Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[DarthEnderX]

pretty ironic to hear that from a person who is against one sided presence especially a series prominent in Japan.

Not sure what that means.

 

[Dinoman96]

Halo has always been an Xbox or PC thing, putting Master Chief on a Nintendo platform might be too much for Microsoft.

They had no problem letting him still appear in the multiplatform versions of Minecraft and Fortnite, to be fair.

I'm sure Microsoft wouldn't object to Halo in Smash if they were ever asked about it, it's literally easy free marketing and good PR for their whole brand. It's more about...well, getting the suits at Nintendo to care about an FPS franchise that's never been particularly a big deal in their home country, nor really having any history on their systems (outside of again, cameos in Minecraft/Fortnite).

 

[Commander_Alph]

They had no problem letting him still appear in the multiplatform versions of Minecraft and Fortnite, to be fair.

I'm sure Microsoft wouldn't object to Halo in Smash if they were ever asked about it, it's literally easy free marketing and good PR for their whole brand. It's more about...well, getting the suits at Nintendo to care about an FPS franchise that's never been particularly a big deal in their home country, nor really having any history on their systems (outside of again, cameos in Minecraft/Fortnite).

So does that mean that could apply to Sony as well just because Kratos is a costume in fortnite? Just asking.

 

[Pillow]

Clearly. That's why Smash has Mega Man but not Resident Evil, right?

Not the point you were trying to make, I know, but Resident Evil SHOULD be in Smash. Even if it was just a nemesis boss fight or zombie polygon horde mode or something. A series like this being relegated to a spirit event hurts.

They had no problem letting him still appear in the multiplatform versions of Minecraft and Fortnite, to be fair.

I'm sure Microsoft wouldn't object to Halo in Smash if they were ever asked about it, it's literally easy free marketing and good PR for their whole brand. It's more about...well, getting the suits at Nintendo to care about an FPS franchise that's never been particularly a big deal in their home country, nor really having any history on their systems (outside of again, cameos in Minecraft/Fortnite).

Halo is still pretty big in Japan, relative to other western franchises at the very least.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So does that mean that could apply to Sony as well just because Kratos is a costume in fortnite? Just asking.

If it's not console locked, then yeah, at least to some extent. Whether or not Sony would work with a direct competitor is still an unanswered question.

Though...that's probably not quite the same issue.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Not the point you were trying to make, I know, but Resident Evil SHOULD be in Smash.

No argument there. It deserves it.

 

[Dinoman96]

So does that mean that could apply to Sony as well just because Kratos is a costume in fortnite? Just asking.

The difference is that Nintendo and Microsoft actually have a working relationship thanks to Minecraft, which is what opened the door for other stuff like Banjo being in Smash. So while not hugely likely, there's some chance that maybe they could extend that olive branch to Chief in Smash one day, if Nintendo really wanted to.

Sony and Nintendo on the other hand have nothing really going on with each other.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly Kratos would be amazing, not just because "holy ****ing **** they put Sony's biggest character in", but also because people who insist Nintendo appearances are what make or break potential characters would either have to shut up entirely or meekly say "It's ok because he was in Fortnite" which is significantly more of a stretch than they had to do for the likes of Cloud and Joker

 

[Commander_Alph]

Honestly Kratos would be amazing, not just because "holy *ing * they put Sony's biggest character in", but also because people who insist Nintendo appearances are what make or break potential characters would either have to shut up entirely or meekly say "It's ok because he was in Fortnite" which is significantly more of a stretch than they had to do for the likes of Cloud and Joker

I prefer Ratchet and Clank more but Kratos is okay I guess, one appearance on a multiplatform game doesn't really make up a whole reason.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I prefer Ratchet and Clank more but Kratos is okay I guess, one appearance on a multiplatform game doesn't really make up a whole reason.

Oh I agree, I just want to see people who insist a character HAS to make a Nintendo appearance, a viewpoint that goes against Sakurai as he's outright said it isn't a requirement, finally be quiet or have to dig themselves so deep that nobody could take them seriously anymore. Especially as in the Smash 4 days, support threads here would get shut down for not being Nintendo enough

 

[Commander_Alph]

Especially as in the Smash 4 days, support threads here would get shut down for not being Nintendo enough

Is this really happened?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Honestly, of all of Sony's characters I think Sackboy fits Smash the best.

Especially if Sakurai takes the whole level customisation thing in a different direction than PSASBR did.

The one I'd like to see is Kat from Gravity Dash/Rush because she is awesome and precious but she's very niche.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

What if a Mortal Kombat character used the variation system? Like, their normal moves would remain constant, but you could pick one of three variations that changes the character's command normals, and some of the Special Moves. Or maybe the character is different in that they don't have command inputs for their normal Special Moves, but their variations add more Special Moves via the command inputs (as well as the aforementioned command normal idea).

 

[ZelDan]

I think it's clear why Hayabusa has more discussion revolving around him than his NES peers. Hayabusa has the benefit of 2 well known "series" across multiple generations while being the face of the Team Ninja division of Koei Tecmo games. Both the division and the company as a whole (especially with Omega Force's musou spinoffs) are really REALLY sucessful. With interviews with the devs, crossovers with musous, being a main character in their fighting game DoA, and multiple refrerences in their new hit action franchise Nioh, Team Ninja clearly have a large amount of respect and reverence for the character.

I really can't say that same level of notoriety or dedication to a single character exists for almost any other game such as Contra, Double Dragon, River City Ransom, Battletoads or what have you.

Personally speaking, Ryu Hayabusa is probably the most "oh duh, obviously" character they could pick since Megaman.
Which is why he's not gonna happen and they'll pick one of the aforemented smaller series.

I perfectly understand why Ryu Hayabusa gets more attention than other NES icons; Ryu has obviously had it better compared to the other remaining ones not in Smash.

It just bugs me when people say he's "the last NES icon to add." Even if things didn't go as fortunately for Contra, Ghost and Goblins, and battletoads etc, They were still big deals on the NES (and even beyond the NES for some), which definitely sounds like an "NES icon" to me.

 

[Golden Icarus]

Is this really happened?

Yup. They would be shut down and then encouraged to voice their opinions on a thread that was made for “impossible characters.” Opinions have certainly changed. Compare Master Chief’s thread in Smash 4 to his current one.

 

[osby]

Yup. They would be shut down and then encouraged to voice their opinions on a thread that was made for “impossible characters.” Opinions have certainly changed. Compare Master Chief’s thread in Smash 4 to his current one.

Granted, this was almost a decade ago but it's kinda hilarious just how badly the comments about Microsoft characters aged.

 

[Dinoman96]

Like I said before, I think the "Nintendo courtesy" issue mostly boils down to well, there not being that many characters without a game on Nintendo that feel like they'd even be considered for Smash, anyways. Something like the Heavy Weapons Guy doesn't feel like a nonstarter to me because "TF2 isn't on Switch ahuh", but really more because of how Nintendo and Valve have absolutely no relationship with each other, same thing with Sony.

Halo and Nier are like, the only two "Nintendo virgin" series I could see getting in one day, because they're both highly popular series owned by companies that actually have a decent enough relationship with Nintendo and thus already have presence in Smash. It's just, well, in the context of FP2, both companies happened to also have even more popular alternatives (Steve and Sephiroth).

 

[BlondeLombax]

Regardless of the status of non-Nintendo characters in Smash, all I know is that the salt from the GoNintendo comments will be glorious if it comes to pass (with all due respect to RMC, of course, the website itself is fantastic).

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Clearly. That's why Smash has Mega Man but not Resident Evil, right?

Mega Man was far more highly requested than any other Capcom character, which is the reason why he was picked.

 

[Phoenix Douchebag]

Yup. They would be shut down and then encouraged to voice their opinions on a thread that was made for “impossible characters.” Opinions have certainly changed. Compare Master Chief’s thread in Smash 4 to his current one.

Ahhh, Smash 4 speculation. When Third Party characters were seen as NEEDING some Nintendo presence to be seen as potential newcomers (instead of "ACHTKUALLY; THEY APPEAR IN A 1 SECOND CAMEO IN A RANDOM DS GAME SO THEY TOTALLY COUNT NYEK NYEK NYEK") and Nintendo characters were the norm. Characters old and new, the idea of reviving old school characters was entertained, Expanding existing Nintendo's existing roster was talked about (DK, Zelda, Metroid, etc) and the likes of Fire Emblem were still welcome with mostly open arms (due to the franchise not being oversaturated back then)

The only things i don't remember fondly is people being really stingy with Mario characters (as if the largest gaming series of Nintendo can't have more than 4 characters apparently)

There's even a quote that perfectly summarizes it:

-Smash Brothers is a Nintendo IP, exclusive to Nintendo consoles, featuring Nintendo characters and a few third parties

Good times, good times.

.,,,,ererrr i mean, oh jeez, what a buncha gatekeeperz! how they can they be so mean!

 

[Flyboy]

I'm glad I dipped during Smash 4 days. People seemed really nasty back then. I remember checking out the Smash 4 Ryu thread and the OP made this really nice post talking about how iconic Ryu is, and then when he leaked tons of people came into the thread to tell the OP they hoped the leak was fake and that they didn't really add him. Like, Jesus, who would want to be in an environment like that?

Sometimes I miss base game speculation for Ultimate because it felt like the craziest first parties and retros were in the conversation and it was a great vibe, but if there's one great part about this DLC cycle it's that it's opened people's minds to some truly out-there names that never would have been considered before and it's lead to significantly healthier conversations versus whatever that junk in the Smash 4 Ryu thread or the aforementioned Master Chief thread was.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Largely unpopular opinion I know, but part of me doesn't really mind the idea of third party characters having some Nintendo connection. I know its completely irrational, however given there are worthy first party fighters that still haven't gotten in Smash,, the idea that they're not included yet characters who've never even been on a Nintendo system would get in? I'd be lying if I said it wouldn't irk me a little bit. Obviously its silly and unfair that a 2B or Master Chief should pay for the sins of Smash not including an Impa or Bandana Dee; its just the way I feel though.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Does anyone here remember the Captain Toad jumping arguments that used to be a thing?

 

[Mamboo07]

Does anyone here remember the Captain Toad jumping arguments that used to be a thing?

Oh yeah I remember that, was pretty stupid.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Largely unpopular opinion I know, but part of me doesn't really mind the idea of third party characters having some Nintendo connection. I know its completely irrational, however given there are worthy first party fighters that still haven't gotten in Smash,, the idea that they're not included yet characters who've never even been on a Nintendo system would get in? I'd be lying if I said it wouldn't irk me a little bit. Obviously its silly and unfair that a 2B or Master Chief should pay for the sins of Smash not including an Impa or Bandana Dee; its just the way I feel though.

I think you missed the point, people don't mind that third parties tend to have some relation to Nintendo, but people think it's not an end all be all that should determine whether or not a character should be in. At the end of the day, every wants their favourites in, some people just have favourites who aren't related to Nintendo much if at all, especially how odd it is that it's seen as an awful idea by some when the fact that someone who bought a Switch and Smash wants the character means that a Nintendo fan wants that character.

 

[Dinoman96]

In the end, the only real rule is be a video game character that's within reasonable grasp.

Thus, the only VG characters you can truly rule out are Sony owned characters and Sora because Disney.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I think you missed the point, people don't mind that third parties tend to have some relation to Nintendo, but people think it's not an end all be all that should determine whether or not a character should be in. At the end of the day, every wants their favourites in, some people just have favourites who aren't related to Nintendo much if at all, especially how odd it is that it's seen as an awful idea by some when the fact that someone who bought a Switch and Smash wants the character means that a Nintendo fan wants that character.

Oh I know, I'm just explaining why I personally would not as bothered as others if there in fact was a hard rule that third party characters should have appeared on a Nintendo console (as realistically there isn't).

 

[Otoad64]

In the end, the only real rule is be a video game character that's within reasonable grasp.

Thus, the only VG characters you can truly rule out are Sony owned characters and Sora because Disney.

I wouldn't say those are impossible, just highly unlikely

 

[Perkilator]

In the end, the only real rule is be a video game character that's within reasonable grasp.

Thus, the only VG characters you can truly rule out are Sony owned characters and Sora because Disney.

People think Sora is ruled out simply for being Disney when they shell put the license to pretty much anyone who's willing to take it?

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

They had no problem letting him still appear in the multiplatform versions of Minecraft and Fortnite, to be fair.

I'm sure Microsoft wouldn't object to Halo in Smash if they were ever asked about it, it's literally easy free marketing and good PR for their whole brand. It's more about...well, getting the suits at Nintendo to care about an FPS franchise that's never been particularly a big deal in their home country, nor really having any history on their systems (outside of again, cameos in Minecraft/Fortnite).

Forgot about that, my bad. Though to be fair, thats multi platform, Smash is a Nintendo exclusive.

 

[Otoad64]

People think Sora is ruled out simply for being Disney when they shell put the license to pretty much anyone who's willing to take it?

people rule him out because disney would probably want a lot of money

 

[Perkilator]

people rule him out because disney would probably want a lot of money

Clearly not if they allow tons of merch companies to use him

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Disney is the reason I wouldnt expect Sora.

I'm among those who does believe Nintendo did approach them but Disney being Disndy charged them too much.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

people rule him out because disney would probably want a lot of money

Thats just it, we dont ****in know if they would ask for a boat load of money or not. For all we know, getting him might be hella easy. Everyone is taking what that dude said as fact for some stupid reason and now the whole "Disney rejected Nintendo" Misinformation is ****ing everywhere

 

[Deleted member]

You know it is interesting how most people view Koei-Tecmo and Arc System Works when it comes to a potential rep in Smash. Ninja Gaiden is considered to be likely for being an NES original whereas Guilty Gear is considered somewhat likely because it's ASW's top franchise at the moment. If you flip the 2 reasonings for both companies, Dynasty Warriors would be considered likely for being KT's top franchise at the moment whereas Double Dragon would be considered likely for being an NES original, but they don't get talked about as much as the other 2 franchises do.

I mean **** Dynasty Warriors and Guilty Gear are both getting a new game this year while the Ninja Gaiden [Sigma] Trilogy is looking all but confirmed and Double Dragon Neon got rereleased on the Switch, yet Dynasty Warriors and Double Dragon aren't speculated as much as either Ninja Gaiden and Guilty Gear. Regardless of how people view those 2 franchises being unlikely for whatever reason, you'd think characters like Zhao Yun, Lu Bu, or Billy and Jimmy would pop up more often than not on 4chan posts and other Smash specific forums, but they're not (which I can somewhat appreciate cause if those 2 franchises do make it in it'd be way more surprising thanks to the lack of discussions around them).

 

[Otoad64]

Thats just it, we dont ****in know if they would ask for a boat load of money or not. For all we know, getting him might be hella easy

true, but there is a good chance they will ask for a boat load of money.


if we're trying to guess wether sora will make it in we have to try to guess wether they will

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

People think Sora is ruled out simply for being Disney when they shell put the license to pretty much anyone who's willing to take it?

Some yeah, though the argument is a bit more complex. While Disney is very generous with merch, a big worldwide gaming crossover is a little different. They might charge more.
Another problem is that Square just got Sephiroth, who either jointly owns Sora, or is the company Disney always goes to when trying to use Sora in games. Squares cooperation seems essential.
Last problem is that Kingdom Hearts focuses a lot on non VG characters. So Sakurai needs to either really stretch his one big no no or do KH dirty. Which may not be a big problem considering how Cloud was done in 4.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

There's also the let's also factor in Sakurai respecting characters portrayals.

Reason why Heihachi wasn't added due to Tekken's gameplay not implementing well into Smash.

The same would be Sora with its Disney content like Donald and Goofy who aren't video game characters.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

imma do a drinking game and everytime I see someone say "Sora needs Disney stuff" Im going to take a drink. That is such Bull**** because he will do just FINE without disney stuff. Hell, ReMind was all OG stuff and 0 Disney and it worked fine

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

imma do a drinking game and everytime I see someone say "Sora needs Disney stuff" Im going to take a drink

Need, not really. You could probably make a good pack only using the VG side of KH. But, you gotta admit a lot of the appeal of KH comes from the Disney side of things.