Eazy vs m2k

[Eazy23]

How do I kill him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEH1CB-dRms

 

[Shaya]

I don't know Eazy. I think spikes and forward smash tippers help.

Is there only one match in the set?

Best I ever did against M2K was around same stock/percent; at least I'm not alone .

 

[Eazy23]

Match 2 was just uploaded.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPbk6dYBkEw

But yea, its so hard 2 kill Jason. It doesn't matter what mks I practice against, if its not him...it doesn't even matter. I bait him but he reacts so safely even when he is being an aggro dumba$$. Then I get scared and DS at predictable times. Thank god there aren't any other mks like this though lol.

 

[Shaya]

Yeah, playing M2K is like nothing else.

Beyond M2K's superiority, you were making a couple of mistakes due to nervousness (I presume). Like the DS', the 'non reactive' smash attacks. He baited you to do commitment fairs so he could tornado you a bit... Even though you didnt let him do that to you for that long.

If you haven't practiced grab release to dolphin slash you should brush up; 130~ ish and a fresh DS and you have a kill...
Not many other guaranteed ways for us to kill -great spacing MKs- then.

Yeah I watched the second match too; M2K just never lets you get away with a mistake. He seems to always be thinking ahead of you, and at most times it feels like you could have just avoided it if you weren't under so much pressure. Like you getting edgehogged for the plank

Lylat funnily enough seemed to have a couple of things going in your favour against some MK traits, but ledge jumps on it is... suicide

 

[Dr Peepee]

Really? I took him to the last stock, fairly high percent(85ish) on FD(by getting a footstool spike on him at 50% first stock and a tipper Fsmash out of his glide around 100% on his second stock) in tournament at HERB 2.

I pretty much knew I wasn't going to win when I played him, so I was able to keep M2K's skill from intimidating me. That allowed me to play my best vs him. I just never did the same thing twice so he couldn't predict me. Granted, he still beat the crap out of me when he did get in.

I guess the best advice I have is to play him like a regular guy and play as unpredictably as possible.

 

[clowsui]

this catfish...just too good

he's moving to ohio, maybe i won't get destroyed? we'll see...

you did the best you could, eazy : /

 

[feardragon64]

Just a tip easy, when you're playing someone who you know is skilled, don't go for the grab release if they're going to land on a platform from it. People who know what they're doing will just shield so you can't do anything(even if you use shield knockback to hit them off, mk can nair you to punish as soon as he falls off if they have decent reaction time or see it coming).

Anyways, that's just my two cents. But good stuff.

 

[Eazy23]

I don't really get too nervous when playing jason, but this was probably the first time I was upset about the loss. I felt as thought I outplayed him at certain points, but couldn't keep momentum. Not being able to kill him in a timely fashion was very upsetting as well.

Shaya, I'm good at grab release ds, but I rarely if at all got any grabs on jason within that kill percentage, and if I did I don't recall it being possible do to the tilting of the stage u know?

jason wrecks you for the little things. While I am soooo busy trying to make sure I stay away from this and that, I get destroyed 2nd stock of r1 by jumping immediately offstage after a clash. The little things like that are such momentum killers and in this matchup....that can end it all.

Dr. peepee, thanks for the advice. I mean, we all know jason is better than us so getting overly intimidated should be a thing of the past by now. One of my main problems with him was his tornadoing. He nados if you ever try to follow up an attack. He nados directly out of neutral standpoint. Man he just nados, and even being hit with the very last part of the nado stole my advantage quite a few times in the set. We have to play so perfect vs this character!

 

[Dr Peepee]

Yeah, I agree with the tornado thing. That was probably the reason I couldn't really juggle him much or finish any strings.

I'm not entirely sure how to get around it(consistently), but I'll start thinking and see if I can get back to you on that.

 

[Shaya]

I was going to mention Tornado, but I brought it up in the MBR recently without any area of discussion other than minor from Pierce and steel trolling...

Tornado is a huge ***** for Marth to handle.

 

[Eazy23]

When a mk is as good at nadoing as m2k is the match literally becomes like a mk ditto. hit and run hit and run. You are forced into your sheild so many times, and you can't apply the pressure that makes us think this match is even close to possible lol. Knowing that mk can nado everytime you hit him really limits your options. If you are losing, and the mk nados like jason....I just can't see what you can do.

I guess we all have to walk back n forth like Mikehaze and wait until the mk magically appears in our hands rofl!

 

[Emblem Lord]

I watched the matches Eazy. You straight up outplayed him a good chunk of the time.

And you lost.

Yup.

 

[Mr-R]

and I thought I did allot up b XD

 

[B.A.M.]

Quick question, in match 1 when u grabbed by the ledge, why didnt you go for the grab-release> dair? Ive only seen a few marths utilize it, and it seems to be quite effective when the chance arises. I think that might help. Also there were some mistakes made simply due to the fact that it is M2K. you have to try to take that out of the picture so you can properly read him. Im sure we all know this, but brawl requires tons of multiple reads due to lack of hitstun. Due to that fact you have to attempt to be in a solid mentally for the entire match. with grab-release >up-b or simply up-B OoS, you do have kill options. I believe the only sound advice i can give is try to condition him more. Yes I know its MK so you usually play by his rules but even the best can be conditioned to respond a certain way. Marth dominates in being reactive, but playing in only one manner will inevitably net you a loss.

 

[Palpi]

Isn't it frame perfect or close to frame perfect. Mew2king always u-airs from the air release off stage.

 

[**Havok**]

When you play jason always remember he takes the safe road.

Easy, i don't particularly think you outplayed him at all, you got nervous through his pressure and up-B randomly, side-B'ed into his shield and so forth. He just sat in his shield most of the game, if you notice during your match, you would just grab him when he gets close, those were the only real times when you were able to take somewhat control of the match. He just baited YOUR reactions into his shield =(

When jason was on platforms again, he sits in shield, waits, then he up-B's OoS. Safe.

Too much random shenanigans, you countered once, you up-B'ed a few times. You can't do those things vs a player like jason, you gotta play safe too. Well as safe as marth can play.

 

[Shaya]

I watched the matches Eazy. You straight up outplayed him a good chunk of the time.

And you lost.

Yup.

I really don't think you can really say Easy outplayed him a good chunk of the time.
It definitely isn't that simple...

There were points that Eazy did -good things-, but M2K was never overly pressured to force him into mistakes. M2K ***** at moments when Eazy made noticable mistakes.

yeah... I can't conceive what you're saying EL

 

[∫unk]

I think EL is pointing to the sections where ez outdamaged m2k

 

[Emblem Lord]

^^ That.

This isn't melee where a simple mistake means huge damage. In Brawl if you have less damage then your opponent consistently that means you are outplaying your opponent, your opponent is making several mistakes or it's both.

Marth and MK aren't Snake. They don't get MASSIVE damage off two hits. They gotta work a bit harder for it. So For MK to have more damage in the first minute or so shows me that Jason wasn't doing so hot.

Also I see several points where Eazy covered himself extremely well and MK got out..because well..you know. And I also see points where Jason could have done something better...but he didn't and he got away with it.

I love it.

Also you can say play safe vs MK, but if Marth plays safe how does he get damage in?

Seriously.

When you are fighting an uphill battle the reason it's uphill is because you have no safe **** to rely on.

So..if Marth takes no risk..and MK takes no risk...who wins?

This is what it means to be at a disadvantage.

Come on now Marth boards...REALLY?!?!?!

*shakes my head

Shaya: Marth can't force MK to do anything..so I dunno what you are trying to say.

Once again

*shakes my head

 

[Pierce7d]

Haha, well, if it comforts you any, that's not how I play the MU EL.

Although, against M2k, I've just been studying his personal style to win. I acknowledge that beating his level of MK with Marth is probably impossible, so instead of trying to fight his character, I'll fight his habits now. I've memorize what he'll do in roughly 40% of all situations, and have a better than average idea of what he'll likely do next, and not everything is always universally safe. When fighting a player this good, instead of doing something that's smart to do against MK, I'll just do what the player fails to.

Course, Jason's a personal friend of mine, and I'm not about to blurt out all of his habits on the boards, so instead I'll just give you tips on the MU.

When he's on a platform, to prevent getting counter-attacked, you can use jabs and tilts to platform pressure.

Well timed pivot utilt hits spot dodges and roll dodges. Many players like to either run up and shield, or shield when you approach. Running past them and Usmashing as a cross up sometimes works if you're fishing for a kill. It's especially useful at semi close range, because a player is more likely to spot dodge, and you'll be able to charge your Usmash on reaction if they spot dodge anticipating a grab.

Add retreating pivot grabs to your wall. It ***** all of MK's grounded approaches except walking and tilting.

On Lylat, remember that you can platform cancel to increase your movement capabilities.

Be careful about understage pressure, because both Tornado and SL OOS can stage spike you if you attempt to Uair MK from underneath the stage. You were quick about your pokes though.

EL, I've noticed m2k always starts the match off losing. He actually performs very poorly in neutral situations, he's just excellent at following up because his opponent's options are more limited, and he covers a lot of options while reading very well. As you've all noticed, he breaks follow ups with Tornado. If trying to decide whether or not to continue a string, or reset to neutral, go for the latter.

Follow up attacks with shield breaker for 2-3 hit strings. It goes through Tornado.

Don't use UpB except to kill or recover.

 

[Emblem Lord]

You are correct. Jason has ALWAYS been horrid in neutral situations. He is pretty bad at taking control.

He is just good at keeping momentum once he has it.

 

[exdia_16]

i like the way you set up your bairs and fairs you spaced alot and to play or last that long is true skill i envy you marth one day maybe mine can be as good as yoursl

 

[Albert.]

Well timed pivot utilt hits spot dodges and roll dodges.

DIDNT I JUST say that like yesterday Junk?

vindication!

UTilt <3

 

[Pierce7d]

DIDNT I JUST say that like yesterday Junk?

vindication!

UTilt <3

Don't be confused. The timing for hitting a spot dodge is not the same as that for hitting a roll dodge. However, the hitbox at the back is active for a particularly long time by Marth's standards, so you can use it to punish dodges, and of course, it hits behind you as well. It also has exceptional kill power. Don't listen to Steel's foolishness about it being a bad move, he probably just doesn't like it because Shaya appreciates it <3

 

[Albert.]

Don't be confused. The timing for hitting a spot dodge is not the same as that for hitting a roll dodge. However, the hitbox at the back is active for a particularly long time by Marth's standards, so you can use it to punish dodges, and of course, it hits behind you as well. It also has exceptional kill power. Don't listen to Steel's foolishness about it being a bad move, he probably just doesn't like it because Shaya appreciates it <3

I wasn't confused lol Obviously the timing is different.

I only commented on you saying it because I made this post the other day which junk dismissed lol

(also, it combos from falling uAir, can hit people out of airdodges, use the back to hit character's rolls or reverse it to hit people out of spotdodge, using the back of it again. when you're falling and you can predict a safe landing you can air-dodge into attacking with it, not very safe but whatever... )

^^^ my only productive post I've ever made forgive me for being proud of it.

I'm glad that someone who's actually good backed up what I said... not that what I said was all that useful lol

 

[Pierce7d]

I wasn't confused lol Obviously the timing is different.

I only commented on you saying it because I made this post the other day which junk dismissed lol



^^^ my only productive post I've ever made forgive me for being proud of it.

I'm glad that someone who's actually good backed up what I said... not that what I said was all that useful lol

Yeah, I figured you knew, I just didn't want anyone to come in here and be like "WHHAAHHAT!!??!? Utilt covers that many options at once? wtfomg!!!!!!!!!!!!1one!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!onehundredelevel!!!!!!!1!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!1111!!!!!!!!!!"

 

[Albert.]

Yeah, I figured you knew, I just didn't want anyone to come in here and be like "WHHAAHHAT!!??!? Utilt covers that many options at once? wtfomg!!!!!!!!!!!!1one!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!onehundredelevel!!!!!!!1!!!!!!1!!!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!1111!!!!!!!!!!"

so I have come to the conclusion that we are safe in assuming that Pierce is uppppp there at the moment.

have fun

 

[Pierce7d]

so I have come to the conclusion that we are safe in assuming that Pierce is uppppp there at the moment.

have fun

Chill, I detest drugs, I just always wanted to do that. Anyway, I'm dragging this off topic.

 

[LanceStern]

I have trouble watching them with dial up. How does he compare to MikeHaze's matches against M2k?

 

[∫unk]

pierce is saying u-tilt with marth is like the super ghetto version of n-air with mk

 

[feardragon64]

I have trouble watching them with dial up. How does he compare to MikeHaze's matches against M2k?

Apparently the most important games for Marth vs M2K that has ever occurred now? lol....

 

[Shaya]

pierce is saying u-tilt with marth is like the super ghetto version of n-air with mk

WHA?

Hell no.

But my GOD utilt would be **** if we could do it out of a foxtrot.

 

[C.box]

WHA?

Hell no.

But my GOD utilt would be **** if we could do it out of a foxtrot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4tmLsflA_c

You can do it out of a foxtrot.

 

[Shaya]

Tech Skill?

Hell no.

 

[BacklashMarth]

HazeWalk utilt > foxtrot utilt

 

[Eazy23]

and I thought I did allot up b XD

I am honestly so accustomed to mks dashing in or attacking at certain times that I thought Jason would do the same. I don't mean the basic mk reactions, of course he isn't going to play that predictably. But my dsing patterns, atleast at certain points are more thought out than they seemed.

 

[Pierce7d]

I am honestly so accustomed to mks dashing in or attacking at certain times that I thought Jason would do the same. I don't mean the basic mk reactions, of course he isn't going to play that predictably. But my dsing patterns, atleast at certain points are more thought out than they seemed.

Try more pivot grabbing instead.