Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[UberMadman]

That's good for me then, because I don't know if I'll even have electricity for the first week.

Oof, sorry to hear that! I hope you manage to stay safe.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Well, soonish, if history repeats itself. I've talked about it before but Nintendo almost never does Directs on the first week of the month or the last. Second week of September is a much safer bet, I'd argue.

Probably. However, they did want to do the September Direct of last year on the 6th, so...who knows?

Lol, watch it be something crazy like Saturday.

 

[ForsakenM]

It's hard to say, considering that how well the costume sold would be proportional to how many people purchased a Wii U, and then purchased Smash 4 to go along with it. The game probably sold well enough for being on a console that did very poorly, but to that end, would they factor that in as whether or not the Geno costume did well enough to warrant redoing?

Well, let's look at the possibilities here. No solid numbers, sadly, but consider this.

Smash 4 sold a total of 14.88 million units, with the 3DS version selling 9.52 million units and the WiiU version selling 5.36 million units.

Out of those 5.36 million, you would have to figure there are three groups: those who bought the Mii Costume for one system, those who bought it for both (Me, because I'm a filthy Nintendo junkie) and those who didn't buy it at all (which was a substantial amount of people just in this group alone). I can say that I doubt those who bought the costume for one system got even remotely close to breaking 1 mil, so you can bet the number of those who bought it for two systems will be the lowest number.

Without more data, it kinda stops here. Frankly, if we don't get Geno and one of the factors is the fact that his Mii Costume didn't sell for ****, I wouldn't be surprised. I'd be sad, but not surprised.

 

[MattX20]

Well, soonish, if history repeats itself. I've talked about it before but Nintendo almost never does Directs on the first week of the month or the last. Second week of September is a much safer bet, I'd argue.

True, but we mustn't forget that last year, September's Direct was intended no later than the 6th, but was delayed due to the earthquakes that hit Japan.

 

[Fatmanonice]

I really doubt the Geno costume sold poorly considering the sheer amount of obscure and weird Mii costumes that were in Smash 4. If Geno sold less than Gil, Jacky, the Flying Men, etc, I will volunteer to transfuse my own blood out and replace it with Code Red Mountain Dew. If anything, Geno was one of the most popular characters that was turned into a costume.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

So, I have a question. Little off topic, so I'll put it in spoilers. Don't read if you don't want to.

Spoiler: Game Question

So, I've been making a 2-D platformer and it's a bit ambitious. It sort of takes inspiration from Kirby Super Star Ultra (in terms of design) and Shovel Knight (in terms of plot quality). So, here's my question and no, I can't go into specific details.

What type of stuff do you wish more platformers did and how would you handle those concepts? What fresh take would you want the most?

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

 

[Ovaltine]

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

I'll answer the on-topic one because analysis right now is just... not happening with my mind being kinda dead rofl.

Who has the most fanfare? Banjo and Kazooie. They EASILY do. Ridley got a lot, especially because of how it was like, "FINALLY!" K. Rool got a lot, as well, easily as much as Ridley, if not more. That's probably because a lot of people feared K. Rool was going to remain dead and buried. B-K is not only a duo we didn't expect to see again, but we also didn't think we'd hear much of their franchise again beyond nostalgic merchandise. Ridley and K. Rool were dreams; B-K was a pipe dream. I'd say they easily got the hugest fanfare.

As for Geno, I'd place him around the level of Ridley in terms of fanfare, if not K. Rool, given people are fearing that he's dead and buried like our Krocodile King seemed to be. I wouldn't put him at B-K tier by any means, but he'd definitely garner some nice fanfare from the hardcore fans like Ridley and Rool did.

ETA: I forgot to mention earlier, if SE's pricing is why Geno hasn't been getting any attention lately, remember to make sure our voices are heard with THEM, as well. They need to know how much we want to see our boy again, and showing how beloved he is might sweeten the pot for both them and Nintendo. It might make negotiating easier. (Okay, it probably won't, but I can't stress the importance of SE knowing how loved Geno is enough.)

 

[Deleted member]

So, I have a question. Little off topic, so I'll put it in spoilers. Don't read if you don't want to.

Spoiler: Game Question

So, I've been making a 2-D platformer and it's a bit ambitious. It sort of takes inspiration from Kirby Super Star Ultra (in terms of design) and Shovel Knight (in terms of plot quality). So, here's my question and no, I can't go into specific details.

What type of stuff do you wish more platformers did and how would you handle those concepts? What fresh take would you want the most?

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

Banjo Kazooie was easily the hypest specifically because their series is dead while Metroid and DKC are still alive and well. As someone who casually followed Yooka Laylee, I can say that thousands of people clamored to see the duo again in a respectable light for decades. (That same logic can apply to K. Rool, which is why he was hype for me, too. But again, dead characters from dead series really make the reveals much more impactful.)

Not sure how big Geno is gonna be. I'd be hype and I know Smashboards is gonna freak the **** out if he's revealed. I just grew up after the N64 era so I have no memories of Geno's early days.

 

[Ovaltine]

Banjo Kazooie was easily the hypest specifically because their series is dead while Metroid and DKC are still alive and well. As someone who casually followed Yooka Laylee, I can say that thousands of people clamored to see the duo again in a respectable light for decades. (That same logic can apply to K. Rool, which is why he was hype for me, too. But again, dead characters from dead series really make the reveals much more impactful.)

Not sure how big Geno is gonna be. I'd be hype and I know Smashboards is gonna freak the **** out if he's revealed. I just grew up after the N64 era so I have no memories of Geno's early days.

Not too on-topic, but my actual DUDE! It's been a while since I've seen you peep into the Geno thread! How's it hanging? You enjoying Hero? (And by Hero, I mean Munchie, the best companion character in the whole game?)

 

[Deleted member]

Not too on-topic, but my actual DUDE! It's been a while since I've seen you peep into the Geno thread! How's it hanging? You enjoying Hero? (And by Hero, I mean Munchie, the best companion character in the whole game?)

Yeah. I pretty much dropped out of the speculation scene after E3 because I got the two characters I wanted most (excluding the deconfirmed Bomberman). Really, the only person I want who I'd say is "realistic" is Geno, and he's hit or miss without hard evidence. His chances aren't zero still, which is beyond shocking to me. Let's go, Geno.

Anywho, I'm doing well. College started back up and I'm pretty much maining Hero (specifically the Munchie alt) until he gets hard nerfed. He fits my bull**** camping playstyle perfectly and it's Dragon Quest. Y'all already know how much I appreciate that series.

 

[wynn728]

Quit whining about characters being "in a ditch" or however you want to position them as if they have no chance for any future additional DLC, Smash games, or just general returns with their own series. It's frankly insulting to any person who continues to support characters that you're just willing to absolutely throw in the towel on all of them just because one goddamn thing in Ultimate didn't go your preferred way. Piranha Plant getting in before them isn't a statement on their inherent value as characters and your naive to believe that this one decision somehow impacts literally everything for all of eternity. Sakurai had an idea for a character and he decided to implement it.

If the characters an Assist Trophy then they are dead. We have characters who get screwed over multiple times over, to a point where it more certain that they'll never happen. Remember, Sakurai said Assist Trophies are reserved for characters he believe have no real potential of being Fighters. The only one who got upgraded only had one game where they had an Assist Trophy role. Out of every single newcomers we ever got only three where chosen from Assist Trophies and two of them are basically clones. Sakurai action shows that he still keeps those views about Assist Trophies.

Think it's an insulting, well I'm not the one who's excluding them from the roster, that's Sakurai's doing. Sakurai is the one who keeps screwing over characters. I'm stating the obvious that people want to ignore.

Also yeah, Piranha Plant is a statement on other characters value. They go on about how Smash Bros Ultimate is filled with THE BEST OF THE BEST, a cast full of All-Stars. If Piranha Plant gets in while characters like Isaac, Geno, Shadow, Bomberman, and the rest that are screwed over by being Assist Trophies, Mii Costumes and Spirits then what does that says about them? It says they aren't the best of the best, Piranha Plant is better than them, all the others can get are participation ribbons. Like it or not, that's how they're view. There's a damn good reason support for many characters are just gone, they got the message. You can't really say that these characters are all-stars when they kept being put in the loser corner and Piranha Plant gets to be in the banner.

Might not be Sakurai intention to give a message like that, but that doesn't matter. Most things in this world start out with good intentions and wind up harmful.

Golden Sun no matter what ain't coming back. ARMS isn't going to get a sequel. Geno's only chance of ever showing up is Smash Bros. The only characters that have futures are the ones who's series are successful like Kirby and Mario, everyone else only had Smash Bros and nothing else.

 

[Deleted member]

So, I have a question. Little off topic, so I'll put it in spoilers. Don't read if you don't want to.

Spoiler: Game Question

So, I've been making a 2-D platformer and it's a bit ambitious. It sort of takes inspiration from Kirby Super Star Ultra (in terms of design) and Shovel Knight (in terms of plot quality). So, here's my question and no, I can't go into specific details.

What type of stuff do you wish more platformers did and how would you handle those concepts? What fresh take would you want the most?

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

Definitely Banjo even though I feel K. Rool competes for the top slot as well and for Geno I would say he'd be right behind Banjo.

Banjo was easily the biggest but I feel like it would go Banjo > Geno > K. Rool > Ridley.

 

[Deleted member]

If the characters an Assist Trophy then they are dead. We have characters who get screwed over multiple times over, to a point where it more certain that they'll never happen. Remember, Sakurai said Assist Trophies are reserved for characters he believe have no real potential of being Fighters. The only one who got upgraded only had one game where they had an Assist Trophy role. Out of every single newcomers we ever got only three where chosen from Assist Trophies and two of them are basically clones. Sakurai action shows that he still keeps those views about Assist Trophies.

Think it's an insulting, well I'm not the one who's excluding them from the roster, that's Sakurai's doing. Sakurai is the one who keeps screwing over characters. I'm stating the obvious that people want to ignore.

Also yeah, Piranha Plant is a statement on other characters value. They go on about how Smash Bros Ultimate is filled with THE BEST OF THE BEST, a cast full of All-Stars. If Piranha Plant gets in while characters like Isaac, Geno, Shadow, Bomberman, and the rest that are screwed over by being Assist Trophies, Mii Costumes and Spirits then what does that says about them? It says they aren't the best of the best, Piranha Plant is better than them, all the others can get are participation ribbons. Like it or not, that's how they're view. There's a damn good reason support for many characters are just gone, they got the message. You can't really say that these characters are all-stars when they kept being put in the loser corner and Piranha Plant gets to be in the banner.

Might not be Sakurai intention to give a message like that, but that doesn't matter. Most things in this world start out with good intentions and wind up harmful.

Golden Sun no matter what ain't coming back. ARMS isn't going to get a sequel. Geno's only chance of ever showing up is Smash Bros. The only characters that have futures are the ones who's series are successful like Kirby and Mario, everyone else only had Smash Bros and nothing else.

Not sure what else to say other than Banjo finally getting into Smash out of huge core fan demand is a pretty good sign for Geno. It means that fan demand does play a role in how characters may get selected.

I also just disagree with how Smash Bros is an all star filled with the BEST OF THE BEST *EXPLOSIVE FIREWORKS*. Because I assure you there are many examples since Smash 64 where that's just not the case. (F Zero and Mother haven't had new games in years and Jigglypuff is only kept around specifically because it was in Smash 64. Hell, Roy is only remembered in the west because of Melee because I assure you his game isn't.)

Like it comes down to business sense (Corrin, third parties, Pokemon), mass appeal (Pokemon, Zelda, Animal Crossing), fan demand (Banjo, K. Rool, Simon), relevance (Joker, Corrin, Lucas), or whatever the hell Sakurai is feeling (PPlant, Wii fit). When so many factors go into what Sakurai's team might decide on, looking at it as a competition is objectively flawed and leads to dumb **** like Banjo vs. Steve.

 

[wynn728]

Not sure what else to say other than Banjo finally getting into Smash out of huge core fan demand is a pretty good sign for Geno. It means that fan demand does play a role in how characters may get selected.

I also just disagree with how Smash Bros is an all star filled with the BEST OF THE BEST *EXPLOSIVE FIREWORKS*. Because I assure you there are many examples since Smash 64 where that's just not the case. (F Zero and Mother haven't had new games in years and Jigglypuff is only kept around specifically because it was in Smash 64. Hell, Roy is only remembered in the west because of Melee because I assure you his game isn't.)

Like it comes down to business sense (Corrin, third parties, Pokemon), mass appeal (Pokemon, Zelda, Animal Crossing), fan demand (Banjo, K. Rool, Simon), relevance (Joker, Corrin), or whatever the hell Sakurai is feeling (PPlant, Wii fit). When so many factors go into what Sakurai's team might decide on, looking at it as a competition is objectively flawed and leads to dumb **** like Banjo vs. Steve.

We got Ridley, K Rool and Simon along with all these other Mii Costume turning into Fighters which lead to believe that Geno had a great chance of getting in. But then Piranha Plant was revealed and Geno is a PNG File. Now Banjo got in and believe fooled themselves into a second wind. There have been many times when we think a character is likely because of past events and 9 times out of 10 it never comes through. Banjo is most likely the last fan demand character we're getting as DLC and Geno will be excluded.

But regardless if you're playable in Smash Bros than you are an All-Star. F-Zero & Earthbound may never get another game but they will always be remembered because they're in Smash Bros. As we see in Mario Tennis Aces Piranha Plant is going to be getting more roles. I won't be surprise if they decided to make it a playable character in Mario Kart because of Smash Bros. It doesn't matter what the status is for a character before Smash Bros, once they're in they're legends.

 

[Deleted member]

We got Ridley, K Rool and Simon along with all these other Mii Costume turning into Fighters which lead to believe that Geno had a great chance of getting in. But then Piranha Plant was revealed and Geno is a PNG File. Now Banjo got in and believe fooled themselves into a second wind. There have been many times when we think a character is likely because of past events and 9 times out of 10 it never comes through. Banjo is most likely the last fan demand character we're getting as DLC and Geno will be excluded.

But regardless if you're playable in Smash Bros than you are an All-Star. F-Zero & Earthbound may never get another game but they will always be remembered because they're in Smash Bros. As we see in Mario Tennis Aces Piranha Plant is going to be getting more roles. I won't be surprise if they decided to make it a playable character in Mario Kart because of Smash Bros. It doesn't matter what the status is for a character before Smash Bros, once they're in they're legends.

I really only saw one thing that stuck out to me. Mate, you think Banjo's gonna get another game after Smash Ultimate? Hell you even admit F Zero and Earthbound aren't gonna get a new game. I'm super confused on why you're so fixated on Piranha Plant.

I assure you you're overblowing the legendary status. Mother-****ing Chain Chomp and Boom Boom are in Mario Tennis. Mario has a big history of making inconsequential characters into playable characters. Remember the hype new additions in Mario Party 8 where we got Blooper and Hammer Bros?

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

Well, soonish, if history repeats itself. I've talked about it before but Nintendo almost never does Directs on the first week of the month or the last. Second week of September is a much safer bet, I'd argue.

I may me misremembering but wasn't the September 2018 direct supposed to go life the first week but then it got delayed due to the earthquake?

 

[Loog]

If the characters an Assist Trophy then they are dead. We have characters who get screwed over multiple times over, to a point where it more certain that they'll never happen. Remember, Sakurai said Assist Trophies are reserved for characters he believe have no real potential of being Fighters. The only one who got upgraded only had one game where they had an Assist Trophy role. Out of every single newcomers we ever got only three where chosen from Assist Trophies and two of them are basically clones. Sakurai action shows that he still keeps those views about Assist Trophies.

Spoiler

Think it's an insulting, well I'm not the one who's excluding them from the roster, that's Sakurai's doing. Sakurai is the one who keeps screwing over characters. I'm stating the obvious that people want to ignore.

Also yeah, Piranha Plant is a statement on other characters value. They go on about how Smash Bros Ultimate is filled with THE BEST OF THE BEST, a cast full of All-Stars. If Piranha Plant gets in while characters like Isaac, Geno, Shadow, Bomberman, and the rest that are screwed over by being Assist Trophies, Mii Costumes and Spirits then what does that says about them? It says they aren't the best of the best, Piranha Plant is better than them, all the others can get are participation ribbons. Like it or not, that's how they're view. There's a damn good reason support for many characters are just gone, they got the message. You can't really say that these characters are all-stars when they kept being put in the loser corner and Piranha Plant gets to be in the banner.

Might not be Sakurai intention to give a message like that, but that doesn't matter. Most things in this world start out with good intentions and wind up harmful.

Golden Sun no matter what ain't coming back. ARMS isn't going to get a sequel. Geno's only chance of ever showing up is Smash Bros. The only characters that have futures are the ones who's series are successful like Kirby and Mario, everyone else only had Smash Bros and nothing else.

Don't you think your taking this a little to seriously?

 

[wynn728]

I really only saw one thing that stuck out to me. Mate, you think Banjo's gonna get another game after Smash Ultimate? Hell you even admit F Zero and Earthbound aren't gonna get a new game. I'm super confused on why you're so fixated on Piranha Plant.

I assure you you're overblowing the legendary status. Mother-****ing Chain Chomp and Boom Boom are in Mario Tennis. Mario has a big history of making inconsequential characters into playable characters. Remember the hype new additions in Mario Party 8 where we got Blooper and Hammer Bros?

Banjo has a better chance on getting another game now. Battle Toads are coming back and now Banjo got his popularity back most likely Microsoft will look into making another Banjo game.

Earthbound is a complete series. There's no need for a Mother 4, Shigesato Itoi told the story he wanted and doesn't want to make another one. F-Zero has it's problem which most likely because of Miyamoto.

As for Piranha Plant that's a character that got in while other family requested characters are just dead in the water as Assist Trophies and Mii Costumes. Piranha Plant is going to get more spot light in future Mario spin-off games because of Smash Bros. That's going to be the enemy they will continue to push because of its status in Smash Bros.

Don't you think your taking this a little to seriously?

Eh, maybe I'm over playing it but I stick to what I say and believe.

 

[Deleted member]

Banjo has a better chance on getting another game now. Battle Toads are coming back and now Banjo got his popularity back most likely Microsoft will look into making another Banjo game.

Earthbound is a complete series. There's no need for a Mother 4, Shigesato Itoi told the story he wanted and doesn't want to make another one. F-Zero has it's problem which most likely because of Miyamoto.

As for Piranha Plant that's a character that got in while other family requested characters are just dead in the water as Assist Trophies and Mii Costumes. Piranha Plant is going to get more spot light in future Mario spin-off games because of Smash Bros. That's going to be the enemy they will continue to push because of its status in Smash Bros.

Eh, maybe I'm over playing it but I stick to what I say and believe.

Are you saying characters that make it in receive legendary status or are you saying the reason they're chosen is because they're legendary? That might help me understand you better.

 

[Musubi]

So, I have a question. Little off topic, so I'll put it in spoilers. Don't read if you don't want to.

Spoiler: Game Question

So, I've been making a 2-D platformer and it's a bit ambitious. It sort of takes inspiration from Kirby Super Star Ultra (in terms of design) and Shovel Knight (in terms of plot quality). So, here's my question and no, I can't go into specific details.

What type of stuff do you wish more platformers did and how would you handle those concepts? What fresh take would you want the most?

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

I don't play many platformers, but it could be interesting if your character was able to make their own platforms. I'm not sure how technical/difficult you're trying to make your game but being able to make your own platforms could lend itself to very complex maneuvers and level design. If you're implementing any type of physics, the character could also make platforms with different properties like something bouncy or slippery.

 

[MisterMike]

So, I have a question. Little off topic, so I'll put it in spoilers. Don't read if you don't want to.

Spoiler: Game Question

So, I've been making a 2-D platformer and it's a bit ambitious. It sort of takes inspiration from Kirby Super Star Ultra (in terms of design) and Shovel Knight (in terms of plot quality). So, here's my question and no, I can't go into specific details.

What type of stuff do you wish more platformers did and how would you handle those concepts? What fresh take would you want the most?

Spoiler: Response

Gotta say, that's definitely a tough question not knowing what you've got thus far, but I guess I can answer this.
I like it when platformers avoid things like knockback and bad enemy placement, like having hard to reach enemies on small platforms over bottomless pits.
Speaking of, I also love when platformer games have ways to circumvent bottomless pits, such as how Kid Icarus has these feathers you buy that allow you to fly out of pits when you fall into them.
I love it when final bosses are built like a sort of test, a way to utilize all you've learned throughout your adventure... assuming your game is like that of course.
I also like it when games have magic on cooldown rather than a strict meter a la the Zelda games, like it slowly refills overtime, but not too quickly that it becomes too abusable.
Also, when games put actual time and effort into harder difficulties. Some games are just fine with beefing up enemies and calling it a day, but I much prefer it when they decide to rearrange enemies into much more difficult formations, or even slightly modify the level geometry to make thing more treacherous.
Y'know, stuff like that. Let me know if you would like any more suggestions, and good luck on your game!

On Topic Question: Who do you think has the most fanfare so far? Ridley, K Rool, or Banjo & Kazooie?

Banjo, easily. Although King K. Rool and Ridley are right up there.

Bonus to that: How much fanfare do you think Geno would get relative to other characters's fanfare?

If Banjo is a 10, then Geno would be at about a 7 or 8, pretty hype overall.

 

[Loog]

Spoiler

Banjo has a better chance on getting another game now. Battle Toads are coming back and now Banjo got his popularity back most likely Microsoft will look into making another Banjo game.

Earthbound is a complete series. There's no need for a Mother 4, Shigesato Itoi told the story he wanted and doesn't want to make another one. F-Zero has it's problem which most likely because of Miyamoto.

As for Piranha Plant that's a character that got in while other family requested characters are just dead in the water as Assist Trophies and Mii Costumes. Piranha Plant is going to get more spot light in future Mario spin-off games because of Smash Bros. That's going to be the enemy they will continue to push because of its status in Smash Bros.

Eh, maybe I'm over playing it but I stick to what I say and believe.

I mean It's fine if you don't like piranha plant but don't you think going only by fan request is a little restricting? I am pretty sure they added him because they saw a fun moveset.

 

[wynn728]

Are you saying characters that make it in receive legendary status or are you saying the reason they're chosen is because they're legendary? That might help me understand you better.

If the characters gets in then that gives them a legendary status. There's more talk, fan art and recognition when a character is playable in Smash Bros. That makes them legandary. The character can be a complete small fry within it's own series, but Smash Bros elevates them to new heights.

 

[RedDragon64]

I made a case of why Geno is the leaked fighter check this out

https://smashboards.com/threads/female-leak-why-i-think-it-is-geno.488467/

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Spoiler: Response

Gotta say, that's definitely a tough question not knowing what you've got thus far, but I guess I can answer this.
I like it when platformers avoid things like knockback and bad enemy placement, like having hard to reach enemies on small platforms over bottomless pits.
Speaking of, I also love when platformer games have ways to circumvent bottomless pits, such as how Kid Icarus has these feathers you buy that allow you to fly out of pits when you fall into them.
I love it when final bosses are built like a sort of test, a way to utilize all you've learned throughout your adventure... assuming your game is like that of course.
I also like it when games have magic on cooldown rather than a strict meter a la the Zelda games, like it slowly refills overtime, but not too quickly that it becomes too abusable.
Also, when games put actual time and effort into harder difficulties. Some games are just fine with beefing up enemies and calling it a day, but I much prefer it when they decide to rearrange enemies into much more difficult formations, or even slightly modify the level geometry to make thing more treacherous.
Y'know, stuff like that. Let me know if you would like any more suggestions, and good luck on your game!

Spoiler: Response

Ah, I see. Well, that's great to know. I want to be able to get an idea on what people are interested in for those types of things. Well, good news! I do have plans for the final boss to work like that and I did consider the difficulty settings. I do plan for a new game plus that is much less forgiving than the base and changes up the level set up quite a bit for extra spicy goodness. Also, thank you for the input on the magic meter. My main protagonist also uses a magic-gauge system but I wasn't 100% sure if it should be rechargeable over time or a restricted input, etc. This is really useful input! Thanks!

Musubi , Funny you mention that. Literally two hours ago, I kid you not, I considered one of the playable characters having the option to throw down their weapon and using it as a platform in midair or on the ground. Glad to see some people do like that idea too. :D I guess they will have that as a gameplay mechanic.



keep this in mind come whenever the game is finished...

 

[wynn728]

I mean It's fine if you don't like piranha plant but don't you think going only by fan request is a little restricting? I am pretty sure they added him because they saw a fun moveset.

Not really seeing how we have a range of fan requested characters like Krystal, Bomberman, Isaac, Shadow, Shovel Knight, Ashley, Takamaru, Waluigi, Skull Kid, Saki, Chibi-Robo, Dixie Kong, Geno a whole lot more that I can't name. There's a lot of fan requested characters that all provide unique moveset. There's not much restrictions.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

He has a point. I feel like any character can have a unique moveset. Not only that but the fact that echoes exist and all the melee dittos makes me think that even then, the character doesn't have to be super insane in moveset...

 

[Loog]

Spoiler

Not really seeing how we have a range of fan requested characters like Krystal, Bomberman, Isaac, Shadow, Shovel Knight, Ashley, Takamaru, Waluigi, Skull Kid, Saki, Chibi-Robo, Dixie Kong, Geno a whole lot more that I can't name. There's a lot of fan requested characters that all provide unique moveset. There's not much restrictions.

That's fine but that means if they wanted to include a character it could only be requested. It would really not allow them to think outside the box.

 

[SpiritOfRuin]

Not really seeing how we have a range of fan requested characters like Krystal, Bomberman, Isaac, Shadow, Shovel Knight, Ashley, Takamaru, Waluigi, Skull Kid, Saki, Chibi-Robo, Dixie Kong, Geno a whole lot more that I can't name. There's a lot of fan requested characters that all provide unique moveset. There's not much restrictions.

To be fair I don't think you're reading what some are actually saying about Piranha Plant. Yes it does have a unique moveset, but it's more than that. Piranha Plant has a completely unique playstyle of it's own in Smash. You have to play Piranha Plant differently than other characters at least to a degree because of how it's strengths and weaknesses work. And honestly Bomberman, Black Shadow, Waluigi, Takamaru, even Shovel Knight don't really have much unique moveset potential. Not to mention many of these characters just aren't as iconic as Piranha Plant is even if it is just a generic enemy. And I don't know how many times people have to remind everyone that fan demand is not the biggest factor to gauge who is "worthy" to get in Smash.

 

[wynn728]

That's fine but that means if they wanted to include a character it could only be requested. It would really not allow them to think outside the box.

Them thinking outside the box has basically kicked so many fan favorite to the curb. So there's the tricky situation, give the fans what they want or ignore the request to be different.

 

[BerBer456]

If the characters an Assist Trophy then they are dead. We have characters who get screwed over multiple times over, to a point where it more certain that they'll never happen. Remember, Sakurai said Assist Trophies are reserved for characters he believe have no real potential of being Fighters. The only one who got upgraded only had one game where they had an Assist Trophy role. Out of every single newcomers we ever got only three where chosen from Assist Trophies and two of them are basically clones. Sakurai action shows that he still keeps those views about Assist Trophies.

Think it's an insulting, well I'm not the one who's excluding them from the roster, that's Sakurai's doing. Sakurai is the one who keeps screwing over characters. I'm stating the obvious that people want to ignore.

Also yeah, Piranha Plant is a statement on other characters value. They go on about how Smash Bros Ultimate is filled with THE BEST OF THE BEST, a cast full of All-Stars. If Piranha Plant gets in while characters like Isaac, Geno, Shadow, Bomberman, and the rest that are screwed over by being Assist Trophies, Mii Costumes and Spirits then what does that says about them? It says they aren't the best of the best, Piranha Plant is better than them, all the others can get are participation ribbons. Like it or not, that's how they're view. There's a damn good reason support for many characters are just gone, they got the message. You can't really say that these characters are all-stars when they kept being put in the loser corner and Piranha Plant gets to be in the banner.

Might not be Sakurai intention to give a message like that, but that doesn't matter. Most things in this world start out with good intentions and wind up harmful.

Golden Sun no matter what ain't coming back. ARMS isn't going to get a sequel. Geno's only chance of ever showing up is Smash Bros. The only characters that have futures are the ones who's series are successful like Kirby and Mario, everyone else only had Smash Bros and nothing else.

Gotta say man that was really brutal but maybe it was something I needed to hear. I’ve been so dedicated to Isaac and golden sun returning, so it’s something I can’t just give up on. I know Isaac may just be seen as an AT for now, but given all the fan outcry that came out for him after that November direct, us golden sun fans can’t just give up on him. He has a high chance for next game along waluigi. Move set is sakurais issue cause Isaac could really bring new things to the fight no other fighter can especially if you played golden sun. We may never get what we want, and that’s something that’s hard to accept, but we are gonna keep reaching out cause Ridley did it. K rool did it. Banjo did it. Isaac can happen!

 

[wynn728]

To be fair I don't think you're reading what some are actually saying about Piranha Plant. Yes it does have a unique moveset, but it's more than that. Piranha Plant has a completely unique playstyle of it's own in Smash. You have to play Piranha Plant differently than other characters at least to a degree because of how it's strengths and weaknesses work. And honestly Bomberman, Black Shadow, Waluigi, Takamaru, even Shovel Knight don't really have much unique moveset potential. Not to mention many of these characters just aren't as iconic as Piranha Plant is even if it is just a generic enemy. And I don't know how many times people have to remind everyone that fan demand is not the biggest factor to gauge who is "worthy" to get in Smash.

Guess what, every character is required to be played different from other characters. Piranha Plant isn't this one exception out of the 78 characters in Smash Bros Ultimate with the only unique moveset.

And freaking bull on that statements saying those characters don't have potential for unique moveset!

And with that statement you say, "not as iconic as Piranha Plant," freaking proves what I've been saying; these characters that are excluded are viewed to be below Piranha Plant. Plant more iconic so it gets in while these fan demand characters like Geno gets to screwed over from being playable.

 

[ZelDan]

Shovel Knight definitely has moveset potential. Just incorporate the different relics you find between all 8 stages, or hell, bring some of the amiibo relics into Shovel Knight's moveset. There's also the shovel techniques that Shovel Knight can learn.

Saying Shovel Knight has no moveset potential is just flat out wrong.

 

[Loog]

Spoiler

Them thinking outside the box has basically kicked so many fan favorite to the curb. So there's the tricky situation, give the fans what they want or ignore the request to be different.

You can make the argument that if they were to pick only really requested characters chibi robo and others would be ignored. I like the chib and all but he might be more niche and end up being overshadowed by other picks. You really can't make everyone happy one way or the other.

 

[Glitch-EGamer]

Shovel Knight definitely has moveset potential. Just incorporate the different relics you find between all 8 stages, or hell, bring some of the amiibo relics into Shovel Knight's moveset. There's also the shovel techniques that Shovel Knight can learn.

Saying Shovel Knight has no moveset potential is just flat out wrong.

I, for one, back this claim. Shovel Knight isn't the only one either! King Knight, Spectre Knight, and Plague Knight are just as diverse and capable! They're some of the most unique platformer characters of all time! I hope my game's characters can be called that in the future.

 

[Ovaltine]

I honestly never thought I'd see the day where someone claimed Shovel Knight has little unique move set potential.

 

[Qeomash]

As we've discussed in this thread before, Sakurai could give anyone or anything a moveset.

 

[3DSNinja]

me neither. I mean, look at his Rivals of Aether moveset!

 

[N3ON]

Gotta say man that was really brutal but maybe it was something I needed to hear. I’ve been so dedicated to Isaac and golden sun returning, so it’s something I can’t just give up on. I know Isaac may just be seen as an AT for now, but given all the fan outcry that came out for him after that November direct, us golden sun fans can’t just give up on him. He has a high chance for next game along waluigi. Move set is sakurais issue cause Isaac could really bring new things to the fight no other fighter can especially if you played golden sun. We may never get what we want, and that’s something that’s hard to accept, but we are gonna keep reaching out cause Ridley did it. K rool did it. Banjo did it. Isaac can happen!

Pretty silly to see Charizard as a summon twice, to see Ridley with a supporting role twice, and go "yeah, but ATs can't be upgraded if they've existed more than once". At that point it's very transparent there's a specific, disingenuous agenda at work.

Plus idk about Isaac. He may never become playable. But it won't be because of a role he had in a previous game. That's logic which implies characters with no role are valued more than characters with roles.

I guess the fact that 7 of the 8 Nintendo newcomers in Ultimate had a supporting role in Smash 4* (AT, boss, costume, etc.) is a fluke, then?
*of those that existed at the time

It also suggests that Waluigi will eternally rest on the sidelines, which isn't something I'd wager on. So if and when the character does become playable, it will be a prime example of fans refusing to let an outcome they want die. Don't give up on something you've pushed so long for just because of rules fabricated by a clearly biased individual.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I don't disagree with any of those points ... more of the reality on what Sakurai does with having that one Joke/Random/Obscure character in Smash. It gives the game "character" (There are fans of such fighters like Ice Climbers, Game & Watch, Duck Hunt, Etc.) which is true.

However, I agree Smash Ultimate is meant to be ... Ultimate? It seems unnecessary to add such a fighter when there has been, and still is, fan demand for certain fighters and instead gives us a common mario enemy.

After Daisy was revealed ... I gotta admit, that was a slap in Waluigi's face. I am not personally a Waluigi fan, nothing for or against him, but even that I had to say "Come on...."

Honestly, I think the WTF/Retro rep should have been Lip or Takamaru instead of Piranha Plant because a lot of people actually would want them instead.