Official DLC Speculation Discussion Volume II

[SharkLord]

The best scenario would be a Klonoa Mii. If he actually got that sort of acknowledgement at all, it'd be a milestone for him.

 

[TheMightyP]

Actually the pre-9/11 world was freakin' great. You could buy a house for a pocketful of lint and didn't even have to take your shoes off at the airport. It's too bad you'll never experience it.

Eh, tbh, I think I'd rather not experience a pre 9/11 world. Some things might have beem a bit better, but I think it would've been worse for me overall given my uh... color.


Now to keep things a bit on topic, I think we may get a Deluxe Mii Costume this time around.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Well, I haven't been one to post here in a while because I've just been busy with other things in life and just not having a ton to say about Smash, but I think Kazuya was definitely a great surprise and specifically one because I think everybody (and I honestly think fairly rightfully) ruled out Tekken when we saw Heihachi's costume come back with Min Min. And like sure, some people will argue that nothing matters in a sort of weirdly nihilistic kind of take that helps a character they want, but like, even within this DLC cycle that's an incredibly odd thing to actively have happen. I guess Nintendo could genuinely have gone for a "throw them off the trail" approach and Tekken was a thing myself and others brought up as in a great position because of Heihachi's absence in Pass 1, but it's still really weird he came a whole year before Kazuya.

But I'm all for this reality given how big Tekken is and how cool of a crossover moment it is to have the Street Fighter vs King of Fighters vs Tekken match in Smash now. And with how much I loved Terry, I suspect I love Kazuya similarly. It was a really great new franchise in Smash moment overall.

And it does do some interesting things to speculation with how I do think it puts things like Pokemon, Monster Hunter, and Capcom in general back on the table in a weird way (but not someone like Geno or say Astral Chain where the option has been explicitly placed in another role in the game already and I don't think Heihachi's Costume breaks this because there's a massive difference between being a background option and playable). I think Capcom coming back into this is exciting and I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see Capcom close out the pass at this point given who all has come back this pass. Sega also could make some sense here. It could also just be another "lowkey first party" but I also wouldn't have expected Tekken to come this late with ARMS opening and XC2 in the middle, so they're already not really following the same hype picks first only option to begin with in this structure, so I think a bigger, though maybe not the biggest closer could be an option too.

I dunno, Kazuya brings some neat stuff to the table and makes me wanna talk about Smash one more time before the ride ends. Still a shame we're closing out with Pass 2, but at least Pass 2 has had some real neat stuff to close us out on.

 

[PeridotGX]

I've been thinking that the lack of Indie spirits since pass 2 started is kinda suspicious, but we also had Tekken costumes before the Tekken rep.

Nothing makes sense anymore!

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Also, one thing I did wanna point out based on some conversations earlier. I think it's worth acknowledging Smash has had a bit of a direction change in character choices trending towards more big crossover moments with third parties during Smash 4's DLC period. Sure it didn't exclusively become a celebrating of gaming icons, but those options certainly got considerably more emphasis starting around that time and I don't think it's any mistake we're basically just Monster Hunter and Resident Evil short of having every single major third party franchise with sales over 30 million total in the game (I mean there is like PES and Gran Turismo, but when we think of options for character driven games that aren't based on real life, Smash basically has it). That's a pretty damn impressive achievement no matter how you slice it and I think that obvious focus has created an enviornment in which people look to those options more immediately.

I'll also go out of my way to say I don't think Smash is all that more toxic than it was back in the Smash 4 early era. If anything, it's more welcoming because entire fandoms have chances to join as opposed to the strict adherence to "only first parties and super duper special third parties that are 'Nintendo' enough" that pervaded Brawl and Smash 4's cycles. A number of people treated Snake like an unnecessary outsider and Ridley talk was so toxic it got the thread shut down. Stuff like King K. Rool vs Dixie Kong could also get into pretty rough arguments that were all about "deserving" as well. Like I think it's easy to look through rose tinted glasses at these periods of time, especially if they were more favorable to your choice, but I think there were plenty of issues that were just as prevalent back then as they are now when it comes to gatekeeping, toxic commentary, etc.

The only thing that's really changed is Smash got bigger and more people joined in on the hype speculation train, so you're more likely to experience certain types of fans more often than we used to.

 

[Arcanir]

That is kind of what I was getting at. I also don’t really take into account non game appearances like the anime or Pachinko machines. To my knowledge, it has been a long time since we’ve had a new entry into the series.

Really though, I have no idea because I still consider Battletoads retro even though they had a new game recently so nothing I say really makes any sense lol.

Even if you're restricting the term to just games the last Castlevania game before Ultimate was Lords of Shadow 2, which released four years before (2014). Also, even if you were to restrict it to just Simon he still appeared in Mirror of Fate, which was only a year more then the sequel (2013). In either case the series wouldn't be retro as both were active within the decade, and with the IP being used in other ways like the show saying it's retro is a bit unfitting.

 

[Faso115]

A surefire way to win is to predict a game and not a character. Much more likely to be on the money if you end up being correct.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Also, one thing I did wanna point out based on some conversations earlier. I think it's worth acknowledging Smash has had a bit of a direction change in character choices trending towards more big crossover moments with third parties during Smash 4's DLC period. Sure it didn't exclusively become a celebrating of gaming icons, but those options certainly got considerably more emphasis starting around that time and I don't think it's any mistake we're basically just Monster Hunter and Resident Evil short of having every single major third party franchise with sales over 30 million total in the game (I mean there is like PES and Gran Turismo, but when we think of options for character driven games that aren't based on real life, Smash basically has it). That's a pretty damn impressive achievement no matter how you slice it and I think that obvious focus has created an enviornment in which people look to those options more immediately.

I'll also go out of my way to say I don't think Smash is all that more toxic than it was back in the Smash 4 early era. If anything, it's more welcoming because entire fandoms have chances to join as opposed to the strict adherence to "only first parties and super duper special third parties that are 'Nintendo' enough" that pervaded Brawl and Smash 4's cycles. A number of people treated Snake like an unnecessary outsider and Ridley talk was so toxic it got the thread shut down. Stuff like King K. Rool vs Dixie Kong could also get into pretty rough arguments that were all about "deserving" as well. Like I think it's easy to look through rose tinted glasses at these periods of time, especially if they were more favorable to your choice, but I think there were plenty of issues that were just as prevalent back then as they are now when it comes to gatekeeping, toxic commentary, etc.

The only thing that's really changed is Smash got bigger and more people joined in on the hype speculation train, so you're more likely to experience certain types of fans more often than we used to.

I think the best example is how nobody gave a flying **** about Timesplitters and Trapezium ended up getting over 50 likes on a post about the series being given another shot. Meanwhile back in the Smash 4 days you got **** like the Master Chief thread where it's not Nintendo enough so it got shut down but not before people gleefully coming in to the thread just to say that it never would and never should happen, I lurk some support threads out of curiousity and trying to expand my horizons and idk, I feel that this is much less of a problem than it used to be

 

[MaplePie]

Okay so I missed the discussion but I’d like to mention I don’t think Nintendo can do anything with Mother without Itoi’s involvement; maybe I’m wrong and there are some things they can do, but Itoi and his Hobonichi company or whatever (if not just himself) have the most control it seems which is why they can do stuff without Nintendo’s involvement.

Itoi did also say he was done with the series’ games iirc, however I think he also said someone else could make a Mother 4, and idk if he’d be against remakes or not. Of course, fans may not want an official Mother 4 without Itoi, idk.

Itoi also seems to be good with fan stuff. With this and the ownership stuffs in mind, I guess Mother 4 didn’t have to be canceled in fear of Nintendo Ninjas, haha, but hey at least they’re making a cool original game based on Mother that can be put on Switch and still takes characters and stuff from what was going to be their idea of Mother 4 (I’m referring to the Oddity game).

also put Porky in Smash please and thank you.

Hell yeah Porky as the final character!

friendly reminder that every smash game got a "retro rep" except ultimate

What about Simon Belmont?

 

[Guynamednelson]

more people joined in on the hype speculation train, so you're more likely to experience certain types of fans more often than we used to.

I mean yeah, that always happens. The bigger a fan/userbase, the more hostility happens. This can easily be seen with Twitter due to its massive influx of Tumblr refugees.

 

[subterrestrial]

What about Simon Belmont?

castlevania series is still alive rn, not rly the same as rob, ice climbers, duck hunt etc. I'd love to see a throwback character like we get every installment but tbh I doubt its happening. balloon fighter would've been cool tho like a reverse little mac

 

[Idon]

castlevania series is still alive rn, not rly the same as rob, ice climbers, duck hunt etc. I'd love to see a throwback character like we get every installment but tbh I doubt its happening. balloon fighter would've been cool tho like a reverse little mac

You mean Jigglypuff?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

You mean Jigglypuff?

She's also a fighter who is a balloon so even more fitting.

Also, Retro Reps were never really a thing, Sakurai always called them surprise characters and this time, it was Plant as stated by the man himself. Oh, and call me crazy, but the GBA is retro, ******'s 20 years old after all yet Retro Rep is only ever used to describe NES characters

 

[Idon]

She's also a fighter who is a balloon so even more fitting.

Also, Retro Reps were never really a thing, Sakurai always called them surprise characters and this time, it was Plant as stated by the man himself. Oh, and call me crazy, but the GBA is retro, ******'s 20 years old after all yet Retro Rep is only ever used to describe NES characters

Yes, this is how Lyn wins...
as the retro rep.

Whatever it takes.

 

[Stratos]

I think as the last DLC character should come the Reiji Arisu from Namco × Capcom.

 

[Bobthealligator]

If Nightmare doesn't get a mii costume I will be really confused. I'm also thinking that we won't get Lloyd this time. Tekken has a lot of characters so I think they'll all be either Tekken or Soul Calibur characters.
As for the last character, it's common practice for them to end on a really recent character to help keep the series feeling fresh for longer. Honestly I think the SMT V protagonist is the only character I can really think of that fits that criteria (they could go a different way, this is the last fighter of a game that was basically pure fan service, they may want to go out with a bang)

 

[DanganZilla5]

My predictions for the Mii costumes are:
Jin Kazuya
Kuma
one of the other popular characters, most likely will be someone who was also in the original
Nightmare
Agumon
Lloyd

Personally I'm also wishing for a Klonoa costume. Anything to give that cutie representation would be great. BTW I'm still waiting on that Klonoa Encore Bamco.

 

[Dinoman96]

I don't really see the SMTV protagonist happening, because I don't think they want to put a character in Smash before their game actually comes out.

Yeah I know Roy, but that was 20 years ago and he was just a last minute clone anyways. At least with Corrin, FE Fates had already been released in Japan for like half a year before he was announced for Smash. A similar thing with Byleth, who also was announced half a year after 3H had its worldwide debut.

SMTV is releasing in November, and Nintendo will more than likely reveal the final character in their inevitable September Direct, which means that the last character will probably release around that timeframe and thus before SMTV even comes out.

 

[Perkilator]

I got another question about another potential candidate for an "Equilibrium" trailer involving a DLC character killing both Galeem and Dharkon: Would a Mortal Kombat character make a good candidate for that, since MK characters tend to kill both dark gods (such as Shinnok) and light gods (such as Kronika and Cetrion)?

Here's my idea for an "equilibrium" trailer; it would start out with Galeem and Dharkon fighting each other...and then a light would appear from the sky and land on the ground.

"Light and darkness are not your playthings."

Sora
Lights the Way!

 

[3BitSaurus]

Personally I'm also wishing for a Klonoa costume. Anything to give that cutie representation would be great. BTW I'm still waiting on that Klonoa Encore Bamco.

I think it's funny: Klonoa is one of my MW's, but I actually have so little confidence in him making it in anytime from now till Smash 7 that a Mii Costume now would be a ******* blessing in my eyes.

Like, seriously, even if the series was active, I don't think I'd be expecting Klonoa until we got, like... 2 or 3 more Bamco reps.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

If you had to pick one 'fourth party' franchise to get a fighter - is there anyone beside Geralt from the Witcher who would fit?

On top of Lloyd potentially Nightmare as well.

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

On top of Lloyd potentially Nightmare as well.

They're not fourth party... I think you quoted the wrong post.

 

[Twilord]

On top of Lloyd potentially Nightmare as well.

"Fourth party" means characters from franchises that didn't start as games. The Witcher started as novels.

 

[Staarih]

Hadn't thought about Klonoa, now would be a perfect opportunity for a costume for him, would be really cool.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Fourth party term doesnt exsits. Just say "character not from a game". Bruh

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Crap quoted the wrong post.

 

[Twilord]

Fourth party term doesnt exsits. Just say "character not from a game". Bruh

Language evolves to suit the culture or subculture or community it is used by. Smash speculation is able to generate terms that serve its purposes. There is nothing wrong with using those terms, you just have an obligation to explain them when needs be.

 

[subterrestrial]

we need a 5th party rep from a different dimension entirely

 

[Twilord]

we need a 5th party rep from a different dimension entirely

5th party means a different Smash Bros character's Fursona.

Fox is 5th party via Bayonetta.



6th party means someone else's fursona...

Lucario and Incineroar are 6th party.

 

[Gengar84]

Even if you're restricting the term to just games the last Castlevania game before Ultimate was Lords of Shadow 2, which released four years before (2014). Also, even if you were to restrict it to just Simon he still appeared in Mirror of Fate, which was only a year more then the sequel (2013). In either case the series wouldn't be retro as both were active within the decade, and with the IP being used in other ways like the show saying it's retro is a bit unfitting.

Yeah, that’s a fair point. I guess it isn’t really retro then. There aren’t really many notable games left that are strictly retro.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

If you had to pick one 'fourth party' franchise to get a fighter - is there anyone beside Geralt from the Witcher who would fit?

hmmmm... That's a difficult one because the term doesn't exist.

Just say "character not from a game".

Ah that made it much more simple to choose. If I had to pick one character that has no involvement with electronic or computer devices that output a video signal or visual image to display a video game that one or more people can play through some type of game controller which is commonly known as a video game console and exclusively appears on telecommunication mediums used for transmitting moving images in monochrome (black and white), or in color, and in two or three dimensions and sound known as a television that with the use of a Set top box, an information appliance device that generally contains a TV-tuner input and displays output to a television set and an external source of signal, turning the source signal into content in a form that can then be displayed on the television screen or other display device which allows you to view television channels which are a terrestrial frequency or virtual number over which a television station or television network is distributed, one these being the adult oriented nighttime programming block, Adult Swim which is the child company of the American cable television channel owned by the Kids, Young Adults and Classics division of Warner Bros. Entertainment, itself a subsidiary of AT&T's WarnerMedia Cartoon Network, I would choose the main protagonist of the show called Xavier Renegade Angel, a self-absorbed and oblivious faun-like shaman wanderer that speaks in a surfer accent with delusions of grandeur from the American computer-animated adult surrealist dark comedy tv show created by Vernon Chatman and John Lee with animation done by the company, Cinematico that first aired back in November 4th 2007 and ended somewhere in 2009, and his name is...

Xavier, Renegade Angel! Fruitatta!

 

[RouffWestie]

If you had to pick one 'fourth party' franchise to get a fighter - is there anyone beside Geralt from the Witcher who would fit?

Lego Mario

 

[Twilord]

hmmmm... That's a difficult one because the term doesn't exist

Are you uncomfortable with the concept that language is fluid and exists to serve the purposes of the culture, subculture, or community which it is used by? Or are you just unfamiliar with the popular usage in Smash Speculation circles to quickly refer to "a character from a franchise which did not originate as a video game series"?

If it's the latter, hopefully I have resolved the issue for you. If the former... I don't know how to communicate effectively with people who have philosophical issue with the base concepts of communication, so I really just have to hope it's not the former.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

Are you uncomfortable with the concept that language is fluid and exists to serve the purposes of the culture, subculture, or community which it is used by? Or are you just unfamiliar with the popular usage in Smash Speculation circles to quickly refer to "a character from a franchise which did not originate as a video game series"?

If it's the latter, hopefully I have resolved the issue for you. If the former... I don't know how to communicate effectively with people who have philosophical issue with the base concepts of communication, so I really just have to hope it's not the former.

Nah I was just being sarcastic. I knew what you meant.

 

[BritishGuy54]

I’m just gonna say it. Eggman for the win. Planet Wisp as stage, October unveiling, and of course, Freddy Fazbear mii costume for the spooks.

 

[Speed Weed]

hmmmm... That's a difficult one because the term doesn't exist.



Ah that made it much more simple to choose. If I had to pick one character that has no involvement with electronic or computer devices that output a video signal or visual image to display a video game that one or more people can play through some type of game controller which is commonly known as a video game console and exclusively appears on telecommunication mediums used for transmitting moving images in monochrome (black and white), or in color, and in two or three dimensions and sound known as a television that with the use of a Set top box, an information appliance device that generally contains a TV-tuner input and displays output to a television set and an external source of signal, turning the source signal into content in a form that can then be displayed on the television screen or other display device which allows you to view television channels which are a terrestrial frequency or virtual number over which a television station or television network is distributed, one these being the adult oriented nighttime programming block, Adult Swim which is the child company of the American cable television channel owned by the Kids, Young Adults and Classics division of Warner Bros. Entertainment, itself a subsidiary of AT&T's WarnerMedia Cartoon Network, I would choose the main protagonist of the show called Xavier Renegade Angel, a self-absorbed and oblivious faun-like shaman wanderer that speaks in a surfer accent with delusions of grandeur from the American computer-animated adult surrealist dark comedy tv show created by Vernon Chatman and John Lee with animation done by the company, Cinematico that first aired back in November 4th 2007 and ended somewhere in 2009, and his name is...

Xavier, Renegade Angel! Fruitatta!
View attachment 319939

I can't wait to recreate one of the most iconic scenes in television history by doing an Xavier mirror match

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I can't wait to recreate one of the most iconic scenes in television history by doing an Xavier mirror match

And when the crowd chants, they yell "Take that, taste the pain".

 

[Hydreigonfan01]

On the Smash Bros Subreddit, someone decided on a game on how they'd change the reveals and one of the responses was to put Sephiroth as the E3 2021 reveal.

Nintendo would have won E3 so easily with that.

 

[Momotsuki]

Nintendo would have won E3 so easily with that.

You say it like they didn't with Kazuya... and Metroid Dread... and a new WarioWare... and finally a look at BotW's sequel...

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

and finally a look at BotW's sequel...

Still wish they could have given us a better title than "The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild's sequel".