Social General Ice Climber Chat

[Wobbles]

Low percent autocanceled b-air has got me more grabs than I think it should.

 

[Kyu Puff]

against fastfallers, low percent b-air -> dash attack -> grab works pretty well

 

[Avalancer]

What setups do you guys use for wobbling? I usually SHFFL-Nair with both climbers into the other character, and quickly grab.
Other times I dashdance-desync (dash forward, back, forward, press down and some attack at about the same time) and make Nana DownB into the enemy. This gives really good stun, and you can walk right to the enemy and grab.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Dash-Dance down-b doesn't work if your opponents get better.

SHFFL nair is a large commitment and doesn't have much range. You need to get the read to use it effectively. You can, however, SH > Landing Desync > SHFFL Nair (P) > Ftilt/DA/Fsmash/Dsmash (N) which is safer in most situations imo, even though it splits you up.

I get most of my grabs from SHFFL'd bair > read, wavedash (facing away) > pivot ftilt desync or just general intelligent use of fair, nair, ftilt, ice shot and jab.

It isn't really so much a specific set-up that gets you grabs, but rather your playstyle.

 

[choknater]

lately i've been getting a lot of grabs from simple ice block chases. haha!

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Ice Block is mad underrated.

Probably their best special.

 

[choknater]

i've been noticing just how much they make people jump.

as i've matured as a fighting gamer, i've learned more and more that projectiles are not thrown out to connect, but for positioning and to gain advantages. if they connect (and you don't get punished on hit) it's just a bonus and likely bad defense on the opponent's part.

also, i beat norcal's 2nd best peach 2-0 with ic's. gives me hope.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

That match-up gets better and better for us the better we get, so great :D

 

[choknater]

i still have yet to play armada, and from what smasher89 says it's really really bad lol.

but as for american peaches, they don't seem to dominate us TOO hard but all of us contend that the matchup is super difficult and counter-intuitive for ic's. we have to run away quite a bit!

there were a couple things that i watched out for, and since my opponent lacked ic's practice, they were EXTREMELY telegraphed. i decided to stand still and wait for some dsmashes because he thought i would try to approach her. he failed a lot and i got some good fairs and jc grabs. turnip throws were also super telegraphed and i just used wd back and waited to catch them.

i feel like doing aerials WHILE HOLDING turnips can be a very threatening peach tactic against ice climbers... i wanna test this theory hahahahahahaha. and then i want to not reveal it to peach players... :'(

 

[Avalancer]

Dash-Dance down-b doesn't work if your opponents get better.

Really? I found it a very flexible move since you can 'catapult' nana backwards if you miss, and blizzard has a huge hitbox.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

It is good as a spacing tool against some characters, Marth and Jigglypuff come to mind.

But it shouldn't combo into anything against good players due to DI, it has slow start-up so an aggressive player familiar with the MU will just hit you out of it and the hitbox obviously has basically no coverage apart from directly in-front of the climbers.

Keep using it if it works, just don't expect it to keep working as your opponents get more used to it.

 

[choknater]

haha yea. i used to use it as a go-to strategy, but now i use it to see if they know enough about blizzard to RESPECT it. if they don't respect it and they run into it, they lose. if they understand it, and they don't run into it/di it well, i know that they are going to respect my space in general and it actually gives me room to move.

ic's are solid haha

 

[Nintendude]

I got to play Armada during Apex weekend and while it was pretty rough, I never felt like he was unbeatable. I got him to the last stock several times. The two things that really stood out when playing against him was his edgeguarding and efficiency in killing Nana. I've never faced an opponent that's so consistently competent at edgeguarding...

 

[Armada]

Yeah you really surprised me. I actually didn't know who you was before we played. And you are hella good at this game.

But I think Peach also gives me a great chance to do some kind of the stuff you did mention in your post.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

DD blizzard is good even if the opponent is quite familiar with it, and it should usually combo into something even if they know how to DI it. Probably not a grab, but still a uair or usmash.

 

[knightpraetor]

Nvm figured everything out.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

DD blizzard is good even if the opponent is quite familiar with it, and it should usually combo into something even if they know how to DI it. Probably not a grab, but still a uair or usmash.

I don't think the risk is worth the reward, at least, against spacies.

But we'll just have to agree to disagree.

I do use blizzard, just sparingly (only when I have positional advantage, I don't actually use it to "space" except in MUs like Marth/Puff/etc...)

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Against spacies, sure. In most other match-ups, DD blizzard is generally fine.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

For the entirety of last year the only 3 players who were better than me in my state were spacie mains.

So yeah

 

[Binx]

anyone else interested in being on the podcast I'm aiming to do it some time next week maybe thur or friday, or possibly pushing it back a week further than that.

 

[choknater]

hey guys i posted in melee discussion how to **** our character

 

[PEEF!]

anyone else interested in being on the podcast I'm aiming to do it some time next week maybe thur or friday, or possibly pushing it back a week further than that.

I could do it if it was a week further, and I'd like to.

Also at Grim and his unanswered questions: Doubleshield makes it so the hitlag of hitting the shield happens twice, once for big shield and one for the small. Means they have to wait a really long time to cancel.

I just got an idea. If they hit nanas big shield, then I press jump and fair right as they hit mine, will she fly out of shield with a fair? Could be sweet.

Also, the "nana rocket" upb is all about TIMING. They get a big grabbox so it isn't much about spacing, besides the fact that you cant be above the ledge or stupidly far away. Here was my post detailing how it works: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=274911&highlight=nana+rocket

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Thanks for answering the shield thing.

I'm going to be in Bali all week, so I can't do the podcast until next week :/

I don't see how the Nana Rocket can be about timing. It isn't like you can adjust the timing of Belay like you can adjust the timing of say... shine > bair.

If you mean timing of when you press up-b, well that is spacing as well because you are timing it so that the spacing is correct.

 

[PEEF!]

Thanks for answering the shield thing.

I'm going to be in Bali all week, so I can't do the podcast until next week :/

I don't see how the Nana Rocket can be about timing. It isn't like you can adjust the timing of Belay like you can adjust the timing of say... shine > bair.

If you mean timing of when you press up-b, well that is spacing as well because you are timing it so that the spacing is correct.

It is both spacing and timing, but the spacing is much more forgiving than the timing. There is a certain amount of time that must go by when you are within edgegrab range before you press upb and stay within edgegrab range. You also cannot do it while your momentum is moving up.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Really? Interesting.

I've always just dropped from the ledge, double jumped and then pressed up-b before touching the ledge.

 

[PEEF!]

Really? Interesting.

I've always just dropped from the ledge, double jumped and then pressed up-b before touching the ledge.

Yeah, that just happens to be the right timing.

You can also do it by jumping backwards off the edge, double jumping immediately, and timing it as you fall.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I could do it if it was a week further, and I'd like to.
I just got an idea. If they hit nanas big shield, then I press jump and fair right as they hit mine, will she fly out of shield with a fair? Could be sweet.

The only way I see this happening without Popo also fairing would be if Popo's shield is also big. Otherwise, I think Nana's shieldstun would last too long to do this without having Popo also fair.

 

[Binx]

The only way I see this happening without Popo also fairing would be if Popo's shield is also big. Otherwise, I think Nana's shieldstun would last too long to do this without having Popo also fair.

wonder if we could shield drop and have Nana grab or jab during the hitstun, if you let go of shield and hit a, im wondering if nana would jab while you grabbed, then hit z or something to headbutt if it connected, and have Nana grab if it didn't

or maybe there is a way to roll while have nana ftilt them or something.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Shield desyncing is unexplored, keep going with this discussion guys!

I'm leaving for a week, so have fun with your ICs discussions lol

 

[choknater]

haha aight later grim

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I used to dabble with N SH blizzard OoS by entering a jump input right before Popo exits shield stun. It actually can work and does have applications, but it requires extreme precision and a really good sense of how long shield stun lasts.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Sounds sexy.
I'm having a lot of trouble practicing OoS N Belay > Wavedash Dsmash

Timing is really strict, only done it twice :/

 

[choknater]

wow that sounds hot

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Miscellaneous nonsense propagation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBjOUA2PNbQ

 

[PEEF!]

Miscellaneous nonsense propagation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBjOUA2PNbQ

Hehe nice vid. Will you start streaming soon? I can help you with everything obvs. You'd be the best player with a stream.

 

[Smasher89]

Did try out the thing I didnt really tell what it was at the last tournament.
It´s a jabdesynch that if you jab, then mash forward b, you get Nana free to move and do whatever you want. A cool aplication is that if nana smashes, the forward b might stop the knockback from the opponent tottaly and you can basicly mash out a dsmash again with Nana making alot of damage in very short time^^

 

[Krynxe]

Looking like brawl ICs

 

[Fly_Amanita]

I don't have any plans of streaming soon. If I do, I'd get a mic first since I hear that Dazzle DVC 100s have audio problems when streaming.

 

[TheZhuKeeper]

Miscellaneous nonsense propagation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBjOUA2PNbQ

I noticed you did this to me a few times in our sets. New technology?

 

[PEEF!]

I noticed you did this to me a few times in our sets. New technology?

It looks like it could work with knowledge of where nana will throw based on distance from platform edge, combined with random prayer DI reads/luck.