COMPETITIVE Brawl+: Code Agenda

[wakka444]

my lines were at 240 when i was running into issues.
and i dont wanna get rusty at melee=P
i prefer hitting a button lol
im gonna play with it more triple check im not just jumping to conclusions

 

[kupo15]

lol people are getting over the limit even without MAD

yea lol. Maybe we should start the combining process

 

[Deleted member]

or we should start thiking "do we really need this code?" like dash cancel

 

[Starscream]

If by dash cancel you mean the one PW made that works like a crouch cancel without reducing knockback... why would you want to get rid of it? It adds options, excellent options. Everyone character gets more approaches, why would you want to get rid of it?

I think if you're running out of space then get rid of your level freeze codes and Pokemon trainer codes.

 

[Blank Mauser]

Crouch canceling doesn't do much different than wavedashing seeing as it just leaves you in a neutral position. Then again I don't know how many people use the melee airdodge code.

 

[zxeon]

Ike with DD and SH x.8 got a huge speed boost. He's lord of shieldstun and punishment. You can screw up, just don't do it against Ike. I didn't realize how much I relied on the buffer to do my moves for me with Ike.

 

[Dan_X]

If by dash cancel you mean the one PW made that works like a crouch cancel without reducing knockback... why would you want to get rid of it? It adds options, excellent options. Everyone character gets more approaches, why would you want to get rid of it?

I think if you're running out of space then get rid of your level freeze codes and Pokemon trainer codes.

For one, the level freeze codes take up few lines, and they add quite a bit to Brawl+. Isn't it awesome to be able to say that Brawl+ has more viable stages than vanilla Brawl? I think it's important to have more viable stages. I would never scrap the level codes.

As for the P.T. codes, I've had to drop two of them, which I've replaced with the independent pokemon code. Which if you ask me, for PT, is a big deal.

I do however use Dash Cancel, and it's it's good. I wouldn't drop that either.

 

[Iamthemovie]

Does anybody here have videos of people playing with higher tier characters with these codes? It's great to see some lower tier characters doing well and those who got nerfed regain some of their former glory but what about Meta/Snake/Falco/etc.?

 

[GPDP]

Dash Cancel is a must IMO. Like I said before, I would sooner drop the level freeze code than that.

Grr, still haven't been able to test the short hop code, but I stand by what I said before. Can't we possibly deal with the nerfed recoveries by somehow exempting them from increased gravity? And yes, I realize this is an ironic request considering what I said about exempting characters from the short hop code lol. But I genuinely think faster jumps overall would fix the problem with slow shffls and aerials than shorter short hops would.

 

[zxeon]

Does anybody here have videos of people playing with higher tier characters with these codes? It's great to see some lower tier characters doing well and those who got nerfed regain some of their former glory but what about Meta/Snake/Falco/etc.?

They got better. Falco the only one of those characters I play and I can tell you he got much better with SH modifier, DD, and CC. Falco can approach with his uair again, his double SH lazer shoots closer to the ground, and hes much better at combos when he can CC and DD.

I don't have any videos though. Sorry lol.

 

[Starscream]

For one, the level freeze codes take up few lines, and they add quite a bit to Brawl+. Isn't it awesome to be able to say that Brawl+ has more viable stages than vanilla Brawl? I think it's important to have more viable stages. I would never scrap the level codes.

As for the P.T. codes, I've had to drop two of them, which I've replaced with the independent pokemon code. Which if you ask me, for PT, is a big deal.

I do however use Dash Cancel, and it's it's good. I wouldn't drop that either.

That's fine if you think that, but there are people that would rather drop dash cancel if the choice had to be made. I think a code that improves every character's approaches and gives them all more options is more important then having a couple more neutrals or fixing PKMN trainer. That's just me though.

 

[MookieRah]

I love the dash cancel and dash dancing codes.

I think that with the weak shield stun code set to 3 it's a bit much, as I was able to jab into a shield with my back facing my opponent (jabs have weird hitboxes) and was able to turn around and do another jab faster than he could shield grab. I'm going to try it at 2.5%.

The lag less ledges code looks bizarre but it works well. Only problem I have is that it needs more invincibility cause G&W dtilt wrecks people so hard it's not even funny. I'm not even sure of a true way to counter it, other than getting lucky with a getup attack from the ledge, and that only works if it hits at the right time. I'm sure there is a way around it though, it's how the metagame works.

Link is actually decent now. When someone mentioned that before I questioned it, but his moveset is really suited to all the changes. His boomerang has a lot of stun, so it allows for some good mixup situations even if it hits ones shield. He can edgeguard fairly well too, but seeing how one can recover well below the stage that won't be as much of an issue in higher end play. I do like the fact that he seems viable though. Definitely a plus.

CF doesn't combo as well as he did without downward gravity (playing at 1.25 cause my roommate doesn't think 1.15 is enough even though I think it is). Down throws no longer set up perfectly for nairs, which was one of the big things about him that made him kick ***. His up throw is more viable, but it still throws your opponent too high 90% of the time. I'd like to see a universal up throw decrease, cause almost every character's up throw is garbage in Brawl. It's definitely not necessary, but more options that could lead to setups would be nice.

That's all I can think of to say for now. I only got to play for about an hour. My roommate had to go to choir so we'll play a bit more when we get back.

 

[wakka444]

You were all right of course I had an issue with lines.
I had assumed it was the difference between L-cancel and Auto-lcancel because both were under 256 with manual at 243 and auto at 222.
So I did a lot of line varying tests(reducing the line count one by one until it would load) and seems my limit was 236 lines=)

 

[zxeon]

You were all right of course I had an issue with lines.
I had assumed it was the difference between L-cancel and Auto-lcancel because both were under 256 with manual at 243 and auto at 222.
So I did a lot of line varying tests(reducing the line count one by one until it would load) and seems my limit was 236 lines=)

Whoa WTF?! 236 lines?

 

[MookieRah]

Oh yeah, what happened to that Hold L for static Pokemon code? It was up in the code list but it seems to have disappeared.

 

[wakka444]

Yup 236, 237+ wouldn't work no matter what I tried...

 

[Starscream]

CF doesn't combo as well as he did without downward gravity (playing at 1.25 cause my roommate doesn't think 1.15 is enough even though I think it is). Down throws no longer set up perfectly for nairs, which was one of the big things about him that made him kick ***. His up throw is more viable, but it still throws your opponent too high 90% of the time. I'd like to see a universal up throw decrease, cause almost every character's up throw is garbage in Brawl. It's definitely not necessary, but more options that could lead to setups would be nice.

This is why I think we need a vertical knockback modifier, to restore the height lost on upward sending moves. Until we get that I'm using a damage ratio mod which negates the vertical knockback nerf but has a slight horizontal attack buff but not enough to screw with combos or make them kill too early with good DI. I play 1.35 gravity with 1.065 damage ratio mod and Falcon is still kickass.

 

[KayJay]

CF doesn't combo as well as he did without downward gravity (playing at 1.25 cause my roommate doesn't think 1.15 is enough even though I think it is). Down throws no longer set up perfectly for nairs, which was one of the big things about him that made him kick ***.

What hitstun value did you use?
For 1.25 downward gravity, try +8,5% hitstun (3EF851EC)

 

[Jiangjunizzy]

i was thinking. if we ever get to a point where we need to rebalance characters, i think there's already a really easy way to do it..

http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Sticker#Power-Up_Effects

stickers!

the sickers undoubtedly use modifiers in game, so why couldn't we just borrow those modifiers to make whatever augments we need? they'd probably be really short too!

for example, we could lower the launch power of all of metaknight's spin attacks.

or increase the slash power of link's attacks.

or "Flinch Resistance - Makes you flinch less at low damage levels. " to crouching.

 

[Steeler]

i suggest disabling PT's Pokemon's Down B so that playing only one Pokemon is reasonable.

 

[Revven]

i suggest disabling PT's Pokemon's Down B so that playing only one Pokemon is reasonable.

Umm... just use the code "Press R for Independent [insert pokemon here]". It's only in the PT forums... it disables Down B and allows you to use only one Pokemon while keeping the old PT.

Edit: Here's the frikkin' code.

Hold SHIELD for Independent Pokemon +no wreck My Music [spunit262]
06407BD0 0000000E
04030F0D 1E1B1F1B
201B211B 221B0000
046847C4 60000000
C268482C 00000003
3800003F 981400B8
2C1D0003 40A20008
3BA00004 00000000
C2684964 00000007
881400B8 2C00003F
40A20028 2C03001D
40A20008 3860001E
2C03001F 40A20008
38600020 2C030021
40A20008 38600022
987400B8 00000000

In case you're too lazy. Removes fatigue, switching, and force switch.

 

[kupo15]

Well paprika, it appears that we should start combining since we have different views on what should go first

i was thinking. if we ever get to a point where we need to rebalance characters, i think there's already a really easy way to do it..

http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/Sticker#Power-Up_Effects

stickers!

the sickers undoubtedly use modifiers in game, so why couldn't we just borrow those modifiers to make whatever augments we need? they'd probably be really short too!

for example, we could lower the launch power of all of metaknight's spin attacks.

or increase the slash power of link's attacks.

or "Flinch Resistance - Makes you flinch less at low damage levels. " to crouching.

Very interesting.


So can I assume that DDing is perfect? Is everyone ok with the weird looking lagless code if it saves more lines? Does it change anything about how you grab the ledge? I'll probably ask pw if we can have more invincibility frames for both codes anyway.

 

[storm92]

DD works amazing, it is so sexy to have it back.
And the lagless code seems fine to me, its like an L-canceled grab.

The suggestion for the buffer system code is 0, am I right?

 

[MBlaze]

DD works amazing, it is so sexy to have it back.
And the lagless code seems fine to me, its like an L-canceled grab.

The suggestion for the buffer system code is 0, am I right?

Yeah, I prefer not having it at all because it still feels like someone's squeezing your nuts every time you do something.

Also what's the value that we should put for the updated ledge code? Keep it at 4000000?

 

[kupo15]

DD works amazing, it is so sexy to have it back.
And the lagless code seems fine to me, its like an L-canceled grab.

The suggestion for the buffer system code is 0, am I right?

yes it is because the other settings glitch up. 0 buffer is amazing beyond words...

 

[Ryuker]

Just and idea I got after I saw that Diddy's UpB requires the auto sweetspot.
What would we change about the game if we reduced or 0'd the ledge invincibility frames and kept autosweetspotting on? I mean the invincibility you get when you grab onto the ledge not the one when you get up and such.

I asked this question on a dutch smash chat and I was told:
1. You'd get hit of the ledge before you would grab it.
2. It forces the player recovering to step up to the stage fast.

I just thought of this cause we also have the ledge camping issue and this would make the ledge a less safe place to be. With the reduced lag on the ledge you'd be able to let go as soon as you'd grab it.

What you guys think?

 

[MBlaze]

Meh idk maybe it's just me with the buffer, just feels like someone's constricting my nuts when playing... (not literally)

Anyway about the new codes, updated ledge code, leave the highlighted value alone?

And for the short hop code.. idk if anyone is using that but I'm not because once again, the value issue.

 

[storm92]

I must be doing something wrong, because the SH/FF code makes FFs fast beyond imagining, even with an extremely low value.

 

[MookieRah]

The buffer isn't a big deal. I also think that 10% hitstun is the way to go even with the gravity changes.

Has anyone else found that Teching is a lot easier at higher downward gravity? It seems easier to me cause the timing is better due to not being so ****ed floaty.

 

[storm92]

10% seems to be working perfectly, I agree wholeheartedly with you Mookie.
What value are you using for the grav?

EDIT: I'm using 1.15, and it seems to be perfect to me.

 

[kupo15]

Meh idk maybe it's just me with the buffer, just feels like someone's constricting my nuts when playing... (not literally)

Anyway about the new codes, updated ledge code, leave the highlighted value alone?

And for the short hop code.. idk if anyone is using that but I'm not because once again, the value issue.

Its def you then and yes, leave the highlighted alone for now. I like 10%

 

[Alopex]

Edit: ok you're right, my memorys tricked me, you could do instant aerials in melee at 1/4 speed, sorry 'bout that, but the brawl 0 buffer aspect remains true. I even tried to auto cancel ganons dair with auto-fire on 1/4 speed in brawl with 0 buffer, instant aerials don't work, maybe it's the codes fault but as it is now, it's not working like melee.

Why is this being ignored?


KayJay, have you tried testing every buffer value from 0 to 10 frames until you can instant aerial at 1/4?
That'll help determine if the issue of no instant aerials is with the buffer length or with the actual code.


I don't know why no one is recognizing this issue. If the plan is to keep 0 buffer, then we need to figure out why 0 buffer is preventing instant aerials in Brawl+ when it did not prevent them in Melee under equal circumstances (1/4 speed training mode).

 

[Dan_X]

in the old lagless edge code I was able to ledge bounce, pull away from the edge before I was fully grasped. For example, I could illusion to the edge as Falco than pull back right away which almost made it look as though I bounced off the ledge. This feature is awesome, is it still possible? I couldn't tell if it was, and wasn't sure if it was because of the buffering.

 

[Shadic]

This is a bit random, and maybe my timing is just sloppy + a lack of playing him, but I have a lot of trouble doing multiple jumps with Dedede with 0 buffer on.

 

[KayJay]

Why is this being ignored?


KayJay, have you tried testing every buffer value from 0 to 10 frames until you can instant aerial at 1/4?
That'll help determine if the issue of no instant aerials is with the buffer length or with the actual code.


I don't know why no one is recognizing this issue. If the plan is to keep 0 buffer, then we need to figure out why 0 buffer is preventing instant aerials in Brawl+ when it did not prevent them in Melee under equal circumstances (1/4 speed training mode).

I only tested 0 and 3, i will test more tomorrow (its midnight here now)

 

[Alopex]

I only tested 0 and 3, i will test more tomorrow (its midnight here now)

So even at 3 frames of buffer you couldn't instant aerial at 1/4?

 

[MBlaze]

Its def you then and yes, leave the highlighted alone for now. I like 10%

Alright, but what about that short hop code, we using that?

 

[Heavyarms2050]

Alright, but what about that short hop code, we using that?

i think the vertical modifier is a better code

 

[zxeon]

It's safe to say that this is now a completly different game from vanilla Brawl.

 

[Eaode]

It's safe to say that this is now a completly different game from vanilla Brawl.

...Such a beautiful thing :')