Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[Jondolio]

I suppose you are right but some of these arguments get pretty inane.
-"FE should be cut to be just Ike and Marth."
-"Any retro character not called Mr. G&W should be cut since they dont have new games."
-"Pokemon cannot have more than 4 characters."
Not to mention that it still boggles my mind that there were actually whining during this smash speculation because every character made the return. Because they wanted cuts.

"They could have dedicated all those resources to adding my most wanted character even though they probably wouldn't have given a **** about said character either way!"

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I would rather not have Snake be cut again, thank you very much

Didn’t like the fact that a lot of people wanted him cut for 4 and he didn’t return as DLC for that game

 

[BlondeLombax]

I suppose you are right but some of these arguments get pretty inane.
-"FE should be cut to be just Ike and Marth."
-"Any retro character not called Mr. G&W should be cut since they dont have new games."
-"Pokemon cannot have more than 4 characters."
Not to mention that it still boggles my mind that there were actually whining during this smash speculation because every character made the return. Because they wanted cuts.

I saw examples on GoNintendo after Ultimate’s reveal. While it’s still a great site, there’s a handful of extremely vocal console elitists on there (not naming anybody in particular) that believe that every third-party character with little relation to Nintendo be cut. Not to mention, completely ignoring just how happy people were made by the new additions.

 

[Jondolio]

I was dreading Greninja getting cut in this game and I'm dreading the possibility of them getting cut next time.
And they're just one character I like that's in danger of getting axed, though if they're cut there's a good chance I won't even buy the next game since they're pretty much my favorite character in all of Smash.

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

Honestly, I’d say the only ones almost guaranteed up for the axe next game are some of the previously one off melee vets, but even then characters like Young Link and Pichu having easy movesets doesn’t mean they are leaving.

3rd Party cuts are a whole other ballpark of hypotheticals, almost all of which have no real evidence to back their logic. The only 3rd Party we’ve ever seen cut thus far has been Snake. With Ultimate necessitating everyones return, and DLC heavily favoring 3rd Parties. Next Smashes roster is essentially impossible to predict without blind luck.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I was dreading Greninja getting cut in this game and I'm dreading the possibility of them getting cut next time.
And they're just one character I like that's in danger of getting axed, though if they're cut there's a good chance I won't even buy the next game since they're pretty much my favorite character in all of Smash.

I mean personally I don't think Greninja will be getting cut since he's been the most popular Pokemon for the last like 3 Generations, but nobody can really say for sure I guess?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Honestly, I’d say the only ones almost guaranteed up for the axe next game are some of the previously one off melee vets, but even then characters like Young Link and Pichu having easy movesets doesn’t mean they are leaving.

3rd Party cuts are a whole other ballpark of hypotheticals, almost all of which have no real evidence to back their logic. The only 3rd Party we’ve ever seen cut thus far has been Snake. With Ultimate necessitating everyones return, and DLC heavily favoring 3rd Parties. Next Smashes roster is essentially impossible to predict without blind luck.

I think the major reason Snake wasn’t in 4 was all Konami’s fault

2014-2015 was a very dark time for them let’s just say, paired with Kojima leaving the company (which explains why Snake’s series logo changed)

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Ah yes. My least favorite part of the smash discussion, the cuts. And its usually the most biased and annoying part of the deal because it usually boils down to cutting down all echoes and clones, discarding at least half the characters of the most represented series in smash (Mario, Pokemon and Fire Emblem), getting rid of most of the unique fighters because "they are not relevant", hoping to get rid of characters because they dont like their playstyles and putting their characters in a pedestal (Cutting my char! No way! Its great and its cool. Sakurai would never cut down my character. Its the others that deserve to be put on the chopping block.).

Honestly if this community were calling the shots, it would probably go down something like this:

Spoiler

Kept:

Kept, but please fix:

Voted off the island:
()
Shrugs all around:
/

And that might be a bit optimistic. Might also be slightly incorrect in some places, but either way, it's a good thing we don't have to deal with that.

 

[Jondolio]

I saw examples on GoNintendo after Ultimate’s reveal. While it’s still a great site, there’s a handful of extremely vocal console elitists on there (not naming anybody in particular) that believe that every third-party character with little relation to Nintendo be cut. Not to mention, completely ignoring just how happy people were made by the new additions.

There's some people who straight up want every third-party character gone, even on this site. It's so dumb.
I can guarantee you that Smash's fanbase wouldn't have beeen as huge as it is today without some of these characters.

I mean personally I don't think Greninja will be getting cut since he's been the most popular Pokemon for the last like 3 Generations, but nobody can really say for sure I guess?

I know. But I can't shake the feeling that they could be gone one day. It's probably just baseless paranoia, but as long as the possibility exists i can't really let go of that feeling.

 

[DarthEnderX]

The magical worlds of Monster Rancher and Super Monkey Ball collide as Suezo rolls into Super Monkey Ball Banana Mania! 👁️#SuperMonkeyBall #BananaMania #MonsterRancher #Suezo pic.twitter.com/tnapXxXVbk

— Super Monkey Ball (@SuperMonkeyBall) September 2, 2021

...What the hell?

Super Monkey Ball Banana Mania is rapidly turning into Sega's Super Bomberman R.

Ivysaur is grass/poison

So it should just be Bug, Dragon, Ghost, Ground, Rock, and Ice.

So let's do this given what I just said, and let's pick a group of 3

I can't anymore.

I cared about Type coverage in Smash 4, when we still had no overlap. But when Trainer and Pichu came back, and then we got Incineroar instead of Decidueye, I completely stopped caring about Type coverage in Smash...and Pokemon in general.

...

But go with Frosmoth.

 

[Shroob]

So, Sony has a State of Play the 17th.

Doesn't necessarily mean Nintendo won't drop a Direct that week but, next week looking good...

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

There's no way Greninja is getting cut, he's up there with Lucario and Charizard for being some of the heavy marketable hitters. I could see Incineroar possibly going in favour of a gen 9 or 10 Pokemon, whatever game is up next by Smash 6's timeline of development.

And tbh, they could very well cut popular characters that aren't necessarily staples like Wolf to sell as DLC. Why do you think Baiken isn't a GG Strive launch character?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Personally, outside of characters like Young Link and Pichu who I expect to get cut just because the only reason they're back is Everyone is Here and without that they would've been left in that 17-year limbo after Melee, it's really hard for me to even try to guess who MIGHT get cut, even in 3rd parties because all of them that I thought were likely have become more involved as time has gone on, if that makes sense?

Like I figured Cloud would be really tough to get back next game because Square were stingy (which is honestly probably still the case, but I digress), and then they added Dragon Quest stuff and Sephiroth brought a bunch of Final Fantasy stuff along. I wasn't sure about Konami when Everyone is Here dropped, but then they added Castlevania which has one of the largest music selections in the game and stuff like Bomberman as an Assist Trophy.

I dunno, it's just hard for me to determine anyone that would definitely be on the chopping block. Even Dr. Mario has been in every game since his debut except for Brawl lol

 

[Jondolio]

Honestly if this community were calling the shots, it would probably go down something like this:

Spoiler

Kept:

Kept, but please fix:

Voted off the island:
()
Shrugs all around:
/

And that might be a bit optimistic. Might also be slightly incorrect in some places, but either way, it's a good thing we don't have to deal with that.

Those are a lot of characters I like there...
This is why I'm hoping for a port

 

[SKX31]

Not... sure what you're talking about. The only recent ones I remember are the leaked LoL crossover skins for Valorant. Apparently Mobile Legends had a collab with Transformers too?

Other than that, no idea what you mean.

So true, bestie.

Am i having a stroke

Yup, I think he's asking about any potential MOBA crossovers which may include skins or heroes / playable characters, like Amaterasu in Dota 2 (who's a courier, not fully playable though):

Or the "Dante in LoL" rumor. It's one of those things where the announcement will come suddenly, such as a number of DC Comics characters* in a mobile MOBA (yes, Arena of Valor).

*Those being Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash and the Joker. And yes, that game saw a Switch release... only to close shop a year later. The mobile game's still performing pretty well in SEA, to the point where it was featured in the SEA Games likely as a test run for e-sports' potential of becoming an Olympic discipline in the future. And I've suspected in the past that AoV closing its Switch version helped lead to Pokemon Unite being a thing.

Hello it's back again.
Some MOBAs collab/crossover that skin or heroes?
Ping to members
Please heard!

Nope. Not what I know of. But if there are any upcoming ones, the announcement will probably be made suddenly as said.

Honestly if this community were calling the shots, it would probably go down something like this:

Spoiler

Kept:

Kept, but please fix:

Voted off the island:
()
Shrugs all around:
/

And that might be a bit optimistic. Might also be slightly incorrect in some places, but either way, it's a good thing we don't have to deal with that.

If I may ask, are you talking about the Smash community as a whole (I'm getting that impression) or specific segments of it? I just want to be sure since I got a little confused.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

There's no way Greninja is getting cut, he's up there with Lucario and Charizard for being some of the heavy marketable hitters. I could see Incineroar possibly going in favour of a gen 9 or 10 Pokemon, whatever game is up next by Smash 6's timeline of development.

And tbh, they could very well cut popular characters that aren't necessarily staples like Wolf to sell as DLC. Why do you think Baiken isn't a GG Strive launch character?

I mean, they could have made Wolf DLC in 4

but they didn’t

Smashboards was absolute chaos when the final presentation dropped and Wolf didn’t return lemme tell ya

at least Snake fans took it in stride cuz they knew Konami were being assholes back then

Yup, I think he's asking about any potential MOBA crossovers which may include skins or heroes / playable characters, like Amaterasu in Dota 2 (who's a courier, not fully playable though):

Or the "Dante in LoL" rumor. It's one of those things where the announcement will come suddenly, such as a number of DC Comics characters* in a mobile MOBA (yes, Arena of Valor).

*Those being Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Flash and the Joker. And yes, that game saw a Switch release... only to close shop a year later. The mobile game's still performing pretty well in SEA, to the point where it was featured in the SEA Games likely as a test run for e-sports' potential of becoming an Olympic discipline in the future. And I've suspected in the past that AoV closing its Switch version helped lead to Pokemon Unite being a thing.



Nope. Not what I know of. But if there are any upcoming ones, the announcement will probably be made suddenly as said.



If I may ask, are you talking about the Smash community as a whole (I'm getting that impression) or specific segments of it? I just want to be sure since I got a little confused.

Dante in LoL

did you mean: Samira?

 

[3BitSaurus]

So, Sony has a State of Play the 17th.

Doesn't necessarily mean Nintendo won't drop a Direct that week but, next week looking good...

It's worth noting that it's happened before. In 2019 there was an Indie World and a State of Play just a few hours apart.

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Looking back, most Nintendo characters cut (that weren't because or hardware issues) were some degree of a clone: Dr. Mario, Young Link, Pichu, Roy and Lucas. Mewtwo is the only outlier because idk actually why they cut him from Brawl.

Anyway that's what I'm expecting really. Clones, 3rd parties who have rights issues and less popular characters. That's not what I want but what I think might happen based on history and how other fighting games treat returning characters.

Additionally, I wonder if Rex might join Smash 6 alongside Pyra and Mythra with him being the main fighter and them functioning as assists like they did in Xenoblade 2. I could see Min Min return over Springman though just because she seems generally more popular UNLESS they add both!

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Honestly, I’d say the only ones almost guaranteed up for the axe next game are some of the previously one off melee vets, but even then characters like Young Link and Pichu having easy movesets doesn’t mean they are leaving.

3rd Party cuts are a whole other ballpark of hypotheticals, almost all of which have no real evidence to back their logic. The only 3rd Party we’ve ever seen cut thus far has been Snake. With Ultimate necessitating everyones return, and DLC heavily favoring 3rd Parties. Next Smashes roster is essentially impossible to predict without blind luck.

Yeah, the next game's veteran prediction discussion probably won't be all that interesting.

"It's time to plaaaaay who's coming back?!!!"

Spoiler

Definitely

Probably
()
Maybe
/
Maybe Not
(To be clear though, while I wouldn't bet on them, their return wouldn't really surprise me either)
???

Only as DLC (Unless Something Changes)

 

[Jondolio]

I dunno man. There's a pretty good chance I won't buy the next game if it's not an enhanced port. Ultimate isn't perfect, but I'll be damned if it isn't the closest the series will ever be to that.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I'm really just hoping that the Gen 9 Grass starter is Grass/Dark when fully evolved.

Then we can have a complete set of Dark starters in Smash with Greninja/Incineroar/newcomer!

Yeah, the next game's veteran prediction discussion probably won't be all that interesting.

"It's time to plaaaaay who's coming back?!!!"

 

[N3ON]

Ah yes. My least favorite part of the smash discussion, the cuts. And its usually the most biased and annoying part of the deal because it usually boils down to cutting down all echoes and clones, discarding at least half the characters of the most represented series in smash (Mario, Pokemon and Fire Emblem), getting rid of most of the unique fighters because "they are not relevant", hoping to get rid of characters because they dont like their playstyles and putting their characters in a pedestal (Cutting my char! No way! Its great and its cool. Sakurai would never cut down my character. Its the others that deserve to be put on the chopping block.).

Clones, series with a large amount of representation, and third-parties (though you didn't say this one) are probably the likeliest categories to experience cuts though, so given we can only do vague guesswork about future cuts, focusing on those groups makes sense.

I'm not for people suggesting characters be cut simply because they dislike them, and that happens, but I notice people who are against talking about cuts often oversimplify the discourse around cuts to people simply exercising their bias, when, I mean, just by some of the categories you listed as typical talking points, there is often more thought put into it than just "I dislike x, cut them".

 

[Adrianette Bromide]

Yeah, the next game's veteran prediction discussion probably won't be all that interesting.

"It's time to plaaaaay who's coming back?!!!"

Spoiler

Definitely

Probably
()
Maybe
/
Maybe Not
(To be clear though, while I wouldn't bet on them, their return wouldn't really surprise me either)
???

Only as DLC (Unless Something Changes)

Steve is a mega wildcard. I think he'd be too much of a bother to program back in but also out of every third party character, he'd gotta be the easiest to get back maybe third only to Sonic and Bayo. I also wouldn't be surprised if Joker was cut for whoever the P6 protagonist is.

 

[DanganZilla5]

It's virtually impossible to predict who will get cut. I feel like many characters on the roster have reasons to stay and be cut. I know certain people (You know who you are) think that it's ridiculous to cut a large portion of the roster but think about this for a moment. Even if they just port over the engine of Ultimate and keep the same balancing the fees to keep all of the third parties will undoubtedly be super high.

I don't have many bets on who will get cut, but I do believe that if Smash wants to evolve and survive cutting fan favorites, they will have to do something else like make a brand new story mode with cutscenes and character interactions or introduce a bunch of brand new modes and improve the online.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Additionally, I wonder if Rex might join Smash 6 alongside Pyra and Mythra with him being the main fighter and them functioning as assists like they did in Xenoblade 2. I could see Min Min return over Springman though just because she seems generally more popular UNLESS they add both!

Considering Sonic hasn't changed much, Ganon took forever to get his swords, Sakurai generally doesn't like changing how characters work between installments, and trying to do this sort of thing had technical issues and that's why Pyra and Mythra are the way they are, I doubt that for Rex.

And I definitely think Min Min will stick considering she's the director of ARMS' favorite character and is also just generally pretty popular.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Yeah, the next game's veteran prediction discussion probably won't be all that interesting.

"It's time to plaaaaay who's coming back?!!!"

Spoiler

Definitely

Probably
()
Maybe
/
Maybe Not
(To be clear though, while I wouldn't bet on them, their return wouldn't really surprise me either)
???

Only as DLC (Unless Something Changes)

Re: Hero - I think the biggest obstacle here is Koichi Sugiyama, who’s notoriously stingy with his music. He’s very old, if he’s passed away by next Smash reacquiring the rights to Hero might be a bit easier. Might.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If I may ask, are you talking about the Smash community as a whole (I'm getting that impression) or specific segments of it? I just want to be sure since I got a little confused.

It was a generalization, but most of my perception of the community does come from here, so there could be quite a lot of bias that wouldn't be there if I was on more sites.

 

[Dinoman96]

I don't have many bets on who will get cut, but I do believe that if Smash wants to evolve and survive cutting fan favorites, they will have to do something else like make a brand new story mode with cutscenes and character interactions or introduce a bunch of brand new modes and improve the online.

Honestly I don't stuff like that is gonna make up for losing popular veterans for most people lol

Like there is a reason Ultimate practically sacrified everything else (game modes, trophies, etc) in favour of having the biggest possible character/stage roster, because they knew that's what people really cared about more than anything else.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Hot take I actually like Spirits

the fact they’re easier to make means more games can be represented

I only wish they came with lore blurbs, and that Spirit representation was more consistent for a few games

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I also just realized that outside of Doc not coming back for Brawl (and he came back the next game anyway), Smash has never really cut a Mario character before?

In Melee obviously nobody was cut, Brawl only cut Doc, Smash 4 added Rosalina, Bowser Jr., and brought Doc back without cutting anyone, and then Ultimate obviously brought everyone back and then added Plant.

Granted, this probably has to do with Mario's main 4 being pretty untouchable, since it's the Mario Bros., Peach, and Bowser, but like I don't expect Rosalina or Jr. to get cut either, so unless Doc or Plant is getting cut, I don't see the Mario roster changing much unless next game is a big shake up.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Shroob where’d you hear about the 17th for the State of Play? Everywhere I’m checking says the 9th

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Hot take I actually like Spirits

the fact they’re easier to make means more games can be represented

I only wish they came with lore blurbs, and that Spirit representation was more consistent for a few games

I like them too, but I wish they were more accessible, that all abilities were useful outside of them, and that some of them (I think it's just the transformations) were active on every stock rather than only at the beginning of the match.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Shroob where’d you hear about the 17th for the State of Play? Everywhere I’m checking says the 9th

I think it might be because they used the date emote on Twitter, which shows the 17th, even though the State of Play is on the 9th.

 

[subterrestrial]

I'm really just hoping that the Gen 9 Grass starter is Grass/Dark when fully evolved.

Then we can have a complete set of Dark starters in Smash with Greninja/Incineroar/newcomer!

inb4 zarude cp11

 

[Momotsuki]

Honestly if this community were calling the shots, it would probably go down something like this:

Spoiler

Kept:

Kept, but please fix:

Voted off the island:
()
Shrugs all around:
/

And that might be a bit optimistic. Might also be slightly incorrect in some places, but either way, it's a good thing we don't have to deal with that.

You take away my good doctor again and we're gonna have a problem.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Mewtwo is the only outlier because idk actually why they cut him from Brawl.

Time constraints, had Sonic not been last minute, Mewtwo may have come back in Brawl as they almost finished the game as is and Sega came in saying they can use Sonic and a Wii games couldn't handle DLC or even a patch, Sakurai saw it as now or never and shifted all priorities on Sonic

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Also I'm hopeful Banjo will be back next game since Sakurai said it was pretty easy to secure him for Ultimate, plus Banjo's company-mate is Steve, who I would imagine would come back, being from the best selling video game of all time that's very marketable and has been in a pretty good relationship with Nintendo.

Both are Microsoft owned, so I imagine if one comes back, so will the other, and they both have pretty good reasons to stick around, especially when Phil Spencer specifically WANTED Banjo in Smash before they got in.

I feel like Microsoft will be surprisingly easy to get back in, all things considered.

 

[Gengar84]

Also I'm hopeful Banjo will be back next game since Sakurai said it was pretty easy to secure him for Ultimate, plus Banjo's company-mate is Steve, who I would imagine would come back, being from the best selling video game of all time that's very marketable and has been in a pretty good relationship with Nintendo.

Both are Microsoft owned, so I imagine if one comes back, so will the other, and they both have pretty good reasons to stick around, especially when Phil Spencer specifically WANTED Banjo in Smash before they got in.

I feel like Microsoft will be surprisingly easy to get back in, all things considered.

I’m hoping that means we can expect more Microsoft characters in the future (mostly from RARE). RARE’s games from the SNES to the N64 were pretty much synonymous with Nintendo for me and I’d love to see a few more get in over time. Not to mention other iconic Microsoft owned characters like Master Chief and Doomguy.

 

[Shroob]

I think it might be because they used the date emote on Twitter, which shows the 17th, even though the State of Play is on the 9th.

Why would they do that.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Why would they do that.

I mean the emoji shows July 17 soooo unless you got a time machine…