Yay, more Kirby posts!
First off... Meta Knight!
Meta Knight does use a Mach Tornado move in Super Star, but in that case, he jumps up, spins into the Tornado, and coasts his way back down until he hits the ground with a large shockwave hitbox. I'd actually prefer that move be in Smash as sort of a brutal land trapping move.
But then, if we were going to take Super Star into account, Meta Knight would have that absurd cyclone attack too. Hey, it would solve his minor KO issues. =P
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4d9PCQ11enI&t=2m34s
While I will admit this was a bit on my part for only bringing up his ability from Meta Knightmare Ultra (which isn't represented in Smash whatsoever), this still isn't how Mach Tornado appears in Smash. In Smash, Mach Tornado resembles and behaves like Fire Tornado from Kirby: Squeak Squad, excluding the fire damage aspect. Mach Tornado is supposed to be the move he used -- "
that absurd cyclone attack". Adding this move wouldn't seem plausible at first, but other moves have been altered to fit their original role while not being insanely overpowered. So... Mach Tornado isn't true the the character, it's a rip-off of Kirby's Fire Tornado.
Mach Tornado much? And Drill Rush comes from an ability granted by his (Master) sword.
And whether I'm him, his dark counterpart or Galacta Knight, it's not their big flashy special
attacks I'm afraid of, but rather the multitude of standard sword techniques they can use, since
they're fast and REACTIVE, not just pattern-based. A lot of their powers would just be Final Smash material anyway.
Drill Rush isn't granted by Galaxia. I've touched on this a bit before, but I guess I'll go more in-depth right now. When Kirby defeats Dark Metaknight and goes into the portal, Meta Knight throws Galaxia into it with him. However, Kirby goes
not eat the sword, he picks it up. This means it's not an actual Copy Ability, he's just wielding the sword.
To add on to this, Kirby, usually, would instantly die by attempting to use Galaxia. This is because Galaxia was forged by the Photron as the ultimate sword - Galaxia is a living being with a consciousness encased in a sword. If the sword is wielded by those that aren't "worthy", they'll just die. Garlude, the one who got the sword with Meta Knight, ended up dying when grabbing the sword. She knew of this, however, and threw it to Meta Knight despite dying herself. The only reason Kirby doesn't die when he wields the sword is because he
does have the strength to wield it, meaning he doesn't need to use his Copy Ability. Along with that, as he can wield Galaxia himself without being killed, Kirby doesn't copy over Meta Knight's moves. Drill Rush is Kirby's move when wielding Galaxia, not Meta Knight's.
One last thing, just to add more proof. In the Kirby Mass Attack mini-game, Kirby Quest, Galaxia is fought as a boss later in the game without Meta Knight. If Kirby defeats Galaxia, he can take it to fight in the next battle, against Dark Mind. This proves that Kirby can use Galaxia without the Copy Ability, as the mini-Kirby can't use the Copy Abilities, proves that Kirby has his own set of moves, as Kirby uses his own version of Galaxia's sword beam (which is also used in the Master ability and Kirby: Right Back at Ya!), and proves that Kirby is capable of wielding the sword, as the mini-Kirby are led by Kirby's heart itself.
Idk, MK would be pretty busted if he could use the projectiles he used in Squeak Squad (namely that tornado move that was nearly impossible to dodge). The other projectiles were flame waves that he could aim. Drill Rush seems to be based on the Master Sword drill attack from Amazing Mirror, and Mach Tornado is one of his attacks from Kirby Super Star (and is controlled like Kirby's Tornado ability). Additionally n-air is the aerial attack option for Sword Kirby and Meta Knight in Nightmare in Dream Land. F-air and b-air resemble MK's attack in Air Ride (not the spinning attack, the one that is done automatically when MK is near another racer). I don't think MK actually uses his cape offensively in the games.
Sorry I play a lot of Kirby games.
Meta Knight has many other projectiles he can use that don't involve incredibly overpowered tornadoes flying all over the place. The most used one is his own version of Sword Beam, which is a simple fast-travelling... sword beam. I've already talked about Drill Rush and Mach Tornado, so read the above. Meta Knight's neutral air isn't based on the attack Sword Kirby uses, as Meta Knight curls up in a ball and twirls around like an idiot. Kirby slashes out his sword while spinning it around. Meta Knight's forward and back aerials are
NOT from Kirby's Air Ride, either. The attacks he uses in Kirby's Air Ride when he comes in contact with another racer are generic sword slashes taken from Sword Kirby.
Sorry, I play a lot of Kirby games, along with being one of the only people who actively explore the internals of the games files to find out how things were intended to play out.
Shuttle Loop also became canon for the Kirby series since MK can use it in RtD.
MK is just not comparable to Wario in terms of representing the character. His sword is small because MK himself is small and the Galaxia was never shown as being a humongous sword, plus MK is basically sword and wing Kirby mashed together when he's playable so his sword, legendary or not, is nothing special gameplay wise.
Kawase said, in an interview, that the characters are all using abilities copied off of Kirby due to time constraints. The only reason the additional characters don't have unique movesets is because the Return to Dream Land team only had a year and a half to develop the game, as the game was in circulation for over 11 years. This is also seen by the fact that each character, including Dedede, uses Kirby's hitbox and hurtbox data. The only difference with the other characters when compared to Kirby is one extra move given to them, along with player models and animations. They're exactly the same after that.
Meta Knight's sword is actually as tall as, if not bigger than him in almost all of it's appearances. Galaxia has a property added to it known as "hammerspace". This is because Galaxia only comes into play once unsheathed, which is how Meta Knight can carry it around all the time. The sheath is only made for the sword hilt, not the sword itself. It's why Meta Knight can actually carry a sword that is bigger and most likely weighs more than him without hindering movement.
Meta Knight being portrayed as Wing/Sword Kirby isn't true to the character. The only reason Meta Knight is ever shown like that is either due to him being playable in an extra mode, or due to time constraints. This is even shown in Metaknightmare Ultra, which was made by re-spriting Sword Kirby as Meta Knight, then giving enemies different palettes, along with making a couple different cutscenes to give him a reason for this all. Along with that, Kirby gets abilities from enemies. Enemies are shown to actually have the same exact abilities as Kirby in Helper to Hero, confirming that Kirby and the enemies he fights are equally matched, just using a different thought process for the abilities. If Meta Knight is a clone of Sword Kirby and Wing Kirby, he would be equal in strength as Sword Knight and Birdon, two common Kirby enemies. If we're going to use that, why not put Birdon on Sword Knight's back ala Duck Hunt and replace Meta Knight? They're the same exact thing.
This also goes into why Meta Knight is compared to Wario. Not many people actually care about the Kirby series, so nobody actually cares about these kinds of things. For those who actually are Kirby fans, they know that Meta Knight has to be one of the most poorly represented characters in Smash. This is all because of -- you guessed it -- Sakurai! Sakurai still thinks that the Kirby series, along with the characters, belong to him. He uses the content he knows and he made instead of learning new Kirby content, as he's either biased for his games or tries to use his knowledge instead of putting extra work behind the series. Both Kirby stages from this game belong to Sakurai. All Kirby items in this game are Sakurai-made. The movesets and arguably designs of the characters are all from Sakurai's Kirby games. Sakurai doesn't own the Kirby series anymore. The only thing from new Kirby games is Ultra Sword, which is pretty stupid.
I mean, why does Meta Knight have a voice? Where did he get those stupid gauntlets? Why does he look completely different and so much more realistic compared to the two other Kirby characters? Sakurai doesn't know anything about the Kirby series anymore, and tries to use his own content or change the characters to his own liking. I can't stand Meta Knight in Smash because of how stupid he is. He's a dumb edgy Kirby/Batman hybrid instead of being having any character. I don't know how actual Meta Knight mains think of this, mostly with the fact that not much of them care about the Kirby series in general, but Meta Knight in Smash doesn't represent the character whatsoever.
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Kirby's role in Competitive Smash.
Sorry for the delay on this thing. I wanted to get some videos to go along with it, but it was taking forever so I decided I'd just post it. With the help of @
Spirst and somewhat @
Locke 06
(but not by much, lol), I've been able to decide what exactly Kirby's role is in competitive Smash.
Kirby is an anti-meta.
Now, I can't exaggerate this. Kirby is not a full anti-meta against every stupid character in the game. Diddy Kong still exists. However, in a customs-meta, Kirby is an anti-meta character once he gets his fancy new tools.
First, let me bring up some of the common custom jank and how Kirby can counter it...
Kong Cyclone
We've already gone over this, but I'll do it again. Kong Cyclone can't be used against Kirby. Kirby has two options to deal with this move -- Meteor Stone and Jumping Inhale. Jumping Inhale is the most common (and safe) option. Kong Cyclone has super armor, and Jumping Inhale is a command grab. However, the momentum of Jumping Inhale and the windbox of Kong Cyclone ends up flinging Kirby over to the blast zone. If Kirby spits out Donkey Kong, he's dead. However, there's a bit more to it. If Donkey Kong tries to lag cancel (I have no idea what the term is called) Kong Cyclone and Kirby uses Jumping Inhale, DK is dead while Kirby lives. However, Kirby must hold forward once he eats DK to launch further over the blast zone. If Kirby uses Jumping Inhale on him when he's recovering, they'll both die unless Kirby holds back once eating DK, and even then can still die dependong (I'm not going to fix that) on when he eats DK. Even if they don't die and Kirby can't Star Spit DK into the blast zone, Kirby can still potentially kill him. Kirby can shift his momentum during a grab break to pop out right above his head, which gives Kirby a free footstool. The only option DK has to escape this is to jump backwards immediately, which then gives Kirby a free F-Air if he reads this. However, if Kirby inhales DK after he uses his double jump, he's dead. This also gives Jumping Inhale the use of having actual Kirbycides against DK.
Now, Meteor Stone was an idea that Spirst brought up during our random play sessions. After a bit of research on this, we've found out that this does counter Kong Cyclone, but to a lesser (and riskier) extent. Kong Cyclone pulls in Kirby's Meteor Stone during the initial windbox before the Super Armor comes into affect, which ends up killing DK. However, there's a problem. If Kirby doesn't double jump before using Meteor Stone, he's dead every time, even if he hits DK during the Super Armor. This is because the windbox ends up pulling Kirby down, but due to the speed he's falling at, he can't cancel it whatsoever before dying. As Kirby has to double jump, he needs to have adequate spacing or he'll hit the super armor. Jumping Inhale should generally be used, but this is also an option.
ADHD Villager Camping
This is simple. Villager is vulnerable from above and no longer has ledge invincibility. Meteor Stone completely destroys Villager, as it kills at 5% on FD and 15% on Battlefield. Along with that, Giant Hammer's super armor can be used to go through the wall of projectiles and Counter Sapling, then swung as Villager. This is surprisingly efficient, as Villager can't escape it. If Explosive Balloons or projectiles are being spammed, Kirby can hit during the mandatory ledge hang time. Villager can't escape this by trying to jump over Kirby without dying, as no ledge invincibility, Explosive Balloons helpless state, and Giant Hammer beats out Villager's grab. Along with that, Kirby can get Pocket to send projectiles back.
This forces Villager to fight on the stage, which, while I won't go into crazy detail on that, isn't a big deal. Kirby doesn't have much trouble dealing with Villager, while Villager doesn't have much trouble dealing with Kirby. It's a pretty even MU with customs on.
Super Speed + Lightweight
Kirby can duck under Super Speed, Kirby can duck under Palutena's grab. Super Speed and Lightweight now lost a majority of their viability. Unless perfectly spaced, Kirby can duck under dash attack, too. Jab can also be ducked under. Explosive Flame can be dealt with if Kirby has autoreticle, too. Kirby's D-Tilt can punish all crouched moves, which leads into F-Smash or a grab. Most of Palutena's options are shut down just by crouching.
Hammer Spin Dash + Burning Spin Dash
Kirby's jab clashes with all three variants excluding Burning Spin Dash when fully charged, while Inhale beats all of them except Burning Spin Dash when fully charged. To deal with Burning Spin Dash, Meteor Stone can be used. The move pops Kirby up, making it so that Sonic will get squished. The super armor protects Kirby if it's timed incorrectly, and the added endlag on BSD makes it unpunishable if fully charged.
Along with being able to deal with some of the custom jank in the game, Kirby has really nice MUs with top tiers. While I'm not going to make an MU chart or a full list, an example of some of the top tier characters that Kirby can beat include Sheik, Rosalina, Palutena and ZSS. Kirby can beat out or at least deal with many of the top tier characters, and goes even if not a very slight advantage/disadvantage with a majority of the cast, while he gets utterly demolished by some characters (ie: Mii Brawler, Yoshi, Charizard, Marth). Having to fight a low-tier/lesser character as Kirby is generally annoying, whereas fighting top tiers isn't a problem.
This doesn't mean he's a full anti-meta, as stated above. However, he has the tools to deal with most better characters, along with some of the jank that comes along with custom moves. As far as I know, this is Kirby's role in the competitive custom community. He's made to fight top tiers. I'm sure this may sound a bit controversial to some, but that's really what he's here for.
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This is just a quick update on how Kirby's customs improve his weaknesses. I don't think I said anything about how they improve his weaknesses before, only covering the strengths. I'm only going to focus on Upper Cutter right now because I'm lazy, though. The main thing that Upper Cutter fixes with Kirby is his advantageous state. Without customs, Kirby keeps you in a disadvantage by comboing you. However, his combos almost always pop the opponent into the air, above him. Yet... what does he do then? He can't trap you in the air because he isn't threatening at all. However, Upper Cutter fixes this. When you're above Kirby, Upper Cutter now instills fear, similar to Sonic's spring to U-Air. Kirby can now trap you to keep you at disadvantage longer. If you airdodge, Kirby gets a free U-Air > Upper Cutter, D-Air > anything, or Grounding Stone > Hammer Bash depending on whether you land on the ground, come right above him, or appear right below him. If you don't airdodge, Kirby now can hit you with Upper Cutter near the top of the stage, potentially risking a stock.
Along with that, Kirby's OoS options are fixed, along with Final Cutter's vulnerability. Kirby was prone to being edgeguarded due to his slow air speed and Final Cutter offering no protection. Anybody can go down and spam their D-Air when Kirby's equipped with Final Cutter. I've already talked about this before, so I won't be detailing it all again, but Upper Cutter fixes this, too. The last (and arguably best) thing is that Kirby gets a true OoS option, and an amazing one at that. Kirby has a frame 2 (3?) OoS option that comes with frame 5 invincibility, kills at later percents, does pretty nice damage (10%), pops opponents into the air where he wants them to be, covers amazing range in front of (and behind if reversed) Kirby, and doesn't have as much risk due to grounded Upper Cutter going less height than the aerial version.
I hate how sloppy my posts are.
...
VS 
) Marth, Lucario, Greninja, Mario, Dr. Mario, Palutena, Kirby, Meta Knight (kind-of), Fox, Falco, Megaman, Mii Brawler, Mii Swordfighter, and I'm almost certain there is more!
