Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[SpiritOfRuin]

Well , they had 3D renders made back when BK released. Unless you're refering to the litteral 3D models in game , they had pre-existing renders to use.
I also find it a bit ironic , since the SMRPG renders are even more outdated , like , look at my man Booster lol
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Hey Booster is beautiful ok? Leave the poor man alone.

 

[MattX20]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

I started supporting Banjo & Kazooie, then when they were announced I moved on to my next most wanted which was Geno.
So I'll probably move on to my next character on the list, probably Waluigi or a new Sonic character.

 

[MisterMike]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Of course I do.

 

[Megadoomer]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

The big ones for me would be Doomguy and Dante, though there are plenty of characters that I'd like to see (both plausible and unlikely), as well as characters that I feel should have been in Smash a long time ago (Dixie Kong, Toad, and to a lesser extent, Bandanna Waddle Dee).

Geno's been on my most wanted list for much longer, though - I didn't start wanting Dante and Doomguy until I played Devil May Cry 3 (which I first played in 2016) and Doom (2016), respectively.

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Yes lots but none that reach my support for Geno barring Rayman. Crash is also a big one for me and Black Mage would become my next most wanted after those 3 get in. Also, Eggman, Nightmare, and Spyro and lots of first parties like Krystal, Dixie, Isaac, Kamek, etc. There are other characters I support without really much experience with their series too like Andy, Agumon, Jibanyan, Klonoa, etc. I don't think Indies are gonna happen so I won't even bring those names up. I love Smash and there are so many characters I would love to see in the game and matchups I would love to see.

 

[Polarthief]

Of course I do.

"Do you have the time? Yes I do."

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Plenty, though most of my new top 5 is very unlikely.

Current list:
#1: Geno
#2: Was BK, so everyone else moves up one
#3: Paper Mario (based on 64/TTYD); I don't see this happening if Geno gets in though.
#4: Advance Wars rep (very doubtful)
#5: Rhythm Heaven rep (also very doubtful)
#6: Lloyd
Others not on the top 5/others that I'm supporting for their fans but don't care if they get in: Phoenix Wright, Dixie Kong, Waluigi (sort of a half-care, half-don't care), Impa (don't really care, but I prefer her over other Zelda reps), BWD (don't care), Isaac (don't care), Toxtricity (if we have to get a Gen 8 rep, otherwise I'm not actively supporting them), and a few others that I don't remember off the top of my head, rip my old signature.

That said though, I won't be actively taking part in speculation like I am now once Geno gets in. The gap between my want for Geno and BK was pretty small, but beyond that, the gap is quite massive. #1 and 2 were leagues ahead of everyone else, so it's more of getting some small neat bonuses.

 

[MattX20]

Apart from Shantae and Rayman, Geno's my most wanted character that I've wanted since at least 2007

 

[StarLight42]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

 

[ActualGarbage]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

You know it's funny, I have absolutely no personal stake in Geno what so ever, I'm a sole Doom Slayer supporter myself. But I still hope and pray with all my heart for Geno to get in because I want all of y'all to finally get what you want and be happy. It's something awfully mushy coming from garbage but, my sentiment is still true.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Probably Waluigi and Lloyd just because of how much of their histories tie into Geno's when it comes to the Smash fanbase but I'm pretty much done with Smash speculation once Ultimate's DLC is done. Despite Ultimate being an amazing game, the road has been rough. You've had major scandals from the competitive community and the insider community, Etika's suicide, an absurd amount of infighting within the fanbase, everything going on with Corona, and of course everything that's personally happened to me. I'm genuinely tired at this point but I want to see this through to the end.

 

[Lord Woomy]

So, this poll was just brought to my attention. Close to 9,000 votes and it shows us the characters who got spirited are the most popular overall. Hell, Min Min almost got a quarter of the vote, which is impressive seeing how divided it is. The only 2 non-spirited characters who got over 5% were Helix (9%) and Dr Coyle (6%). What does this show us? The spirited characters are clearly the most popular and Fatman is correct in assuming that they'd have to jump through a decent amount of hoops to include a non-spirited one. Helix is the only one of the non-spirits I could really see happening, but even then, it's unlikely I'd say. 2/3rds seem to want a spirited character, which bodes well.

 

[PatPrime]

You know it's funny, I have absolutely no personal stake in Geno what so ever, I'm a sole Doom Slayer supporter myself. But I still hope and pray with all my heart for Geno to get in because I want all of y'all to finally get what you want and be happy. It's something awfully mushy coming from garbage but, my sentiment is still true.

I'm sort of in a similar boat myself. I like Geno but Doomguy is my most wanted alongside Rayman and Crash (Banjo would be here but he's already in, yay). Geno getting in would make me happy for all of you guys moreso than myself, even though I also think he would be cool and I like how he looks. There's plenty of other characters I would happy to see as well. I just don't really wanna more JRPG characters or human-proportioned characters that use weapons to whack and slice people with. Give me dudes with a focus on guns and more wacky, weird, cartoony, or bat-**** insane characters.
Fun Fact: Doomguy is my most wanted but he is also one of my most recent additions to my wishlist thanks to the Switch ports of the Doom games.

 

[StarLight42]

So, this poll was just brought to my attention. Close to 9,000 votes and it shows us the characters who got spirited are the most popular overall. Hell, Min Min almost got a quarter of the vote, which is impressive seeing how divided it is. The only 2 non-spirited characters who got over 5% were Helix (9%) and Dr Coyle (6%). What does this show us? The spirited characters are clearly the most popular and Fatman is correct in assuming that they'd have to jump through a decent amount of hoops to include a non-spirited one. Helix is the only one of the non-spirits I could really see happening, but even then, it's unlikely I'd say. 2/3rds seem to want a spirited character, which bodes well.
View attachment 271201

Blows my mind that this many people think spirits don't deconfirm yet there is still so much arguing about it.

 

[ActualGarbage]

So, this poll was just brought to my attention. Close to 9,000 votes and it shows us the characters who got spirited are the most popular overall. Hell, Min Min almost got a quarter of the vote, which is impressive seeing how divided it is. The only 2 non-spirited characters who got over 5% were Helix (9%) and Dr Coyle (6%). What does this show us? The spirited characters are clearly the most popular and Fatman is correct in assuming that they'd have to jump through a decent amount of hoops to include a non-spirited one. Helix is the only one of the non-spirits I could really see happening, but even then, it's unlikely I'd say. 2/3rds seem to want a spirited character, which bodes well.
View attachment 271201

I know the internet well enough to know exactly why people are voting for Min Min and Twintelle, I see through their games.

 

[QQS]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

I’m 100% done with Geno. But only cause you ask, I would love to see Skull Kid, Zero, Tails(or Knuckles), The Knight(or Hornet), and probably a few more.

But with Geno I’m done 100% in speculation and wishing. Also my most wanted before Geno was Mega Man and that dream came true also.

Now Geno will join the party, let’s get this show on the road!

 

[Lord Woomy]

Blows my mind that this many people think spirits don't deconfirm yet there is still so much arguing about it.

Vocal minorities are a hell of a drug

I know the internet well enough to know exactly why people are voting for Min Min and Twintelle, I see through their games.

There is very much a reason I made this after the March Direct lol

 

[MrJudd]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Beyond Geno, I’m kinda rooting for a Xenoblade rep of any kind (because Xenoblade is my favorite game series), and Master Chief, so we can cement Ultimate as one of the greatest crossovers of all time.

 

[Lord Woomy]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

Honestly don't have the energy in me to go head first into supporting another character. This image is how I feel right about now.

 

[Rohanx17]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

after geno is isaac, and if he makes it too then waluigi. I don't think wah is in the cards for ultimate anymore barring some freak miracle like a third pass but if he does or I guess when smash 6 rolls around I'll settle into the custom robo thread to spread awareness until I pass or just stop caring about smash altogether. That said if I get rock and geno in smash my motivation to be actively involved will be mostly gone and after my current top 3 I doubt i'll follow speculation anymore at all. This has been one hell of a ride sakurai's put us through and I'm glad I got to spend it with the geno gang for as long as it's going to last. Gonna be pretty bittersweet to see this place dry up after reveal ngl, even though I took a pretty massive hiatus and I'm sure it won't be the last the way things are going I always make sure to peek in and see what was going on. It's going to be pretty weird going to back to not having that once dlc ends either way.

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

I fail to see what makes the renders of BK so "uncanny", they look perfectly fine to me. The SMRPG renders on the other hand.........yeah no, a lot of them only look good as sprites in-game, where the imperfections are hidden (yikes Bowser)

Smash fans contorting logic to try and explain how a LM3 character is guaranteed while Geno is still deconfirmed like
View attachment 271170

I mean, this is the only thread in which i have seen people throw this idea of King Boo. The King Boo thread is barely alive (heh). Makes me wonder why they just don't.......you know, go into that thread and talk about it. Not to sound like a gatekeeper, but still.

I know the internet well enough to know exactly why people are voting for Min Min and Twintelle, I see through their games.

If Twintelle gets in, she will get the Snake/Ann Treatment for sure. So the joke's on them:

 

[Lord Woomy]

If Twintelle gets in, she will get the Snake/Ann Treatment for sure. So the joke's on them:

Twintelle fans if she gets in but gets her ass nerfed

 

[Sigran101]

I fail to see what makes the renders of BK so "uncanny", they look perfectly fine to me. The SMRPG renders on the other hand.........yeah no, a lot of them only look good as sprites in-game, where the imperfections are hidden (yikes Bowser)


I mean, this is the only thread in which i have seen people throw this idea of King Boo. The King Boo thread is barely alive (heh). Makes me wonder why they just don't.......you know, go into that thread and talk about it. Not to sound like a gatekeeper, but still.



If Twintelle gets in, she will get the Snake/Ann Treatment for sure. So the joke's on them:

I brought up King Boo like twice. Ya'll talk about Waluigi more than you talk about Geno. I don't want to hear it from this thread of all places.

 

[MattX20]

I'm just hoping by the end of the month that we don't have to wait long in June for more info

 

[Enigma735]

I'm going to make my full prediction for the fighter pass.

1. Ribbongirl- The more I think about it the more I think she just makes sense if they're not going to upgrade assist trophies. I wish I was more confident in Min Min, but Ribbongirl's cool too.

2. Geno- like I really have to tell you guys why.

3. Rayman- the "western character" if you will. Tons of evidence piling up and it's still weird that we got Ubisoft costumes but no Rayman costume when he's had a presence in the game since smash 4 base game.

4. King Boo- Yes I know you don't agree, but the LM3 dlc came and went and still no spirit event so I'm still predicting him.

5. Lloyd/Heihachi- We are absolutely getting a Bamco character. Heihachi's costume not returning with Terry is just too suspicious. I'm leaning towards Lloyd because he's the longtime fan request, but it could go either way.

6. Rex- Anyone expecting the pass to end with Sora or Master Chief needs a history lesson. Not that they won't get in, but they probably won't be the finale. Rex seems obvious after ARMS, and I honestly believe, regardless of the other choices, that he is absolutely the kind of character they would end on. At least it would be less messy than Byleth!

Overall I think it's a pretty strong pass. No internet breaking reveals, but that doesn't mean it's not solid. It's heavy on 1st parties, but I don't think there's any reason to automatically expect mostly 3rd parties again. It's got two fresh recent Nintendo characters without going into shill territory, two long time request 3rd parties with Lloyd and Rayman, a unique curve ball/legacy Nintendo character with King Boo, and of course, the number one fan favorite Geno to seal the deal.

Honestly, these are my exact same predictions except for King Boo. I would personally replace him with Sol Badguy or a Gen 8 Pokemon but otherwise I agree with everything.

 

[Sigran101]

Honestly, these are my exact same predictions except for King Boo. I would personally replace him with Sol Badguy or a Gen 8 Pokemon but otherwise I agree with everything.

I think it's interesting how many people are predicting a similar lineup. I feel like half the time people post these I see some combination of Rayman, Geno, Lloyd/Heihachi, Rex, and Crash

 

[Fatmanonice]

I think it's kind of cool that there's a handful of people that have hung around since Brawl or longer but the main reason for that is that a lot of them are waiting for that ONE character to finally happen. I suppose it's similar to the how the Chicago Cubs were (went 106 years without winning a championship for you non-yanks): how the odds looked awful and several generations lived and died before seeing a World Series victory but it eventually happened anyways. A lot of the people from the Brawl days are now in their 30's and a lot of us are just looking for closure at this point. I started to get gung-ho about Geno in Smash Bros my senior year of high school and now I have two degrees and happily married so Geno has quite literally been a big part of my entire adulthood. It doesn't take too much guessing to figure out the remaining characters that people are still holding out for and will likely have Smash fanbases until they finally get in.

 

[Enigma735]

I think it's interesting how many people are predicting a similar lineup. I feel like half the time people post these I see some combination of Rayman, Geno, Lloyd/Heihachi, Rex, and Crash

Yeah true. I will admit, it can be tricky predicting Nintendo since they can be very unpredictable, but those characters always seem to be the frontrunners for many people.

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

My three most wanted characters for several years were Crash, Banjo and Geno, as you can probably tell from my profile pic. I already got one of my most wanteds with Banjo, so now the only two characters I am really hoping make it in are Crash And Geno.

 

[Deleted member]

In SmashBoards for Brawl, people hated the idea of Cloud in Smash because he’s not Nintendo and everybody prefers Geno and Crono. Nowadays, Geno is popular but also a much more controversial pick because of his obscurity. Times have changed...

 

[QQS]

I think it's kind of cool that there's a handful of people that have hung around since Brawl or longer but the main reason for that is that a lot of them are waiting for that ONE character to finally happen. I suppose it's similar to the how the Chicago Cubs were (went 106 years without winning a championship for you non-yanks): how the odds looked awful and several generations lived and died before seeing a World Series victory but it eventually happened anyways. A lot of the people from the Brawl days are now in their 30's and a lot of us are just looking for closure at this point. I started to get gung-ho about Geno in Smash Bros my senior year of high school and now I have two degrees and happily married so Geno has quite literally been a big part of my entire adulthood. It doesn't take too much guessing to figure out the remaining characters that people are still holding out for and will likely have Smash fanbases until they finally get in.

Agree! Most of you probably know my enthusiasm about Geno. I was born in 1990 and I always say my story attached to him, supporting theories and posting all the Pros in Geno’s favor, his reasons to be in and what should his challenger pack will look like. My “circle” would be full with him and I’m not asking for anything more ever, in gaming. Also, I believe 100% he is happening.

I can accept that maybe he is another #number and not necessarily #77; he can perfectly be 78 or even 81. Maybe they don’t have to “play with the numbers” I know. For example Banjo-Kazooie are a duo and they weren’t Challenger Pack #2. B-K was the middle of the pass for a reason, of course. Sakurai didn’t match the duo with the number 2. Same for Geno.

-What I believe? He will be in Fighter Pass 2
-What number? If you ask me, #77
-Can he be another number? Totally yes
-Can developers skip him and add him as a Mii costume like Sm4sh, Premium costume like Sans or not doing anything new? Totally no. Geno is happening as a playable character 100%, just wait and see. He will descend once again after these long 24 years.

Geno follows Smash Road!

 

[Polarthief]

-Can developers skip him and add him as a Mii costume like Sm4sh, Premium costume like Sans or not doing anything new? Totally no. Geno is happening as a playable character 100%, just wait and see. He will descend once again after these long 24 years.

I'm glad more people have that attitude of "Geno is definitely happening" and not "I think he's got about a 60% chance or so". Seriously, if he somehow doesn't get in despite that huge post I have in my sig, I'm gonna be sad and never trust anything circumstantial ever again in my life.

But it's okay, because he's gonna be in.

 

[Qeomash]

Hmm...you guys have any other characters you would support if Geno becomes playable?

There are only two characters I've ever seriously wanted in Smash: Geno, and Isaac. At this point, I will be overjoyed with just one of them. Any other serious wants, like Inkling, were truly shoe ins. Really, when Smash Ultimate was announced, I was even more worried for the characters already in that might not come back. The day "everyone is here" was announced was just relieved.

Geno was always the one I considered a long shot, because of the association with Square. Funny that he's still the most likely of the two to finally get in.

Isaac I assumed was a shoe in for Brawl. When that didn't happen, I assumed he'd be a likely candidate for Smash 4. His reveal as an assist trophy, yet again, still disappoints me. Seeing him drop in at the top of the assist trophy section was a bitter sweet moment. I was happy he wasn't forgotten again, but I was and still am bitter that's all he is.

Any other characters I rep are ones I would like to see but have zero mass appeal or really any chance of getting in. Sure, I know that nobody knows who Gitaroo Man is, but I know he'd be great and that's enough for me. And I'm okay with him never being in. Its the fact that Geno and Isaac are so freaking close and so tantalizingly possible that I'm still disappointed they're not in. Ultimate would have been a perfect game for me had they been in, but instead it's just pretty great.

 

[QQS]

Hi there! If you're reading this, chances are I linked it in the hope of educating you on evidence that I've compiled that may point to Geno getting in Smash Ultimate. This list contains all the leaks/rumors and other circumstantial evidence that still have an unconfirmed status, meaning that it has yet to be disproven, or stuff that has already happened (and is "confirmed"):

• Mii Costume List Leak: Someone leaked a bunch of Mii costumes, and there were some SMRPG ones on there like Mallow and Smithy. Geno however is not on that list. If this leak is real, it most certainly points to Geno being playable because why would the only character from the game who actually did have a Mii costume in the past not get one for Ultimate?
  • No returning costumes have ever returned alongside new costumes from their series: Tails & Knuckles with Joker, Zero and Proto Man with Banjo, Jacky and Akira with Terry, and Mega Man X and MegaMan.EXE with Byleth. If Geno's costume was coming back, it'd be unprecedented to come with Mallow and/or Smithy. (Credit: MisterMike ) That said though, SE is different and can do different things, including breaking this pattern. Still though, if Mallow and Smithy are coming as costumes, it would be greatly in Geno's favor of becoming playable.
• CacoMallow Leak: Someone leaked videos (and an image) of Ken fighting a Mii wearing a Cacodemon (from Doom) headpiece/"hat" and a second Mii wearing a Mallow costume (hence the name of the leak being "CacoMallow"). There are notable things to this leak, including the timer being locked and not ticking down, and modders have tried extensively to recreate the costumes, but they always come up short. Specifically, there's always small clipping issues or lack of polish on the modded hats that aren't as clean as CacoMallow. If this was a fake, it's made by the best modder ever because no other modder can replicate it as well. Also just to clarify, this leak in no way showed off Doomguy nor Geno. The leak itself is just for the two Mii costumes. It's totally possible both costumes can get in without either associated character being playable, but it very likely points to at least one, if not both, Geno and Doomguy being put in FP2.
  • Picture comparisons and a post courtesy of @RuffyYoshi.
• 4chan post, Doomguy+Geno: A 4chan post was seen in early April, featuring Geno, Mallow, and Doomguy on Vista Hill, looking up to see Cacodemon on Exor. The post then namedrops the first 3 characters in FP2 all to be revealed in June: The ARMS rep being a Bowser Jr.-esque character having Spring Man, Ribbon Girl, Min Min, and Ninjara; Doomguy, and then Geno. Now this is just a 4chan post and could absolutely be fake, or could just be someone's predictions for what they think E3 will be, but this compilation post is for all unconfirmed info, so I'm slapping it on here.
• Copyright Takedown Songs: Beware the Forest Mushrooms (Forest Maze, the place that everyone associats with Geno) and Battle Against an Armed Boss (Smithy Gang 2nd boss OST) were both copyright taken down, by Nintendo, who doesn't own the rights to either song, around E3 2019, roughly the time FP2 characters would be negotiated for. What's notable about this is that other songs that were taken down by Nintendo ended up getting content in Smash, such as that MEGALOVANIA remix being taken down 9 months before the Sans premium Mii costume was revealed, bringing with it that very same MEGALOVANIA remix. What's further notable is that exactly 2 songs were taken down, which all other Square Enix characters have gotten in Smash: 2 songs each. Cloud got 2 FF7 songs and each of the DQ Heroes goes 2 songs each from their associated games in the series. This likely points to Geno being added with these 2 songs, more than a premium costume with one of them. All that said, Yoko Shimomura was the composer for SMRPG and she's much easier to work with than Nobuo Uematsu (the Final Fantasy composer) and Koichi Sugiyama (the Dragon Quest composer), meaning that if Geno is made playable, he could totally come with more than just those 2 songs (just don't expect "Fight Against Culex" as that's a remix of FF4's boss theme, which Uematsu has the rights to). Regardless whether he comes with 2 or more songs, the fact remains that these songs were copyright taken down and we still do not know the purpose of it.
• Geno's Sm4sh Costume Remains AWOL: If Geno was just coming back in his Sm4sh costume, it would have been pushed with Hero's Mii costume wave. There's absolutely no point in delaying that costume any further if he's not intended to be made playable.
• Sakurai's Approval of Geno since Brawl: Sakurai himself said he likes Geno and the possessed doll is perfect for Smash. He tried to get him in as far back as Brawl, but for whatever reason, it didn't happen.
• Nintendo is Well Aware of Geno's (and Waluigi's) Fan Demand: I personally missed the "Geno" part back in pre-release, and thought this was just about Waluigi. Credit to @Paraspikey for correcting that, who also has a whole post about this on page 2548. His post goes into more detail, and you should absolutely check it out, but a quick TL;DR: The person who confirmed that Nintendo's aware of the demand is a manager of product marketing for over 3 years (at Nintendo) and has 12+ years of experience with Nintendo in general. This is absolutely someone who would know if Nintendo was listening or not.
• Smash Bros Legacy C&D: Smash Bros Legacy was taken down and had a few interesting characters in it, namely, Geno and Waluigi. This could mean that Nintendo doesn't want to have competition with something using their assets anyway.
  • [NOTE: I'm not knowledgeable on ^this^ topic at all. If someone would like to update this bullet point more clearly and precisely, reply with an @ to me, or PM me and I'll gladly credit you. All I did was piece together the posts around pages 2550-2552 on 3/14-15 when this was happening.]
• 2020's 2nd Half is Heavily Rumored to be Very Mario-Focused: While this could totally be an elaborate April Fool's joke that all media outlets are in on since they're all covering it at the end of March, this year's second half is looking to be very Mario-heavy. In addition to that, the been-rumored Paper Mario 3 (6) has resurfaced again, and unless they're adding Paper Mario into the Smash roster, I don't know of any better potential rep for all things "Mario RPG"-related, since SMRPG was the spiritual predecessor for what eventually became Paper Mario (and Mario & Luigi down the line).

Geno chances to be playable are better than they ever have been before. He's got quite the legacy behind him regarding Smash, he's a piece of gaming history as being a (if not the) major protagonist of the first ever Mario RPG (which later created Paper Mario, it's originally intended sequel, and the Mario & Luigi series), and SMRPG also happened to bring RPGs to the mainstream appeal in the West. His fan demand is quite high, definitely in the top 10 of all characters not yet in Smash for sure. IMO, he's as close to a lock as any character can get, and I will be crushed if he doesn't get in because I'm that sure that, to quote @TerminalMontage: "he's gonna be in" (also for anyone who hasn't seen that video and his others, go watch. TM is a great dude and a big part of the Geno support community who sometimes posts in here and totally deserves your time!).

PS: If I forgot anything, feel free ping me in a brand new post and I'll be more than happy to add it in.

(3/12: Credit to MisterMike for cleaning up some bits of the post)

This post is amazing! Thanks for sharing!

 

[Icewolff92]

I'm glad more people have that attitude of "Geno is definitely happening" and not "I think he's got about a 60% chance or so". Seriously, if he somehow doesn't get in despite that huge post I have in my sig, I'm gonna be sad and never trust anything circumstantial ever again in my life.

The Grich leak should be the king of an example of why you should blindly trust in anything circumstantial, to be honest. While I personally find the "7 more unannounced characters, or however many they claimed it to be." suspicious from the beginning, I can understand why some believed in it, based on... Discu"potential circumstantial evidence".

 

[Powerman293]

I want to be optimistic Geno bros, but I have a hard time imagining Geno being a character Nintendo would willing reveal at E3 specifically? Do fans want him? Yes. Would it generate a lot of hype? Yes. Does Nintendo see Geno as worth it at that time.... I am not sure.

 

[Polarthief]

This post is amazing! Thanks for sharing!

I keep it updated as more information comes out (and obs give credit to those who point stuff out), but yeah, AFAIK, no other character in existence not-already in Smash, besides the ARMS rep (for OBVIOUS reasons) has more evidence than Geno right now. Yeah it's a ton of circumstantial stuff, but it's still a lot in his favor.

The Grich leak should be the king of an example of why you should blindly trust in anything circumstantial, to be honest.

I'm gonna assume you meant "shouldn't", and yeah I get that for sure, but this is a bit of a different circumstance where there's just a lot from multiple different places vs just one source of blurry pics with those obnoxious emoji (and outright mocking Smash as well; that should have been a better indicator of it being fake TBH). I think the problem with the Grinch leak was whatever company was responsible put out a notice or something? The leak itself looked pretty BS, but I believed it more because of the madness that it caused with actual companies.

While I personally find the "7 more unannounced characters, or however many they claimed it to be." suspicious from the beginning, I can understand why some believed in it, based on... "potential circumstantial evidence".

Idk if anyone else was in my shoes, but outside of wanting to be super optimistic of getting BK and Geno, it was just more or less that actual companies (I can't remember which, but I also think Nintendo was involved?) were looking for who did it and whatnot, despite it being fake in the first place. Sakurai also did say they went a bit trigger-happy way too soon, so it made a lot more sense for the end to be lacking (but man I never expected it to be that weak); having BK and Geno out of nowhere, alongside Isaac, Shadow, and a few others was obviously too good to be true, and did go against what Sakurai was saying.

Meanwhile, the evidence/leaks in Geno's favor is just for one character, and again, they do come from a wide array of circumstantial and speculative evidence. CacoMallow, Mii Costume Leaker, Nintendo being aware of (and even calling out) both Geno and Waluigi's fan demand, etc. Even if one or two pieces turn out to be false (such as CacoMallow if Caco costume doesn't come, and Mii Costume Leaker if Smith doesn't for example), other ones can still be true. It's not an all-or-nothing like Grinch Leak from a single source.

I want to be optimistic Geno bros, but I have a hard time imagining Geno being a character Nintendo would willing reveal at E3 specifically? Do fans want him? Yes. Would it generate a lot of hype? Yes. Does Nintendo see Geno as worth it at that time.... I am not sure.

If a dead character like BK can be an E3 reveal, I don't see why Geno couldn't, especially after they were extremely surprised that BK had such an insanely positive reception.

Unless they have a bigger-and-still-relevant character that is also heavily fan-demanded coming in FP2, I don't see anyone else that would fit. If someone like Sora or MC are actually coming, then yeah they'd probably take this spot. That said, Geno can be used to celebrate Mario's 35th, esp if the rumors of all the Mario games coming this year are true. He can be used further to also advertise for the upcoming rumored Paper Mario game, especially in the Sakurai video when he explains the history of the character (something like "Paper Mario is the spiritual successor of SMRPG, speaking of which, there's a new Paper Mario game coming, isn't there?" *gives his sly smirk to the camera as the (would be) people in the background chuckle*).

 

[Icewolff92]

I'm gonna assume you meant "shouldn't", and yeah I get that for sure, but this is a bit of a different circumstance where there's just a lot from multiple different places vs just one source of blurry pics with those obnoxious emoji (and outright mocking Smash as well; that should have been a better indicator of it being fake TBH). I think the problem with the Grinch leak was whatever company was responsible put out a notice or something? The leak itself looked pretty BS, but I believed it more because of the madness that it caused with actual companies.

It was a typo yes. But I argue that Grinch had much more than that, even if I agree with you that it was quite... yeah...

Meanwhile, the evidence/leaks in Geno's favor is just for one character, and again, they do come from a wide array of circumstantial and speculative evidence. CacoMallow, Mii Costume Leaker, Nintendo being aware of (and even calling out) both Geno and Waluigi's fan demand, etc. Even if one or two pieces turn out to be false (such as CacoMallow if Caco costume doesn't come, and Mii Costume Leaker if Smith doesn't for example), other ones can still be true. It's not an all-or-nothing like Grinch Leak from a single source.

Like I said it before. Just because that dude acknowledge the popularity does not mean that Nintendo of Japan will. Nintendo of America and Nintendo Europe were acknowledging the benefits of Youtube, but Nintendo of Japan were idiots on that front, for lord knows how long. It took NoJ a failed console to finally realize. People have asked have cried for specific titles/proper VC on Switch and NoA and NoE knows it... Yet we have nothing. The only "big thing" was that you can play the Kirby golf game on SNES online with people. Edit - Hell, people have pushed for background themes since the release of Switch, we have nothing so far. Even the selection of icons is still lackluster. Its sort of like with the Sora that people miss.

Just because a higher up in Disney of Japan would be okay with them technically grabbing Sora, does not mean that the big guys over in the states would/be as easy to work with potentially. Especially with the new CEO that is known for being a downright asshole (and that is, to put it mildly)

Could the other leaks be true? Sure... but taking the "call out" as something to hold on too (which I feel people claim is the most important one)... sorry, but that¨s nothing solid to hold on too.

 

[Polarthief]

It was a typo yes. But I argue that Grinch had much more than that, even if I agree with you that it was quite... yeah...

I'm more than aware the leak had a lot going for it especially with the number of suckers (including me) who believed it, but the companies and high-profile people getting involved definitely didn't help.

Like I said it before. Just because that dude acknowledge the popularity does not mean that Nintendo of Japan will. You know how long Nintendo of America and Nintendo Europe were acknowledging the benefits of Youtube, but Nintendo of Japan were idiots on that front, for lord knows how long. It took them a failed console to figure it out. People have asked have cried for specific titles/proper VC on Switch and NoA and NoE knows it... Yet we have nothing. The only "big thing" was that you can play the Kirby golf game on SNES online with people. Its sort of like with the Sora that people miss. Just because a high up in Disney of Japan would be okay with them technically grabbing Sora, does not mean that the big guys over in the states would/be as easy to work with potentially. Especially with the new CEO that is known for being a downright <snipped> (and that is, to put it mildly)

Could the other leaks be true? Sure... but taking the "call out" as something to hold on too... sorry, but that¨s nothing solid to hold on too.

I totally get that, and that's why it's still one piece of the puzzle, but granted, the guy never said "NoA is aware", they just said *Nintendo*, and you can't say that NoJ isn't listening either. Reggie has heard "MOTHER 3 PLZ REE" for years; you think NoJ was just in the dark about that? Same with the YouTube thing; there's no way they didn't hear about it, they just didn't act on it. I also do recall reading something about Sakurai specifically was aware of the backlash on Waluigi. Too lazy to look for that as it was shortly after he was shown as an AT, but I swear I remember reading about it. As for Geno, well, he's literally talked about the doll before, so how NoJ can be just in the dark, that doesn't hold up.

I'm also not "holding onto" this as end-all, be-all, evidence that Geno is getting it. It's one piece of the much bigger picture. If we only had *one* piece of the evidence, then I'd be like "yeah that's too circumstantial". Even if it was just the copyright takedowns (which IMO is a very big piece), I wouldn't be nearly this confident. It's all the pieces combined that's the true strength of them. Just like a real life jigsaw puzzle is worthless with missing pieces, so too is the circumstantial evidence if there's only one or two. Mii Costume Leaker hasn't been wrong yet, but they could just be getting lucky with educated guesses. CacoMallow could be made by SuperModder, or hell it could just be two costumes getting in and not mean anything for Geno actually being playable. The copyright takedowns could just be a quirk in the system like when Fortnite and GTA things were taken down, since we all know how awful and garbage content ID copyright BS works on YouTube. The costume is still missing but could totally make a return with another Square rep in FP2. Sakurai's approval of a character doesn't mean they're for sure getting in. I'll fully tear down each piece of evidence by playing devil's advocate, but my point is that there's a lot of circumstantial evidence from numerous sources, and we keep getting more pieces and a few more unconfirmed leaks from even more sources as time goes on.

TL;DR: Each piece means very little on their own, but together, makes them all that much stronger.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm more than aware the leak had a lot going for it especially with the number of suckers (including me) who believed it, but the companies and high-profile people getting involved definitely didn't help.



I totally get that, and that's why it's still one piece of the puzzle, but granted, the guy never said "NoA is aware", they just said *Nintendo*, and you can't say that NoJ isn't listening either. Reggie has heard "MOTHER 3 PLZ REE" for years; you think NoJ was just in the dark about that? Same with the YouTube thing; there's no way they didn't hear about it, they just didn't act on it. I also do recall reading something about Sakurai specifically was aware of the backlash on Waluigi. Too lazy to look for that as it was shortly after he was shown as an AT, but I swear I remember reading about it. As for Geno, well, he's literally talked about the doll before, so how NoJ can be just in the dark, that doesn't hold up.

I'm also not "holding onto" this as end-all, be-all, evidence that Geno is getting it. It's one piece of the much bigger picture. If we only had *one* piece of the evidence, then I'd be like "yeah that's too circumstantial". Even if it was just the copyright takedowns (which IMO is a very big piece), I wouldn't be nearly this confident. It's all the pieces combined that's the true strength of them. Just like a real life jigsaw puzzle is worthless with missing pieces, so too is the circumstantial evidence if there's only one or two. Mii Costume Leaker hasn't been wrong yet, but they could just be getting lucky with educated guesses. CacoMallow could be made by SuperModder, or hell it could just be two costumes getting in and not mean anything for Geno actually being playable. The copyright takedowns could just be a quirk in the system like when Fortnite and GTA things were taken down, since we all know how awful and garbage content ID copyright BS works on YouTube. The costume is still missing but could totally make a return with another Square rep in FP2. Sakurai's approval of a character doesn't mean they're for sure getting in. I'll fully tear down each piece of evidence by playing devil's advocate, but my point is that there's a lot of circumstantial evidence from numerous sources, and we keep getting more pieces and a few more unconfirmed leaks from even more sources as time goes on.

TL;DR: Each piece means very little on their own, but together, makes them all that much stronger.

Eh, is there actually any proof that GTA and Fortnite music were taken down? I also see it unlikely that Mii costume guy was a fraud all that I won’t be surprised if was verified.

 

[Icewolff92]

I totally get that, and that's why it's still one piece of the puzzle, but granted, the guy never said "NoA is aware", they just said *Nintendo*, and you can't say that NoJ isn't listening either. Reggie has heard "MOTHER 3 PLZ REE" for years; you think NoJ was just in the dark about that? Same with the YouTube thing; there's no way they didn't hear about it, they just didn't act on it. I also do recall reading something about Sakurai specifically was aware of the backlash on Waluigi. Too lazy to look for that as it was shortly after he was shown as an AT, but I swear I remember reading about it. As for Geno, well, he's literally talked about the doll before, so how NoJ can be just in the dark, that doesn't hold up.

I was not speaking about you specifically about that call out. I¨m more talking about the entire thread. But yeah, Mother 3 PLZ is also a prime example. Sure, Sakurai has talked about Geno before, and they could know about the backlash of Wah from him (we don¨t know the exact communication between him and Nintendo after all). Does this mean that Nintendo can¨t have other ideas (in this cause fighters) in mind? Not really. I mean, (and I know that I will sound like a broken record) but they gave us Arms before the likes of Geno, Isaac, Waluigi, Rayman, Master Chief, etc, due to an obvious try to push the franchise. If anyone says that it was anything else, then said person is fooling themself.

Sure, Geno could be another Banjo, but that¨s nothing we should take for granted.

The copyright takedowns could just be a quirk in the system like when Fortnite and GTA things were taken down, since we all know how awful and garbage content ID copyright BS works on YouTube.

This is exactly why I don¨t think the copyright strikes are worth looking into. Had GTA music never been copyrighted, then maybe I could have believed it since Nintendo likes to push Fornite (ugh)... but now.. You get the drill.

Mii Costume Leaker hasn't been wrong yet

And if Byleth showed us anything, then its that said character, no matter who it is, don¨t necessarily get costumes from the same franchise. We could get Cacamallow with Arms, Rayman, or someone else, not Geno or Doomguy related as far as we know.