Q&A Doc General Discussion: Ask and ye shall receive ft. otg and Shroomed!

[Dogysamich]

Sarcasm Answer: A vast majority of the time, seeing as most people refuse to learn how to "edgeguard".

Real answer: There's like little to no hope on most stages, Mute City should be frickin automatic once he gets off the stage. So yeah, if you can actually edgeguard a doc, MC actually makes for a good CP.

 

[unknown522]

As far as the Jiggs and Peach thing goes, I usually ban those stages when going against them, especially with Doc. I can deal with Dreamland 64, but Mute City is just a joke. I'm not familiar with this new tourney rule-set though so maybe some things have changed (like Mute City being auto-banned, which would make life a lot easier.)

Oh man. DL64 and KJ64 vs jiggs are the biggest pains in the *** ever. Brinstar is annoying, but manageable.

Also, doc can fight sheik on mute city, which is nice but I'd never pick that level.

 

[SmashMac]

Oh man. DL64 and KJ64 vs jiggs are the biggest pains in the *** ever. Brinstar is annoying, but manageable.

Also, doc can fight sheik on mute city, which is nice but I'd never pick that level.

Yeah man. Those stages are ********. They're horrible vs. Peach too. I had to fight Dop in tourney a few times and would auto-ban Mute City, and he would pick KJ64 against me as a counter-pick. Was a terrible experience.

 

[Dogysamich]

I swear it's cause of how you guys play.

Cause i'd rather fight a puff/peach/samus on DL64 than I would on Yoshi's.

Not saying you guys are wrong by any strech (i know i'm the one who's wrong if somebody has to be wrong), but that's just how i operate.

__

But that's not why I posted here.

PLAYED SOME MELEE, WITH PEOPLE, IN MY CITY TODAY. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAND it was a bunch of ffas. :|

 

[unknown522]

player preference. Nobody is wrong. I like FoD vs a lot of characters as fox, though it's supposed to be bad for him apparently (like vs sheik). I prefer smaller stages most of the time, so that I don't have to chase my opponent as much (I've come to accept that I will always have to chase my opponents, or camp them back, unless it's Raynex and he's ahead in the set).

 

[SmashMac]

Actually FoD isn't half bad for Doc. honestly. The roof on the stage is nice too for Fox's usmash below 95% or so damage (being usmashed below 95%). You don't die if you can DI properly, also the stage seems to be as confined as Yoshi's Story but in reality it's not. Fact of the matter is you can actually recover most of the time when you/your opponent wouldn't expect you to be able to do so.

As far as DL64 goes, Dogy I don't know about you but there's no way I'd rather fight a Peach/Jiggs/Samus on that stage instead of Yoshi's. Granted the stage gives me a better chance at recovery, but in reality ... their recoveries are already ridiculous as is, let alone on a stage where they can survive literally twice as long as they should with the proper DIing. At least on Yoshi's when you've faird/fsmashed (even usmash on the Jiggs/Peach) one of them at 100% you know they're going to most likely die. I guess what it all boils down to though is personal preference like unknown522 said.

 

[Dogysamich]

It's cause I have a willingness to step the f*** back, move out, and use the fact that I have the lead so somebody has to approach me.

The thing that's heavily frowned upon in this game for whatever reason.

None of those characters can catch you, so if you're willing to move and work your way back to the middle, it beats getting gimped.

Look at it like this. Sure you can kill jiggs at like, 60% on YS, but if jiggs gets you off the stage, you have the same chance to die on YS as you do on DL64. So if nothing else, Jiggs has to do MORE work to kill you on DL than on YS. If you wanna stay jacked up on jiggs or peach or samus all day, make it work. I'd rather play to their disadvantage. >.>

 

[SmashMac]

It's cause I have a willingness to step the f*** back, move out, and use the fact that I have the lead so somebody has to approach me.

The thing that's heavily frowned upon in this game for whatever reason.

None of those characters can catch you, so if you're willing to move and work your way back to the middle, it beats getting gimped.

Look at it like this. Sure you can kill jiggs at like, 60% on YS, but if jiggs gets you off the stage, you have the same chance to die on YS as you do on DL64. So if nothing else, Jiggs has to do MORE work to kill you on DL than on YS. If you wanna stay jacked up on jiggs or peach or samus all day, make it work. I'd rather play to their disadvantage. >.>

Yeah good point on the lead thing. I agree if you have a 1 stock+ lead there's no reason to approach the opponent really unless you're confident in killing them. Really they should be approaching you since they're not in a camping position.

I guess the process of camping would be worth it in these match-ups since like you said you can just out-run those opponent's character. Man, the thing that gets on my nerves with Jiggs/Peach/Samus on DL64 is you can't kill them sideways, it has to be upward to be efficient. Doc's only way to really do that is fair them. Problem is, everyone sees that coming, so it's twice as hard to mind-game that in. It's really just personal preference as far as the recovery thing goes. Either you take the fact that you're increasing both you and your opponent's characters recovery with DL64 ... or, you take the fact that you're increasing both you and your opponent's chances of dieing quicker with Yoshi's.

 

[Dogysamich]

wait wtf! You're not supposed to agree with me!


jk.

 

[idea]

Actually FoD isn't half bad for Doc. honestly. The roof on the stage is nice too for Fox's usmash below 95% or so damage (being usmashed below 95%). You don't die if you can DI properly, also the stage seems to be as confined as Yoshi's Story but in reality it's not. Fact of the matter is you can actually recover most of the time when you/your opponent wouldn't expect you to be able to do so.

As far as DL64 goes, Dogy I don't know about you but there's no way I'd rather fight a Peach/Jiggs/Samus on that stage instead of Yoshi's. Granted the stage gives me a better chance at recovery, but in reality ... their recoveries are already ridiculous as is, let alone on a stage where they can survive literally twice as long as they should with the proper DIing. At least on Yoshi's when you've faird/fsmashed (even usmash on the Jiggs/Peach) one of them at 100% you know they're going to most likely die. I guess what it all boils down to though is personal preference like unknown522 said.

I'd only want yoshi's or FoD vs fox as Doc (FD will inevitably be gone). You don't have to chase them as much and the level may screw fox over as well, in many ways.

Also, there's no point in using DL64, for recovery purposes, since doc's recovery sucks no matter where you go to.

- Unknown522

 

[ranmaru]

My favorite stages: Pokemon stadium and FD. I don't like FoD at all. Maybe it could mess up a falcon but, I'd mess up as well. I don't want that risk.

 

[Dogysamich]

-is currently watching "The Return of Bob$'s doc-

 

[ranmaru]

-Is trying to get good at ITG... but meh- I was gonna go to a smashfest but meh.

 

[otg]

-is currently watching "The Return of Bob$'s doc-

Loooking mad good, I hope he picks him up again fulltime. Darkatma is no joke.

 

[VGmasta]

-is currently watching "The Return of Bob$'s doc-

I vote that Bob$ should re-convert as a Doc main.

 

[Dogysamich]

Loooking mad good, I hope he picks him up again fulltime. Darkatma is no joke.

I mean, I'ma get slapped in the face and called out like a maaf***er, but you do realize that man got hit with the Doc Statue of Liberty play, right?

like... im not even sayin that to put him down, i'm actually just kinda salty that he got hit with that.

 

[JPOBS]

they're currently discussing doc in the matchup thread in general discussion. get in there Dogy.

 

[Dogysamich]

why? I've talked about that so many times and people who dont even play doc or really have a clue how to deal with a doc want to tell me how MY matchups are?

Makes no sense.

edit:
*points out in the doc forum*
There's a whole matchup guide for anybody who actually wants my opinion. I know how the whole "public press conference" thing goes 'round here.

 

[ranmaru]

Wait what is the statue of liberty doc thing...

 

[Lixivium]

Loooking mad good, I hope he picks him up again fulltime. Darkatma is no joke.

Darkatma is a totally decent player (he could almost beat Tink/Kels), he's just really bad against Doctor Mario.

 

[otg]

why? I've talked about that so many times and people who dont even play doc or really have a clue how to deal with a doc want to tell me how MY matchups are?

Makes no sense.

I agree, I'm probably sitting this one out.

 

[Shroomed]

doc sucks

everyone should jus play good chars

 

[VGmasta]

Wait what is the statue of liberty doc thing...

Lol, must be that tornado Bob$ landed because Darkatma failed to ledge roll in time.

doc sucks

everyone should jus play good chars

Don't worry, I've come to this realization and I only play Doc because he's a fun character and I just wanna show off his potential.

 

[Dogysamich]

Wait what is the statue of liberty doc thing...

edit: wait, forgot there's commentary
I'd be better off just linking to the match instead of dealing with higher ups complaining about "Non-PG-esque stuff being shown directly on the forum."

Watch. You'll know what it is when you see it, and you'll be like "... daaaaamn, I wish I could get people to fall for that."

Lol, must be that tornado Bob$ landed because Darkatma failed to ledge roll in time.

Rolling it is almost as bad as getting hit.

There's literally enough time for you to stand up (if your <100%) and jump back on the ledge before he can even move.

Darkatma is a totally decent player (he could almost beat Tink/Kels), he's just really bad against Doctor Mario.

he's not that bad against doc. And I know he's not bad at all. I'm just jankin on the man for taking a risk against an unknown unknown. That's what happen's in these parts.

He didnt know that he didnt have to take that risk.

doc sucks

everyone should jus play good chars

Don't worry, I've come to this realization and I only play Doc because he's a fun character and I just wanna show off his potential.

I think shroomed already realizes this, but eventually people will start realizing that melee is nowhere near as uber as they make it out to be, and they'll start liking the game more.

 

[Lixivium]

he's not that bad against doc. And I know he's not bad at all. I'm just jankin on the man for taking a risk against an unknown unknown. That's what happen's in these parts.

He didnt know that he didnt have to take that risk.

LOL he should have known

I've hit Darkatma with the Doc tornado plenty of times, including one time I killed his Fox at 0% with it.

He should have played Peach; his Sheik got edgeguarded way too easily.

 

[Dogysamich]

why? I've talked about that so many times and people who dont even play doc or really have a clue how to deal with a doc want to tell me how MY matchups are?

Makes no sense.

edit:
*points out in the doc forum*
There's a whole matchup guide for anybody who actually wants my opinion. I know how the whole "public press conference" thing goes 'round here.

I agree, I'm probably sitting this one out.

Click it if you need to see it ANY BIGGER THAN THAT. o_o

 

[#HBC | Mac]

lmao i was def about to call him out on that one too

edit: nvm lawl

 

[otg]

You know what Dogy. **** you. I'm kinda just trollin there and not really actually discussing anything of any value in all fairness.

But still, **** you.

SHOULDN'T YOU BE AT WORK OR SOMETHING?

 

[Dogysamich]

TROOOOOOOOLLIN.

And no that's not smash blue, it's Brawl skin, a.k.a. Mod skin.

GET AT ADLESS SWF, SIR.

 

[otg]

I didn't realize you were in the MBR Dogy, I hear it's terrible.

 

[Dogysamich]

No comment. (more like aim me 'bout it)

 

[otg]

I'll hit you up about it when I get home from work, tho I doubt you'll tell me anything I don't already know from the people I know in it. And goddammit, I've officially been suckered into that matchup chart.

 

[Dogysamich]

OTG IT'S NOT TOO LATE. YOU DONT GOTTA FIGHT, JUST WALK AWAY LIKE THE BIGGER MAN!!

I GOT FAITH IN YOOOOOOOOOU! o_o

 

[otg]

OTG IT'S NOT TOO LATE. YOU DONT GOTTA FIGHT, JUST WALK AWAY LIKE THE BIGGER MAN!!

I GOT FAITH IN YOOOOOOOOOU! o_o

It's actually kinda interesting tho, Magus is posting things I didn't know as usual and it turns out there are even more things that are different between Mario and Doc that I was unaware of. Too good.

 

[Dogysamich]

ah man. I wanted to go lol 'round some melee discussion threads, but they're all like, wack.

And then i look in that matchup thread? Oof.

lol @ you guys saying it's impossible to CG spanimals from 0%. That's the road down 18s street where CGing is a waste of time cause "nobody ever does it right."

 

[#HBC | Mac]

you know you wanna post there dogy

 

[Dogysamich]

20 more matches till list 2 is filled.

And lol, no, i dont feel like arguing with people who dont play my character and want to tell me how my matchups are based off of them playing their lil brother.

Talking matchups in this community makes no **** sense.

 

[VGmasta]

Talking matchups in this community makes no **** sense.

I suppose. I'll just leave it to "the best Doc" to talk about all the freakin' matchups from now on. I get verbally attacked for wanting insights on matchups in that stupid thread anyways.

 

[otg]

I suppose. I'll just leave it to "the best Doc" to talk about all the freakin' matchups from now on. I get verbally attacked for wanting insights on matchups in that stupid thread anyways.

Nah, I'm done with that thread. Just chill ricky, you're taking that **** way too seriously. In no way did I verbally attack you. Just chill urself.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

ah man. I wanted to go lol 'round some melee discussion threads, but they're all like, wack.

And then i look in that matchup thread? Oof.

lol @ you guys saying it's impossible to CG spanimals from 0%. That's the road down 18s street where CGing is a waste of time cause "nobody ever does it right."

*sigh.*

I still can't believe people are saying Puff is the best character in the ****ing game. It's like, I may be the scrubbiest ****ing Sheik on the boards but even I can see that people just need to not be ******** in the match-up. Everybody expects to just rush in on Jiggs and get results straightaway. It doesn't work like that. You have to play gay, and what I mean by playing gay is you camp the piss out of her and bait.

>_>

Smooth Criminal