General ICs Q&A Thread

[DeLux]

Frame by Frame test it if you feel like

The general rule I derived that MOST windows range between 2-6 frames on dthrow, 2-5 frame on fthrow. The heavier the character, the larger the frame window minus a few exceptions.

 

[-LzR-]

Why test it when you gave me the answer I was looking for? Thanks again Delux.

 

[Rubberbandman]

I kinda feel like it went like "Your answer wasn't valid because your name is not 'Lux'."

 

[-LzR-]

Wat
10Wats

 

[Latch]

I kinda feel like it went like "Your answer wasn't valid because your name is not 'Lux'."

He was looking for the number of frames for each throw that you can regrab in... you posted a link to data that did not include that. The data you linked to was just the duration of the throws (plus some other stuff).

 

[Smoom77]

No, the link told you the number of frames you have to regrab.

 

[DeLux]

The thread gives throw animation duration. The answer to the question he was asking was regrab window duration.

Just to add what I said, while Dthrow generally has a higher window range of regrab, it also varies at a much sharper rate than fthrow as percents increase. So while Dthrow might have like an absurdly easy regrab window at early percents, it'll shrink to 2 frames much faster than fthrow will. Although most of this doesn't matter because the 2 frame windows usually occur after 150, which you really shouldn't be CGing past anyways

 

[Latch]

Unless you're Lain at 2:55 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFFGnZ5lctM

 

[-LzR-]

That's good to know. So they are that hard afterall. Now I don't feel so bad for dropping them
Also I hate Dthrow, I never got that one down, I just use the 2011 cg on everyone.

 

[DeLux]

Dthrow typically has the longest window of regrab at most relevant percents though

 

[Latch]

But Dthrow CGs are not tripless... therefore they are INFERIOR!!!

2011 CG for life!

 

[infiniteV115]

I don't even play this character and I 2-stocked a Lucario on Brinstar. Get on my level.

Though on a serious note, I'm trying to pick up this character as a secondary and I have nobody to practice with at home, so I've just been practicing the bthrow-dthrow CG on MK, Diddy and Lucario in training mode...any advice?

Btw don't say anything like read the guides and what not, I will do that, I want to know what you guys suggest I should practice.

 

[Rubberbandman]

Guides? What Guides? All you need to do is practice. All day, everyday. Don't even ask questions until after you've run into a true roadblock like "What are the inputs for this desynch, I'm kinda lost. I've watched like 3 videos of people using it and everything."

So practice these things: Chaingrabs, Desynchs, and General Character Movement. Any order you want.

 

[TheSaintKai]

But Dthrow CGs are not tripless... therefore they are INFERIOR!!!

2011 CG for life!

Walk it, and it's tripless. -.-
9B did it. It was not only tripless and unmashable, but extremely ****ing scary looking.
You only have to turn around once, which you can do by d-throw > d-throw > P f-throw > N b-throw > D-throw > D-throw etc. etc.
Basically do one rep of the 2011 CG at the edge.

 

[DeLux]

^ you could also hobble on certain stages as well

 

[TheSaintKai]

^ you could also hobble on certain stages as well

If they are light, it's weird.
Most people have trouble hobbling light characters.

 

[DeLux]

It's easier to hobble light characters out of dthrow CGs lol

 

[-LzR-]

Moar questions from hungry for knowledge me...

When you practice chaingrabbing, how do you do it? How often do you practice? How long are your sessions? What do you look for when practicing? Do you practice a single character or a lot of them? How long it took for you to get on the level you are now=

For me, I practice almost every day for about an hour. Sometimes more. I practice the characters who are played by the players I consider the biggest threats. I still suck at it though.

Just want to hear if you have some awesome methods I could try.

 

[dettadeus]

I usually practice one character for an hour at a time on weekends, and do it for like 3 hours straight. I look at the people on my PR and who I'd be going Icies against (mainly a Falco and a Snake) and then after getting those down I start with some of the other characters going down tier list order.
If I don't plan to use Icies in a particular matchup, I'll leave that character for last. (Basically anyone lower than A tier minus Lucario)

I also practice like 4 different chaingrabs to see which one for me is most comfortable. I really hate doing the 2011 CG on Snake, but I can do P Bthrow > N Fthrow consistently, as well as Hobbling. On Falco I can do like 5 different ones though. It also helps so I can reset my spacing for a particular CG after having one climber walk too far.

After I've practiced a couple characters I'll find a human to do some friendlies with. Since they're friendlies, they're not worried about losing as much so I can get a lot more grabs in.

 

[Rubberbandman]

I rarely practice at all, let alone CGs. When I do practice, I usually schedule exactly what I'm going to do ahead of time. My last session was: (Check Lux Desynch 2, practice it out of rolling; Experiment with Ice Blocks for at least 20 minutes; Practice Lux's cg for 10 minutes)

I actually haven't taken the time out to learn Lux's CG since I'm already comfortable with the one I have, but I try to learn it slowly at my own pace. Anyways, I don't really need to focus on CG's when I do train right now. When I need to refresh myself fully I'll do a sit down and just practice CGs for as long as my fingers let me.

 

[DeLux]

Procedure:

- Go to TRAINING MODE
- Put CPU on Random
- Select Stage from LC, PS1, PS2, DP, FO, YIB, BH, CS
- Put CPU on Run
- Chase CPU and Frame Trap
- CG to death
- Do this 3 times
- Switch stages with the same character
- Put CPU on Run
- Chase CPU and Frame Trap
- CG to death
- Do this 3 times
- - Switch stages with the same character
- Put CPU on Run
- Chase CPU and Frame Trap
- CG to death
- Do this 3 times
- Switch character
- Restart loop


- If I whiff a grab (ie drop a CG, whiff a setup read, etc) I put my controller down and do 8 pushups.
- I do this until I can't feel my arms anymore

 

[-LzR-]

I like that pushup thing. At my pace I'll be an athlete by summer. I just don't know someone would bother trying to land the grab in training mode as friendlies are for that purpose. I just want the tech skill down
But I love that idea of having to do pushups so much I guess I'll try it out.

 

[Latch]

Walk it, and it's tripless. -.-
9B did it. It was not only tripless and unmashable, but extremely ****ing scary looking.
You only have to turn around once, which you can do by d-throw > d-throw > P f-throw > N b-throw > D-throw > D-throw etc. etc.
Basically do one rep of the 2011 CG at the edge.

I meant B-throw to d-throw... stupid me.

That sounds like a fun CG... practice time!

 

[Rubberbandman]

You can do tripless B-throw, just no one bothers.

 

[Hylian]

Soft turning bthrows is ******** and always makes me mess up :/.

When I used to practice I would practice desynchs, then I would chaingrab mk/snake/diddy for 99 stocks each. I would then put the computer on random level 1 with 3 stocks and just practice until I felt satisfied.

I don't practice anymore though so eh.

 

[Dojo]

I've been doing it in segments.

I usually do hour long segments. Sometimes more. Go to 3 most neutral stages with character I want to learn. Put in a second controller and put it on human control so I don't have to worry about a CPU running. I usually do basic bthrow>dthrow or bthrow>fthrow to start off with for about 10-20 stocks. Then I just start mixing up every grab like :

Popo dthrow>nana fthrow>popo fthrow>nana dthrow> popo bthrow>nana bthrow> etc. I feel like it helps me for when i have those situations where you're in a strange positioning when you grab.

I do that for another 10-20 stocks on a character and switch off. I do this for about an hour at least a couple of times a day. I feel like it helps my muscle memory more so I can just pick up the controller and start doing them immediately.

Also, I got 2nd at a tourney this weekend. I keep losing to Olimar.... >.>

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Dojo plays ?

 

[Smoom77]

As of MK ban, yes.

 

[Hylian]

I've been doing it in segments.

I usually do hour long segments. Sometimes more. Go to 3 most neutral stages with character I want to learn. Put in a second controller and put it on human control so I don't have to worry about a CPU running. I usually do basic bthrow>dthrow or bthrow>fthrow to start off with for about 10-20 stocks. Then I just start mixing up every grab like :

Popo dthrow>nana fthrow>popo fthrow>nana dthrow> popo bthrow>nana bthrow> etc. I feel like it helps me for when i have those situations where you're in a strange positioning when you grab.

I do that for another 10-20 stocks on a character and switch off. I do this for about an hour at least a couple of times a day. I feel like it helps my muscle memory more so I can just pick up the controller and start doing them immediately.

Also, I got 2nd at a tourney this weekend. I keep losing to Olimar.... >.>

Olimar is super annoying, just takes experience really. Most olimars don't know how to deal with properly spaces blizzard wall into ice block approach. The ones that do I feel like it's a bunch of rps situations.

 

[Vinnie]

Got 2nd to Ally going 100% . I keep losing to him . I beat Dabuz though which is good.

I went in GF but lost (3-2), so that doesn't count towards character usage, right?

MK was banned, btw.

edit: just realized my past 2 posts were in the wrong thread. Sorry

 

[Hylian]

I would say winning games in grand finals definitely counts as character usage, even if you don't win the set.

 

[Vinnie]

I still got top 2 without

 

[Hylian]

I still got top 2 without

Yes, but think of how many people list characters for single game wins in bracket. Grand finals is the furthest you can get in the tournament, going to the last game in grand finals with a single character and then not listing the character as being used is just incorrect. You can also look at it as you got 2nd instead of 1st because you used GW, your character usage had an impact on the results of the tournament regardless of who you go and should be listed in that significant of a set.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Who did Elliot use against you? ?

Me personally, I feel like if you use a character in bracket against someone who's a tough opponent for you, if you win games it should be counted. If you're just using a character to **** around that one thing but if you felt the games you took we're because you used said character instead of another...I'd count em.

 

[Vinnie]

All I wanted to say was that I got top 2 without g&w yesterday. I used ICs vs Ally in winners' semis, but got 2-0'd. I didn't use g&w once until grand finals. I've gotten 1st and 2nd in tournaments going 100% ICs before. I recently saw a post (forgot who posted it) that I only place with ICs because I use G&W for CPs and stuff. But yeah, most of the time @ tourneys, I go 100% ICs. Either way, I was just posting some results.

Who did Elliot use against you? ?

yes

 

[Hylian]

I mean, you asked a question Vinnie and I answered it to the best of my ability. You certainly don't need to prove anything to anyone lmao.

Edit: I won my first tournament since 08 or 09 without using IC's at all saturday, I think my first tournament win ever only using one character.

 

[Rubberbandman]

All I wanted to say was that I got top 2 without g&w yesterday. I used ICs vs Ally in winners' semis, but got 2-0'd. I didn't use g&w once until grand finals. I've gotten 1st and 2nd in tournaments going 100% ICs before. I recently saw a post (forgot who posted it) that I only place with ICs because I use G&W for CPs and stuff. But yeah, most of the time @ tourneys, I go 100% ICs. Either way, I was just posting some results.

yes

I've actually missed seeing your GW more, since I'm still trying to get better with him. You rarely even use him for tournaments in the past couple of months, just Wario or MK for CPs.

Still, you shouldn't worry about what other people say about you. ICs are *** on CPs, that's why we have seconds. >_>

 

[F A N G]

When I have a banana and throw it, why does Nana sometimes do the corresponding action and sometimes not?

And is the any reason not to hobble Snake?

 

[DeLux]

Typically speaking, Nana will only Jump, special, shield, roll, air/spot dodge, item catch when Popo is holding a banana as far as I can tell. She can't perform standard attacks without multiple button presses.

That's just off the top of my head though, it might work differently, but that's generally what I base any item gimmick I have around.

 

[Latch]

Something I noticed... you can pass any item from popo to nana or vice versa by doing airdodge -> nair... or maybe nair -> airdodge... or something like that.