Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[AdamBel731]

An ARMS character, eh? ...I'm fine with that. Look, is it my first choice? Nah. But I always welcome new Nintendo franchises being represented in Smash. Plus, any ARMS character is gonna inherently have a dope moveset that is gonna be super unique! As people have been saying, we have been sort of conditioned into expecting 3rd parties at this point, but Smash was first and foremost a Nintendo crossover fighter. Has it evolved more than that? Sure. Can you be disappointed in this choice? Oh absolutely. But when I see people belittling others' opinions and going on these long tirades on how others are "wannabe intellectuals" and act like their mindset is superior... I'm sorry, but that behavior is just immature and childish to me. State your opinion and be done with it, you know? And if you need to defend it, do so without be a condescending know-it-all to others. Oh, and ARMS was successful. Did it do Splatoon numbers? No, but 2 million for a new IP ain't nothing to scoff at. ARMS did well for a new IP, it just didnt have a lot of staying power I think (like I tried to play it, and while I really liked the characters, the gameplay was only fun for a little bit but never got me hooked for whatever reason).

Also, yes I agree that an ARMS character being added has a great chance for you guys getting your boy (though I'm really conflicted on who the ARMS character will actually be though). I'm getting excited because I think your guys' wishes will finally be granted soon! For the people who miss me and/or like what I have to say, sorry I haven't been posting much. This crappy virus and general drought of news has made me pretty lethargic. But as always... (for those who forgot), I'm always here rooting for you guys! As I said before, I'm with you guys until the end of the line! Anyway, back to lurkin', ciao!

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

That's straight up not true. I play both versions of Byleth frequently. They have the same idle animations, taunts, and victory animations.

It straight up is true. I play them both frequently too.

http://www.ssbwiki.com/Byleth_(SSBU)

Byleth, like Ike, Pokémon Trainer, Wii Fit Trainer, and Inkling, is one of the few characters to have alternate costumes with different animations.
* Female Byleth holds the Sword of the Creator with its tip pointed upwards, while male Byleth holds it with its tip pointed downwards. All animations that can be played from their stand animations (like their idle animations) are subsequently affected through the animation blending.
* Their victory poses are different. Byleth is also the only fighter where the camera angles will also change depending on the costume, rather than just the animations.

 

[Sigran101]

It straight up is true. I play them both frequently too.

http://www.ssbwiki.com/Byleth_(SSBU)

Byleth, like Ike, Pokémon Trainer, Wii Fit Trainer, and Inkling, is one of the few characters to have alternate costumes with different animations.
* Female Byleth holds the Sword of the Creator with its tip pointed upwards, while male Byleth holds it with its tip pointed downwards. All animations that can be played from their stand animations (like their idle animations) are subsequently affected through the animation blending.
* Their victory poses are different. Byleth is also the only fighter where the camera angles will also change depending on the costume, rather than just the animations.

I stand corrected. However holding the sword at a different angle and having different camera angles on the victory screens is nothing compared to the differences the ARMS cast would have to have. That's more in DS and Daisy territory.

 

[Polarthief]

At this point, if we're getting a single character for the rep, I think the chances are in this order (highest to lowest chance of being picked):
- Min Min: Won the Crash Bash (most popular). Bonus for +1 female when we've had no standalone female characters in FP1. Honestly, why have a popularity contest and just flat out ignore the results?
- Twintelle: The Bayonetta glitches thing. If the Bayonetta thing is a bust, then she's 5th, under Ninjara. That said, she's also been very popular since launch. Bonuses for +1 female and first black character in Smash (second if you personally count Ganondorf: I don't).
- Ribbon Girl: Is a mascot that isn't Spring Man. Bonus for +1 female.
- Spring Man: Boring, basic *****; is a mascot. Could you imagine doing this just to reveal him though? The backlash would be pretty harsh to delay a reveal for him. People would be more thrilled they may get Isaac, Shadow, or Waluigi as a result instead of him being added, lol. I'm also still a touch skeptical on AT promotion.
- Ninjara: Popular, and is a spirit, but not as popular as Min Min.
- The other 5 base game characters: Aren't spirits, aren't as popular, but rep the game better than the DLC characters.
- The remaining 5 DLC characters: Aren't spirits or nearly as popular. Rep the game the worst.

 

[Sigran101]

To put this in perspective, people are saying that 4 to 8 of these characters have similar enough style and movement to be copy pasted over each other.

ARMS Victory Animations

Surely no one here actually believes these are as similar as male and female variants of the same character.

 

[ForsakenM]

God, I'm sick of this crap and repeating myself when people just flat-out ignore the factual statements made.

Fact #1: ARMS only sold as much as it did because there were very few titles in the first 3 months of the life cycle of the Switch. 1-2-Switch is proof of this, BotW is an exception because people kept buying it once more games came out because it was good.

Fact #2: Nintendo pushed ARMS as much as it could, it was everywhere and constantly being mentioned by them. New content, tournaments (both online and offline), Meet The Devs, I've never seen them push a game quite like they did with ARMS since Dragon Quest. This is an effective marketing strategy even if it is very annoying to those who will never buy the game, yet it still only sold 2 million units.

Fact #3: Much like the novelty of 1-2-Switch, despite what reviewers have said, the general consensus of the game was that people didn't enjoy it for that long if at all. Lots of complaints about lack of content at launch, bland and somewhat clunky general gameplay, but with an appealing style. Had the game been a runaway success, it would sold MUCH better, perhaps 6 million or more. For yet ANOTHER comparison, ARMS has only bumped up to 2.2 million according to more recent information and it's existed for almost three years now and hit the 2.1 million mark by the end of 2018...the original Splatoon came out in 2015 and had very similar sales numbers around launch yet managed to hit 1.62 million in the same year it released and already passed 3 million by the end of 2016 and now sits a pretty 4.71 million units...and that was on the Wii U, a flopped console that was mostly just a Smash 4 machine for most households, but I guess it was a Splatoon machine too.

Fact #4: Once the content support for this game ended, Nintendo stopped shoving it in people's faces. This most recent advertisement we got yesterday is the first advertisement since...well it's hard to remember honestly, but the last time up until yesterday that I can find was that they released a demo in May of 2018 and that was after they stopped updating the game with new content at the end of 2017. Regardless, without the constant push and no more content as well as not having a big following in the first place, the game basically disappeared. I completely forgot it existed multiple times and was just recently reminded of it with this announcement and I'm positive it was the same for most Smash fans whether they will deny it or not. I remember lots of people reacting to Spring Man's AT reveal with 'Wow, I thought for sure he would get in as playable. Maybe Ribbon Girl?' and then with Ribbon Girl's costume it was followed by 'Huh, wow, guess it wasn't a big success after all.' and that was in March of 2018 when the game was just starting to truly fall off and hadn't been lost to time yet.

Fact #5: The negative response to the ARMS character reveal is completely justifiable: we've all essentially known whether with real insider information or confident logical analysis or anime-level gut feelings that a promotion would be happening and we all essentially knew the first reveal was a first party rep. With that in mind, Waluigi is the first to come up, but then you also have SO MANY OTHER FIRST PARTY ATs that people would love to see playable...and yet every single one of them were passed over for an ARMS character. Now instead of clicky-clacking your keyboards away, sit for a moment and really let that sink in: the majority of the fanbase was looking forward to just about any other first party promotion, and Nintendo chose an ARMS rep. Imagine how that makes people feel. Right now, a buddy of mine who wants Waluigi is pretty down about it and he has every right because this was almost scripted for the purple mustachio'd mayhem maker but then a spring-loaded arm flew past the ropes and punched him in the face while the other one stole his title belt-ahem, I mean promotion. Seriously, give people some time to get over it. So many of you were ******** about Byleth for nearly a solid ****ing month, so I think you can give the majority of the fanbase a couple of days.

Fact #6: I can't believe we are here again, but NO IP DESERVES A SPOT IN SMASH! There is no such thing as deserving the spot, no single IP is entitled to have a character in the game. Also, as we have discussed before, it's not about who sold the most either. Finally, Sakurai himself mentioned that the character being recognizable isn't really a factor as much as it is that they are fun and unique. He also wants to bring in new worlds to Smash Ultimate, but with both Byleth and now an ARMS rep, this seems to imply that both new entries in an existing series that are already represented in Smash or that aren't playable characters in Smash don't apply...or you know, Nintendo is just an oppressive shilling overlord. This means that DLC characters don't have to be popular by general gaming public standards, need to offer fun and unique gameplay, and are a balance between fan picks, corporate demand and Sakurai's own desires while also bringing a new gaming world that in some form hasn't been featured as playable in Smash. We can use this information to try and determine who will get in, but for the love of whatever deity you do or don't believe in, NO IP DESERVES A SPOT! ARMS is not entitled to a spot any more than Banjo & Kazooie were.

Now, I will clarify my final opinion on the matter of an ARMS rep.

I'm completely fine with it. Sure, I was disappointed at the choice initially, but much like how I got over Byleth in a day I've gotten over this already as well. I've moved from disappointment to intrigue on who will be chosen and what their gameplay will be like. Will it be one character, or many? Will they have a regular playstyle, or will they be build-a-bear like the Miis? Will this finally be the end of the range-increasing power creep that started with Shulk in Smash 4? What moves will be where? Will their recovery be like Plant Down-B but can grab the ledge? A new character with very unique gameplay will always triumph over despair of not getting another character in my book. Remember, I'm a fan of the weird characters: just look at my mains and you'll get the idea. However, I still feel like this was not the best way to start the pass off with Byleth being the last thing we all remember about Ultimate. It brings me down a bit that other characters got passed over, but knowing that this is the Nintendo shill pick means there is a lot of hope for the future.

Honestly, if you think about it, this is probably the coolest shill pick choice they could have made next to Sushi Striker getting a playable character.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

To put this in perspective, people are saying that 4 to 8 of these characters have similar enough style and movement to be copy pasted over each other.

ARMS Victory Animations

Surely no one here actually believes these are as similar as male and female variants of the same character.

Should they be? Absolutely not. Could they be? Absolutely. Dark Samus shouldn’t be just like Samus. Lucina shouldn’t play like Marth and Chrom shouldn’t play like Roy. But these things happen in Smash. It’s completely possible for them to share a generalized move set while having unique animations and victory poses between them.

 

[Icewolff92]

I still don't understand this idea. Why would they change their mascot character after one game? It makes no sense. It would make sense if ARMS was a game like FE or an RPG or something that would have a main character shift each game. Even if there is ARMS 2 Spring Man is still going to be the mascot and if they don't choose the mascot as the fighter then it still breaks a fan rule. I understand if people aren't happy with this character choice. Rex would have made more sense to coincide with the Xenoblade announcement and there are other fan demanded characters that have been waiting in line far longer than an ARMS character so I get that, but this specific issue is something that people are worrying over nothing about. People can be upset about the choice sure and there are plenty more than 6 better options imo as well, but let's not be upset or worried over literally nothing.

You misunderstand me. If we are getting a sequel, (and especially if the character(s) arrival contains sequel related stuff) this could signal what we can expect for this fighter pass. Especially if the likes of Urushifu get next in line (the DLC he is introduced in, releases in June too..... which just screams potential Byleth scenario) that many are afraid of, myself included. And I doubt Nintendo has bought the rights to Geno and have him as a mascot for an upcoming RPG/Square is making a sequel, unfortunately. PS - If Geno get¨s in, I don¨t believe in the notion that he has to be number 7 (or 8 if we count PP)

 

[Firox]

That's straight up not true. I play both versions of Byleth frequently. They have the same idle animations, taunts, and victory animations.

NEWS FLASH:
"Byleth is the only character other than Jigglypuff with only one idle pose. However, the female variant has a different idle pose than the male one."

Source: https://www.ssbwiki.com/Byleth

EDIT:

It straight up is true. I play them both frequently too.

http://www.ssbwiki.com/Byleth_(SSBU)

Byleth, like Ike, Pokémon Trainer, Wii Fit Trainer, and Inkling, is one of the few characters to have alternate costumes with different animations.
* Female Byleth holds the Sword of the Creator with its tip pointed upwards, while male Byleth holds it with its tip pointed downwards. All animations that can be played from their stand animations (like their idle animations) are subsequently affected through the animation blending.
* Their victory poses are different. Byleth is also the only fighter where the camera angles will also change depending on the costume, rather than just the animations.

Whoops, beat me to it! lol

 

[Deleted member]

Glad to see Nintendo and Hackurai continuing to ignore gaming icons for stuff that no one wants/franchises that already have too much.

Calling it right now, the next 5 characters are:
BOTW shill(Likely another Zelda)
Pokemon DLC shill
Another FE character(we've had one ever game/dlc since melee)
MAYBE one character people actually want, but it won't be hype like B&K. It'll be something like Billy & Jimmy(but I doubt it. Sakurai seems to dislike the fans and their requests.)
And another blade user(shill for a soon release game/dlc)

Glad too see I'll be saving money by not buying this garbage pass, just like the first. Smash's roster choices have always sucked more than were good.

This is the thread you are looking for.

When did I say it wouldn't work because they're different people? You're making up an entire argument I didn't use. Those all work with the same animations and taunts. Gender variations are really similar. And the Heroes are all blank slates with the same build and the same abilities.

ARMS is a totally different story. They have vastly different abilities and even more vastly different personalities and movement styles. You've obviously never played ARMS if you think they're all basically the same.

Different people have different personalities, normally, that was the implication there. I'm going to have to learn to stop using equivalencies. I'm definitely not above talking **** about a game I haven't played, but ARMS is not one such case - I gave ARMS a good hour or two close to when it came out and played around with several different characters. Robo Cop and his dog were very different because he basically had a ****tier Luma following him around, but everyone else played the same with minor variations in their speed and attack power - small mechanical things that can be overlooked in Smash. I play characters that look interesting to me in any game that I play, and I tend to shy away from the everyman mascot/main character and his inevitable female equivalent, but I did try out Spring Man just to learn the basics, then I gave Ninjara, Kid Cobra, gooey blob man, and Robo Cop a try. Aside from the aforementioned dog Luma, everyone else felt the same, and what was important was what ARMS I decided to go into the fight with. I ended up liking Ninjara the best because he had what felt like the most useful dodge of the group, and then I quit playing because it was very slow and boring. Going and looking at some videos, Ribbon Girl kinda tiptoes around the ring, but... she plays the exact same.

So from what I played, yes. Everyone with that general body type that I'm speculating has a chance of ending up in a Hero situation plays the same, minor things that can and have been written off entirely for a Smash fighter excluded. Personality can be brought through in victory screens, voice lines, etc. It's all about funny spring arms and the weapons on the business end of those arms.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

Sure, I was disappointed at the choice initially, but much like how I got over Byleth in a day I've gotten over this already as well.

This “ARMS bad” essay definitely sounds like you’re over it

Seriously though, there’s not even a guarantee it will be a promotion. And even if it is, so what? You said yourself nobody is entitled to a spot in Smash, so ARMS is as good of a Nintendo character as any.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Glad to see Nintendo and Hackurai continuing to ignore gaming icons for stuff that no one wants/franchises that already have too much.

Calling it right now, the next 5 characters are:
BOTW shill(Likely another Zelda)
Pokemon DLC shill
Another FE character(we've had one ever game/dlc since melee)
MAYBE one character people actually want, but it won't be hype like B&K. It'll be something like Billy & Jimmy(but I doubt it. Sakurai seems to dislike the fans and their requests.)
And another blade user(shill for a soon release game/dlc)

Glad too see I'll be saving money by not buying this garbage pass, just like the first. Smash's roster choices have always sucked more than were good.

You posted in the wrong Dimmadome son!

 

[Heoj]

At this point, if we're getting a single character for the rep, I think the chances are in this order (highest to lowest chance of being picked):
- Min Min: Won the Crash Bash (most popular). Bonus for +1 female when we've had no standalone female characters in FP1. Honestly, why have a popularity contest and just flat out ignore the results?
- Twintelle: The Bayonetta glitches thing. If the Bayonetta thing is a bust, then she's 5th, under Ninjara. That said, she's also been very popular since launch. Bonuses for +1 female and first black character in Smash (second if you personally count Ganondorf: I don't).
- Ribbon Girl: Is a mascot that isn't Spring Man. Bonus for +1 female.
- Spring Man: Boring, basic *****; is a mascot. Could you imagine doing this just to reveal him though? The backlash would be pretty harsh to delay a reveal for him. People would be more thrilled they may get Isaac, Shadow, or Waluigi as a result instead of him being added, lol. I'm also still a touch skeptical on AT promotion.
- Ninjara: Popular, and is a spirit, but not as popular as Min Min.
- The other 5 base game characters: Aren't spirits, aren't as popular, but rep the game better than the DLC characters.
- The remaining 5 DLC characters: Aren't spirits or nearly as popular. Rep the game the worst.

On your min min point i would add the fact that ARMS lead producers favorite character is min min.

 

[StrangeKitten]

Edit: PapaGenos posted a speculation video regarding the ARMS fighter, and he had this one veeeeeery interesting bit I totally forgot about (linked to the relevant time):.

Brought this up to people over on Assist Alliance yesterday. It was then that I learned that the Duck Hunt glitch ended up having nothing to do with new fighters. Banjo was actually built off of Ridley of all characters. No one was built off of DH. So, while it's possible the Bayo glitch could lean towards Twintelle, there's a strong possibility that it means nothing.

 

[Sigran101]

This is the thread you are looking for.


Different people have different personalities, normally, that was the implication there. I'm going to have to learn to stop using equivalencies. I'm definitely not above talking **** about a game I haven't played, but ARMS is not one such case - I gave ARMS a good hour or two close to when it came out and played around with several different characters. Robo Cop and his dog were very different because he basically had a ****tier Luma following him around, but everyone else played the same with minor variations in their speed and attack power - small mechanical things that can be overlooked in Smash. I play characters that look interesting to me in any game that I play, and I tend to shy away from the everyman mascot/main character and his inevitable female equivalent, but I did try out Spring Man just to learn the basics, then I gave Ninjara, Kid Cobra, gooey blob man, and Robo Cop a try. Aside from the aforementioned dog Luma, everyone else felt the same, and what was important was what ARMS I decided to go into the fight with. I ended up liking Ninjara the best because he had what felt like the most useful dodge of the group, and then I quit playing because it was very slow and boring. Going and looking at some videos, Ribbon Girl kinda tiptoes around the ring, but... she plays the exact same.

So from what I played, yes. Everyone with that general body type that I'm speculating has a chance of ending up in a Hero situation plays the same, minor things that can and have been written off entirely for a Smash fighter excluded. Personality can be brought through in victory screens, voice lines, etc. It's all about funny spring arms and the weapons on the business end of those arms.

So you played it for an hour or two. That doesn't really mean anything. It's not even just about the personality. Though I would say that the Byleths, the Corrins, the Robin's, and the Inklings have virtually no personality differences. What I'm saying is that you literally cannot justify a teenage pop star and a stoic ninja having the same animations. It's simply ridiculous. These characters are so far removed from simple gender variations.

 

[Polarthief]

On your min min point i would add the fact that ARMS lead producers favorite character is min min.

I didn't know that, but I still feel like that shouldn't really matter. It's up to the higher ups at Nintendo more than anything and if the Crash Bash isn't enough, I don't see how this specifically would be. Also semi-unrelated, but your pfp is adorable. Fanart like that really makes me like her more than I do. I'd still like RG or TT over her, but I'd be okay with MM.
Honestly at this point, any Spirit fighter besides SM would get at least an "alright, nice." reaction from me, plus I know how much people love MM (SHE WON THE CRASH BASH) so at least a ton of other people would be ecstatic.

Brought this up to people over on Assist Alliance yesterday. It was then that I learned that the Duck Hunt glitch ended up having nothing to do with new fighters. Banjo was actually built off of Ridley of all characters. No one was built off of DH. So, while it's possible the Bayo glitch could lean towards Twintelle, there's a strong possibility that it means nothing.

Yup, which is why I included both possibilities. If it's nothing, she moves to 5th where we all thought she was yesterday, otherwise, it definitely shoots up her chances. I still think Min Min is more likely, but the Bayo glitches *could* mean something and at the very least shouldn't be flat out ignored.

 

[Firox]

So you played it for an hour or two. That doesn't really mean anything. It's not even just about the personality. Though I would say that the Byleths, the Corrins, the Robin's, and the Inklings have virtually no personality differences. What I'm saying is that you literally cannot justify a teenage pop star and a stoic ninja having the same animations. It's simply ridiculous. These characters are so far removed from simple gender variations.

To your point, I think the only two ARMS characters that MIGHT be able to be a reskinned pair of the same character are Springman and Ribbon Girl. Otherwise I would agree that the personalities would clash too much to be believable.

 

[Deleted member]

This “ARMS bad” essay definitely sounds like you’re over it

Seriously though, there’s not even a guarantee it will be a promotion. And even if it is, so what? You said yourself nobody is entitled to a spot in Smash, so ARMS is as good of a Nintendo character as any.

"I see that this man has posted some facts that validate people's opinions, I am going to lampoon his efforts with 'ARMS bad' and watch those upboats pour in lmao"

Quarantine's a *****.

Now, I will clarify my final opinion on the matter of an ARMS rep.

I'm completely fine with it. Sure, I was disappointed at the choice initially, but much like how I got over Byleth in a day I've gotten over this already as well. I've moved from disappointment to intrigue on who will be chosen and what their gameplay will be like. Will it be one character, or many? Will they have a regular playstyle, or will they be build-a-bear like the Miis? Will this finally be the end of the range-increasing power creep that started with Shulk in Smash 4? What moves will be where? Will their recovery be like Plant Down-B but can grab the ledge? A new character with very unique gameplay will always triumph over despair of not getting another character in my book. Remember, I'm a fan of the weird characters: just look at my mains and you'll get the idea. However, I still feel like this was not the best way to start the pass off with Byleth being the last thing we all remember about Ultimate. It brings me down a bit that other characters got passed over, but knowing that this is the Nintendo shill pick means there is a lot of hope for the future.

Honestly, if you think about it, this is probably the coolest shill pick choice they could have made next to Sushi Striker getting a playable character.

I'm really looking forward to the idea that the longer you charge your Smash, the further it goes, like Mega Man's charge shot. Maybe even charged aerials, that could be a hell of a concept.

So you played it for an hour or two. That doesn't really mean anything. It's not even just about the personality. Though I would say that the Byleths, the Corrins, the Robin's, and the Inklings have virtually no personality differences. What I'm saying is that you literally cannot justify a teenage pop star and a stoic ninja having the same animations. It's simply ridiculous. These characters are so far removed from simple gender variations.

I can't? The ARMS team justified it.

 

[Sigran101]

To your point, I think the only two ARMS characters that MIGHT be able to be a reskinned pair of the same character are Springman and Ribbon Girl. Otherwise I would agree that the personalities would clash too much to be believable.

That would at least be more reasonable. But I still don't see how a plucky rookie boxer and a teenage popstar could share their animations either. Plus Ribbon girl has the extra jumps and all that. Can you imagine Springman hoping on pink music notes to get extra height? (Let alone Ninjara)

@Serenade01 you're just proving that you don't know anything about ARMS. By this logic I could post side by side pictures of Mario and Terry throwing a single punch and say "look they could be alts!" There is so much more to these characters both gameplay wise and personality wise than having extendable arms.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

"I see that this man has posted some facts that validate people's opinions, I am going to lampoon his efforts with 'ARMS bad' and watch those upboats pour in lmao"

Quarantine's a *****.

Well when somebody goes around and literally belittles people for having different opinions (wannabe intellectuals? really?), yeah, I’ll absolutely lampoon those “efforts”.

Here’s some more facts then. People like ARMS. ARMS is a Nintendo game. Smash is a Nintendo game that focuses on crossovers of Nintendo characters. Therefore, ARMS (a Nintendo game) is a great choice for Smash (a Nintendo crossover).

Also I’m not even in quarantine because I’m a vet tech, but sure, whatever you say.

 

[SwitchButton]

God, I'm sick of this crap and repeating myself when people just flat-out ignore the factual statements made.

Fact #1: ARMS only sold as much as it did because there were very few titles in the first 3 months of the life cycle of the Switch. 1-2-Switch is proof of this, BotW is an exception because people kept buying it once more games came out because it was good.

Fact #2: Nintendo pushed ARMS as much as it could, it was everywhere and constantly being mentioned by them. New content, tournaments (both online and offline), Meet The Devs, I've never seen them push a game quite like they did with ARMS since Dragon Quest. This is an effective marketing strategy even if it is very annoying to those who will never buy the game, yet it still only sold 2 million units.

Fact #3: Much like the novelty of 1-2-Switch, despite what reviewers have said, the general consensus of the game was that people didn't enjoy it for that long if at all. Lots of complaints about lack of content at launch, bland and somewhat clunky general gameplay, but with an appealing style. Had the game been a runaway success, it would sold MUCH better, perhaps 6 million or more. For yet ANOTHER comparison, ARMS has only bumped up to 2.2 million according to more recent information and it's existed for almost three years now and hit the 2.1 million mark by the end of 2018...the original Splatoon came out in 2015 and had very similar sales numbers around launch yet managed to hit 1.62 million in the same year it released and already passed 3 million by the end of 2016 and now sits a pretty 4.71 million units...and that was on the Wii U, a flopped console that was mostly just a Smash 4 machine for most households, but I guess it was a Splatoon machine too.

Fact #4: Once the content support for this game ended, Nintendo stopped shoving it in people's faces. This most recent advertisement we got yesterday is the first advertisement since...well it's hard to remember honestly, but the last time up until yesterday that I can find was that they released a demo in May of 2018 and that was after they stopped updating the game with new content at the end of 2017. Regardless, without the constant push and no more content as well as not having a big following in the first place, the game basically disappeared. I completely forgot it existed multiple times and was just recently reminded of it with this announcement and I'm positive it was the same for most Smash fans whether they will deny it or not. I remember lots of people reacting to Spring Man's AT reveal with 'Wow, I thought for sure he would get in as playable. Maybe Ribbon Girl?' and then with Ribbon Girl's costume it was followed by 'Huh, wow, guess it wasn't a big success after all.' and that was in March of 2018 when the game was just starting to truly fall off and hadn't been lost to time yet.

Fact #5: The negative response to the ARMS character reveal is completely justifiable: we've all essentially known whether with real insider information or confident logical analysis or anime-level gut feelings that a promotion would be happening and we all essentially knew the first reveal was a first party rep. With that in mind, Waluigi is the first to come up, but then you also have SO MANY OTHER FIRST PARTY ATs that people would love to see playable...and yet every single one of them were passed over for an ARMS character. Now instead of clicky-clacking your keyboards away, sit for a moment and really let that sink in: the majority of the fanbase was looking forward to just about any other first party promotion, and Nintendo chose an ARMS rep. Imagine how that makes people feel. Right now, a buddy of mine who wants Waluigi is pretty down about it and he has every right because this was almost scripted for the purple mustachio'd mayhem maker but then a spring-loaded arm flew past the ropes and punched him in the face while the other one stole his title belt-ahem, I mean promotion. Seriously, give people some time to get over it. So many of you were ******** about Byleth for nearly a solid ****ing month, so I think you can give the majority of the fanbase a couple of days.

Fact #6: I can't believe we are here again, but NO IP DESERVES A SPOT IN SMASH! There is no such thing as deserving the spot, no single IP is entitled to have a character in the game. Also, as we have discussed before, it's not about who sold the most either. Finally, Sakurai himself mentioned that the character being recognizable isn't really a factor as much as it is that they are fun and unique. He also wants to bring in new worlds to Smash Ultimate, but with both Byleth and now an ARMS rep, this seems to imply that both new entries in an existing series that are already represented in Smash or that aren't playable characters in Smash don't apply...or you know, Nintendo is just an oppressive shilling overlord. This means that DLC characters don't have to be popular by general gaming public standards, need to offer fun and unique gameplay, and are a balance between fan picks, corporate demand and Sakurai's own desires while also bringing a new gaming world that in some form hasn't been featured as playable in Smash. We can use this information to try and determine who will get in, but for the love of whatever deity you do or don't believe in, NO IP DESERVES A SPOT! ARMS is not entitled to a spot any more than Banjo & Kazooie were.

Now, I will clarify my final opinion on the matter of an ARMS rep.

I'm completely fine with it. Sure, I was disappointed at the choice initially, but much like how I got over Byleth in a day I've gotten over this already as well. I've moved from disappointment to intrigue on who will be chosen and what their gameplay will be like. Will it be one character, or many? Will they have a regular playstyle, or will they be build-a-bear like the Miis? Will this finally be the end of the range-increasing power creep that started with Shulk in Smash 4? What moves will be where? Will their recovery be like Plant Down-B but can grab the ledge? A new character with very unique gameplay will always triumph over despair of not getting another character in my book. Remember, I'm a fan of the weird characters: just look at my mains and you'll get the idea. However, I still feel like this was not the best way to start the pass off with Byleth being the last thing we all remember about Ultimate. It brings me down a bit that other characters got passed over, but knowing that this is the Nintendo shill pick means there is a lot of hope for the future.

Honestly, if you think about it, this is probably the coolest shill pick choice they could have made next to Sushi Striker getting a playable character.

Its not a shill pick. A popular new Nintendo IP got into the Nintendo crossover game. It makes sense.

Man you would be saying the same thing if the modest 1-million selling Pikmin series got into smash nowadays instead of in brawl wouldnt you

 

[Sigran101]

"I see that this man has posted some facts that validate people's opinions, I am going to lampoon his efforts with 'ARMS bad' and watch those upboats pour in lmao"

Quarantine's a *****.



I'm really looking forward to the idea that the longer you charge your Smash, the further it goes, like Mega Man's charge shot. Maybe even charged aerials, that could be a hell of a concept.


I can't? The ARMS team justified it.
View attachment 267338

I already responded to the part about my point, but I wanted to comment on the part about Absol. You posted a text wall about how garbage tier of a choice an Arms rep is and ended it with "I'm over it". That's kinda ridiculous. You can always expect to be called out on stuff like that. Plus they responded with a PacMan emoji which says they meant it mainly as a joke anyway. Chill out.

 

[Deleted member]

That would at least be more reasonable. But I still don't see how a plucky rookie boxer and a teenage popstar could share their animations either. Plus Ribbon girl has the extra jumps and all that. Can you imagine Springman hoping on pink music notes to get extra height? (Let alone Ninjara)

@Serenade01 you're just proving that you don't know anything about ARMS. By this logic I could post side by side pictures of Mario and Terry throwing a single punch and say "look they could be alts!" There is so much more to these characters both gameplay wise and personality wise than having extendable arms.

Yeah, sure, we'll just ignore that Terry is a near 7 foot tall turbo chad and Mario is a 4 and a half foot tall manlet. My point is that their idle stances are similar and their attack animations are, likewise, similar. Every move the character makes does not have to scream "personality", and you act like particle effects can't be swapped out if need be. There's no need for them to have a triple jump because Ribbon Girl has a triple jump, just like there's no need for them to puff into smoke when they roll just because Ninjara does sometimes. But honestly? I'm going to stop arguing the point because we're far beyond the realm of reasonably saying any of this ties into Geno's chances of getting into Smash. The whole ****ing cast of ARMS can be in one character for all I care, I just want to see one of those spirits become playable, or infinitely more preferably, Spring Man break all the goddamned rules.

I already responded to the part about my point, but I wanted to comment on the part about Absol. You posted a text wall about how garbage tier of a choice an Arms rep is and ended it with "I'm over it". That's kinda ridiculous. You can always expect to be called out on stuff like that. Plus they responded with a PacMan emoji which says they meant it mainly as a joke anyway. Chill out.

Wrong guy.

 

[Sigran101]

Yeah, sure, we'll just ignore that Terry is a near 7 foot tall turbo chad and Mario is a 4 and a half foot tall manlet. My point is that their idle stances are similar and their attack animations are, likewise, similar. Every move the character makes does not have to scream "personality", and you act like particle effects can't be swapped out if need be. There's no need for them to have a triple jump because Ribbon Girl has a triple jump, just like there's no need for them to puff into smoke when they roll just because Ninjara does sometimes. But honestly? I'm going to stop arguing the point because we're far beyond the realm of reasonably saying any of this ties into Geno's chances of getting into Smash. The whole ****ing cast of ARMS can be in one character for all I care, I just want to see one of those spirits become playable, or infinitely more preferably, Spring Man break all the goddamned rules.


Wrong guy.

I guess we'll just agree to disagree. Also, **** you're right, wrong guy sorry. You didn't write the essay, but your response to Absol was still uncalled for.

 

[StarLight42]

Stop complaining about Arms and bow down to our new lord and savior. She will thrust the doors wide open for Geno to make his grand entrance.

Min min for the win win.

Just look at how popular she is

And she’d be an excellent choice for the first fully female DLC fighter, assuming a Hero-type situation is out of question.

 

[Sigran101]

View attachment 267340
Stop complaining about Arms and bow down to our new lord and savior. She will thrust the doors wide open for Geno to make his grand entrance.

Min min for the win win.

Just look at how popular she is

View attachment 267341
And she’d be an excellent choice for the first fully female DLC fighter, assuming a Hero-type situation is out of question.

Min Min is the best case scenario. Also the most likely I think.

 

[Deleted member]

I guess we'll just agree to disagree. Also, **** you're right, wrong guy sorry. You didn't write the essay, but your response to Absol was still uncalled for.

Forsaken might be a confrontational ass but he deserves the respect that anyone expects for themselves to not be met with petty bull**** responses about how his entire argument boils down to "ARMS bad", joke or not.

 

[Sigran101]

Forsaken might be a confrontational ass but he deserves the respect that anyone expects for themselves to not be met with petty bull**** responses about how his entire argument boils down to "ARMS bad", joke or not.

Absol wasn't disrespectful. It was a reasonable call out, and even then it was a freaking joke. I garuntee you would not have done the same thing if I had been called out like that. There's no need to be so touchy.

 

[Polarthief]

Just look at how popular she is

For the record, both Spring Man and Twintelle were also trending. Ninjara and Ribbon Girl were both sadly nowhere to be seen. Also at one point, Waluigi was also trending due to the speculation on if Spring Man gets the spot, that means Waluigi could get in too.

 

[TheShiningAbsol]

Forsaken might be a confrontational ass but he deserves the respect that anyone expects for themselves to not be met with petty bull**** responses about how his entire argument boils down to "ARMS bad", joke or not.

Well then maybe he shouldn’t belittle other people for having differing opinions in the first place. I’d say it’s completely valid to crack a joke in return, especially when he ends said essay with “I’m fine with it” when he’s very clearly not

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

would be funny if nintendo made every btfo and added Misango to smash

 

[StarLight42]

would be funny if nintendo made every btfo and added Misango to smash

no. It would be dumb. He’s probably the least popular character in the entire arms league

if you really wanna bandwagon a non-spirit Arms character, just go Lolapop. She’s cute and frilly

Misango makes me dream about sleeping

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

no. It would be dumb. He’s probably the least popular character in the entire arms league

if you really wanna bandwagon a non-spirit Arms character, just go Lolapop. She’s cute and frilly

Misango makes me dream about sleeping

I like Misango *shrugs* Id love to see him rather then bandwagon like a boring person

 

[StarLight42]

I like Misango *shrugs* Id love to see him rather then bandwagon like a boring person

Lolapop isn’t boring.

Misango is pretty boring.

 

[Deleted member]

I like Misango *shrugs* Id love to see him rather then bandwagon like a boring person

Lolapop isn’t boring.

Misango is pretty boring.

Know who isn't boring?

Geno.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Lolapop isn’t boring.

Misango is pretty boring.

I respectufully disagree but one thing we can agree on is an arms character is smash is bound to be fun to play

 

[StarLight42]

Know who isn't boring?

Geno.

can’t argue there

 

[Dr. Jojo Phantasma]

Forget Lolapop and Misango, who we need is Dr. Coyle. And of course Geno somewhere in the pass.

 

[StarLight42]

Eh... as far as the non spirited Arms characters go

I like
Lolapop
Coyle
Helix

Neutral
Byte/bark
Springtrap

Boring
Master mummy
Max brass
Kid cobra
Misango

Don’t like
Mechanica

whereas I like all of the spirited Arms characters even if Spring Man and Ninjara come off as a little “vanilla”

(Also, i noticed im getting a bit too off topic, will dial it down a bit, just wanted to clarify my stance on the nonspirited arms characters)

 

[Fatmanonice]

The fact that they aren't revealing anything about the character aside from them being from ARMS is just super weird. Character is out in 2-3 months, they have to be basically done right? Banjo was done complete with a trailer 2-3 months before they released, Terry had a model, trailer, and some gameplay 2 months before he came out, why would they not have anything to show? The Sakurai presentations are recorded well in advance anyway. It makes me think SOMETHING has to be up here.

Yeah... This along with the fact that according to two of my guys that 6 was basically ready to present by mid January. Coincidentally, two months later and we're probably seeing a repeat of Byleth, a character ready to present in November but wasn't released until almost February. Until we get more details it can't really be said if this was always the plan or it really was delayed because of Corona. Like axel_ pointed out earlier, Season 2 was probably decided last E3 so we're looking at a full year between 6 being decided and being finished. Actual development supposedly takes about 6-8 months so it potentially suggests that 6 is actually largely done but has balancing issues or is kind of buggy based on their range. In other words, 6 was potentially planned to release in April originally but pushed back due to balancing issues.

Also... HA! My theory about the shield adjustments were spot on! The adjustments were predominantly to characters with long legs, arms, and protrusions like tails, ears, and exaggerated facial features. Again, got the character wrong in my prediction (although the WAH-pocolapse is likely just postponed, not cancelled) but a human like character with long limbs was right!