Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Noipoi]

Here it is:

Since the leak was fake, you could feasibly call whoever concocted it an Einstein of Social Engineering, if only because they figured out things like specific staff members of an advertising company and related advertising campaigns that'd run concurrently with Smash to lend credibility to the "leak."

I still think it was mariotehplumber. That's the only person I can think of who'd have that level of commitment to ****ing with the Smash fandom.

This post got like 200 likes it was insane bro

 

[Schnee117]

Thanks for being the first to say it. When people started talking about the Grinch leak I immediately thought back to how much of a ****show Grinch leak speculation was. As someone who knew the Grinch leak was fake (there were too many inconsistencies on the banner), I got so much hate for simply disagreeing with the general consensus. I don't believe in blocking people, but I had to block around 10 people because I was getting targeted harassment here and didn't want to put up with it. Overall it felt like forever when it was, in reality, only a single week where it all went down.

The Grinch leak, while one of the most impressive fake leaks from a technical and social engineering standpoint, isn't something to recall fondly. The community's never been more toxic, and I'll take boring 4chan text leak talk any day or the week over the complete ****show Smash spec was during the height of the Grinch leak.

You didn't even need the banner inconsistencies tbh
Sakurai was on record as being like "Oh we revealed too much" and "There's not much left" but here's a leak that added to the then revealed number of new characters by two thirds.

 

[Shroob]

You didn't even need the banner inconsistencies tbh
Sakurai was on record as being like "Oh we revealed too much" and "There's not much left" but here's a leak that added to the then revealed number of new characters by two thirds.

To be fair


We still have people going 'oh this really isn't the end lmao'


Sakurai can say anything, but there's always going to be a handful of folks who won't believe him because "He's trolling lol".

 

[Noipoi]

You didn't even need the banner inconsistencies tbh
Sakurai was on record as being like "Oh we revealed too much" and "There's not much left" but here's a leak that added to the then revealed number of new characters by two thirds.

But Sakurai’s le epic troll he was just lying.

 

[Dan Quixote]

I wasn't as terminally online in 2018 as I am now, so I pretty much only have fun memories of the wild way the Grinch leak kept exploding over itself. In the end, I don't recall believing it, but I'm not gonna claim I "knew" it was fake, cuz really there was no way to be 100% certain. Still, it sounds like it really hurt a lot of people who were far more active in the speculation community than I, so that sucks to hear. It's crazy what people on the Internet will get up to when they're just a little wired, or think they can "stick it" to more powerful people than themselves like GameXplain. Still, I'm gonna share a three-part playlist of really hilariously edited Youtube videos (that runs a lil less than an hour in total) that go over the Grinch leak. It's damn funny and I still watch it a couple times a year, so hopefully it makes some people able to remember the humorous parts of that little saga heh.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUrfHDC3SJwwAvURPeO5rN3ebYKGbr0Mz

 

[toonito]

My FP1 ranking:

> > > > >

FP2:

> > > >

Overall:

> > > > > >>>>>

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

I wasn't as terminally online in 2018 as I am now, so I pretty much only have fun memories of the wild way the Grinch leak kept exploding over itself. In the end, I don't recall believing it, but I'm not gonna claim I "knew" it was fake, cuz really there was no way to be 100% certain. Still, it sounds like it really hurt a lot of people who were far more active in the speculation community than I, so that sucks to hear. It's crazy what people on the Internet will get up to when they're just a little wired, or think they can "stick it" to more powerful people than themselves like GameXplain. Still, I'm gonna share a three-part playlist of really hilariously edited Youtube videos (that runs a lil less than an hour in total) that go over the Grinch leak. It's damn funny and I still watch it a couple times a year, so hopefully it makes some people able to remember the humorous parts of that little saga heh.

https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUrfHDC3SJwwAvURPeO5rN3ebYKGbr0Mz

I appreciate the sentiment, but there's little humor to be found from that ****show.

The only humor I found was the feeling of vindication when Incineroar and Ken were revealed at the last two fighters, with Plant being the extra cherry on top to blow the Grinch leak the **** out, but that's also because I'm a petty ***** who indulges in childish feelings like that.

 

[3BitSaurus]

I don’t even remember why we were talking about her, but she was a hot topic for about a week and a half and then we never spoke of her again.

Hitagi, that's why.

Post-Grinch might actually have been the worst period for speculation imo. Not because of Grinch, but because that was a time where a lot of people started taking info from leakers as gospel. Doesn't help that a fair amount of them were petty as **** because of what happened during Grinch and kinda drank the attention.

'Member when Volume 1 was supposed to be "Steve, Katalina, a Namco character, another western rep and a Switch rep"? I 'member.

And then we got Joker, and thankfully that period of speculation ended there.

Also, imo Milk-BOSATU was way worse than Cacomallow. At least Cacomallow seemingly had a competent modder behind it, Milk was literally some dude on Twitter saying "my friend works at Nintendo, trust me bro" and some people bought it from before the SNK leak aaaall the way to Min Min.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

It's a good thing the only leak that I had to endure was "the list", and all that really did was make speculation dry up.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

The only thing I'm not looking forward to in the next Smash game speculation cycle is that the Grinch Leak will inevitably being brought up (if only as a point of comparison) and all the nonsense associated with it will once again rear its ugly head.

It's funny how the Gigaleak was almost the opposite. Whereas the Grinch Leak seemed to bring out the worst in everything, the former was a delight in revealing all sorts of uncovered details and secrets, culminating in that 24 years and 1 month after Mario 64's release the Luigi models were found in the prototype; L is Real 2401 indeed. In what was an especially big drought period for Nintendo news thanks to the pandemic, it was a breath of fresh air.

 

[Shroob]

Hitagi, that's why.

Post-Grinch might actually have been the worst period for speculation imo. Not because of Grinch, but because that was a time where a lot of people started taking info from leakers as gospel. Doesn't help that a fair amount of them were petty as **** because of what happened during Grinch and kinda drank the attention.

'Member when Volume 1 was supposed to be "Steve, Katalina, a Namco character, another western rep and a Switch rep"? I 'member.

And then we got Joker, and thankfully that period of speculation ended there.

Also, imo Milk-BOSATU was way worse than Cacomallow. At least Cacomallow seemingly had a competent modder behind it, Milk was literally some dude on Twitter saying "my friend works at Nintendo, trust me bro" and some people bought it from before the SNK leak aaaall the way to Min Min.

The fact we're 4/5 is

 

[Noipoi]

The fact we're 4/5 is

She’s coming

 

[Guynamednelson]

The fact we're 4/5 is

To be fair that is kind of easy when you don't name names for the most part.

 

[Eldrake]

There will never be anything like the grinch hoax ever again. It relied on like a hundred coincidences to stay alive when most people would have disregarded it on account of it being the typical blurry photo hoax type.

 

[3BitSaurus]

The fact we're 4/5 is

I know you're joking, but it should be stressed that at the time, a second Volume seemed possible, but unlikely. The fact that only one of these happened in Volume 1 kinda shows that Hitagi's Smash info was pretty much provided by monkeys on typewriters.

("Another western rep" doesn't really count because Hitagi flat out said Banjo wasn't in, too.)

 

[GalacticPetey]

I've followed Smash since around the reveal of Smash 4. I've seen many things. Some real, some fake. Gematsu, Palutena leak, Ridley's shadow, Chunky Kong, Ninka/Vaanrose, ESRB, Rayman, Tower of Smash, Roy and Ryu, Vergeben, Loz18, chairs, ken thumbs up, Box Theory, Grinch, Brave, 7-11, Cacomallow, purple.

Chunky Kong might be the funniest because of how mundane it was and all the memes that followed. Grinch was definitely the most toxic. But now I am just ready for it all to be over.

 

[Dan Quixote]

I appreciate the sentiment, but there's little humor to be found from that ****show.

The only humor I found was the feeling of vindication when Incineroar and Ken were revealed at the last two fighters, with Plant being the extra cherry on top to blow the Grinch leak the ** out, but that's also because I'm a petty *** who indulges in childish feelings like that.

Laughing at Piranha Plant's reveal is a certifiably healthy thing to do though, it was peak stuff

 

[Shroob]

I've followed Smash since around the reveal of Smash 4. I've seen many things. Some real, some fake. Gematsu, Palutena leak, Ridley's shadow, Chunky Kong, Ninka/Vaanrose, ESRB, Rayman, Tower of Smash, Roy and Ryu, Vergeben, Loz18, chairs, ken thumbs up, Box Theory, Grinch, Brave, 7-11, Cacomallow, purple.

Chunky Kong might be the funniest because of how mundane it was and all the memes that followed. Grinch was definitely the most toxic. But now I am just ready for it all to be over.

View attachment 331982

The truth is out there.

 

[ZelDan]

Honestly, the reason I still thought the grinch leak could have been real despite Sakurai's words was because of DLC. maybe base game really was only going to get a few of the Grinch characters and the others would have DLC that they would have shown off some time during or shortly after the Nov. 2018 direct.

Now, showing off all DLC characters at once isn't how Nintendo/Sakurai goes about DLC, though to be fair the only precedent of Smash DLC we had up until the Grinch leak was Smash 4, so I thought maybe they would have went about things different for Smash Ultimate, but obvioulsy that wasn't the case.

I suppose I wasn't wrong to think DLC could have ended up being a thing atleast lol.

 

[GalacticPetey]

The truth is out there.

Part of me wishes we got a Chunky Kong AT just for the closure but I still love it as a weird and often forgotten part of Smash history.

 

[SNEKeater]

You'd have to go to the centre of the Earth to go under that particular bar

Capcom better make Ken justice visually speaking for SFVI or I'm gonna burn their offices, my man didn't deserve this.

The redesign he got was cool, but not the face lmao

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

I took a more hands off role in speculation until I made this account back at Sephiroths Presents.

I lurked here sometimes and followed Ultimate speculation since the beginning though. The Grinch Leak (I kinda prefer Muriel leak tbh) seemed infallible for a hot minute before Vergeben opposed it. I decided to believe it since I just wanted more characters. Either way, it boring real quick and made the November Direct even more underwhelming than it probably would’ve been.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Who do you think fits that criteria?

As far as first party characters go, Waluigi, Skull Kid and Isaac are some good examples when talking within the context of the Western Smash fanbase.

I actually do have a question also

-What do you think is the biggest example of Revisionist History in Smash Speculation?

The idea that Krystal was a more popular fan request for Brawl than Wolf.

 

[Trevenant]

When it comes to Grinch, I'm still pretty sure the Banjo on it was just some used mural artwork that I saw used somewhere else online but just rotated lmao. The Shadow on it also looked like some fanart someone made in the run-up to Ultimate and Mach Rider looked just like the trophy from Melee. Isaac also had a tonne of art leaks in the runup to Ultimate too and the Chorus Kids are the most simply designed characters Nintendo owns so adding them in by just drawing them in MSPaint or ripping some png from a RH game woulda been pretty simple. It was certainly an interesting leak but hardly a time anyone should want to revisit in terms of the community reaction, which is surprising as it barely lasted a week.

 

[Theguy123]

Speaking off leaks Today I shall remind the people that caccomallow still technically isn’t debunked.

yes I’m prepared for the backlash. Truth hurts

 

[CommanderZaktan]

So what's going to be announced tonight? A spirit event or a tourney?

 

[GolisoPower]

So what's going to be announced tonight? A spirit event or a tourney?

Maybe it'll be a Metroid Dread spirit event? The game is just around the corner, after all...

 

[spicynun]

Oh ranking sounds fun. My fav to least fav.
Pass 1 :


Pass 2:


Unless CP11 blows me away, I think I preferred pass 1 overall. The only characters in pass 2 I have any associations with are Sephiroth and Kazuya. Ive played every game represented in pass 1 except for Three Houses (I will play it at some point). I will also get to XC2 one day after I finally finish the first one

 

[Warumian]

FP1 from my perspective (kinda late).


: Didn't hate it, it was a funny pick as a random nonsense character, but gameplay wise is very boring.

: Hot take I don't think he fits in smash (his only Nintendo games are 2 spin offs), I would rather have Flynn or Nanashi over him. Gameplay wise is fast, agile and has good combos, but in online (elite smash) is terrible.

: Hyped af character, granddaddy of RPGs finally here and is really fun to use with his command selection (Althought I would've love DQ1 hero to be here but it already has my boy Eight in so I can't complain)

: Never cared about his game, so it didn't hype me. I've almost never touched him but I've heard his gameplay is boring, idk if it's true.

: Easily mi favorite reveal and character out of the entire 2 waves of DLC, too many SNK references in that trailer alone and introducing a very important 90s fighting game character with 50 SNK songs, his inputs are easier to use than Ryu/Ken's ones and is very fun to mess around with them.

: It exists. I've played most of the FE games and I'd rather have SOMETHING from the super famicom Kaga's era that isn't a spirit instead of like the fourth or fifth new FE games' character. His gameplay is ok, I don't use him as much anymore.

 

[GilTheGreat19]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


WHY DOES HE LOOK LIKE WEIRD DIO


AAAAAAAAAAAAAA

I-uh. uhhhh

WHAT IS THAT HAIRLINE BRUH

 

[MrJudd]

Speaking off leaks Today I shall remind the people that caccomallow still technically isn’t debunked.

yes I’m prepared for the backlash. Truth hurts

I'm also prepared for the chaos wears Cacomallow Hat

So what's going to be announced tonight? A spirit event or a tourney?

I'm guessing a tourney, but my gut feeling is a SNES spirit event.

 

[GolisoPower]

Just wanna share this little brain-child I thought of on the Reimu thread a few days ago:

So I've been doing a little thinking and I think I may have another point in favor of Reimu.

Autumn Reitaisai 8.

Now the odds/idea of a fighter being revealed coinciding with a specific event can be tricky. On the one hand, we've had predictions that were completely off (I admittedly thought Doom Slayer would be revealed for Smash Ultimate in 2018 because the presentation that revealed K. Rool and Simon were really close to QuakeCon that year), but on the other hand, Steve was revealed really close to last year's MineCon and some cues told me that this was planned from the start (I mean, Sakurai himself made an appearance, albeit prerecorded. There's no way this was not planned between Nintendo and Mojang IMO). Though probably not likely to happen again, announcing Reimu this month because of Autumn Reitaisai would sort of mirror the Steve reveal in a way.

Now you're probably thinking: "But Goliso, the Smash presentation is a bit over two weeks from Reitaisai!" (For context, Autumn Reitaisai this year takes place October 24th.) I mean, yeah, the presentation is over two weeks off, but the release could very well be a lot closer. Spacing a presentation from a release isn't unheard of (Byleth and, to an extent, Min Min, come to mind), so having it that far wouldn't be too unlikely. Though I'm not sure if Nintendo would be willing to willingly repeat things in a new coat of paint (I'd bring up Min Min and Kazuya being fighting game characters revealed in June, but Occam's razor tells me that's just coincidence), it would make sense for the same thing to happen somewhat.

Spoiler: Putting this here as a separate thought

Also, if Reimu does turn out to be the Final Fighter, imagine if Sakurai plays a compilation of Touhou memes and fan videos in the presentation while saying, "For some of you, you may have taken a liking to something you never knew was from Touhou."

God, I would look forward to the collective existential crisis of the Smash community lol

I might be looking too deep into it, and I might be perpetuating a reputation for inane ramblings that I had no idea I had before. But hey, I'm just as crazy as anybody else.

 

[ryuryunonoroi]

You may have a different recollection, but boy howdy are you wrong lol.


Ask probably any staff member here who were on duty.

Ask PushDustin how they straight up had to ban Box and Grinch discussion in the SourceGaming Discord server due to how toxic it got.

Go back and read a lot of the archived posts on this site, and see how many of those accounts no longer post here.


The whole situation was an ungodly mess.

I read through this whole exchange. Interesting how this comes up while I'm familiarizing myself with more of the site and its functions. Obviously I wasn't around when all this mayhem unfolded, but I want to know more about this environment at the time. Certain people were being harassed over thinking the leak wasn't real? What kind of things were being posted on these public profiles? Which archived topics are worth combing through?

I realize that curiosity may sound somewhat morbid to you, but I find amusement in dissecting this sort of drama, if only to function as a kind of internet history lesson of sorts.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

We’re gonna get the sword tournament tonight

which means the last fighter goes pew pew

 

[subterrestrial]

Part of me wishes we got a Chunky Kong AT just for the closure but I still love it as a weird and often forgotten part of Smash history.

*funky

 

[CapitaineCrash]

To be fair


We still have people going 'oh this really isn't the end lmao'


Sakurai can say anything, but there's always going to be a handful of folks who won't believe him because "He's trolling lol".

I do wonder, where does the "Sakurai is a troll" mindset even comes from? Legit the only time I remember him "trolling" was when he said in a Smash 4 direct something like "unfortunately Zero suit samus isn't coming back... no I'm only kidding" but the joke lasted for 2 seconds. Sometimes he makes jokes in direct (I think Sakurai is actually very funny especially in the Sakurai presents with Ultimate dlc), but that's not really "trolling".

 

[subterrestrial]

I do wonder, where does the "Sakurai is a troll" mindset even comes from? Legit the only time I remember him "trolling" was when he said in a Smash 4 direct something like "unfortunately Zero suit samus isn't coming back... no I'm only kidding" but the joke lasted for 2 seconds. Sometimes he makes jokes in direct (I think Sakurai is actually very funny especially in the Sakurai presents with Ultimate dlc), but that's not really "trolling".

iirc sakurai also said sm4sh wouldnt have dlc and to not expect alot of newcomers in ult

 

[CapitaineCrash]

iirc sakurai also said sm4sh wouldnt have dlc and to not expect alot of newcomers in ult

That's not really trolling, the first one was probably true when Smash 4 was in development and they started working on dlc after development end. The second one was true because he was talking base game only.

 

[Shroob]

I do wonder, where does the "Sakurai is a troll" mindset even comes from?

Denial.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I do wonder, where does the "Sakurai is a troll" mindset even comes from?

He just rides a different train of thought than most fans.