Final Fantasy Tactics Mafia: Game finally over! Raziek lynched, Town wins! Lego too!

[Inferno3044]

Vote: Rajam

Really Rajam? You're gonna come in here and post about that? You can die. Also I voted Raziek before to prove I'm not a dancer.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Inferno, I want you to die.

 

[T-block]

Again, what's wrong with that?

because with the timing of it, you were literally only hindering progress without offering an alternate route

My inactivity was only a result of necessity, not by choice.

Regardless of my alignment, my play is pretty transparent. (For better or worse)

Yeah, we do have a fairly spotty history of reading each other. Mostly because we're never the same alignment when I want us to be.

It's also less that he went too far, because nobody's lynching Nickel here. It's (as I stated), moreso the issue of him displaying little Town intent, and trying to hide behind his meta as an excuse for tunneling.

What annoys me is that Nickel has been entirely silent since. Hoping we get that reads post from him soon.

Like half this game is inactive.

if your play was transparent, it wouldn't be so hard for me to read you =P

anyways, i guess i'm okay with these answers

unvote

 

[T-block]

not really liking inferno atm

pretty much every push he's made this game has been pretty opportunistic

vote: Inferno

 

[Overswarm]

Ryker - Red Ryu,
Nicholas1024- Legolas, Ryker, MOD
Red Ryu- Rajam,
Rajam - NickelbackR0cks, Glyph, Raziek, Inferno3044,
Gheb- Nicholas1024,
Legolas - MOD
Inferno - T-block,

Gova, Seph, Gheb,

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline is February 17th at 3:00 PM EST

 

[Inferno3044]

not really liking inferno atm

pretty much every push he's made this game has been pretty opportunistic

vote: Inferno

If a good amount of the cast had material on them and were active maybe I could do something. What am I supposed to do? Claim someone like Gova (literally chose a random inactive name) is scum and give reasons when he doesn't have anything. There are a lot of people that are null for me due to lack of contribution. Trying to work with what I got.

 

[Gova]

I take offense to being called inactive. I'll be making post(s) once I turn in my project that's due at midnight.

 

[Nicholas1024]

tbh, i can't remember why you were on my case in TT, and i sure as hell ain't gonna reread that game. the part about our interaction i remember more is me tunneling the **** out of you for a pretty blatant contradiction.

I was more or less asking whether you thought my case was justified or if I needed a reality check, since I trust your judgement ATM.

question for you though - what are your thoughts on ryker?

My read on him at the moment is basically null jerk. He's playing pretty similar to how he usually plays, with plenty of insults and not much explanation, and although I think it's really anti-town, it doesn't make him scum.

@Ryker, Raziek, Inferno, Lego
Since you're all either voting me or have expressed an interest in doing so, explain in your own words with detail why you think I am scum.

@Raziek
How has my play this game not matched my meta, and what about my case on Gheb doesn't sit well with you?

@Inferno
You didn't answer, how was my pressure on Nickel scummy?

@Ryker
Scum reads, please. With more detail than "This guy can die" for one post that annoyed you.

@Lego
How has Nickel's delay in giving reads affected your read on him? Any other notable reads you have to share?

@OS
Next game, could you reserve a less common emphasis color than red for mod use? Might reduce the number of mod votes floating around.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

@Ryker, Raziek, Inferno, Lego
Since you're all either voting me or have expressed an interest in doing so, explain in your own words with detail why you think I am scum.

@Ryker
Scum reads, please. With more detail than "This guy can die" for one post that annoyed you.

1.) Because you received a mafia role PM. That entails that you are not town. Not town roles are scum.

2.) Why would I do that? What do I profit from it? Right now I don't want to lynch them, so please tell me what I get out of explaining it to you (my scum pick).

 

[Nicholas1024]

Postgame I will need someone to explain to me why we don't start every game with a policy lynch on Ryker.

Anyway, you might want to explain your scum read on me considering you're trying to lynch me, unless you don't actually have any reasoning to call your own (which I did suspect, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt).

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Man, you're pretty desperate to figure out what I'm thinking.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

Nich I can tell you now that you're not exactly rallying the troops to your side by trying to act like Ryker's play hasn't been justified.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Sorry, I've been at work for most of the week, with things happening in the before and after.

After reading the entire thread I've come to the stance that Gheb vs. Nich is TvT.

Don't like Raz, he gives off the vibes of trying to seem active, but not entirely doing anything himself. Don't like his random questions that seem to have no purpose.

Ryker is making me sad, I was expecting the same Ryker that I saw back in Super Smash Bros Mafia. The one who was super active and pointed out the entire scum team Day 1. What happened? You claim to have auto-potion, you should be tearing this game up.

Although I seem kinda a parrot, I want to hear more from Nekoback. He's had plenty of things said about him, and he really hasn't responded to much.

 

[Gova]

@Raziek, don't plan on answering until you explain your town reads.

I'm not entirely convinced Nich is scum based on what's going on. My original concern with him was the fact that he agreed with T-Block's accusation of NB faking activity which I didn't think was a valid accusation at that point in time. However, as the day goes on it's apparent that both of their accusations are becoming more valid the longer NB doesn't post.

I had other stuff I wanted to say but I've forgotten it in the course of my project.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX here, to give content (finally).

I had to read the entire game for this, so be thankful.

[Collapse=Notes]Nich's 22 is odd, just because it comes out of nowhere. Nothing "reminded" him about that, so why even post it? Seems fake. -.25

Actually nvm see where he's coming from given the set up. Back to complete null with him.

Lolz at Rajam's 29.

Rajam's 30 is an useless question. -.25

I like nich's catch on onto Xonar. Kinda nitpicks, but I see what he's saying. +.5.

Agree with Ryker's 39 that seph's 23 was rhetical. -.25 for Seph. +.25 for Ryker.

TB is too anatogonistic in his opening post. Feels forced. -.25

Gheb's over focusing on voting mechanics. -.5

Orboknown's posting lacks scumhuntiong as of his 65. -.5

Nich trying to get people to scumhunt as of his 78. +.5.

Not much going on that I can really dig into as of page 3. Mostly just set up analysis.

Kinda like Nich for trying to direct people into commenting on other things in his 97. +.25

Agree with Raz's 106.

Don't like Inferno's 111. Criticizing people about lack of scumhunting without making an attempt to do so himself. feels disingenuous. -.5

@Gova's 113: Do you think that TB was scummy for preemptively calling Nick out for inactivity? Cus you don't really say.

Gheb's first posts from 121-123 don't really do anything for me.

Nich missing Gheb's point in his 126. He didn't say you were wrong, Nich, just that you were being nitpicky.

Gheb opinion on TB? You're calling Nich out for the same thing that TB did, so I want to know what you're thinking about him.

Nich again misses the point in his 133.

Nick's 145 is very . . . . meh. All I can tell from this post is that he could very well go either way on the "newb scum" or "newb town."

Think TB's vote on Raz is unwarranted. Don't know where he's coming from at all with that. -.5.

Both me and my other half believe that we see good intent in Gheb's attack of Nich. So we're fine with him.

Don't like Nich 157. Both a reachy defense and offense. -.5

Agree with Raz's 162 & 163. I find myself agreeing with him a lot. He can get a nice +1 for that.

Inferno your 170 is bleck. Not really scummy but just bad. You mention scum picks but only unvote. If you're fine with someone dying, then vote them.

Nich's 200 is VERY reachy with suggesting that Gheb is using a chainsaw defense on him. Just because in your eyes Gheb is not playing optically doesn't mean that his motive is something entirely different. -.5

Nich vs. Gheb going on longer than it needs to.

I can see things from Glyph's pov in his 205.

@Raz 210: Could you explain to those of us who don't know Nich's meta what it is?

Wow @ Rajam's 230. We're be fine with a policy lynch on him.

Raz vs. TB resolved nicely. My other half might disagree with me here, and if he does then we can talk about and possibly change it, but the fact that TB was actually worried about why Raz was doing what he was doing and then not just drag it on shows me that TB was being genuine there. +1.

Seph you should be backing those works up with a vote bro.
[/Collapse]

So yeah, those are my notes. Note that I don't actually tally points, I just kind of use them to give people a general feeling of how much I like/don't like a certain post.

So basically, to answer Raz's question, our top two town picks right now would be Gheb, Raz, and Ryker, for the reasons you can see in our posts.

Our main scumpick would be Nich (as explained above). Nich started off alright to me, and I could even see town intent in how he was asking people about specific stuff, but then he got into the argument with Gheb and he just started making some hardcore reaches plus wierd defense that I just didn't like. He can lean scum.

My other half didn't like TB and explained to me some legit reasons why (thought he was putting himself into a position where he didn't really have to do anything), but upon observation of recent events (TB's pressure on Raz and how that worked out) I'm questioning that. We're gonna have to talk again about this.

Both of us agree that Rajam is, as of now, policy lynch material. Also I think it's safe to say that Nick needs to speak up as well. Can't really get an accurate read on him until he does.

 

[Gova]

First of all, he wasn't "preemptively" calling Nick out for inactivity. He was straight up calling him out for right there. Secondly, you have no reasons listed as to why Ryker is town.

If I could just get one more person maybe I could call it a pattern.

 

[Gova]

EBWOP: And yes I thought it was scummy.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I already answered Nick in that I don't think the wording was necessarily a scum tell, it just raised a flag with me. It drew my attention. I don't think Inferno is scum for it.

It was important enough for you to point out anyway so that still raises the question what the point of that is supposed to be. If it does raise a red flag to you but doesn't make him scum ... then what is the point?

You say my reasoning is convenient, but what makes it differ from, say, Rykers?

Ryker's stances are harder and more to the point. Your reasoning is eeriely similar to mine when it comes to Nick [and now T-Block too]. You have the same people on the radar as I do and you seem to be pretty indifferent when I call you out on stuff right now. Rather than defending you'd ask counter-questions which means that you're kind of OK with what I'm doing from the very start.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I'm actually OK with what Rajam posted because it provides new info - something that we overlooked earlier. With the threat of a dancer in mylo / lylo I think it would indeed be a good choice for everybody to claim "not dancer" in his posts to make sure mafia can't alpaha strike somebody.

More content would be nice though.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

The Question for toDay: Who out of Nich, Raz and T-Block is / are the scumbag?

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

@Lego
How has Nickel's delay in giving reads affected your read on him?

What are you hoping to accomplish here? I don't need questions when they don't do anything.

I have reason to believe Raziek n Ryker are town. I want to talk with Lego on T-Block, but besides that I stand by my previous post. Nich I'm cool with offing. Same for Rajam.

 

[Nicholas1024]

@Lego
How does that question not mean anything? Your slot was pushing Nickel most recently to give reads, he hasn't done so, I want to know how that's affected your view of him. Also, you never answered (with specifics) on why you think I'm scum, just going "Oh, he's reaching". Quit dodging and answer already.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

How does that question not mean anything? Your slot was pushing Nickel most recently to give reads, he hasn't done so, I want to know how that's affected your view of him.

...He hasn't done ANYTHING.
You're hinting that he wants to discuss with his scummate, aren't you? Don't you think he would have done that by now already?

Also, you never answered (with specifics) on why you think I'm scum, just going "Oh, he's reaching". Quit dodging and answer already.

I'll refrain from going into this, because I'm at a tourney. I'll answer properly as soon as I can. Blaming me of dodging is, however, just straight out dumb. Do you even know how a hydra works?

Seriously it's bad posts like this that annoy me.

 

[Inferno3044]

@Inferno
You didn't answer, how was my pressure on Nickel scummy?

It was how you tried to justify your pressure. You pressured Nickel and Gheb got on you for pressuring him. You tried to defend and rationalize it and your response to him just seemed bad. Anyways I would actually prefer Rajam dead than you atm.

I'm actually OK with what Rajam posted because it provides new info - something that we overlooked earlier. With the threat of a dancer in mylo / lylo I think it would indeed be a good choice for everybody to claim "not dancer" in his posts to make sure mafia can't alpaha strike somebody.

More content would be nice though.

THE FOLLOWING PLAYERS DID NOT PICK DANCER:
Red Ryu
Gheb
Rajam
Orbo/Nickelback
Nich
T-Block
Raziek

Vote: Glyph

I'm not a dancer.

Vote: Raziek

Vote is solely to prove that I'm not a dancer.

This issue has already been addressed. That was why I didn't like it. Obviously he hasn't read and playing a game with Rajam in the past, he will be playing catch up all game.

 

[Nicholas1024]

And everyone I've asked to explain their reasoning for voting me (except Gheb) has ignored/refused to answer at least once. Perhaps I should've given you a little more time before pressing, but this is getting really annoying, I can't defend myself against "Oh yeah, he's scummy", and there's not much point to making another long answer to Gheb that you guys probably won't read (I think I made the last post in that anyway, actually). I'm pretty confident that there's one (perhaps more) scum on my wagon, but this game is seriously looking like a repeat of Fire Emblem here.

Anyway, I wasn't hinting at anything wrt Nickel. I wanted to get a read on you via your response, since it would likely illuminate your thought process for me, since you've focused a fair bit on Nickel. But of course nobody's willing to give me the time of day this game, which makes it kind of hard to get meaningful questions answered.

@Evil Eye, Vanderzant, J, anyone else competent
Namesearch this and replace in please. The incompetence levels of this town are rapidly approaching 9000.

 

[Nicholas1024]

It was how you tried to justify your pressure. You pressured Nickel and Gheb got on you for pressuring him. You tried to defend and rationalize it and your response to him just seemed bad. Anyways I would actually prefer Rajam dead than you atm.

What was I supposed to do, ignore Gheb's accusations? I'm not Ryker. What part of my response seemed bad to you?

Considering Rajam's an easy target (and disliked by a good number of people), and half the playerlist wants me dead, would you agree that your pushes this game have been opportunistic?

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Anyway, I wasn't hinting at anything wrt Nickel. I wanted to get a read on you via your response, since it would likely illuminate your thought process for me, since you've focused a fair bit on Nickel.

...wat.

@Evil Eye, Vanderzant, J, anyone else competent
Namesearch this and replace in please. The incompetence levels of this town are rapidly approaching 9000.[/QUOTE]

Easy way out; just die.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Anyway, I wasn't hinting at anything wrt Nickel. I wanted to get a read on you via your response, since it would likely illuminate your thought process for me, since you've focused a fair bit on Nickel.

...wat.

@Evil Eye, Vanderzant, J, anyone else competent
Namesearch this and replace in please. The incompetence levels of this town are rapidly approaching 9000.

Easy way out; just die.

 

[Nicholas1024]

So are you going to actually answer my question, or are you pulling a Ryker on me? If the latter, what does town gain by hiding your thoughts here?

Also, if I were to die, then the incompetence levels would cause an over 9000 joke. And that's just terrible.

 

[DtJ Glyphmoney]

What do you do when those guys replace in and want you dead too Nich?

 

[Nicholas1024]

What do you do when those guys replace in and want you dead too Nich?

If that were to happen, I'd reevaluate the game and see where I went wrong. But let's just say that neither the track records or reasoning of the players questioning me are good enough to make me doubt my stances.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Gheb, read on Lego?

 

[Orboknown]

Again, what's wrong with that?


What annoys me is that Nickel has been entirely silent since. Hoping we get that reads post from him soon.

Like half this game is inactive.

sorry i had work friday and school today.
Glyph:Don't like his "lynch liability player regardless of alignment" idea. I've seen it before in other games i have read, but personally think it scummy.
T-Block:Not sure really. Called me out on faking activity for saying "I want to be active." Don't get that..slight scum lean i guess.
RR-Questioned ryker..and thats it IIRC? since xonar said no nulls, slight town lean.
Rykeralled out Nich, then refused to answer questions. But that is just ryker, so town lean.
Legolas:accepted rajam's :gift", then voted rajam. scumlean.
Gheb:Called out nich for attacking me, called out Raz on buddying him. Townish.
Raziek:the dancer thing, agreed with Gheb i think WRT me, townish.
Nich:Tunneling me for three posts or something like that, the gheb and raziek interactions. Scummy leaning i guess but veryy slight.
Gova:Questioned nich's methods, town lean.
Sephiroth's masamune:barely anything to go off of. no read.Yet.
Rajam: RVS vote omni who is not in the game, perpetual catching up, and the gift. Town for now i guess.
Inferno:Called out the set up talk, wants people to post. Town for now.

...He hasn't done ANYTHING.
You're hinting that he wants to discuss with his scummate, aren't you? Don't you think he would have done that by now already?
.

Yea, sorry for the two+inactive days ya guys.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

so gheb, you think nich's pressure on nickel is making it so that nickel is less likely to give actual content. do you buy into the fear that things nickel says under pressure can be misconstrued by scum? if so, and we are capable enough to be aware that such pressure might lead to false evidence, why can't we simply rely on us being able to notice when such miscontruing is attempted? doesn't this help us catch scum in itself? seems like a pretty empty fear to me.

Wow, you sound like a ****ing politician. Let's analyze what you've said and what you're trying to accomplish with this paragraph.

You act like the only thing Nickel-town can possibly say under pressure is iffy things that can be misconstrued to make him look like scum. The thing is, saying things in that grey area and having it manipulated isn't something as easily spotted as you're making it out to be. It could easily be a townie making a mistake and scum can and will play off that. Outside of that, Nickel-town is just as likely to **** up and say something outright scummy. I have little faith in him and pressuring him like you and Nich is a great way to pull out a slip from a townie. There was nothing in the game at that point to suggest that Nickel needed that pressure to be read. For all you knew, you'd get the info you needed (especially if you knew anything about his newbie game) without NEEDING to pressure the slot.

No, the goal of this post is two-fold. One, to reduce the pressure on Nich (and by extension yourself as you're sitting right next to him) by validating his actions with this half-***** logic without actually defending him. And two, to strengthen your own slipping position in the hierarchy of this game as you've set yourself up opposite to Gheb who most players like in this game.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Rykeralled out Nich, then refused to answer questions. But that is just ryker, so town lean.
Legolas:accepted rajam's :gift", then voted rajam. scumlean.

So, accepting the gift I assume you consider scummy.

Ryker said he wanted to accept it but I was faster than him. What does that say?

Why is what I did scummy, is a better question.

I wanna talk about Orbo with myself, but it looks like I'll be saying a definite town. I'm feeling half brain-dead though. Might have that fixed tomorrow, depending on when my brain decides to come back to me.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

No, the goal of this post is two-fold. One, to reduce the pressure on Nich (and by extension yourself as you're sitting right next to him) by validating his actions with this half-***** logic without actually defending him. And two, to strengthen your own slipping position in the hierarchy of this game as you've set yourself up opposite to Gheb who most players like in this game.

Skimmed post, read this. This part agrees 100%, and reached similar conclusions. Want to talk this over with other half, because T-Block caused some contradiction between us.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Between me?

 

[Orboknown]

So, accepting the gift I assume you consider scummy.

Ryker said he wanted to accept it but I was faster than him. What does that say?

Why is what I did scummy, is a better question.

I wanna talk about Orbo with myself, but it looks like I'll be saying a definite town. I'm feeling half brain-dead though. Might have that fixed tomorrow, depending on when my brain decides to come back to me.

Not the accepting of the gift, but voting rajam in the same post you accepted it, after getting a guarantee he wouldn't vote you toDay.

 

[(:xXx11!1!LegOLAAAzz!!11XxX:)]

Alright. Now why is that scummy? What was the profit a scum would have? What was the intent a scum would have?

It's simply RVS, so taking it too serious isn't always fruitful. That's my explanation. Rajam is one of the best policy lynches on dGames at that, so why not start out with pressuring somewhere where it can be put to use?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Eh, I'm used to people just not understanding what I have to say. It took forever for them to figure out my arguments vs Nabe in Time Travelers...

Anyway, more to the point, here's a basic summary of me/Gheb/nickel interactions to this point.

Nickel makes a few odd posts that don't do any content and seem like posting for the sake of posting.

T-block and I call him out on it, and start up a wagon to see what a little pressure does.

Nickel basically apologizes for his lack of content and does a bit of setup speculation, but still doesn't produce any scumhunting.

I keep pushing.

Gheb says that Nickel's obviously new and that I'm scaring him, so I should stop the pressure because he's reacting badly to it.

I explain to him that that's horrible reasoning, and keep pushing.

Gheb says he dislikes my tunneling (in effect) and votes me for it.

I've had enough, and turn things back around on Gheb with my own mini-case.

Basically, the reason I dislike Gheb is that his defense of Nickel feels fake. How can anyone even pretend that "The pressure is actually PRESSURING him, so you should stop it" is a valid argument?!? Not to mention, his attack on me seems rather odd as well. I'm one of the heaviest tunnelers on this site, so how is it logical to call me scummy for said tunneling? Yeah, I'll admit that it's possible for me-scum to try and imitate said tunneling (and logically, what I would try to do as scum). However that doesn't change the fact that I tunnel as town all the time, so you'd need better evidence as to WHY a particular instance of me tunneling is scummy. (And I play with Gheb a fair bit, so he's definitely aware of my meta.)

@T-block
You weren't in Fire Emblem. I know from experience how dumb arguments can somehow catch on and get out of hand if you let them, so I'm shutting it down before that happens.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5Bw-QufBPk