Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[Sinji]

I noticed somthing about Mango's style of play. he would jumpshine oos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMjqjhP7g-c

 

[KAOSTAR]

LOL. Excellent deduction by Jamaica.

 

[Lovage]

whod you beat

beat macd and lucky, then lost to fly
then beat s2j in losers finals and beat fly twice in some closeee assssss sets.

wait for the vids they're really hype

 

[Brookman]

wavedash is faster if you do it perfectly, by a couple frames, and the lag time is something you're probably more use to
but i guess shield drop utilt would be easier
wavedash oos feels more comfortable to me than shield drop

You are more prone to mess up wavedashing out of the shield stun than simply releasing the shoulder button. If it's not broke, don't fix it.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Good stuff Lovage! =)

I split with M2K at this NC tournament today. Which is gay, but it means I got to play Fox in WFs and second set of GFs. =p Tear my vids apart with me(when they go up) please? <3

 

[Brookman]

Yay for PP tourney fox.

By the sound of your post, it must have been ugly. . .

 

[Tomacawk]

pp your falco is literally flawless
fox is cool and all but you should stick with falco lol

Spoiler

and falco is better than fox

 

[Smooth Criminal]

What's double shining usually good for, Fox thread?

Smooth Criminal

 

[Sinji]

I dont a dazzle so used my laptop to film this.

Please skip the fountain of dreams match cuz the quality is ****ty.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVQAsBNFQSs&feature=channel_video_title

 

[Tomacawk]

doubleshining is pretty good on shield after you land from an aerial, it'll catch anybody who tries to jump/grab/up b (maybe not samoo?)
I use it a lot more in teams. If you can land on the other team while they shield, go nuts with the shines
it's also super nice on stadium if you can get people against a wall but don't have time for waveshining over and over for various reasons
i use it to pressure shields when people are at the ledge, too

 

[unknown522]

wavedash is faster if you do it perfectly, by a couple frames, and the lag time is something you're probably more use to
but i guess shield drop utilt would be easier
wavedash oos feels more comfortable to me than shield drop

oh, I know.




also, Good **** lovage! Also, I beat I wanna be the guy a few days ago.

edit: good **** peepee. You should've just ***** m2k again and took all the money. =P

edit 2:

What's double shining usually good for, Fox thread?

Smooth Criminal

pretty much:
- shield pressure.
- Momentum stacking on combo enders (one shine is good enough though)
- gimp setups.
- style points.

 

[Divinokage]

ya.. Lovage beasting everyone... Good stuff. =)

 

[Silent Wolf]

beat macd and lucky, then lost to fly
then beat s2j in losers finals and beat fly twice in some closeee assssss sets.

wait for the vids they're really hype

i could see that happening. damn were bout to **** in teams. ima come down there in june or somethin

 

[SwiftBass]

I think ness from neutral isnt that bad.(on like FD) Ness off stage and when he is getting hit is the problem. His WD isnt that bad, he has some tricksies with DJ cancels, he has some good rock paper scissors-like trade offs in priority(dash attack, fair, upair have GREAT priority.

 

[voorhese]

just goofing around http://www.ustream.tv/channel/melee-with-voorhese

 

[MarsFool!]

Just recently started doing this:

Nair through sheild>shine> air dash into ground> run like youre gonna cross up then just sheild again>shine OoS. EVERYONE will try to grab you. Its so dumb...

 

[Sinji]

just goofing around http://www.ustream.tv/channel/melee-with-voorhese

LOL. how long you plan on playing?

 

[voorhese]

just finished... lol
i played for like 2 hours or something, might get back on later tho idk >_< i pressed record for 5 min or so if u wanna watch that, the quality is really crappy, and if u are wondering why ill do a run up shine and not do anything, its cuz i put the input in for shine bair to fast (the jump part)

 

[Sinji]

My quality was crappy this morning ( considering i dont have a dazzle). You can barely see a wavedash.

 

[voorhese]

i do have a dazzle and it still sucked >_<

 

[Brookman]

I like that last trick, Mars.

 

[Strong Badam]

- Momentum stacking on combo enders (one shine is good enough though)

little known fact: in Melee, momentum only stacks if the second attack hits within 10 frames of the first one hits, excluding hitlag, I believe. 2 frames before the jump cancel window + 3 frames startup + shine = 6 frames, so you only have 5 possible frames to initiate the shine depending on when you jump cancel if you want the momentum to stack.

 

[voorhese]

is that why infinite grabs like wobbling or jabbing someone that is grabbed by somone else works?

 

[Tomacawk]

no, that's like, permanent hitstun
or something
pretty sure that's different

 

[voorhese]

well if you stack hitstun to the point where they cant get out, it would make sense i think...idk

 

[JPOBS]

momentum stacking like strong bad said is exactly what it sounds like. Hitting someone with 2 moves so fast that the knockback is more than it "should" be. which is why double shine gimps are supposedly more effective than single shine attempts.

wobbing and ics glitches like tomacawk said just keep you virtually locked in hitstun by hitting you with moves. But because your also being held by one of the climbers, there is no knockback at all.

so ya, wobbling and stuff is different. but i think double shining is the only thing in the game fast enough to have real application momentum stacking cuz like, nothing else that happens in a match has those attributes.

 

[voorhese]

yeah i love doubleshining after an upthrow near the edge

 

[KAOSTAR]

momentum stacking like strong bad is exactly what it sounds like. Hitting someone with 2 moves so fast that the knockback is more than it "should" be. which is why double shine gimps are supposedly more effective than shine shine attempts.

wobbing and ics glitches like tomacawk said just keep you virtually locked in hitstun by hitting you with moves. But because your also being held by one of the climbers, there is no knockback at all.

so ya, wobbling and stuff is different. but i think double shining is the only thing in the game fast enough to have real application momentum stacking cuz like, nothing else that happens in a match has those attributes.

good analysis. u can probably do late ledge canceled aerials into aerials to stack if its just a ten frame window.

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

i always figured the reason double shine knocks farther is simply because there's lag in between doing the 1st and 2nd shine, so they're hit from the first shine, pushed a little away, then shined again

no?

 

[Strong Badam]

is that why infinite grabs like wobbling or jabbing someone that is grabbed by somone else works?

Nope. Wobbling works because you can't escape a grab while in hitstun. Try grabbing a char and pummeling repeatedly; they don't break out DURING the pummel, but shortly afterward. By alternating pummel & Nana Forward/Down-Tilt/Blizzard, the opponent can be in hitstun at all times, making it inescapable.

good analysis. u can probably do late ledge canceled aerials into aerials to stack if its just a ten frame window.

yes.

i always figured the reason double shine knocks farther is simply because there's lag in between doing the 1st and 2nd shine, so they're hit from the first shine, pushed a little away, then shined again

no?

the extra distance in this case would barely be enough to notice. it's due to momentum stacking.

 

[Sinji]

The second shine's effect is kind of like a glicth.

 

[Ocean]

The second shine's effect is kind of like a glicth.

no it's not. it's a logical addition to the game.

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

logical implies planned. i doubt they had any logical reasoning behind 'momentum stacking'

 

[Lovage]

'momentum stacking' is a good name for it

it's one of those things pretty much every good melee player is aware of on a subconscious level/in their muscle memory but can't totally explain technically.

SB's description makes perfect sense tho

 

[Beat!]

"Momentum stacking"...

I like it

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U00kyfNnc44#t=7m15s

****in intense endings make my head explode. also check out that nair to reverse pivot ledgegrab near the very end

it may not have been on purpose but it was ****in sexy :3

 

[Lovage]

that was a Pc homeboy


good **** tho, was that finals?

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

nahh that was at a RR

we played again in gfinals yesterday at our monthly

came back from losers ended up winning 6-2.

of course no footage

 

[JPOBS]

is "Pc homeboy" the name, or was lovage trying to say "thats the Pc, homeboy"

like westcoast calls the nair->shine->retreating nair "DC homeboy" right? or is it just DC?

lol semantics

 

[trahhSTEEZY]

i think im the homeboy in this scenario pobs

wtf is the dc?

i call that **** mango