made Chrom a Mii costume in Smash 4, because the body of a Mii swordfighter fits Chrom just fine and represents him very well.

Also, it's not that "only indie characters can be premium Mii costumes", none of the Smash 4 Mii costumes got upgraded, all of them got ported with any changes except some Mii costumes that are still missing, for example: Geno. But wait, now that I think about it, some Mii costumes from Smash 4 actually got upgraded...

Sure they could have put Geno in base IF they had the rights to him as a costume at that time, but perhaps Square was being stingy and only allowed Geno/Mallow spirits for base. Let's be honest putting in a mii costume as paid DLC (especially one as requested as Geno) puts out a lot more money then putting him in base for free. And we already know Square was pretty hard to negotiate with the base game.

Most people bring up the fact that Geno missed Hero's mii costume as some big shining bullet, but as we all know Hero only came with Enix/DQ costumes. This is one explanation of why Geno/Chocobo may have missed the boat during that time, or maybe Geno/Chocobo are going to be full-blown fighters in FP 2; who knows?

But on top of that, there are other mii costumes that have just as much weird stuff going on with them.

Monster Hunter: Full blown assist in the base game, has a MH stage, and MH music. So it's pretty clear that Capcom were open to MH representation. Yet, Monster Hunter is still missing the Mii costumes. MH is one of the biggest franchises in Japan, and Capcom's biggest franchise at the moment; are we getting a Monster Hunter character? Or is it likely that MH will just get it's mii costume down the line.

Lloyd/Heihachi/Gilgamesh: Sakurai expressed interest in them previously (even planning out a Heihachi fighter, but dropping it). Namco Bandai literally creates the game so I doubt that they would have been stingy with putting in the Lloyd/Heihachi/Gil mii costumes. Let's say that 1 of them is playable, then why didn't they put the other in base? There's no reason to hold them back.

Some characters also broke the pattern with their costume releases as well. Banjo didn't even come with Banjo-Kazooie/Microsoft costumes, but rather an assortment of 1st/3rd party series. Byleth didn't even come with costumes related to his OWN series and he is 1st party, besides Edelgard/Dmitri/Claude are pretty popular characters too, so I doubt that it wouldn't have made them $$$. Does this mean we're getting another Microsoft/Rare and a Fire Emblem character like Edelgard to come with those "missing" costumes? Probably not.

That said, I would be pretty interested in what the ARMS mii costumes are. Will they be from ARMS, or will they be entirely 3rd party costumes (like Byleth). Chances are that the speculation scene will completely change with those costumes.

Also most people bring up the idea of a Geno Premium costume because proportionately, Geno fits pretty well to the size of a premium mii costume. So far both Sans and Cuphead were scaled pretty well to the proportions of the Premium Mii. The idea is that Premium Mii costumes will be left for popular characters that fit the proportions well, so for example we could end up seeing a Premium Mii costume of Geno/Hollow Knight/Tom Nook, but we won't be seeing premium mii's of characters like Dante/Sora/Monster Hunter/Lloyd/Heihachi/Phoenix Wright; if they end up getting costumed, chances are that it'll just be regular mii costumes (maybe with a music track).

While I definitely agree that Geno has the same frame and proportions as the Mii Gunner, there's still far more to making a character than just the frame. Mario, Ness, and Villager all share a body type and utilize punches and kicks, but there's so much more to their abilities that you could never have them share a moveset. Mario utilizes general atheletics and his variety of power-ups, Ness uses JRPG magic reimagined as PSI, and Villager uses household tools and objects repurposed as weapons. It's a similar deal with Mii Gunner and Geno. At a first glance, everything would look fine, but so much of Geno's individuality and appeal is stripped away, to the point where you really can't say it's a good representation of the character.

Regarding Cuphead's speculation and general premium Mii Costume speculation, I don't know if I was an anomaly or just have a terrible memory, but I really can't remember seeing any discussions of either of those topics going on. Most posts I remember from the time were just hype over the fact that Sans and Megalovania were effectively memed into the game. Surprisingly, there was little discussion over what this meant beyond "Mii Costumes can now bring songs with them", with little emphasis put on who would be getting this treatment. For Cuphead, maybe one or two people might've brought it up, but it definitely wasn't a popular or expected idea like Hollow Knight getting a premium costume is now. Plus, plenty of studios openly give their approval to Smash and most get nothing. The Doom devs, for example, have been very open about giving their approval to Doom in Smash yet nothing has happened. As such, Studio MDHR giving their public blessing really didn't catch the eyes of many people for more than a few seconds, because it's not really a new song and dance.

The idea isn't to make a 100% accurate portrayal of Geno using a mii costume; but rather make it feel like his mii costume "fits" with the rest of the cast without needing to use as many resources required to make him a full blown fighter. Yes, Geno is capable of so much more then what a Premium Mii Gunner fighter allows him to be, but so is almost every other Mii Costume in the game (not just Premium Mii's). If they went all out with a Sans/Cuphead mii costume, chances are it would be an incredibly unique/fun character, but they didn't and gave them premium mii's because it does a "good enough" job of representing them.

Now will Nintendo Premium Mii costume Geno? Nintendo is pretty aware of the demand for Geno, but to be fair there are a ton of demanded characters that don't make the cut, like Isaac or Waluigi. Even Sans was a pretty popular request overall, and all he ended up with was a Premium Mii Costume. So really in my opinion, there's a good chance that he could be a fighter, but there is also a good chance that he'll end up with a premium mii costume.

 

[Sigran101]

Sora and Crash

Paper Mario is my number 1 first party pick though



Everyone harps on World of Final Fantasy but I think that's the exception as opposed to the rule. I don't see Sakurai agreeing to make Sora a limited time offer and then he's gone forever; he wants Smash to be for everyone, and it can't be for everyone is there's a character you just can't get after a certain time.

Also it would be hell for tournament players if say someone mains Sora and they end up on a setup that doesn't have him because that person just didn't get him in time.

I don't buy Sora being a LTO, he'd either be available like the rest or not at all

Yeah, a LTO character in smash would be met with HUGE backlash. I feel like if Disney demanded that Sakurai would just say no deal and go for a different character.

 

[Enigma735]

Sure they could have put Geno in base IF they had the rights to him as a costume at that time, but perhaps Square was being stingy and only allowed Geno/Mallow spirits for base. Let's be honest putting in a mii costume as paid DLC (especially one as requested as Geno) puts out a lot more money then putting him in base for free. And we already know Square was pretty hard to negotiate with the base game.

Most people bring up the fact that Geno missed Hero's mii costume as some big shining bullet, but as we all know Hero only came with Enix/DQ costumes. This is one explanation of why Geno/Chocobo may have missed the boat during that time, or maybe Geno/Chocobo are going to be full-blown fighters in FP 2; who knows?

But on top of that, there are other mii costumes that have just as much weird stuff going on with them.

Monster Hunter: Full blown assist in the base game, has a MH stage, and MH music. So it's pretty clear that Capcom were open to MH representation. Yet, Monster Hunter is still missing the Mii costumes. MH is one of the biggest franchises in Japan, and Capcom's biggest franchise at the moment; are we getting a Monster Hunter character? Or is it likely that MH will just get it's mii costume down the line.

Lloyd/Heihachi/Gilgamesh: Sakurai expressed interest in them previously (even planning out a Heihachi fighter, but dropping it). Namco Bandai literally creates the game so I doubt that they would have been stingy with putting in the Lloyd/Heihachi/Gil mii costumes. Let's say that 1 of them is playable, then why didn't they put the other in base? There's no reason to hold them back.

Some characters also broke the pattern with their costume releases as well. Banjo didn't even come with Banjo-Kazooie/Microsoft costumes, but rather an assortment of 1st/3rd party series. Byleth didn't even come with costumes related to his OWN series and he is 1st party, besides Edelgard/Dmitri/Claude are pretty popular characters too, so I doubt that it wouldn't have made them $$$. Does this mean we're getting another Microsoft/Rare and a Fire Emblem character like Edelgard to come with those "missing" costumes? Probably not.

That said, I would be pretty interested in what the ARMS mii costumes are. Will they be from ARMS, or will they be entirely 3rd party costumes (like Byleth). Chances are that the speculation scene will completely change with those costumes.

Also most people bring up the idea of a Geno Premium costume because proportionately, Geno fits pretty well to the size of a premium mii costume. So far both Sans and Cuphead were scaled pretty well to the proportions of the Premium Mii. The idea is that Premium Mii costumes will be left for popular characters that fit the proportions well, so for example we could end up seeing a Premium Mii costume of Geno/Hollow Knight/Tom Nook, but we won't be seeing premium mii's of characters like Dante/Sora/Monster Hunter/Lloyd/Heihachi/Phoenix Wright; if they end up getting costumed, chances are that it'll just be regular mii costumes (maybe with a music track).


The idea isn't to make a 100% accurate portrayal of Geno using a mii costume; but rather make it feel like his mii costume "fits" with the rest of the cast without needing to use as many resources required to make him a full blown fighter. Yes, Geno is capable of so much more then what a Premium Mii Gunner fighter allows him to be, but so is almost every other Mii Costume in the game (not just Premium Mii's). If they went all out with a Sans/Cuphead mii costume, chances are it would be an incredibly unique/fun character, but they didn't and gave them premium mii's because it does a "good enough" job of representing them.

Now will Nintendo Premium Mii costume Geno? Nintendo is pretty aware of the demand for Geno, but to be fair there are a ton of demanded characters that don't make the cut, like Isaac or Waluigi. Even Sans was a pretty popular request overall, and all he ended up with was a Premium Mii Costume. So really in my opinion, there's a good chance that he could be a fighter, but there is also a good chance that he'll end up with a premium mii costume.

You make some decent points and I think their is a chance Geno could be a premium outfit. However, and I am not trying to set myself up for disappointment, but I really think its more likely Geno will be playable imo then to get his outfit back. Geno is such a highly requested character that even Sakurai has said by name that he wanted to include. I can't really see why Nintendo and Sakurai would include him as an outfit again unless Square is stingy about it and wants some other character then Geno, but either way, I think Geno would be the most likely next Square rep since I feel he has less obstacles to go through then other Square characters. I also think the lack of Namco outfits are pretty significant too which makes me believe a Namco rep is very likely too. And I feel like if Geno were to be an outfit, he would have came with Hero, and it had to have been around Hero's release when Nintendo and Sakurai decided to do more DLC after the first Pass, so the fact that the Geno outfit has yet to come back is pretty significant since their is a good chance that Nintendo And Sakurai decided not to include it in case Geno is to come as a playable character in the near future. That is just my two cents.

 

[AdamBel731]

Yowzers. I came in at a bad time.


Oh, pardon my question, but what all have I missed? I didn't ask the other day when I came back because I sort of assumed nothing of note has really happened due to so many things likely being delayed due to the virus.

I usually don't like asking this because it feels like a nuisance, but... well, I've been gone for a bit (as people know) so I'd have to read a lot of pages ti catch up. Just a SparkNotes version of everything to get me up to speed again would be appreciated! Godspeed.

(Also happy Mother's Day if there happen to be any in this thread.)

 

[pupNapoleon]

Sure they could have put Geno in base IF they had the rights to him as a costume at that time, but perhaps Square was being stingy and only allowed Geno/Mallow spirits for base. Let's be honest putting in a mii costume as paid DLC (especially one as requested as Geno) puts out a lot more money then putting him in base for free. And we already know Square was pretty hard to negotiate with the base game.

Most people bring up the fact that Geno missed Hero's mii costume as some big shining bullet, but as we all know Hero only came with Enix/DQ costumes. This is one explanation of why Geno/Chocobo may have missed the boat during that time, or maybe Geno/Chocobo are going to be full-blown fighters in FP 2; who knows?

But on top of that, there are other mii costumes that have just as much weird stuff going on with them.

Monster Hunter: Full blown assist in the base game, has a MH stage, and MH music. So it's pretty clear that Capcom were open to MH representation. Yet, Monster Hunter is still missing the Mii costumes. MH is one of the biggest franchises in Japan, and Capcom's biggest franchise at the moment; are we getting a Monster Hunter character? Or is it likely that MH will just get it's mii costume down the line.

Lloyd/Heihachi/Gilgamesh: Sakurai expressed interest in them previously (even planning out a Heihachi fighter, but dropping it). Namco Bandai literally creates the game so I doubt that they would have been stingy with putting in the Lloyd/Heihachi/Gil mii costumes. Let's say that 1 of them is playable, then why didn't they put the other in base? There's no reason to hold them back.

Some characters also broke the pattern with their costume releases as well. Banjo didn't even come with Banjo-Kazooie/Microsoft costumes, but rather an assortment of 1st/3rd party series. Byleth didn't even come with costumes related to his OWN series and he is 1st party, besides Edelgard/Dmitri/Claude are pretty popular characters too, so I doubt that it wouldn't have made them $$$. Does this mean we're getting another Microsoft/Rare and a Fire Emblem character like Edelgard to come with those "missing" costumes? Probably not.

That said, I would be pretty interested in what the ARMS mii costumes are. Will they be from ARMS, or will they be entirely 3rd party costumes (like Byleth). Chances are that the speculation scene will completely change with those costumes.

Also most people bring up the idea of a Geno Premium costume because proportionately, Geno fits pretty well to the size of a premium mii costume. So far both Sans and Cuphead were scaled pretty well to the proportions of the Premium Mii. The idea is that Premium Mii costumes will be left for popular characters that fit the proportions well, so for example we could end up seeing a Premium Mii costume of Geno/Hollow Knight/Tom Nook, but we won't be seeing premium mii's of characters like Dante/Sora/Monster Hunter/Lloyd/Heihachi/Phoenix Wright; if they end up getting costumed, chances are that it'll just be regular mii costumes (maybe with a music track).


The idea isn't to make a 100% accurate portrayal of Geno using a mii costume; but rather make it feel like his mii costume "fits" with the rest of the cast without needing to use as many resources required to make him a full blown fighter. Yes, Geno is capable of so much more then what a Premium Mii Gunner fighter allows him to be, but so is almost every other Mii Costume in the game (not just Premium Mii's). If they went all out with a Sans/Cuphead mii costume, chances are it would be an incredibly unique/fun character, but they didn't and gave them premium mii's because it does a "good enough" job of representing them.

Now will Nintendo Premium Mii costume Geno? Nintendo is pretty aware of the demand for Geno, but to be fair there are a ton of demanded characters that don't make the cut, like Isaac or Waluigi. Even Sans was a pretty popular request overall, and all he ended up with was a Premium Mii Costume. So really in my opinion, there's a good chance that he could be a fighter, but there is also a good chance that he'll end up with a premium mii costume.

I appreciate this comment a lot. I understand that the thread here is of course in high favor of Geno- but I truly don't understand how the concept of costumes is being dismissed as if it's completely implausible. It sounds like a really easy way to be utterly disappointed.... and I understand vividly and being interested in best wishes. But I get a bit concerned that, if Geno is a costume, this thread could react in a pretty negative way. Which ultimately would probably not be in its best interest.
There may be some reasons to think Geno is possible... but there are lots of possibilities for characters, as the post above states. Square Enix is also a big company, with some huge icons still in Sora and Lara Croft. There are many ways that a Geno character could not pan out. We don't have to live in that assumption, but to not consider the possibility could lead a bad turn up ahead.

 

[Droodle]

You make some decent points and I think their is a chance Geno could be a premium outfit. However, and I am not trying to set myself up for disappointment, but I really think its more likely Geno will be playable imo then to get his outfit back. Geno is such a highly requested character that even Sakurai has said by name that he wanted to include. I can't really see why Nintendo and Sakurai would include him as an outfit again unless Square is stingy about it and wants some other character then Geno, but either way, I think Geno would be the most likely next Square rep since I feel he has less obstacles to go through then other Square characters. I also think the lack of Namco outfits are pretty significant too which makes me believe a Namco rep is very likely too. And I feel like if Geno were to be an outfit, he would have came with Hero, and it had to have been around Hero's release when Nintendo and Sakurai decided to do more DLC after the first Pass, so the fact that the Geno outfit has yet to come back is pretty significant since their is a good chance that Nintendo And Sakurai decided not to include it in case Geno is to come as a playable character in the near future. That is just my two cents.

I'm not saying that Geno isn't going to be playable. If you think that he is 100%, be free to do so. If I was saying anti-Geno stuff it would be in the Newcomer thread not the Geno thread. I think a lot of people here think Geno is playable.

But what I am saying is that there's at least a solid 10 characters (discounting all ARMS characters) that have some wonky stuff/"evidence" hinting that they might be in. Now obviously as far as we know there are only 5 slots left; so some of those characters won't make it unless there's another set of characters.

 

[7NATOR]

You know, Beyond the talk of Premium Mii Costumes and stuff like that, Isn't it possible for Geno to be a Bonus character. I Know Mr Fatman has been putting out the idea of Bonus Characters and he speculates characters like Waluigi, But i think Geno could just be a bonus character instead of a Full on Fighter Pass.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

You know, Beyond the talk of Premium Mii Costumes and stuff like that, Isn't it possible for Geno to be a Bonus character. I Know Mr Fatman has been putting out the idea of Bonus Characters and he speculates characters like Waluigi, But i think Geno could just be a bonus character instead of a Full on Fighter Pass.

i know you mentioned a similar idea in the newcomer thread, that they'd be individual dlc like , with no stage (and possibly no music) and they could fill in the remaining 4 WoL slots after the pass is done. what i wonder, though, is if they'd actually do that, do impromptu individual DLC while the pass is still going. they said they have no plans after this pass, which would suggest no individual DLC during or after the pass

 

[Enigma735]

I'm not saying that Geno isn't going to be playable. If you think that he is 100%, be free to do so. If I was saying anti-Geno stuff it would be in the Newcomer thread not the Geno thread. I think a lot of people here think Geno is playable.

But what I am saying is that there's at least a solid 10 characters (discounting all ARMS characters) that have some wonky stuff/"evidence" hinting that they might be in. Now obviously as far as we know there are only 5 slots left; so some of those characters won't make it unless there's another set of characters.

Fair enough. I don't think he will 100% be in, but I do think that now is his best chance of getting included.

 

[7NATOR]

i know you mentioned a similar idea in the newcomer thread, that they'd be individual dlc like , with no stage (and possibly no music) and they could fill in the remaining 4 WoL slots after the pass is done. what i wonder, though, is if they'd actually do that, do impromptu individual DLC while the pass is still going. they said they have no plans after this pass, which would suggest no individual DLC during or after the pass

They did say no ideas after the pass. That's why im thinking if they were any bonus characters, it would be during the Production of FP2, cause that's technically not after the Pass after all

I Don't know if they would do it though, it is extra work. that's why im thinking if they do this, it be Characters that are from already represented franchises, and can easily re-use assets. So Characters like Waluigi, Geno, Shadow, Knuckles, Dixie, Alucard, maybe Rex. Maybe this bonus fighter idea could explain why Fatman has been hearing Sephiroth prominently it seems (even though i don't know who he can re-use assets from)

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

I'm not saying that Geno isn't going to be playable. If you think that he is 100%, be free to do so. If I was saying anti-Geno stuff it would be in the Newcomer thread not the Geno thread. I think a lot of people here think Geno is playable.

But what I am saying is that there's at least a solid 10 characters (discounting all ARMS characters) that have some wonky stuff/"evidence" hinting that they might be in. Now obviously as far as we know there are only 5 slots left; so some of those characters won't make it unless there's another set of characters.

May you mention those 10 alleged characters?

 

[Garteam]

New question to the room (since I continually read that an upgraded costume has no point or is a waste of resources... which doesn't make sense to me but that's really not my point).

But here is the question:

Would the room honestly prefer no Mii costume to any mii costume? No Mii costume to an upgrade?
Obviously everyone here wants the character. But let's in this theoretical concept, take off that option.
What's the next best option?

If we don't get Geno, a Mii Costume is definitely a decent consolation prize relative to nothing.

In terms of outcomes, here's how I'd rank things:
1. Geno is fully playable.
(big gap)
2. Geno gets an upgraded Mii Costume and a new remix of something from Super Mario RPG (probably Beware the Forest's Mushrooms, but I'd prefer the battle theme personally).
3. Geno's Mii Costume from Smash for Wii U returns with nothing new.
(big gap)
4. Geno gets nothing.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

They did say no ideas after the pass. That's why im thinking if they were any bonus characters, it would be during the Production of FP2, cause that's technically not after the Pass after all

I Don't know if they would do it though, it is extra work. that's why im thinking if they do this, it be Characters that are from already represented franchises, and can easily re-use assets. So Characters like Waluigi, Geno, Shadow, Knuckles, Dixie, Alucard, maybe Rex. Maybe this bonus fighter idea could explain why Fatman has been hearing Sephiroth prominently it seems (even though i don't know who he can re-use assets from)

I think Sephiroth would be individual DLC on the sole basis that there's no point in adding a second FFVII stage and... getting music has been next to impossible, we still only have 2 songs

I do think characters like Octoling and Elma, both from already repped franchises, are pass-worthy with a stage and music. Echoes like Kasumi (for Joker) could be individual though, but i wouldn't mind more music with characters like those if not a stage. if Black Shadow is individual I hope he comes with more F-Zero GX tunes including Theme of Captain Falcon and Theme of Black Shadow

 

[7NATOR]

I think Sephiroth would be individual DLC on the sole basis that there's no point in adding a second FFVII stage and... getting music has been next to impossible, we still only have 2 songs

I do think characters like Octoling and Elma, both from already repped franchises, are pass-worthy with a stage and music. Echoes like Kasumi (for Joker) could be individual though, but i wouldn't mind more music with characters like those if not a stage. if Black Shadow is individual I hope he comes with more F-Zero GX tunes including Theme of Captain Falcon and Theme of Black Shadow

To be honest with you I don't know about Octoling being Pass worthy, In my mind i always pegged her as a Inkling Bonus Costume or echo unless they want to focus on the Exclusive Splatoon 2 weapons, that's just me though and Otherwise i do agree with your sentiments


and something else about those Slots, Might it be possible for them to add more to the game. I don't know if the put in 16 more Slots becuase that's the maximum cap on characters or they just put that because that's the amount they decided on. I don't know though

 

[TriggerX]

I appreciate this comment a lot. I understand that the thread here is of course in high favor of Geno- but I truly don't understand how the concept of costumes is being dismissed as if it's completely implausible. It sounds like a really easy way to be utterly disappointed.... and I understand vividly and being interested in best wishes. But I get a bit concerned that, if Geno is a costume, this thread could react in a pretty negative way. Which ultimately would probably not be in its best interest.
There may be some reasons to think Geno is possible... but there are lots of possibilities for characters, as the post above states. Square Enix is also a big company, with some huge icons still in Sora and Lara Croft. There are many ways that a Geno character could not pan out. We don't have to live in that assumption, but to not consider the possibility could lead a bad turn up ahead.

Bias aside, Geno actually works fine as a mii gunner costume. I’d personally want the whole “helmet/head” setup so the character is more accurate though. Minus his specials I expect him to play like the mii gunner anyways.
I wouldn’t mind Geno being playable, but I would say there are plenty of other characters who aren’t as lucky to be able pull off being translated into a mii costume as successfully.
That being said, I do find a lot of other characters designs and potential play styles to be more interesting than Geno, for example 2B.

At this point I wouldn’t say Geno is 100%. However it wouldn’t be too surprising if he makes the cut either and from a game development stand point, Geno would probably be an easier character for them to develop.

 

[Lord Woomy]

I might as well just say any other character will be a premium Mii costume to deconfirm them. Really, it's that simple. No piece of evidence, insider info or anything for that matter has pointed to it happening. It's really pointless spitballing, Shantae's gonna be a premium costume, Ray Man's gonna be a premium costume, Crash's gonna be a premium costume! Same amount of evidence, yet we're the only ones that get this treatment. I can say with confidence that if Geno is getting costumed again, it'll just be his Sm4sh costume.
Me looking for substance in these premium Mii costume arguments:

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

Presently, here's my locked in predictions for Fighter's Pass 2 until it's proven wrong:

ARMS: I'm a believer of the "Multi-character in one slot" theory, if it was just Springman or Ribbon Girl they would have outright told us. Also, this has a very good chance of breaking the "No Spirits" rule, which leads to...

Geno: Our boy, the one we're all here for. There are plenty of fan requests, but Geno is the last of the "Legacy" requests, the last of the "Never Evers". Banjo was Fighter Pass 1's big "Fan Pick", and Geno is bound to be the fan pick of THIS one. This is Geno's now or never moment, and I'm going all in on this being his time. CacoMallow was still never disproven, Legacy XP was sniped and featured Geno, the YouTube strikes, whatever's going on with the Square and Nintendo Amiibo... Who knows? Maybe it all means nothing, but as someone who was neck deep in Banjo speculation, the little things can sometimes add up

Crash or Rayman: Both are 90's platformer icons, but I think only one is getting in. As Fatmanonice pointed out in a previous post, Activision has a five-year plan to reboot the 'coot, and so far it's working. Crash is in the middle of a huge revival and they're pushing him hard to be a gaming icon again. Like Sonic, his history with Nintendo is as their rival, and he would complete the "Rival Trio" with Mario and Sonic.

Rayman however has some interesting little things going on that might point to his arrival being imminent: Ubisoft deconfirming his two biggest competitors AC and Rabbids, Ubisoft using a new remix of Ezio's Family in the Mii showcase that's only just recently been found in Valhalla's teaser, Ubisoft seemingly erasing all mentions of them ever speaking of Smash on multiple platforms... Only time will tell

Cinderace: I know people keep saying Game Freak doesn't want to put a new rep in DLC, but I feel like its just inevitable that we're getting a Galar rep since an Alola Rep got into the base roster, and it'll be Cinderace. I hear people pushing for Rillaboom, but Scorbunny is the FACE of the starter trio, and his evo line is the star of the new anime series just like Greninja was.

Nightmare: I just mentioned it in a previous post, but Nightmare has the BIGGEST connection to Nintendo in the fact that Link has been in Soul Calibur 2. Soul Calibur is a fighting game staple, Nightmare is the face of the game, and you KNOW Sakurai would love to hype up a big rematch between the two. Siegfried possibly as an alt too. Of course he has serious competition between Lloyd and Heihachi though. Again, time will tell, but I'm rooting for the Azure Knight

Sora or Master Chief: What do Sonic, Snake, Joker, and Cloud have in common? Their reveals blew the roof off and completely blew our expectations of who is viable to get into Smash out of the water, and I think Nintendo is going to go for one more. Master Chief is the Mario of Xbox, and Sora teeters the line between third and fourth party. The team behind Halo once shot down a crossover request with DoA and reached a thin compromise, and everyone is convinced Disney would never cooperate. Two "impossible" characters owned by "impossible" companies. Ultimate has made the impossible happen before, and I think they'll do it again

 

[Rie Sonomura]

To be honest with you I don't know about Octoling being Pass worthy, In my mind i always pegged her as a Inkling Bonus Costume or echo unless they want to focus on the Exclusive Splatoon 2 weapons, that's just me though and Otherwise i do agree with your sentiments


and something else about those Slots, Might it be possible for them to add more to the game. I don't know if the put in 16 more Slots becuase that's the maximum cap on characters or they just put that because that's the amount they decided on. I don't know though

I was thinking of the Splatoon 2 weapons, and Octo Expansion music for Octoling

and I GUESS they could add more slots if they wanted? it's not like the 3DS which had a limited number of spaces due to hardware limitations, and DBFZ added slots several months before its current (and I presume last? I haven't been following DBFZ closely) DLC. idk if Smash would add more at this point in time though

then again ANYTHING is possible with how Splatoon 2 is deadass doing an encore Splatfest

 

[Droodle]

May you mention those 10 alleged characters?

Sure (but most of this is my personal opinion):
- Rayman (Ubisoft deleting mentions of Rayman for Smash. On top him not getting a costume alongside Altair/Rabbids, despite being more requested) You could technically put Ezio too, but I think Altair's costume covers most AC characters, so I don't think Ezio is going to be a fighter.
- Monster Hunter (Has a stage/music/AT, but the Hunter itself has no Mii costumes)
- Lloyd/Yuri/Tales ( Lloyd Mii costume still missing)
- Heihachi/Tekken (Originally planned for 4, got scrapped. Mii costume still missing)
- Sol Badguy (Arcsys spirits added as free content, no other representation). I don't think Arcsys would get Ragna first, but it is possible I guess.
- Geno (Missing Mii costume)
- Sephiroth (Missing Mii Costume related to his series)
- Rex and Pyra (Mentioned alongside ARMS as a character that couldn't make it due to timing)

There's some more that have tons of rumors surrounding them, but they don't have as much of tangible evidence such as missing costumes in the game/other things of that nature. Most of these are probably going to just be false ends, but Crash Bandicoot/Waluigi/Reimu/Dante/Master Chief/Sora, plus a couple others could probably fit in this area.

And that's only the ones with some sort of "evidence", chances are that 2-3 of the 5 fighters remaining won't be from any of the characters I listed above.

 

[Lord Woomy]

- Rayman (Ubisoft deleting mentions of Rayman for Smash. On top him not getting a costume alongside Altair/Rabbids, despite being more requested) You could technically put Ezio too, but I think Altair's costume covers most AC characters, so I don't think Ezio is going to be a fighter.
- Monster Hunter (Has a stage/music/AT, but the Hunter itself has no Mii costumes)
- Lloyd/Yuri/Tales ( Lloyd Mii costume still missing)
- Heihachi/Tekken (Originally planned for 4, got scrapped. Mii costume still missing)
- Sol Badguy (Arcsys spirits added as free content, no other representation). I don't think Arcsys would get Ragna first, but it is possible I guess.
- Geno (Missing Mii costume)
- Sephiroth (Missing Mii Costume related to his series)
- Rex and Pyra (Mentioned alongside ARMS as a character that couldn't make it due to timing)

Y-you do realize Geno's missing costume isn't his only piece of evidence, right?

 

[QQS]

Just found this amazing art on a Facebook group called: “GenoForSmash WishMakers”. Please credits to the creator of the photo.

Im so glad to finally see some light at the end of the tunnel. Just 3 days left for Geno and SuperMarioRPG to turn 24° years on next Wednesday 13th May (USA release date). Also less than a month for the next mega Nintendo Direct/Smash Direct, showcasing SuperMario 35° years anniversary, bringing potential 3D adventures remastered/ported to the Switch; potential SuperMarioRPG to the Switch library; ARMS opening the first spot in FP2; and most important, Geno being the big reveal coming playable to Smash, probably at Challenger #7.

Maybe after the Arms reveal, we will see Geno as #77 (bringing back SuperMarioRPG to the Switch); and Paper Mario as #78 (bringing back a Legacy of Paper Mario games to the Switch + a completely new entry). Probably Geno/Crash could be our next Hero/Banjo. Geno for the epic/beautiful fan demand and Crash to break the internet like Sonic or Mega Man did.

And of course many more good news.

Geno will be our next Star very very soon...

Edit: fixed words

 

[Polarthief]

- Rayman (Ubisoft deleting mentions of Rayman for Smash. On top him not getting a costume alongside Altair/Rabbids, despite being more requested) You could technically put Ezio too, but I think Altair's costume covers most AC characters, so I don't think Ezio is going to be a fighter.
- Monster Hunter (Has a stage/music/AT, but the Hunter itself has no Mii costumes)
- Lloyd/Yuri/Tales ( Lloyd Mii costume still missing)
- Heihachi/Tekken (Originally planned for 4, got scrapped. Mii costume still missing)
- Sol Badguy (Arcsys spirits added as free content, no other representation). I don't think Arcsys would get Ragna first, but it is possible I guess.
- Geno (Missing Mii costume)
- Sephiroth (Missing Mii Costume related to his series)
- Rex and Pyra (Mentioned alongside ARMS as a character that couldn't make it due to timing)

Man, that's a LOT of non-SE characters, so let me break it down for you: We're getting a SE character. Honestly, it would be more weird for no SE rep than Geno not getting in, because that would mean both Geno and Chocobo costumes just vanish instead of returning. Regardless, this means your "10 characters" gets dropped to 2: Geno and Sephiroth.
PS: That was 8, not 10.

Y-you do realize Geno's missing costume isn't his only piece of evidence, right?

It sure isn't.

 

[Lord Woomy]

It sure isn't.

I was actually gonna point in the direction of your list if I ever got the chance, but you beat me to it lol. Based on what I'm gleaning from this though, I doubt they've taken the opportunity to read it.

 

[TriggerX]

Man, that's a LOT of non-SE characters, so let me break it down for you: We're getting a SE character. Honestly, it would be more weird for no SE rep than Geno not getting in, because that would mean both Geno and Chocobo costumes just vanish instead of returning. Regardless, this means your "10 characters" gets dropped to 2: Geno and Sephiroth.
PS: That was 8, not 10.


It sure isn't.

I think it’s likely we are getting Square character, but I wouldn’t say it’s 100%. Unfortunately dlc just started being a thing last installment, and while it’s important to take note of how it was handled in the past , the dlc is obviously evolving and with ultimate has structure. It’s hard to say that there is any kind of pattern when there’s only 2 prior examples to base your assumption off of.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the chocobo hat just didn’t return. May not be worth the money involved to bring it back if it didn’t sell well.

 

[Polarthief]

I was actually gonna point in the direction of your list if I ever got the chance, but you beat me to it lol. Based on what I'm gleaning from this though, I doubt they've taken the opportunity to read it.

I mean, they're free to think what they want, and I'm sure they didn't read it, but to use 6 characters not even in competition with Geno in any way is just odd.

I think it’s likely we are getting Square character, but I wouldn’t say it’s 100%.

Sure, nothing is ever 100% until official, but even if you want to think Geno isn't coming (or isn't as likely as I like to claim), the chances of an SE rep outright not appearing is ridiculously lower. It would be downright silly for an SE rep to not appear.

 

[StarLight42]

Square Enix will absolutely get new content.

Otherwise Geno and the Chocobo would’ve appeared in the Hero DLC pack

 

[Let Geno Smash]

Presently, here's my locked in predictions for Fighter's Pass 2 until it's proven wrong:

View attachment 271362

ARMS: I'm a believer of the "Multi-character in one slot" theory, if it was just Springman or Ribbon Girl they would have outright told us. Also, this has a very good chance of breaking the "No Spirits" rule, which leads to...

Geno: Our boy, the one we're all here for. There are plenty of fan requests, but Geno is the last of the "Legacy" requests, the last of the "Never Evers". Banjo was Fighter Pass 1's big "Fan Pick", and Geno is bound to be the fan pick of THIS one. This is Geno's now or never moment, and I'm going all in on this being his time. CacoMallow was still never disproven, Legacy XP was sniped and featured Geno, the YouTube strikes, whatever's going on with the Square and Nintendo Amiibo... Who knows? Maybe it all means nothing, but as someone who was neck deep in Banjo speculation, the little things can sometimes add up

Crash or Rayman: Both are 90's platformer icons, but I think only one is getting in. As Fatmanonice pointed out in a previous post, Activision has a five-year plan to reboot the 'coot, and so far it's working. Crash is in the middle of a huge revival and they're pushing him hard to be a gaming icon again. Like Sonic, his history with Nintendo is as their rival, and he would complete the "Rival Trio" with Mario and Sonic.

Rayman however has some interesting little things going on that might point to his arrival being imminent: Ubisoft deconfirming his two biggest competitors AC and Rabbids, Ubisoft using a new remix of Ezio's Family in the Mii showcase that's only just recently been found in Valhalla's teaser, Ubisoft seemingly erasing all mentions of them ever speaking of Smash on multiple platforms... Only time will tell

Cinderace: I know people keep saying Game Freak doesn't want to put a new rep in DLC, but I feel like its just inevitable that we're getting a Galar rep since an Alola Rep got into the base roster, and it'll be Cinderace. I hear people pushing for Rillaboom, but Scorbunny is the FACE of the starter trio, and his evo line is the star of the new anime series just like Greninja was.

Nightmare: I just mentioned it in a previous post, but Nightmare has the BIGGEST connection to Nintendo in the fact that Link has been in Soul Calibur 2. Soul Calibur is a fighting game staple, Nightmare is the face of the game, and you KNOW Sakurai would love to hype up a big rematch between the two. Siegfried possibly as an alt too. Of course he has serious competition between Lloyd and Heihachi though. Again, time will tell, but I'm rooting for the Azure Knight

Sora or Master Chief: What do Sonic, Snake, Joker, and Cloud have in common? Their reveals blew the roof off and completely blew our expectations of who is viable to get into Smash out of the water, and I think Nintendo is going to go for one more. Master Chief is the Mario of Xbox, and Sora teeters the line between third and fourth party. The team behind Halo once shot down a crossover request with DoA and reached a thin compromise, and everyone is convinced Disney would never cooperate. Two "impossible" characters owned by "impossible" companies. Ultimate has made the impossible happen before, and I think they'll do it again

I have a question, What do you mean Gamefreak saying they don't need / want a Smash DLC to sell the Pokemon Pass? Do you have a Link?

 

[7NATOR]

I mean, they're free to think what they want, and I'm sure they didn't read it, but to use 6 characters not even in competition with Geno in any way is just odd.



Sure, nothing is ever 100% until official, but even if you want to think Geno isn't coming (or isn't as likely as I like to claim), the chances of an SE rep outright not appearing is ridiculously lower. It would be downright silly for an SE rep to not appear.

for a Square rep not appearing, i don't think it's silly. There are only 6 slots (1 confirmed to be ARMS) in the FP, and there are many companies out there, along with the possibility of More Nintendo characters down the line. Not to say Square is unlikely to get a character cause there is likely chance for a Square character in the FP, but eh

Also i did read the list. One thing I will say is that there's nothing Exclusively pointing towards Geno being a Playable Character, or Character in FP. The Mii Costume leak for example did not get Sans, the Premium costume. the the music takedown also applied to Sans, who was a premium Costume. Of course Using this info to speculate on Geno's status would gear you to different outcomes. He's a Premium costume, He's a Playable character in the Fighter Pass, or he's sometype of Bonus character. All Conclusions i say are valid, but none of them are confirmed

I think Geno won't just have his regular costume return though. That would be weird. I don't think he's confirmed to be a Playable character because the possiblity of a Premium costume still exists. I personally think Geno would be a Bonus type character that comes with music, likw how Corrin did back in Smash 4. yes

 

[pupNapoleon]

I might as well just say any other character will be a premium Mii costume to deconfirm them. Really, it's that simple. No piece of evidence, insider info or anything for that matter has pointed to it happening. It's really pointless spitballing, Shantae's gonna be a premium costume, Ray Man's gonna be a premium costume, Crash's gonna be a premium costume! Same amount of evidence, yet we're the only ones that get this treatment. I can say with confidence that if Geno is getting costumed again, it'll just be his Sm4sh costume.
Me looking for substance in these premium Mii costume arguments:
View attachment 271366

Wait... do you and the ten people that liked this post really not see a difference between Geno and Shantae or Crash? Again... I'm speaking merely from a body standpoint. Is this visual identity not evident? It truly seems delusional to not see the similarities in body type between the Mii (Gunner) and Geno.

EDIT: Perhaps delusional is a bit triggering. How about intentionally turning the other cheek to ignore the similarities?