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[earla]

ok working on my cg on fox no DI.

0-20 i up-thow regrab
20-34 i u-throw 'pivot (i think im doing pivot correctly? i move a tiny bit back but grab in the same direction?? strict timing?

for some reason i can't get an utilt regrab at 27-28 as m2k suggests. im not sure if thats because of this being melee pal version?

anyway 34% i normal u-tilt, dash regrab.

- here im not sure how to continue the cg to get them off stage. can someone please help give me the best options.

cheers

 

[Strong Badam]

u-tilt, uthrow, and fox's falling speed are identical in NTSC and PAL.

 

[KAOSTAR]

xzczxczcxzcxcxzczx

smash right or left and rotate up. you will get an sdi right/left and another hopefully up ish. probably hold c stick diagonal up.

smash everything the opposite way fox is going. or if he isn't moving much, smash away from the second hit.


sw knows how to **** with that tho lol.

it actually depends on where fox hits you and his speed and direction and the way he is facing. no guaranteed way.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

marth players
show yur marth main pride

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=282370
HBK '10

 

[Tee ay eye]

hey marth mains

what do you guys usually do when people take you to bad stages? (any stage that isn't one of the 6 original neutrals)

i'm trying to learn how to make DK64 unwinnable for Jiggs and Peach using Fox by infinite camping

i also wanna see how effective camping vs Sheik is on this stage

 

[DJMirror]

Marth gets ***** hard and it's alot harder to edge guard sheik on that stage because of the barrel and the high platform which you can't do much about it.

the uneven floors is dumb.

Plus it's really really hard to sweet spot.

 

[Jun.]

In my experience camping sheik with even fox is kinda hard. Getting punished out of a mistake while camping is generally not equal to what sheik can capitalize if they know what they're doing. Camping also puts you near the sides of the stages which puts you up against what I view as the "sheik wall" with her tilts and aerials, adding additional risk if you go off stage.

When someone counterpicks you to a non neutral, its usually clear what their gameplan is. Test them out the first stock or maybe two to see what they're really after. Fox is ideal to test people out with since he's fast and can recover from a lot of mistakes.

as Marth... lol same thing i guess.

 

[ArcNatural]

quarter circle or semi circle to the other direction?

i didn't feel like reading it (i probably will tomorrow when i'm not tired)

but based on that, what is the most effective rotational SDI input against Fox's uair?

I like to start either below 3 o'clock or below 9 o'clock, then I rotate whichever direction goes up. I try to half circle it, but I'm pretty sure by the time it hits I've only done the quarter circle.

It's very important to start below those clock times imo, it will give you something like 2-4 chances to SDI if you only get quarter circle and possibly more if you get like 190 degrees of rotation in.

Also if you moonwalk it (ie stay at nuetral THEN do the circle) you get another chance to SDI, I don't know for sure if I do that or not, usually not for upthrow upair, but for a lot of normal hits I can see that happening. I smash DI a lot of silly things.

 

[Phoenix~Lament]

Unrelated, but I found something pretty cool out.

You can short hop fair nair, and only the first hit of nair comes out.

What is this good for? If your opponent fails to crouch cancel your fair (and instead gets knocked over onto the ground) nair's first hit will jab reset them. COol stuff

 

[earla]

opponent = no DI

at 27,28+ % m2k says you can get an utilt - regrab.

i can only get it at 31% minimum,

is it possible at 27,28%?

 

[Moo2Kang]

Marth *****.

how do you play against ice climbers?

 

[KAOSTAR]

I like to start either below 3 o'clock or below 9 o'clock, then I rotate whichever direction goes up. I try to half circle it, but I'm pretty sure by the time it hits I've only done the quarter circle.

It's very important to start below those clock times imo, it will give you something like 2-4 chances to SDI if you only get quarter circle and possibly more if you get like 190 degrees of rotation in.

Also if you moonwalk it (ie stay at nuetral THEN do the circle) you get another chance to SDI, I don't know for sure if I do that or not, usually not for upthrow upair, but for a lot of normal hits I can see that happening. I smash DI a lot of silly things.

yea, i don't think half circle is beneficial even if you get it. you would sdi back towards fox.

but yea you get the initial sdi @3/9. its ok to smash perfectly right/left tho. the rotational di point is actually just above 3/9. if you get a little past 12 you get 1 more then an asdi.

so "quarter" circe up can get you 4 like you said.

its reasonable to expect:
-initial sdi
-a rotational sdi
-1 sdi

imo

 

[booshk]

opponent = no DI

at 27,28+ % m2k says you can get an utilt - regrab.

i can only get it at 31% minimum,

is it possible at 27,28%?

u might have to turn around u-tilt

i dont know though, i usually go for the utilt 29-32 ish, give or take a percent

 

[Phoenix~Lament]

Marth *****.

how do you play against ice climbers?

Space them out. Dtilt is good.

Don't get grabbed.

 

[Tee ay eye]

how do u fight noobs?

i'll clarify more tomorrow, but im really tired

 

[AceDudeyeah]

Spam fsmash?

haha

wait, wha? dashing behind me after a shffl does feel weird compared to dashing forward, is it cause of that 1 frame turn around?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I fight noobs how i fight pros. Out zone them, dont do anything stupid, bait them into doing something stupid, punishing as hard as possible.

Unless were talking about sandbagging, then my preferred method is killing with jab.

 

[Niko45]

Noobs will pretty dependably commit to something unsafe that you can wait for and then punish.

 

[ChivalRuse]

how do u fight noobs?

i'll clarify more tomorrow, but im really tired

Play Falco. Laser. Win.

Honestly, though, just dash dance camp them. They might think they can camp you, but you shouldn't have trouble approaching them if necessary.

 

[booshk]

does anyone know how many frames f-air oos comes out in

 

[PB&J]

cactus man- teach me marth

 

[Tee ay eye]

okay, now that i'm well rested and still a bitter little kid

i am bad against (certain kinds of) noobs. i realized this when i was in california last week, and it's a problem that i've had for a long, long time now. i fear bad people more than i do good people. i (in friendlies, but it's still a basis for something) felt more helpless against some bad sheiks than i did against really good sheiks like SF@T, Kira, and Luc13N (to prevent namesearching). The problem persists mostly vs Sheik, Falco, and Marth.

i think the reason that i'm bad against them is because i simply don't know what beats the "bad" tactics that noobs tend to use.

fwiw, forward told me that he gets angry playing against me because i tend to take off the first stock or win the first match, and then he just starts doing really dumb, nooby things and then i get *****.

i'm not sure how to go about fixing this, though:

a) learn the tactics that are giving me trouble and their counters (seems like the most viable option) by just playing against noobs and learning how to do it (side note: this problem may stem from the fact that i barely played vs noobs during my career, but i spent tons of time playing against good people)

b) try to mentally simplify the game in a way that makes countering these tactics easier (sounds really really nice, but i'm not exactly sure if and how it would actually WORK)

 

[Jun.]

You have to keep in mind a lot of the times when you're playing people who are not at your level, your metagame knowledge is less important. They're not going to make choices that you are used to seeing your opponent make and seemingly random and lucky shots are whats probably annoying you.

They'll try to shield grab everything
Roll
Eat every bait
Recklessly approach

Just try and play really clean and careful. Or smother the crap out of him with tech skill which he/she probably doesn't have.

 

[Strong Badam]

5 + 4-5 = 9-10 frames

 

[KirbyKaze]

okay, now that i'm well rested and still a bitter little kid

i am bad against (certain kinds of) noobs. i realized this when i was in california last week, and it's a problem that i've had for a long, long time now. i fear bad people more than i do good people. i (in friendlies, but it's still a basis for something) felt more helpless against some bad sheiks than i did against really good sheiks like SF@T, Kira, and Luc13N (to prevent namesearching). The problem persists mostly vs Sheik, Falco, and Marth.

i think the reason that i'm bad against them is because i simply don't know what beats the "bad" tactics that noobs tend to use.

fwiw, forward told me that he gets angry playing against me because i tend to take off the first stock or win the first match, and then he just starts doing really dumb, nooby things and then i get *****.

i'm not sure how to go about fixing this, though:

a) learn the tactics that are giving me trouble and their counters (seems like the most viable option) by just playing against noobs and learning how to do it (side note: this problem may stem from the fact that i barely played vs noobs during my career, but i spent tons of time playing against good people)

b) try to mentally simplify the game in a way that makes countering these tactics easier (sounds really really nice, but i'm not exactly sure if and how it would actually WORK)

I would like to help you, and I would like to stay friends. I would implore you provide some specifics, however.

This issue is coming from three specific matchups. If you can isolate the issues to specific characters, I'm sure you can narrow it down further. What stumps you?

 

[ChaosNoobSlayer]

5 + 4-5 = 9-10 frames

5 + 4-5= 9-10


How do I fight peach? I need some mental tips on spacing if anyone can help plz do!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Strong Badam]

why did you quote that and then say the same thing without the units of measurement on it

 

[Jun.]

why did you quote that and then say the same thing without the units of measurement on it

hahahahaha he undid your work and took credit for it?

hahaha no idea

 

[KAOSTAR]

why did you quote that and then say the same thing without the units of measurement on it

I think he was correcting you.

you didn't put units on the left side of the equation. so technically you created frames from unitless measurements.

so I guess just being a smart ***.

 

[Phoenix~Lament]

5 + 4-5= 9-10


How do I fight peach? I need some mental tips on spacing if anyone can help plz do!!!!!!!!!!!!

Full hop aerials with good spacing is good. Watch out for her dash attack, peaches like to get under you with it and while it's a really good move, it's usually pretty predictable. You can bait that.

Also, punish her when she pulls turnips, or when you think she will. You can stay in a certain range close enough to her where she'll feel too pressured to pull turnips if you want, or you can try baiting turnip pulls and then punish her.

Watch the downsmash and don't let her get under you.

Oh yeah, I have my own question. Which has more horizontal range, nair or fair? Or is the difference so negligible that it doesn't even really matter?

 

[Strong Badam]

I think he was correcting you.

you didn't put units on the left side of the equation. so technically you created frames from unitless measurements.

so I guess just being a smart ***.

is Strong Bad gonna have to choke a *****?

 

[AceDudeyeah]

is strong bad gonna have to choke a *****?

ho-ly crap!
Ho-ly crap!

 

[KAOSTAR]

is Strong Bad gonna have to choke a *****?

Lol you might have 2 haha

 

[earla]

does anyone have a link to a video example of a 'pivot'? i want to make sure im doing it correctly.

this is for regrabbing a no DI fox at 20+ % in the cg

thanks

 

[JBM falcon08]

Pivoting is when there is visually no momentum to the other direction you are going and you simply turn around.

Tried to make it sound pretty simple.

 

[mers]

If you aren't pivot grabbing correctly, Marth will move forward in the direction of his grab. If you are, he will simply do a standing grab.

 

[Phoenix~Lament]

Does nair or fair have more horizontal range, or is the difference so negligible it doesn't really matter?

Just wondering.

 

[ChivalRuse]

does anyone have a link to a video example of a 'pivot'? i want to make sure im doing it correctly.

this is for regrabbing a no DI fox at 20+ % in the cg

thanks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOEkqe08yzM#t=1m6s

 

[earla]

thanks heaps!

is the input just dash forward dash backward z ? really quickly?

or is it dash forward dash backward JC z? jump cancelled grab?

sorry just confirming

 

[KAOSTAR]

dash forward, flick back. you will be standing an you just grab.

don't jc