Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Momotsuki]

Like - okay. If there's anybody that glitch was pointing to, yeah I'd say it would be Reimu. But I highly doubt glitches are pointing to any fighters.
It's one thing that there may be glitches pertaining to upcoming content - but the idea that said glitches would keep manifesting in the behavior of existing fighters seems... cherry-picky? Give me any glitch, and give me a DLC fighter that released after said glitch was found. If I tried hard enough, I could "connect the dots."

 

[chocolatejr9]

Yeah but what else we gonna discuss until June?

If you're willing to wait until March 26, I can tell you all about Balan Wonderworld.

What, there's some other game coming out that day? Well, if I forgot about it, then it probably wasn't important.

 

[Shroob]

If you're willing to wait until March 26, I can tell you all about Balan Wonderworld.

What, there's some other game coming out that day? Well, if I forgot about it, then it probably wasn't important.

Well ya see.

That game ain't gonna be playable thanks to the last presentation.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Like - okay. If there's anybody that glitch was pointing to, yeah I'd say it would be Reimu. But I highly doubt glitches are pointing to any fighters.
It's one thing that there may be glitches pertaining to upcoming content - but the idea that said glitches would keep manifesting in the behavior of existing fighters seems... cherry-picky?

To be fair, there was a Ness glitch where his eyes vanished, before Steve was announced. In Steve’s presentation he said the flint behaved like Ness’s PK Fire so I can see some merit to that

and there was a SUPPOSED Marth glitch where his cape vanished, that MAY have been related to Sephiroth’s one wing form, but this is the first I’ve heard of it

 

[KillerCage]

Well

If the Glitch does imply Reimu is in, there are some statements/Questions I have

-Vergeben Deconfirm theory would not be real, since Reimu was on the list

-What would Reimu's DLC Tournament be? A Projectile based tourney would have been perfect, but they recently just did that one. Any ideas for what she would have

-A May reveal would seem more likely, if CP10 is getting revealed solo. I don't think they ever have Reimu as a Sole E3/June reveal. Min Min is one thing, but I can't see it just being Reimu as the sole reveal. Yes

-I really hope they balance her correctly. Just from her hypothetical design she's be like Jigglypuff with Projectiles. does not sound fun to fight against if not balanced correctly

Wait. We found a new glitch?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Ah **** here we go again

new bug in 11.0: projectiles sometimes completely ignore specifically head hurtboxes when moving forward (or going from dash to run, im not sure)
i first saw this with byleth's arrow and jigglypuff's head, but it seems to affect any projectile in the game pic.twitter.com/fMVobjX5Sw

— angie🌙 (@firubiii) March 7, 2021

Lucas AND Dark Pit glitches? Hoo boy...

Here’s the “new glitch” in question

 

[Ivander]

To be fair, there was a Ness glitch where his eyes vanished, before Steve was announced. In Steve’s presentation he said the flint behaved like Ness’s PK Fire so I can see some merit to that

and there was a SUPPOSED Marth glitch where his cape vanished, that MAY have been related to Sephiroth’s one wing form, but this is the first I’ve heard of it

Was there a glitch with Ice Climbers before Pyra/Mythra? I thought there was mention of Ice Climbers having a glitch at one point and considering supposedly the smash team tried doing Rex & Pyra/Mythra similarly to Ice Climbers, but it was too much effort so it was scrapped, that could have some merit.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Was there a glitch with Ice Climbers before Pyra/Mythra? I thought there was mention of Ice Climbers having a glitch at one point and considering supposedly the smash team tried doing Rex & Pyra/Mythra similarly to Ice Climbers, but it was too much effort so it was scrapped, that could have some merit.

ANOTHER one??? How do I not know about these???

oh wait no I remember this

was this the one with Terry and it crashed the game? Yeah that’s nothing. It’s the visual glitches that count

 

[Ivander]

ANOTHER one??? How do I not know about these???

I don't know. Like around when Pyra & Mythra was announced, there was someone who gave a list of characters who were glitched, like Daisy, around before certain fighters were released and I thought they mentioned Ice Climbers had a glitch at one point.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Say it with me, bros.

Glitches don't point to specific characters. There have been examples of this in the past and they haven't ever lead to actual confirmation of a fighter.

I get the feeling this is largely for the sake of discussion, but there's nothing that suggests any particular glitch will hint at a future fighter and even if it did there's no actual way to narrow down who the fighter would be besides assumptions.

 

[MBRedboy31]

To be fair, there was a Ness glitch where his eyes vanished, before Steve was announced. In Steve’s presentation he said the flint behaved like Ness’s PK Fire so I can see some merit to that

and there was a SUPPOSED Marth glitch where his cape vanished, that MAY have been related to Sephiroth’s one wing form, but this is the first I’ve heard of it

If we assume that the the Ness eye glitch related to Steve, wouldn’t it have more to do with Steve‘s and Alex’s very minimal eye blinking animation? I guess they’d have based Steve off of Ness, which caused Ness to somehow inherit part of the blinking animation? IDK, I kind of get this angle, but it also feels like it contains a whole lot of assumptions...

 

[Ivander]

I think I found the posts that first mentioned the Ice Climbers deal.

Does anyone remember that ice climbers, bayonetta, duck hunt and link had problems in the game long ago? All these issues are similar to the dlc characters. banjo =duck hunt , link = Hero, ice climbers = Mithra/Pyra, etc. I cant remeber all the characters.

I thought it was Mii Swordfighter instead of Link for Hero.

Lets see.... The Glitches/Bases for Each Character

= (Due to certain moves still being in the files that matched Bowser Jr)
= ??? (Honestly do not remember, but it wouldnt surprise me if it was Sheik)
= (It might have been Link, but I remember there was a Glitch with both Mii Swords and Duck Hunt around that time.
= (Seems Self Explanatory)
= (I dont remember the specifics, but they make they make the most sense)
= (There were things about their Whips Glitching which lined up with Byleths moves)
= (With her Summoning being Glitched, thats what got people with her.)
= (Not as confident, but she had some glitches, and since the Turnip can line up with the mining, it adds up)
= ??? (I dont remember for sure, but I seem to remember something with Marth?)
And According to you Pyra and Mythra had a glitch with the Ice Climbers.

Now I just need to find out what the actual glitch for Ice Climbers was.

Edit: I think I have found the actual glitch in question.

It was a glitch that happened around when Terry was first released and it was one that got fixed very quickly, as it was much less a visual glitch compared to the others and more an actual gameplay glitch.

2nd Edit: Heh, somebody else actually talked about this possibility on the Geno thread long ago.

With that argument, Rex and Pyra are getting in, because of the glitch between Terry and Ice Climbers.

3rd edit: How long was this Glitch theory being discussed? Because apparently, someone talked about this possible theory around January 2020.

Ok, so seeing as our hopes for Geno as FP5 are ever so slightly raised at the moment, I thought I'd share something interesting from many months ago.
So, y'all remember how Piranha Plant, Mii Sword Fighter and Duck Hunt were having weird glitches a few months ago? Well, we all know now that it was because they were being used as bases for the upcoming Joker, Hero, and Banjo.
So, thing is, I remember hearing from somewhere around the same time that Mewtwo and Mii Gunner were having the same glitches happening to them as well. This could possibly mean Mewtwo was a base for Terry and Mii Gunner was FP5 (maybe Geno).
Now, I know what you're probably thinking "But Wooooomy, Terry doesn't make sense to have Mewtwo as a base. Wouldn't Ken make a lot more sense" And you're definitely right in that regard but keep in mind, Piranha Plant was used as a base for Joker and someone like Marth or Robin or literally anyone more humanoid would've made more sense but they went with Piranha Plant. They still do have some similarities (like how Mewtwo's attacks all have a purple psychic effect while Terry's all have a fiery effect). Obviously, Geno and Mii Gunner have a lot of similarities (seeing as how he was a literal Mii Gunner costume in Smash 4) but it still could have been someone else (like Doomslayer)
Now, I understand you may doubt me and that's completely okay. Don't call me a liar though please, if what I heard wasn't true then it may have been a false memory or the reports of Mewtwo and Mii Gunner glitching that I saw were just completely bogus but I am not just making this up myself. Either way, I just thought I'd post this here for it to get inevitably torn apart in 5 minutes.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Maybe Daisy’s glitch, if we’re humoring this and Ness’s was for Steve cuz of the PK Fire thing, is for a character that hasn’t been released yet still

it would have to be a female character that has a similarly sized skirt. And I’m not feeling 2B for some reason

eh actually Daisy might have been for Pythra after all. No, I don’t know how

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Dancing in the moonlight....

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[Shroob]

Say it with me, bros.

Glitches don't point to specific characters. There have been examples of this in the past and they haven't ever lead to actual confirmation of a fighter.

I get the feeling this is largely for the sake of discussion, but there's nothing that suggests any particular glitch will hint at a future fighter and even if it did there's no actual way to narrow down who the fighter would be besides assumptions.

We're bored, teach.

The realization that we're probably going to be waiting until June has set in for most of us. Let the class chat during recess.

 

[yeq]

Maybe Daisy’s glitch, if we’re humoring this and Ness’s was for Steve cuz of the PK Fire thing, is for a character that hasn’t been released yet still

it would have to be a female character that has a similarly sized skirt. And I’m not feeling 2B for some reason

eh actually Daisy might have been for Pythra after all. No, I don’t know how

cough cough arle

 

[Arcanir]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

cough cough arle

I was thinking more Ahri cause the skirt length is almost 1:1 with the Daisy glitch

 

[yeq]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

if we ever get arle i want primp town as a stage

 

[2006ToyotaTacoma]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

The stages I want with my top 3 MW's:
Amaterasu: Ark of Yamato
Kiryu: Kamurocho (or Millenium Tower)
Master Chief: Blood Gulch

 

[Pillow]

The stages I want with my top 3 MW's:
Amaterasu: Ark of Yamato
Kiryu: Kamurocho (or Millenium Tower)
Master Chief: Blood Gulch

Surely the Master Chief stage would be Halo

 

[Otoad64]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

forget Fighter's Pass 3, I want a Stage Pass!

 

[MBRedboy31]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

Yeah, but, due to how near-impossible it is to get the Smash competitive community to accept less-than-typical stages, they tend to become rather irrelevant.

(I do wish we got some new “weird“ stage picks, though; things like PictoChat, Hanenbow, Living Room, ect.)

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Challenger Pack 10 is the 10th challenger pack. 10 Times 1.6 equals 16. 16 plus another 10 is 26. 26 is the number of letters in the alphabet. P is the 16th letter of the alphabet. Pig starts with P. The scientific name for a pig is Sus.
Do you know what this means?!?!?

They’re in.

 

[Otoad64]

Yeah, but, due to how near-impossible it is to get the Smash competitive community to accept less-than-typical stages, they tend to become rather irrelevant.

(I do wish we got some new “weird“ stage picks, though; things like PictoChat, Hanenbow, Living Room, ect.)

yeah well who cares about the competitive Smash community?

well, a lot of people do, but I don't.

 

[Shroob]

We could talk about stages, it's another aspect to getting a newcomer and something we rarely go over.

It has more we can add to the discussion too since Glitches are a crapshoot in nature.

Because tossing out stage ideas directly implies characters tied to said stages.

And then we just loop back around to character discussion while the original idea gets forgotten about.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Yeah but what else we gonna discuss until June?

If you're so desperate to discuss something, anything, that you're willing to indulge something that has consistently proven to have absolutely no relation to upcoming fighters, might as well go see what Hotgirlvideos has been up to lately.

It'll be just as helpful for speculation, and I guarantee you, a lot more entertaining.

 

[Pillow]

Yeah, but, due to how near-impossible it is to get the Smash competitive community to accept less-than-typical stages, they tend to become rather irrelevant.

(I do wish we got some new “weird“ stage picks, though; things like PictoChat, Hanenbow, Living Room, ect.)

Why does the competitive community not wanting to play on imbalanced stages make them irrelevant? They're relevant to anyone not playing in a tournament.

 

[Shroob]

If you're so desperate to discuss something, anything, that you're willing to indulge something that has consistently proven to have absolutely no relation to upcoming fighters, might as well go see what Hotgirlvideos has been up to lately.

It'll be just as helpful for speculation, and I guarantee you, a lot more entertaining.

Look I know my bar is low but it's not that low.

 

[Ivander]

They’re in.

Nah, Smash Bros. cannot handle them. It can only handle up to 8 players while Among Us handles more than 8. Even my hands can handle up to 10 of them.

 

[Arcanir]

Because tossing out stage ideas directly implies characters tied to said stages.

And then we just loop back around to character discussion while the original idea gets forgotten about.

Then lets try a different tack:

If we were to get a stage pass like suggested before, what stages would you like to see? Could be from any represented or even unrepresented franchise, just have fun with some ideas.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Why does the competitive community not wanting to play on imbalanced stages make them irrelevant? They're relevant to anyone not playing in a tournament.

For me personally, I watch a lot more tournaments / livestreams by tournament players than I play Ultimate itself. As such, I see tournament stages used way more often than anything else.

 

[Otoad64]

Then lets try a different tack:

If we were to get a stage pass like suggested before, what stages would you like to see? Could be from any represented or even unrepresented franchise, just have fun with some ideas.

Bowser's Castle
Chemical Plant
Pokefloats 2
Tetris, just Tetris
Dangerous Dinner
and Pac-Maze returning, of course

 

[Pillow]

For me personally, I watch a lot more tournaments / livestreams by tournament players than I play Ultimate itself. As such, I see tournament stages used way more often than anything else.

That's fine, but the way you phrased your previous comment seemed to imply that the competitive community should be more accepting of these random uncompetitive stages for the sake of diversity. They're entirely separate things. Sakurai doesn't really consider the competitive community that much (if at all) when designing dlc stages, and the people who care about them being competitive or not, like yourself, are actually just a small minority.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Look I know my bar is low but it's not that low.

Well then, how about this for a conundrum: since the glitches have never, ever given us any insight about the fighters released thus far, it follows that, if they do mean something, they aren't each individual hints about the next fighter. Rather, they're all hinting at just one fighter, so complex that they actually require massive amounts of experimentation with several traits and several characters. What character has traits that all the past glitches could have been pointing to?

inb4 it's still reimu

 

[chocolatejr9]

Well then, how about this for a conundrum: since the glitches have never, ever given us any insight about the fighters released thus far, it follows that, if they do mean something, they aren't each individual hints about the next fighter. Rather, they're all hinting at just one fighter, so complex that they actually require massive amounts of experimentation with several traits and several characters. What character has traits that all the past glitches could have been pointing to?

inb4 it's still reimu

From what little I know about Touhou, it probably IS still Reimu...

 

[Ben Holt]

Honestly, you know what'd be a cool stage?

Lake Lapcat. A travelling stage where every minute or so Fury Bowser starts ****ing **** up. You can fight him, but he likely wouldn't be beaten in one sitting. Whoever KO's him gets a free KO, and the rest of the match plays out without Fury Bowser's interference.
I think that'd be rad.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

If you're so desperate to discuss something, anything, that you're willing to indulge something that has consistently proven to have absolutely no relation to upcoming fighters, might as well go see what Hotgirlvideos has been up to lately.

It'll be just as helpful for speculation, and I guarantee you, a lot more entertaining.

Good lord, people have standards I think

But to help steer discussion in a different direction, how would you all rank the new stages we got from DLC. Here is mine

9. Garreg Mach

It's ugly. Sorry. A layout that is not fun for hazardless and honestly more than any other stage the transformation makes me a little motion sick. I can handle Northern Crater or Umbra Clock fine, but this is ugh for me. It also does not help the cameo models are absolute garbage. Complete miss, easily the worst new stage in Ultimate.

8. Spring Stadium

I want to preface that I am neutral at best with the stages going forward. Spring Stadium to me compared to the other stages just feels a little... empty. I don't know. Maybe its because it is not as busy as the other stages. Its fine in the same way something like Moray Towers is fine in the base game. Is it egregious? No. Is it great? Not really.

7. Spiral Mountain

I love Banjo, he is arguably my favorite DLC character so far. But Spiral Mountain has problems. I can 100% get why a lot of people feel sick on this stage, the rotation ain't great. For hazards off, the layout sadly just is not ideal. It is a shame since it looks so pretty, but honestly it is just not as good as some of the later stages.

6. Yggdrasil's Alter

Honestly, its pretty much Town and City in its normal form hazards off. Outside of the beginning which if you die on that you are really dumb or doing something dumb, its fine. It has a simple layout that is fun to fight on. Not much to say here.

5. KOF Stadium

I hate walk offs generally, but this stage did them right. The gimmick of hitting someone through the wall is a ton of fun and honestly, the cameos here being tied to the music is such a nice touch. Also has one of my favorite BF/Omega forms.

4. Minecraft World

Its simple. The biomes are a nice touch. Fun in hazards off free for alls, relatively charming with hazards on. Great stage.

3. Cloud Sea of Alrest

I am glad we got this. It is a pretty stage, and Gramps giving his tour guide spheel is fun. Hazards off its on the small side but I dig it.

2. Northern Crater

Honestly if the background was just a tad less bright it would be number 1. A ton of fun to fight on, perfect for free for alls and one on ones. Amazing stage. Very pretty.

1. Mementos

Its just fun. Hazards on is chaotic as heck, hazards off is workable in a free for all. I love the aesthetic. It is just fun.

Here is hoping whoever is next has a good stage as well.

 

[MBRedboy31]

That's fine, but the way you phrased your previous comment seemed to imply that the competitive community should be more accepting of these random uncompetitive stages for the sake of diversity. They're entirely separate things. Sakurai doesn't really consider the competitive community that much (if at all) when designing dlc stages, and the people who care about them being competitive or not, like yourself, are actually just a small minority.

I mean, are things like hazards off Momentos, hazards off Minecraft World, ect. really that random and uncompetitive? I know that there‘s good reasons for not using these stages, but I’d like to see side events in tournaments using unorthodox stage lists more often.

 

[cashregister9]

Good lord, people have standards I think

But to help steer discussion in a different direction, how would you all rank the new stages we got from DLC. Here is mine

9. Garreg Mach

It's ugly. Sorry. A layout that is not fun for hazardless and honestly more than any other stage the transformation makes me a little motion sick. I can handle Northern Crater or Umbra Clock fine, but this is ugh for me. It also does not help the cameo models are absolute garbage. Complete miss, easily the worst new stage in Ultimate.

8. Spring Stadium

I want to preface that I am neutral at best with the stages going forward. Spring Stadium to me compared to the other stages just feels a little... empty. I don't know. Maybe its because it is not as busy as the other stages. Its fine in the same way something like Moray Towers is fine in the base game. Is it egregious? No. Is it great? Not really.

7. Spiral Mountain

I love Banjo, he is arguably my favorite DLC character so far. But Spiral Mountain has problems. I can 100% get why a lot of people feel sick on this stage, the rotation ain't great. For hazards off, the layout sadly just is not ideal. It is a shame since it looks so pretty, but honestly it is just not as good as some of the later stages.

6. Yggdrasil's Alter

Honestly, its pretty much Town and City in its normal form hazards off. Outside of the beginning which if you die on that you are really dumb or doing something dumb, its fine. It has a simple layout that is fun to fight on. Not much to say here.

5. KOF Stadium

I hate walk offs generally, but this stage did them right. The gimmick of hitting someone through the wall is a ton of fun and honestly, the cameos here being tied to the music is such a nice touch. Also has one of my favorite BF/Omega forms.

4. Minecraft World

Its simple. The biomes are a nice touch. Fun in hazards off free for alls, relatively charming with hazards on. Great stage.

3. Cloud Sea of Alrest

I am glad we got this. It is a pretty stage, and Gramps giving his tour guide spheel is fun. Hazards off its on the small side but I dig it.

2. Northern Crater

Honestly if the background was just a tad less bright it would be number 1. A ton of fun to fight on, perfect for free for alls and one on ones. Amazing stage. Very pretty.

1. Mementos

Its just fun. Hazards on is chaotic as heck, hazards off is workable in a free for all. I love the aesthetic. It is just fun.

Here is hoping whoever is next has a good stage as well.

1. Mementos - Fantastic Layout, Music, Appearances etc.

2. Minecraft World - Minecraft makes a fantastic stage, in aesthetics and a fun layout, More Biome variety would have been appreciated

3. KOF Stadium - One of the Most fun casual stages and great aesthetics

4. Northern Crater - Another Fantastic layout, the background is too busy though

5. Spring Stadium - This is what I wanted from an Arms stage with the large exeception of the pointless ceiling protrusions.

6. Garreg Mach - Garreg Mach was my second most wanted stage, I like it but it could have been way better in everything

7. Spiral Mountain - I love the gimmick and aesthetics, Layout could be more interesting IMO

8. Yggdrasil's Altar - I like this stage but it is very unremarkable in all categories.

9. Cloud Sea Of Alrest - Too Small, The Cameos can barely be seen at some points, You can't hear Gramps and there is a lot of missed potential, We should have gone closer to the titans and if that wasn't possible Uraya, Argentum, Torna and the Leftheiran Archipelago would have been more interesting stages.

I like all the stages though, I'm excited to get 2 more.