Heartstring
Smash Legend
i call taking part as a ganon when bloody is taknig the challenge!
also, anyone is a pair who needs to share a hotel room with 2 others? i think theres only 2 of us set for apex right now :L
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Ganonic Grimoire (Social) - Commiseration and Hierarchy
- Thread starter Vermanubis
- Start date
also, anyone is a pair who needs to share a hotel room with 2 others? i think theres only 2 of us set for apex right now :L
JuxtaposeX
Smash Lord
I will double post.
JuxtaposeX
Smash Lord
Okay, I did it.
![[FBC] Papa Mink](/data/avatars/l/166/166410.jpg?1363023093){kind=avatar}
[FBC] Papa Mink
Smash Legend
I'm trying to figure out my hotel room.
If you guys can snag me a good price, maybe i'll stay with ya'll.
If you guys can snag me a good price, maybe i'll stay with ya'll.
MetalPat
Smash Ace
i think everyone is looking right now. im talking to my friend now, and we are definitely going, but we might be rooming with more NYS people, so idk
Supreme Dirt
King of the Railway
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2009
- Messages
- 7,336
I was under the impression it was Smashville only for Ganon challenges.
And yeah, 3 stocks.
And yeah, 3 stocks.
[FBC] Papa Mink
Smash Legend
So,
At APEX we're going to have to get a ganon picture.
Hopefully you guys can allow me up in that.
I have some new Ganon replays from this past weekend.
At APEX we're going to have to get a ganon picture.
Hopefully you guys can allow me up in that.
I have some new Ganon replays from this past weekend.
Mr. game and watch
Smash Master
I feel as though this threads OP needs to be updated.
Exalted
Smash Lord
Z1G and I have been pitching a few ideas for a new thread. Except awesomeness in the near future.
Heartstring
Smash Legend
i will EXPECT awesomeness in the near future
also, im currently trying to confirm how many uk players are going. everyone here ******* sucks at organisation
[FBC] Papa Mink
Smash Legend
I know that feeling.
I was the like, 3rd person to confirm in FL because the flights got super cheap.
I couldn't decide before yesterday/two days ago. But i was like, you know what. If it's cheap. I'll meet cool people, and my mom's xmas present is 2/3rds my plane ticket.
So. I'll take that.
I was the like, 3rd person to confirm in FL because the flights got super cheap.
I couldn't decide before yesterday/two days ago. But i was like, you know what. If it's cheap. I'll meet cool people, and my mom's xmas present is 2/3rds my plane ticket.
So. I'll take that.
Exalted
Smash Lord
It really feels like a Wizkick to the place my heart used to be when I see all of you planning to go to APEX while I'm completely powerless in the matter.
whining/
whining/
Heartstring
Smash Legend
well im currently the only uk person confirmed. which is slightly daunting, i dont really feel like going solo :L
Mr. game and watch
Smash Master
Lulz I wanna try the ganon challenge with... Uhhh... No joke I'd do the best with ganon.
Heartstring
Smash Legend
to win the ganon callenge i resort to being the most unmanly ike ever, straight to the ledge and ledgecamping, i wonder how that tactic will do when i come up against ganons that know how to edgeguard
Xubble
Smash Ace
One Ganon sacrifices himself, boots you during his respawn invincibility frames.
The only problem is Ike's SA frames during Aether. But I'm sure if that fails, grabbing the ledge will solve the problem.
The only problem is Ike's SA frames during Aether. But I'm sure if that fails, grabbing the ledge will solve the problem.
Bloodynite
Smash Ace
god dammit I've been trying to make a chart for the flame choke lock and its so freaking hard man!! I'm not even a quarter of the way done and I've been on it for more than 2 hours....
Some interesting notes though about what I have found:
-A flame choke lock can lead to a guaranteed grab on wario and thus a good chance to do an infinite
-A wizfoot is guaranteed after a flame choke lock and in most cases will lead to a wizfoot ledge cancel
-Best places where a flame choke lock can lead to a kill (excluding ledge cancel opportunity's) are among Rainbow cruise's first and last slants as well at the small arch, and the stairs on Delfino
-If Yoshi's Island (melee) were legal, ganon would have an infinite on ROB (assuming no DI since I can't test DI on my own)
-There is a slant on RC where you can perform the flame choke lock that not only gives you a great chance to kill your opponent, but also gives you a chance to actually perform the GO TO HELL glitch. Of course it won't be easy
also on some stages the flame choke lock can actually be practical as I've found that the max limit it can be done can go up to 25%-ish but it could be even higher since I haven't tested on any heavy's yet so expect to see some interesting things within the next week or so
Some interesting notes though about what I have found:
-A flame choke lock can lead to a guaranteed grab on wario and thus a good chance to do an infinite
-A wizfoot is guaranteed after a flame choke lock and in most cases will lead to a wizfoot ledge cancel
-Best places where a flame choke lock can lead to a kill (excluding ledge cancel opportunity's) are among Rainbow cruise's first and last slants as well at the small arch, and the stairs on Delfino
-If Yoshi's Island (melee) were legal, ganon would have an infinite on ROB (assuming no DI since I can't test DI on my own)
-There is a slant on RC where you can perform the flame choke lock that not only gives you a great chance to kill your opponent, but also gives you a chance to actually perform the GO TO HELL glitch. Of course it won't be easy
also on some stages the flame choke lock can actually be practical as I've found that the max limit it can be done can go up to 25%-ish but it could be even higher since I haven't tested on any heavy's yet so expect to see some interesting things within the next week or so
DLA
"Their anguish was my nourishment."
Ike is really easy to gimp with Ganon.
Against most of those characters it does, but Ike, DK and Falcon are sometimes exceptions. San, Will and Ally all knew how to get around my tipmen and made it extremely dangerous to get around. Most smart Ikes will recover low (like San), DKs will rarely be low enough to be largely affected and Falcon's Falcon Dive beats tipman if the Falcon knows to wait for it.
Bloodynite
Smash Ace
best way to kill dk offstage would be dair so long as he isn't that high up
DLA
"Their anguish was my nourishment."
Honestly the easiest way to gimp Ike is to get to him before he even gets a chance to up B. If you knock Ike into the corner of the screen, you want to jump off the stage and fall with him while he's recovering, just a bit below him. What you're trying to do is to bait an air dodge, and then punish it with double jump Uair (not tipman). So basically, you knock Ike offstage, he's falling back to the stage, and you jump off the stage and fall with him, out of range of his Fair but in range for your double jump Uair to hit. Ike pretty much has to air dodge in this situation because his aerials are too slow to clear his recovery space effectively, and he doesn't want to get hit by your Uair or it will kill him.
You may have to dip pretty low to bait his air dodge, but luckily there's a fairly large opening where if Ike air dodges, he'll kill himself, but if he Up B's, he won't make it back to the stage. If he hasn't air dodged before this point, then this is where you DJ Uair him, and he HAS to take it. Then he usually dies afterwards.
If Ike is recovering with Side B, just jump off the stage and throw yourself in his way. If he hits you, then he loses momentum and dies. You take a hit but so what, Ike's dead. And if you're pro like me, you can predict when he's going to let go of his side B and then you air dodge, so that the mechanics of his side B make him swing at you even though you're air dodging. No damage AND dead Ike... not sure what else you can ask for.
If you fail at baiting his air dodge, and he doesn't use side B to recover, all you need to do is get to the ledge before he does. Then use the carry over invincibility frames to Uair Ike as he's rising, as this is where he has no super armor. It shouldn't matter if he recovers low, since drop off Uair will hit him anyways.
If he up B's early/high, just drop off and regrab. If he's going for the ledge, your invincibility frames will make him die. If he's going to land onstage, just get up or getup roll (depending on timing so that you don't get hit by UpB onstage), then knock him back offstage during his up B landing lag. Also getup attack works really well if he's close enough to the ledge that he'll get knocked offstage by it. Then rinse and repeat.
If he up B's low/late while you're on the ledge, screw the invincibility frames... just go after him with tipman before he gets a chance to up B. Drop off Bair also works really well because it comes out a lot faster than tipman, and he's going to try to make you hit his super armor frames as early as possible. He'll expect the tipman but get hit early by Bair instead. If he gets hit by either of these moves then he's probably dead. Also keep in mind that if he recovers low, he has a LOT less frames to snap to the ledge, since he's only near the ledge at the apex of his up B. So it is much easier to edgehog him in this situation.
While I'm at it, general tips against Ike... dash attack and wizkick are both marvelous in this matchup, use them a LOT to punish bad spacing... much like how you would against Marth, except it's a lot easier.
Ike's jabs were really really good for a few years... now all of the cool kids just smash DI out of them. Learn how to do this and Ike's jabs really aren't a problem anymore. Good Ikes replace options that other characters would normally do (such as shield, spot dodge, rolling) with jabs, because the jabs are actually safer due to the fact that his opponent has to be shielding or he'll get hit. If you shield Ike's jabs, just roll away from him and reset, Ganon can't punish Ike's jabs unless Ike finishes the jab combo with bad spacing. And if you get hit by Ike's jabs, then just smash DI out and you'll take like 7-10 damage overall. Not a big deal.
What else..... oh yeah, Ganon's stomp is Ike's jabbing fist's worst nightmare. When Ike replaces options with Jab, he's not ACTUALLY invincible, as compared to rolling, shielding, or spot dodging. So learn when Ike is going to jab as a defensive option, then just stomp his fkin fists. Stomp > jab every time, and Ike doesn't like getting stomped because that means he has to land, which he's not great at, especially against Ganondorf.
One more thing... Ike's dash attack comes out deceptively fast, so just... learn when it hits and don't get hit by it.
Ike used to be my least favorite matchup, now he's one of my favorites. You just gotta learn how to deal with his jab, and Ganon has better tools for this task than a lot of characters do, believe it or not. Learning how to edgeguard Ike doesn't hurt either.
You may have to dip pretty low to bait his air dodge, but luckily there's a fairly large opening where if Ike air dodges, he'll kill himself, but if he Up B's, he won't make it back to the stage. If he hasn't air dodged before this point, then this is where you DJ Uair him, and he HAS to take it. Then he usually dies afterwards.
If Ike is recovering with Side B, just jump off the stage and throw yourself in his way. If he hits you, then he loses momentum and dies. You take a hit but so what, Ike's dead. And if you're pro like me, you can predict when he's going to let go of his side B and then you air dodge, so that the mechanics of his side B make him swing at you even though you're air dodging. No damage AND dead Ike... not sure what else you can ask for.
If you fail at baiting his air dodge, and he doesn't use side B to recover, all you need to do is get to the ledge before he does. Then use the carry over invincibility frames to Uair Ike as he's rising, as this is where he has no super armor. It shouldn't matter if he recovers low, since drop off Uair will hit him anyways.
If he up B's early/high, just drop off and regrab. If he's going for the ledge, your invincibility frames will make him die. If he's going to land onstage, just get up or getup roll (depending on timing so that you don't get hit by UpB onstage), then knock him back offstage during his up B landing lag. Also getup attack works really well if he's close enough to the ledge that he'll get knocked offstage by it. Then rinse and repeat.
If he up B's low/late while you're on the ledge, screw the invincibility frames... just go after him with tipman before he gets a chance to up B. Drop off Bair also works really well because it comes out a lot faster than tipman, and he's going to try to make you hit his super armor frames as early as possible. He'll expect the tipman but get hit early by Bair instead. If he gets hit by either of these moves then he's probably dead. Also keep in mind that if he recovers low, he has a LOT less frames to snap to the ledge, since he's only near the ledge at the apex of his up B. So it is much easier to edgehog him in this situation.
While I'm at it, general tips against Ike... dash attack and wizkick are both marvelous in this matchup, use them a LOT to punish bad spacing... much like how you would against Marth, except it's a lot easier.
Ike's jabs were really really good for a few years... now all of the cool kids just smash DI out of them. Learn how to do this and Ike's jabs really aren't a problem anymore. Good Ikes replace options that other characters would normally do (such as shield, spot dodge, rolling) with jabs, because the jabs are actually safer due to the fact that his opponent has to be shielding or he'll get hit. If you shield Ike's jabs, just roll away from him and reset, Ganon can't punish Ike's jabs unless Ike finishes the jab combo with bad spacing. And if you get hit by Ike's jabs, then just smash DI out and you'll take like 7-10 damage overall. Not a big deal.
What else..... oh yeah, Ganon's stomp is Ike's jabbing fist's worst nightmare. When Ike replaces options with Jab, he's not ACTUALLY invincible, as compared to rolling, shielding, or spot dodging. So learn when Ike is going to jab as a defensive option, then just stomp his fkin fists. Stomp > jab every time, and Ike doesn't like getting stomped because that means he has to land, which he's not great at, especially against Ganondorf.
One more thing... Ike's dash attack comes out deceptively fast, so just... learn when it hits and don't get hit by it.
Ike used to be my least favorite matchup, now he's one of my favorites. You just gotta learn how to deal with his jab, and Ganon has better tools for this task than a lot of characters do, believe it or not. Learning how to edgeguard Ike doesn't hurt either.
Bloodynite
Smash Ace
oh yeah now before i forget congratz guys into making this 400 pages....
Noobicidal
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2008
- Messages
- 3,551
But it's only on page 150.
Bloodynite
Smash Ace
its on 400 for me...
Supreme Dirt
King of the Railway
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2009
- Messages
- 7,336
Well you're wrong.
Bloodynite
Smash Ace
Exalted
Smash Lord
It depends on the display option that decides how many posts per page you can see.
I'm on page 400 too.
I'm on page 400 too.
DLA
"Their anguish was my nourishment."
I type a novel about Ike and then we start to argue about how which page the thread is currently on...
p.s. only hipsters use 50 ppp.
Heartstring
Smash Legend
you got to get to the edge before they run out XD
yeah, but most ikes cant recover. it's literally the only thing i do with ike thats better than others. i spent the best part of a day learning exactly where the SA frames are so i can time them to block most attempts at hitting me out of aether
...
its a shame i suck at the important bit of the game (i.e: killing)
even i couldnt be arsed to read it, and i normally love text walls
Noobicidal
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2008
- Messages
- 3,551
DLA
"Their anguish was my nourishment."
It doesn't matter if most Ikes can't recover... Ganon has a very easy gimp that Ike can't do anything about. And it doesn't even involve Ike's up B.
Read the wall of text........ it will change the way Ganon views Ike forever, I promise....... this is all fresh info, straight from my brain. Not rehashed 09 ****.
Read the wall of text........ it will change the way Ganon views Ike forever, I promise....... this is all fresh info, straight from my brain. Not rehashed 09 ****.