The Real Inferno
Smash Hero
What ****** would say this list does damage to the community?
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Character Rankings List - Post-March 2010
- Thread starter Zankoku
- Start date
- Status
Kyari
Smash Lord
Come on, do you honestly think Ankoku would take it down if he thought the guy was a ****** for saying that? Seems like it would be an insult to Ankoku to suggest such a thing.
im going to assume that it was taken down because of some whining in the SBRoom lol.
ankoku, i respect the time and effort you put into the list.
ankoku, i respect the time and effort you put into the list.
I think InfernoRage is right. What could possibly be the legitimate reason for demanding that this list be taken down? All Ankoku has been doing is reporting and organizing factual data. You have to be pretty ******** to want to argue with facts.
Kyari
Smash Lord
That didn't really answer what I said.
I'm agreeing with InfernoRage that the people who wanted the list removed are ********, because a non-******** reason does not exist to justify withholding factual data.
Kyari
Smash Lord
And who said Ankoku had to humor a ******** request? That's the part you've forgotten to address. He is under no contractual obligation of any kind, and it's not against the rules of the forums to display such a list.
I'm under the personal obligation of having as little interaction with the "competitive Smash scene" as possible.
Because I don't like making ripples.
Because I don't like making ripples.
You're right, he didn't have to. But I can imagine that there was a sufficient amount of pressure where it no longer became reasonable to endure the pressure for the sake of the list. You can't blame the guy for caving in if the community he believes he is serving all of a sudden accuses him of causing damage. That's a pretty crappy deal, and I'm certain I would have done the same in his place.
This is all speculation, of course.
This is all speculation, of course.
There is exactly one person who made the accusation.
My mistake then, I was wrong.
Voidious
Smash Apprentice
I'm really surprised by this, I hope it comes back.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
me too
who ever asked for this is lame sauce
who ever asked for this is lame sauce
But removing the list after putting so much time and having such a quality result does -- a lot more than leaving it up.
Your list was a valuable tool and appreciated by many, and losing easy access to it is going to just make it a lot harder to see what's going on. Taking it down certainly won't remove any damage to the community that could be caused by whatever was shown, at this point -- it's too late for that, people already know to look at the results as they come in and watch current trends. Maybe if it had never existed it would matter, but...even then I don't think so.
I would be grateful if it were to return, and I'm sure many others would be as well.
Adapt
Smash Lord
I'll join the ranks of those disappointed that the list was taken down.
Ankoku, do you thing you could elaborate on the reasoning behind this damaging the community? Perhaps get the reasoning from the person who made the accusation and add it in the first post?
Ankoku, do you thing you could elaborate on the reasoning behind this damaging the community? Perhaps get the reasoning from the person who made the accusation and add it in the first post?
Something about everyone picking Meta Knight because my list told them to.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
since there was only one person that said you were harming the community, i say this
I believe that you were doing a great good and a strong justice for every single member of SWF,
and I humbly and repectfully ask that you put your list back up.
I realise that you dont know/care about me, but I figured that you should know that many people see, and appreciate the work you are doing and would love to see it back up and being worked on again.
I believe that you were doing a great good and a strong justice for every single member of SWF,
and I humbly and repectfully ask that you put your list back up.
I realise that you dont know/care about me, but I figured that you should know that many people see, and appreciate the work you are doing and would love to see it back up and being worked on again.
da K.I.D.
Smash Hero
no disrecspect intended here, but:
lol
everyone is picking up metaknight because of M2K and i believe that it has little to nothing to do with you
Sgt Isaac
Smash Cadet
Ankoku, you aren't the reason everyone plays MK. It's because anyone playing any other character gets ***** within the first 3 rounds by other MKs.
Agreed. No names need be named, but I'd like to understand why this has happened.
I mean, the circumstances are now completely ******** and inefficient. First of all, it's not like the facts are gone. Even if the list didn't exist, anyone could have gone back and figured it all out. It would be prohibitively time-consuming for most of us, though, which is why I believe most of us here feel an enormous debt of gratitude towards you for putting it up.
But now, the list exists, and according to the OP now, anyone can still access it, it just puts more of the work on your shoulders. Now, instead of simply updating the OP, you have to field a whole ton of PMs and IMs about the list. Not only does this increase the total amount of work, but it's really unfair to you.
I'd like to know what kind of reasoning counters the lack of efficiency that this suggestion promotes.
If that's the case, then it seems the only way to maintain diversity in the metagame is to keep people in the dark about the status of the metagame, and in fact to hamper the growth of the metagame.
Frankly, the facts can't hamper the metagame or ruin diversity. But keeping people ignorant of the facts definitely will. I really hope an SBR member didn't make this argument to you, because frankly, it's an idiotic claim.
The official tier list would have far more responsibility for this than your thread.
I don't think anyone with any clue what they were doing would feel "told to" by your list, and everyone who has no clue wouldn't find it in the first place.
This isn't against you, it's against the idea you were told :/
Fletch
Smash Master
If you don't want to post/maintain the list under your name, I might be interested in keeping it going, I don't even play Brawl so I don't care if I get accused of anything.
hotgarbage
Smash Lord
Well, there's not much to say :/. Thanks for the work you put into this Ankoku, we all appreciate it.
DarkDragoon
Smash Champion
LOL.
Ankoku.
Post your list in here, and ignore PoF.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=5530138
-DD
Luigi player
Smash Master
Man, that sucks =/
Leaving everyone in the dark doesn't really change anything... it just makes people sad that there's no list to look at anymore...
Leaving everyone in the dark doesn't really change anything... it just makes people sad that there's no list to look at anymore...
Kasai
Smash Journeyman
QFT
Not only will this put more work on your shoulders, it also won't really help diversify anything. People still have the tier list, and anyone who was competent enough to find this list already knows that Metaknight is #1. Hiding the facts won't do anything.
Besides, the list was probably the one reliable source of information when it came to actual results. You have been doing a great job and it seems like a waste to let that fade away.
VulgarHandGestures
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2008
- Messages
- 326
i lol'd
although dangr's matchup chart thread has potential if it can get filled in, it's much more objective than the joke ivaneva's been running
I just had to quote this, hahaha.
May DanGR's post serve as a memmorial to "MK > Statistics"
Snail
Smash Lord
Okai what the hell? You're actually taking down the list because ONE person told you to? -_- If we'd all listen to every whiner posting, SWF would instantly die. I don't mean to be disrespectful, but THIS IS MADNESS!
Browny
Smash Hater
can you at least post the tournament refernce .txt file so the non-lazy people among us can calculate it themselves. im still very interested in watching how lucario ranks vs marth for example and have no problems calculating it myself.
Grunt
Smash Master
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I have to sig this.
3GOD
Smash Ace
Nothing like supressing the truth to pacify people!
In all seriousness, this list in no way had negative effects on the smash community. It simply exposed the imbalance of the game more quickly than had it not existed.
PND
Smash Champion
This list will be missed. (rhyming ftw)
Good job Ankoku. If anything, amongst the low tier players it actually drove them to become better to try and make a ripple on behalf of their character. How could this hurt the community?
Good job Ankoku. If anything, amongst the low tier players it actually drove them to become better to try and make a ripple on behalf of their character. How could this hurt the community?
Samochan
Smash Master
So the SBR member has certain evidence that this list somehow influences how the metagame develops? >_> Unless the has (which I really doubt), then his claim is null and void. And in any case, he really has no power over this list, he's not some kind of god of SWF and I doubt it was an admin either who claimed such. Only the staff on swf have power whether your information on this topic is harmful and that's only to swf, not anything regarding brawl metagame whatsoever or outside Smash World Forums.
So please Ankoku, use your own sense in whether this sbr member's claim was heeded. And such thing definitely needs to be pondered over by many persons, not just one who thinks he's above everyone else. If anything, this list has brought many people in supporting their favourite low tier character and play them in order to see them rise in this list. On the same notion we should get the tier list banned, so sbr claiming this is harmful is being hypocritical.
So please Ankoku, use your own sense in whether this sbr member's claim was heeded. And such thing definitely needs to be pondered over by many persons, not just one who thinks he's above everyone else. If anything, this list has brought many people in supporting their favourite low tier character and play them in order to see them rise in this list. On the same notion we should get the tier list banned, so sbr claiming this is harmful is being hypocritical.
The type of argument to shut down this list that we've heard could also be used to justify not talking about how good characters are at all. After all, if somebody reads on the King Dedede forum that he's a good character, that could be dangerous! And let's not talk about match ups at all. If people learn Meta Knight has the advantage versus Ganon, that might dishearten aspiring Ganon players!
Although I can understand not wanting to make ripples, I'm really surprised Ankoku would put so much effort into making something like this (maintaining that list of tournaments must have been an insane and tedious job), and even providing disclaimers against drawing conclusions from the data more than what it actually shows (tournament results)... only to shut down the topic with no warning.
Although I can understand not wanting to make ripples, I'm really surprised Ankoku would put so much effort into making something like this (maintaining that list of tournaments must have been an insane and tedious job), and even providing disclaimers against drawing conclusions from the data more than what it actually shows (tournament results)... only to shut down the topic with no warning.
I don't go into the brawl forums much, but this was one of the most interesting threads on the site. If you don't wish to continue with it, would you be up for passing the responsibility onto someone else? It just seems too interesting to abandon.
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