COMPETITIVE Brawl+: Code Agenda

[MookieRah]

I got a chance to play more with my other roommate. He is a casual player, and he really likes the changes overall. He enjoys Brawl+ more than Vanilla Brawl, so yah, it's not just a "competitive player" thing.

...Such a beautiful thing :')

Agreed.

This is a bit random, and maybe my timing is just sloppy + a lack of playing him, but I have a lot of trouble doing multiple jumps with Dedede with 0 buffer on.

You are just jumping too early with him, you'll have to learn when you can jump. It's really not that hard though, spend about 5 minutes practicing and you'll get it.

@Starscream
I'm thinking a vertical knockback code isn't all that necessary unless we really pump up the downwards gravity. Even at 1.25 that I'm playing on I just mix up CF's uthrow, which does seem to combo if they DI bad, so w00t, CF is still get great setups and this time it's more skill intensive since you can't spam down throw and have guaranteed hits.

@Kupo
I'm testing various things with the weak shield stun. Like I said earlier 3 was too much stun, as it allowed me to pretty much lock players in shields with jabs. 2.5 wasn't enough as it didn't feel too much different from normal Brawl. Whenever my friend gets back from choir I'll try out 2.75. I think that, or around that figure, will be perfect. I think 3 for the strong shield code is absolutely perfect.

Also, I don't find anything wrong with the shield stun codes. I don't experience the extra sliding people were complaining about, it seems to be working normally to me. I know weak moves don't make you move, and that is the most important thing. Jab to grab is awesome again, and now when I sweet spot a knee I don't get shield grabbed! Yay!

I'll probably ask pw if we can have more invincibility frames for both codes anyway.

The lagless code definitely needs more invincibility. Like almost twice as much. As it stands if I jump off the ledge I'm almost immediately vulnerable and moves like Pika's jab and G&W's downtilt just **** you. If I had invincibility I could actually get back on the stage. In melee Link had almost as much invulnerability to fully land a fair coming from the ledge before the invulnerability wore off.

The dash dance code needs to allow for shielding during the initial dash animation. Other than that it is freakin gold. I'm LOVING it, although I have to get used to Falcon's distances (sadly it's not quite as good as it was in Melee >_<).

 

[shanus]

I got a chance to play more with my other roommate. He is a casual player, and he really likes the changes overall. He enjoys Brawl+ more than Vanilla Brawl, so yah, it's not just a "competitive player" thing.
Agreed.
You are just jumping too early with him, you'll have to learn when you can jump. It's really not that hard though, spend about 5 minutes practicing and you'll get it.

@Starscream
I'm thinking a vertical knockback code isn't all that necessary unless we really pump up the downwards gravity. Even at 1.25 that I'm playing on I just mix up CF's uthrow, which does seem to combo if they DI bad, so w00t, CF is still get great setups and this time it's more skill intensive since you can't spam down throw and have guaranteed hits.

@Kupo
I'm testing various things with the weak shield stun. Like I said earlier 3 was too much stun, as it allowed me to pretty much lock players in shields with jabs. 2.5 wasn't enough as it didn't feel too much different from normal Brawl. Whenever my friend gets back from choir I'll try out 2.75. I think that, or around that figure, will be perfect. I think 3 for the strong shield code is absolutely perfect.

Also, I don't find anything wrong with the shield stun codes. I don't experience the extra sliding people were complaining about, it seems to be working normally to me. I know weak moves don't make you move, and that is the most important thing. Jab to grab is awesome again, and now when I sweet spot a knee I don't get shield grabbed! Yay!


The lagless code definitely needs more invincibility. Like almost twice as much. As it stands if I jump off the ledge I'm almost immediately vulnerable and moves like Pika's jab and G&W's downtilt just **** you. If I had invincibility I could actually get back on the stage. In melee Link had almost as much invulnerability to fully land a fair coming from the ledge before the invulnerability wore off.

The dash dance code needs to allow for shielding during the initial dash animation. Other than that it is freakin gold. I'm LOVING it, although I have to get used to Falcon's distances (sadly it's not quite as good as it was in Melee >_<).

All I've been playing with is mostly falcon now. He is so beast once you get used to the new combos. I have some true beauty's recorded with 10% hitstun and 1.1 fallspeed. With some more practice I know you'll be seeing the same thing. (I was a melee falco and falcon player)

 

[MookieRah]

I already see ridiculous combos XD. I even got off a few YES! combos with the new setup already. Yummy stuff. YES! combos are insta-death at almost any percent on Warioware.

Speaking of Warioware, it is the great equalizer. For all the characters with crappy recoveries it is the ultimate counter-pick. One can't use great recoveries when everyone dies at low percents due the size of the stage. CF, Marth, Ganon, Ike, etc do very well there. Great stage.

 

[zxeon]

I already see ridiculous combos XD. I even got off a few YES! combos with the new setup already. Yummy stuff. YES! combos are insta-death at almost any percent on Warioware.

Speaking of Warioware, it is the great equalizer. For all the characters with crappy recoveries it is the ultimate counter-pick. One can't use great recoveries when everyone dies at low percents due the size of the stage. CF, Marth, Ganon, Ike, etc do very well there. Great stage.

It's like the revival of Melee's Yoshi's Story close quarters madness.

 

[Eaode]

I already see ridiculous combos XD. I even got off a few YES! combos with the new setup already. Yummy stuff. YES! combos are insta-death at almost any percent on Warioware.

Speaking of Warioware, it is the great equalizer. For all the characters with crappy recoveries it is the ultimate counter-pick. One can't use great recoveries when everyone dies at low percents due the size of the stage. CF, Marth, Ganon, Ike, etc do very well there. Great stage.

Kind of like Melee YS, no?

EDIT: Beat <_>

 

[MookieRah]

It's like the revival of Melee's Yoshi's Story close quarters madness.

It's like Yoshi's Story on crack though. Marth tippers and knees kill at like 60%. It's nutty. Ironically, it seems to be an INCREDIBLY neutral stage despite that, and the ledges are pretty unique.

 

[Starscream]

@Starscream
I'm thinking a vertical knockback code isn't all that necessary unless we really pump up the downwards gravity. Even at 1.25 that I'm playing on I just mix up CF's uthrow, which does seem to combo if they DI bad, so w00t, CF is still get great setups and this time it's more skill intensive since you can't spam down throw and have guaranteed hits.

What about Utilt spam? The effects of a low amount of move stale or no staling at all will be negated by the higher fall speed.

Speaking of stale moves, anyone tried to make a 1/3 stale moves yet? Or is anyone working on stale damage only?

Also, I don't find anything wrong with the shield stun codes. I don't experience the extra sliding people were complaining about, it seems to be working normally to me. I know weak moves don't make you move, and that is the most important thing. Jab to grab is awesome again, and now when I sweet spot a knee I don't get shield grabbed! Yay!

Are you using the 1 line code as well? What values are you using for each?

 

[K1T3]

The dash dance code needs to allow for shielding during the initial dash animation. Other than that it is freakin gold. I'm LOVING it, although I have to get used to Falcon's distances (sadly it's not quite as good as it was in Melee >_<).

I've been saying this for over a month now.... people always respond with dashdancing is already too good on it's own and being able to shield during it will make it broken......
I of course disagree. Though I would be fine if you could simply crouch during your initial dash animation, one should then shield from there.
Though techinically you can shield, I've been able to dash pivot shield, but it causes you to face the opposite direction and is fairly difficult, it's still there.

Lagless ledge does need more invincibility.

It would be rather nice if down airs didn't auto fast fall.

10% hitstun is fine at lower gravity modifiers. I'm playing at 1.3x though and it is wayyy too much. I then moved to 9% and it is still too much. I will try 8% next as has been suggested for that gravity setting and hopefully that will be fine.

Mookie try non falcon characters, I was just playing on random and was easily pulling off dirty combos that shouldn't work with most characters and I have manual L cancel on and 0 buffer so comboing should be much harder. Especially since I don't really play these characters at all or know their movesets and yet I'm easily comboing right off the bat, that's just not right.

My code list for reference.

no tripping
manual l cancel
hitstun 8%
lagless ledges
No auto sweetspot ledges
dash cancel with down
hold shield for independent pokemon
air release / ground release modifier
dash dancing
both heavy and light attack shield stun codes set to 3 (jab doesn't seem overpowered to me but maybe I need more testing?)
1.3 downwards gravity mod
buffer set to 0

 

[Eaode]

It's like Yoshi's Story on crack though. Marth tippers and knees kill at like 60%. It's nutty. Ironically, it seems to be an INCREDIBLY neutral stage despite that, and the ledges are pretty unique.

Tippers kill early @ YS as well; my friend was right on the ledge (and the cloud lifted him off xD) and my tipper killed him at 45% (Roy) o_o

 

[shanus]

Does anyone else have too much fun playing against computers now (its actually amusing now!!)? I just did a dthrow triple nair light knee full knee on a donkey with captain falcon across all of final. Man do I love Brawl+.

 

[zxeon]

Does anyone else have too much fun playing against computers now (its actually amusing now!!)? I just did a dthrow triple nair light knee full knee on a donkey with captain falcon across all of final. Man do I love Brawl+.

Computer Game and Watch and Pikachu kick my *** sometimes.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

Does anyone else have too much fun playing against computers now (its actually amusing now!!)? I just did a dthrow triple nair light knee full knee on a donkey with captain falcon across all of final. Man do I love Brawl+.

i play computers a lot too

 

[SketchHurricane]

Well I just had to read like 10 **** pages. Thanks for being so active, guys

Go-go gadget WALL OF TEXT!

Can someone recommend a value for the lagless ledges code that makes it functional but not have a ridiculously fast animation?

Well I thought 2 (40000000) was a bit slow. I like 4 personally (40800000)

Wario Ledge action @ 40800000
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fForK5xSSUI#t=35s

i was thinking. if we ever get to a point where we need to rebalance characters, i think there's already a really easy way to do it..

http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Sticker#Power-Up_Effects

stickers!

This is an awesome idea and should really be looked into.

The buffer isn't a big deal. I also think that 10% hitstun is the way to go even with the gravity changes.

Has anyone else found that Teching is a lot easier at higher downward gravity? It seems easier to me cause the timing is better due to not being so ****ed floaty.

Yes, I actually noticed that the very first game I played with gravity on! The faster fall-speed just makes it feel more natural, reaction-wise. I bet we've all been teching too early do to a year+ of air-dodge canceling in VB. (BTW I like these new acronyms, B+ and VB ).

in the old lagless edge code I was able to ledge bounce, pull away from the edge before I was fully grasped. For example, I could illusion to the edge as Falco than pull back right away which almost made it look as though I bounced off the ledge. This feature is awesome, is it still possible? I couldn't tell if it was, and wasn't sure if it was because of the buffering.

Definitely not possible with the new ledge code. The old code actually interrupted the ledge-grab animation with back/down, whereas this code just speeds up the animation but still requires you to go through it. You'd need a pretty high modifier value to mimic the old code.

Speaking of Warioware, it is the great equalizer. For all the characters with crappy recoveries it is the ultimate counter-pick. One can't use great recoveries when everyone dies at low percents due the size of the stage. CF, Marth, Ganon, Ike, etc do very well there. Great stage.

Perfect example of why the stage codes should be fought for in the face of line limitations.

I've been saying this for over a month now.... people always respond with dashdancing is already too good on it's own and being able to shield during it will make it broken......

I don't remember anyone saying it would be broken. We're just saying there is no need to patch it since you are technically trading defense for offense, which makes sense.

Though techinically you can shield, I've been able to dash pivot shield, but it causes you to face the opposite direction and is fairly difficult, it's still there.

WTH? You just discovered Power-Shielded RAR, my friend. I'm going to try this

10% hitstun is fine at lower gravity modifiers. I'm playing at 1.3x though and it is wayyy too much. I then moved to 9% and it is still too much. I will try 8% next as has been suggested for that gravity setting and hopefully that will be fine.

Looks like the recommended value pairs are thus:
1.1 / 10%
1.2 / 9%
1.3 / 8%

 

[shanus]

interesting bug. I didnt grab the edge or press down, i did my Up+b as falcon to the edge, it released automtically and i fell straight down and could up+B again instantly. Went through no grab animation or anything.

 

[storm92]

God I love Brawl+, beating up on CPUs has never been more fun.
This is what I'm running right now, seems to be fairly good:

ALC
10% Hitstun
No Trip
Both Shield Stun Codes (3)
No ASL
New Lagless Ledge
Downwards Gravity (1.15x)
Dash Dancing
Dash Cancel

I need to try out the buffer code.

But that seems pretty good for now ^, at least a compromise between some posts I've seen.

 

[K1T3]

WTH? You just discovered Power-Shielded RAR, my friend. I'm going to try this

Looks like the recommended value pairs are thus:
1.1 / 10%
1.2 / 9%
1.3 / 8%

Those values look rather nice =)

Hmm yeah even if shield while dashing isn't put in I guess it's not tooo bad, but it would still be nice to have as it was in both the other smash games as well.

The pivot shield is pretty difficult and will take a decent amount of practice to do regularly but that's a nice idea and use for it. If you could pivot regularly in melee though then it's pretty much the same timing so it should be easy for those that could already do any move out of a DA dash in melee.

God I love Brawl+, beating up on CPUs has never been more fun.
This is what I'm running right now, seems to be fairly good:

ALC
10% Hitstun
No Trip
Both Shield Stun Codes (3)
No ASL
New Lagless Ledge
Downwards Gravity (1.15x)
Dash Dancing
Dash Cancel

I need to try out the buffer code.

But that seems pretty good for now ^, at least a compromise between some posts I've seen.

Yeah my code combination is to optimize skill/practice/knowledge requirement for the game to increase it's depth and how well it will hold up and continue to be competative over the years with people still getting better and better.
Most people don't want that sort of thing though and like the basic idea of brawl being easy so that anyone can jump in and do well which is fine too.

It's really nice that with brawl + we can cater the game to exactly what we want and how complex or non we want it to be.

Side note, if there was anyway to combine the codes I have and include the MAD together into one and fit it into the 256 line requiement I would be really really happy.

 

[MookieRah]

Are you using the 1 line code as well? What values are you using for each?

I was using 3 for the 1 liner, but that was too much stun. I could pretty much lock people in shields with jabs. I tried 2.5 and it didn't seem to be much different than vanilla brawl. I'm going to try out 2.75 the next time I play (hopefully tonight).

The pivot shield is pretty difficult and will take a decent amount of practice to do regularly but that's a nice idea and use for it. If you could pivot regularly in melee though then it's pretty much the same timing so it should be easy for those that could already do any move out of a DA dash in melee.

Just because that is in the game I'm going to be against the shield improvement as this would actually be a rather awesome tech skill and seeing how there isn't much room for lines and you can technically do it then it's not worth the lines. I like run on sentences.

 

[Starscream]

Well, any input on the level of Utilt spam with 1.25 gravity without any knockback modifiers?

 

[MookieRah]

Well, any input on the level of Utilt spam with 1.25 gravity without any knockback modifiers?

Haven't tried it yet. I'll do it sometime soon though. Sheik's ftilt spam seemed a lil bit more spammible than in vanilla brawl, but really not much worse if that is any indication.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

So I'm looking at the tier list, and I'm thinking of possible ways of nerfing/buffing characters with stickers.

Here's a list of the modifiers available from the stickers.

[Arm] Attack - Increases the damage done by punches, slaps, and elbows.
[Leg] Attack - Increases the damage done by kicks and knees.
[Head] Attack - Increases the damage done by headbutts.
[Body] Attack - Increases the damage done by full-body attacks such as Dedede's dash attack.
[Spin] Attack - Increases the damage done by attacks which involve spinning.
[Tail] Attack - Increases the damage done by tail attacks.
[Bite] Attack - Increases the damage done by attacks which involve mouths.
[Slash] Attack - Increases the damage done by claws and sword attacks.
[Weapon] Attack - Increases the damage done by non-sword weapons, such as hammers.
[Throwing] Attack - Increases the damage done by throwing an enemy.
[Flame] Attack - Increases the damage done by fire-based attacks.
[Electric] Attack - Increases the damage done by electric attacks.
[Freezing] Attack - Increases the damage done by ice-based attacks.
[Water] Attack - Increases the damage done by water-based attacks.
[Grass] Attack - Increases the damage done by plant-based attacks.
[Energy] Attack - Increases the damage done by energy-based attacks such as Fox's Blaster.
[Magic] Attack - Increases the damage done by magical attacks.
[PK] Attack - Increases the damage done by psychic attacks.
[Aura] Attack - Increases the damage done by Aura-based attacks.
[Pikmin] Attack - Increases the damage done by Pikmin-based attacks.
[Darkness] Attack - Increases the damage done by Dark-based attacks.
[Explosives] Attack - Increases the damage done by Explosion-based attacks.
[Specials: Direct] Attack - Increases the damage done by physical special moves.
[Specials: Indirect] Attack - Increases the damage done by ranged special moves.

SS Tier
Meta Knight
-Spin
-Slash

S Tier
Snake
-Kicks

King Dedede
-Kicks

Mr. Game & Watch
-Weapon

ZSS
-Kicks

Samus
+Energy

Link
+Slash

 

[GPDP]

Alright, I did some testing, and I was able to determine which characters' recoveries suffer as a result of increased gravity. Here are the results at 1.5 gravity:

Link (Up B does not go as far in the air)
Samus (Up B, but only in the air, as doing it on the ground makes it gain the same distance as usual)
Luigi (down B when pressed repeatedly is nerfed, on both the ground and air)
Sonic (Up B, ground and air, as we all know)
Diddy (Up B distance is nerfed, ground and air)
Sheik (slightly, as the little bit of distance you gain when first performing her Up B is reduced)
Pit (his Up B is harder to control, and cannot go up as much)
Yoshi (slightly nerfs the distance gained from his Up B, but his double jump is unaffected)
Ice Climbers (both Side B and Up B are nerfed)
Dedede (Up B is nerfed on the ground and air)
Ness (his Up B is harder to aim because Ness falls faster, but double jump is unaffected)
Bowser (Up B gains less upward distance)
Toon Link (Same as Link, though obviously not to the same extent)
Lucas (harder to aim his Up B like Ness, but he stays floating a bit longer, so it's not as bad; double jump is also unaffected)

So that makes 14 characters with nerfed recoveries in some form or another, from the barely affected (Sheik and Yoshi) to the ones who really get hurt (Link and Sonic). As for double jumps, and characters like Kirby with many jumps, they obviously get nerfed, but as the Bunny Hood demonstrates, all that's needed is to increase jump launch power accordingly. Thus, increasing gravity and launch power accordingly would serve to make jumps faster, which would then be coupled with faster falling to truly speed up the air game, without messing with jump or short hop height.

The only problems left to solve, then, is the above-named recoveries. Thus, I propose a hacker take a look at the possibility of somehow exempting the affected recoveries from the ill effects of gravity.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

Alright, I did some testing, and I was able to determine which characters' recoveries suffer as a result of increased gravity. Here are the results at 1.5 gravity:

Link (Up B does not go as far in the air)
Samus (Up B, but only in the air, as doing it on the ground makes it gain the same distance as usual)
Luigi (down B when pressed repeatedly is nerfed, on both the ground and air)
Sonic (Up B, ground and air, as we all know)
Diddy (Up B distance is nerfed, ground and air)
Sheik (slightly, as the little bit of distance you gain when first performing her Up B is reduced)
Pit (his Up B is harder to control, and cannot go up as much)
Yoshi (slightly nerfs the distance gained from his Up B, but his double jump is unaffected)
Ice Climbers (both Side B and Up B are nerfed)
Dedede (Up B is nerfed on the ground and air)
Ness (his Up B is harder to aim because Ness falls faster, but double jump is unaffected)
Bowser (Up B gains less upward distance)
Toon Link (Same as Link, though obviously not to the same extent)
Lucas (harder to aim his Up B like Ness, but he stays floating a bit longer, so it's not as bad; double jump is also unaffected)

So that makes 14 characters with nerfed recoveries in some form or another, from the barely affected (Sheik and Yoshi) to the ones who really get hurt (Link and Sonic). As for double jumps, and characters like Kirby with many jumps, they obviously get nerfed, but as the Bunny Hood demonstrates, all that's needed is to increase jump launch power accordingly. Thus, increasing gravity and launch power accordingly would serve to make jumps faster, which would then be coupled with faster falling to truly speed up the air game, without messing with jump or short hop height.

The only problems left to solve, then, is the above-named recoveries. Thus, I propose a hacker take a look at the possibility of somehow exempting the affected recoveries from the ill effects of gravity.

umm this isn't really an issue as you can use just downward gravity to fall faster.

 

[leafgreen386]

Lower line count lagless ledges that actually works for stuff besides just getting off the ledge and... DASH DANCING?!?!?!?

Too good. Just way too good. There also appears to be a faster fast falls code, too? That could be fun to try out. We may not need to mess with gravity after all.

 

[zxeon]

Is that 1.5 fall speed?

 

[GPDP]

umm this isn't really an issue as you can use just downward gravity to fall faster.

I know that, but the way up is still incredibly floaty, and thus it takes quite a while with some characters to reach the apex of a jump and then fast fall into an aerial. It was with this in mind that the code for shorter short hops was made, but that has some nasty side effects of its own. Which is why I ask that we find a way to speed up jumps as a whole, and increasing launch power and gravity at the same time seems the way to do so. The only problem remains the recoveries I pointed out.

Is that 1.5 fall speed?

No, 1.5 gravity as a whole, up and down.

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

I know that, but the way up is still incredibly floaty, and thus it takes quite a while with some characters to reach the apex of a jump and then fast fall into an aerial. It was with this in mind that the code for shorter short hops was made, but that has some nasty side effects of its own. Which is why I ask that we find a way to speed up jumps as a whole, and increasing launch power and gravity at the same time seems the way to do so. The only problem remains the recoveries I pointed out.



No, 1.5 gravity as a whole, up and down.

i see. well, what i did was set my up gravity to 5% and set my shorthops to be a bit shorter, and it feels very controlled, however, i noticed that when i do a full hop its like i accidentally forgot to l cancel or something.

 

[Shell]

@ GPDP: That sounds like a lot of lines. I think that if you stick to a more moderate amount of gravity, recovering isn't too much of a problem.


The sticker idea is completely genius. Can you access stickers in versus mode, or are they locked on the other half of the disc with most of the other SSE stuff?

If it worked, it would likely be light on lines as it's using a built in mechanic.

Can you imagine applying a 2x "Spin attack" sticker effect to Link, and returning his up-B to its true glory?
This would save his current combo game, yet give him a great kill move again.

While I'm sure there would be a constant push/pull for different things to balance, the thought is so enticing...

 

[MBlaze]

Lower line count lagless ledges that actually works for stuff besides just getting off the ledge and... DASH DANCING?!?!?!?

Too good. Just way too good. There also appears to be a faster fast falls code, too? That could be fun to try out. We may not need to mess with gravity after all.

If we don't have to mess with the gravity then that would just be freakin perfect. I would test it out but I don't really know any values, but if this works I will prefer this WAY more than screwing with gravity!

 

[shanus]

Alright, I did some testing, and I was able to determine which characters' recoveries suffer as a result of increased gravity. Here are the results at 1.5 gravity:

Link (Up B does not go as far in the air)
Samus (Up B, but only in the air, as doing it on the ground makes it gain the same distance as usual)
Luigi (down B when pressed repeatedly is nerfed, on both the ground and air)
Sonic (Up B, ground and air, as we all know)
Diddy (Up B distance is nerfed, ground and air)
Sheik (slightly, as the little bit of distance you gain when first performing her Up B is reduced)
Pit (his Up B is harder to control, and cannot go up as much)
Yoshi (slightly nerfs the distance gained from his Up B, but his double jump is unaffected)
Ice Climbers (both Side B and Up B are nerfed)
Dedede (Up B is nerfed on the ground and air)
Ness (his Up B is harder to aim because Ness falls faster, but double jump is unaffected)
Bowser (Up B gains less upward distance)
Toon Link (Same as Link, though obviously not to the same extent)
Lucas (harder to aim his Up B like Ness, but he stays floating a bit longer, so it's not as bad; double jump is also unaffected)

So that makes 14 characters with nerfed recoveries in some form or another, from the barely affected (Sheik and Yoshi) to the ones who really get hurt (Link and Sonic). As for double jumps, and characters like Kirby with many jumps, they obviously get nerfed, but as the Bunny Hood demonstrates, all that's needed is to increase jump launch power accordingly. Thus, increasing gravity and launch power accordingly would serve to make jumps faster, which would then be coupled with faster falling to truly speed up the air game, without messing with jump or short hop height.

The only problems left to solve, then, is the above-named recoveries. Thus, I propose a hacker take a look at the possibility of somehow exempting the affected recoveries from the ill effects of gravity.

Personally, i think jumps are fast enough and we don't need to overcomplicate every detail as such. Just my opinion though, i think fallspeed 1.1 is sufficient.

 

[Starscream]

No, 1.5 gravity as a whole, up and down.

Well nobody really uses the universal gravity code anymore, only the 1 line downward gravity code. As far as I know, that one doesn't affect jump heights or Up+Bs at all. The only way it nerfs recoveries is that characters can float as far towards the stage anymore. Unless I'm missing something here.

And changing fast falls only won't make the game less floaty. I mean it's not everyone is going to fast fall all the time.

I'm trying 1.25 downward gravity without any damage mods and I guess it's a pretty good compromise. The Utilt spam isn't bad, although I'm using the no stale code.

I wanted shorter short hops before, but I know it's going to create a ****storm from people who use characters that rely on short hop double aerials. I'll test it, I don't know if it's really necessary though.

 

[abcool]

have u guys found a standard code set for the shield stun as of yet? My friend was playing brawl+ earlier today with me and said luigi miss fired from time to time when the buffer was at 0, he stated that he only tapped B and not foward b, i notice each time was a misfire instead of a normal fire idk what was up with that. Yea i also notice it's hard to double fair with marth again ( not a bad thing because of spammers) But because of brawls knock back i can't DI forward while fairing and that is just annoying.. idk if it's the other codes i am using that is causing the problem..but 0 buffer does ruin alot of things btw dash attack cancel is out the window now :/

 

[SketchHurricane]

Here's a quick-cap of me and Bleak with:

DD
new lagless
1.2 grav / 10% HS
no asl
auto-l
level freeze
3/4 shield stun

edit: well nvm, quick-cap cuts off my vids after a certain point it seems...

 

[GPDP]

Alright, it looks like I need to clarify, I only used 1.5 overall gravity to easily test the effect of gravity on recoveries. I am not advocating we use 1.5 gravity. What want is the following:

- higher launch power to make jumps faster
- higher upward gravity to offset the effect of higher launch power on jump height
- higher downward gravity to match the faster jumps
- somehow make it so that recoveries that are tied to upwards gravity are not affected

 

[shanus]

Alright, it looks like I need to clarify, I only used 1.5 overall gravity to easily test the effect of gravity on recoveries. I am not advocating we use 1.5 gravity. What want is the following:

- higher launch power to make jumps faster
- higher upward gravity to offset the effect of higher launch power on jump height
- higher downward gravity to match the faster jumps
- somehow make it so that recoveries that are tied to upwards gravity are not affected

Why is this necessary?

 

[wazgood]

New grab tech:
Dash canceled grab gives you a pretty nice slide w/ normal grab. Just run, then tap down and z at the same time.


also what does editing the yellow in the lagless edge code do?

 

[GPDP]

Why is this necessary?

It's not absolutely necessary, in the sense that shorter short hops aren't absolutely necessary.

What I want to do is rid Brawl of some excess floatiness, both on the way up and on the way down, without any of the negative side-effects of gravity on recoveries. I want to speed up the air game considerably.

I will understand if people feel the overly floaty mechanics are not much of an issue, and thus don't warrant much attention, but I gotta at least get it out there that a substantial speed increase in the air game could be beneficial.

 

[Heavyarms2050]

i demand fresh videos

 

[Shadic]

I still think more focus needs to be spent on horizontal air speed, not vertical.

 

[zxeon]

i demand fresh videos

Vids plox.

 

[K1T3]

Wish I could upload vids =(
Just pulled off a sick kirby downthrow to many up tilts to about 3-4 up airs following him off to an up B spike, I died too but it was great =)

Sad that it was on a lv 9 comp though =/
but still with only 8% hitstun that's pretty good.

1.3x downwards gravity feels great to get rid of the floatiness and keeps recoveries.
Momentum carried from a run now would be nice as everyone has said.