Important Carefully Ask PPMD about the Tiara Guy

[Niko45]

KJ64 is playable in my experience, though peach might be a nightmare there. Brinstar is just totally unplayable as Marth and its what I ban if I suspect they might take me there at all and I'd recommend using fox/falco/sheik on Rainbow Cruise.

 

[maXXXpower]

yeah, that sounds like a pretty good info base for playing on those stages with marth.

does anyone think that it's worth putting the effort into a new character for those stages?

fox .

 

[Jun.]

imo KJ64 is almost a certain loss against both peach and sheik. If they aim to dirty you on that stage, there are just too many options of camping and stopping marth's strengths that I just don't even bother playing marth if that stage is picked. Just pick fox (which every marth player has most likely) and dirty them back there lol.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

My fox and my marth are basically on the same level. I would never choose to play marth on a non-neutral. Fox is better on brinstar than most people think. DK64 is obviously a stupid-silly stage for fox if you get past the dreamland ceiling. RC goes without saying...

sometimes its fun to use marth on these stages when you're sandbagging, but more and more people know how to abuse the stages these days so idk if i'd even risk it.

 

[Tee ay eye]

Who's better on KJ64 and Brinstar? Sheik or Fox?

 

[Bob Money]

shiek on both, better recovery options and aerial camping with back airs. fox has a hard time(harder time) killing on dk64 due to lack of shine spike opportunities and ceiling. plus sheiks back air can cover the entire top platforms of dk64 without having to be really precise about it. shiek can also needle to keep people from recovering via barrel.

 

[Strong Badam]

bob$'s answer is correct. fox also gets combo'd by the acid on brinstar harder than anyone else. first thing I learned on my path to being a Bum-style DK...

i usually just ban Flat Zone, as I'm amazing on all the other stages.

 

[KAOSTAR]

why not falco who falls faster, and has less recovery.

 

[Strong Badam]

falco's lasers allow him to fly up into the sky and then fall down without being hit then use lasers after he lands. his recovery is infinite.

 

[KAOSTAR]

Agreed .

 

[DJMirror]

KJ64 imo is fine against Puff


against everything else is ******** and hard.

 

[Strong Badam]

what .

 

[DJMirror]

I agree wholeheartedly with this entire post.

**** you you douche bag. I take back what I said when I finish watching Clannad. (I'm almost done with Durarara)

Dont forget Diakonos in the green marths lol

How stupid of me.

Thanks for the shoutout. I'd put Diakonos under the green marths, and Tec0 under the black marths. I actually got to play both Tec0 and HBK's marths this weekend which was awesome. And in general, PewPewU is my new must-watch Marth player. That Marth ditto with M2K? Legit as ****. I really like KFC as well, but there's not much footage of his Marth these days.

You're welcome =D

I didn't count Teczero because he's a sheik main.

Nor Cal's Marth players *****.


PewPewU *****! Did you watch his set against SS?
Too bad So Cal doesn't have any good Marth players like Boa, Ken, Mike Y etc.


EDIT: I take that back, I forgot that KFC moved to So Cal from Nor Cal for school.


What I meant that: Marth vs Puff on KJ64 is fine, it's not too bad.

Against everyone else on that stage and other non neutral stages (I think PS is not bad) are stupid and ********.

 

[ChivalRuse]

I love PewPewU's Marth. I used to think he was overrated, but then I watched some more videos of him, and I was like "no, he's actually really good."

 

[Teczer0]

I didn't name search and found me in this thread like wtf am I doing here.

I thought Tai was always a sheik main.

I need to play HBK more, maybe grab some tips while I'm at it. =D

 

[ChivalRuse]

I love your sig, Haley.

And your Marth, too.

 

[Dart!]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyfgNQo6mw4&feature=feedu

bored...and found some videos of me playing bad...hurray!

 

[painlord k11]

I love kongo jungle even though it's bad for both my mains marth and shiek. idk i actually though marth is better on brinstar then kongo jungle i gues im just a noob. ill counter pick and stage ban depending on person and moment ect.

 

[Dart!]

every marth player should have what is known as a "pocket fox/falco/sheik/character good on brinstar and rainbow cruise....why? because people love cping marth's there. i've had limited success sticking with marth on rainbow and brinstar. going fox on rainbow i am now undefeated there and the same for brinstar using my pocket ganondorf ^_^

oops, forgot to define pocket for people that don't know

"pocket": a character that one may not main but be proficient enough with tech skill and the characters moveset to use safely in tournament on a stage or a MU that one's main may not be well equipped to handle. also something you put stuff in attached to the side of your pants or shorts XD

 

[Retroking2000]

^ 100% agree with you

 

[Dart!]

btw i suck against samus...tell me what i'm doing wrong. please :/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stJa9...ture=feedumore

 

[Jun.]

btw i suck against samus...tell me what i'm doing wrong. please :/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stJa9...ture=feedumore

your link is "malinformed video ID" or something like that

 

[Dart!]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stJa9xdNDtU

try this, btw i really noticed that i stopped caring when i got down to two stocks game 2 lol. was playing really salty bad that weekend -_-

 

[Jun.]

samus first stock why are you dtilt'ing instead of fsmashing he would have died way earlier.

yeah on the match on FD dtilting basically cost you the match when you were edgeguarding.

In general that samus is baiting everything by just wavedashing back turning your approaches into mistakes. Notice how you are clearly at a disadvantage when the match is at a standstill with both of you on neutral ground. You probably feel the need to approach too since he is missiling.

when you try to recover you try and hover over him and get hit by his utilt a few times. Remember you have an air dodge in all directions and just sweetspot the ledge or aim for somewhere far away instead of right over his head.

Try not to stay midair against samus. Mid air means that you'll most likely throw out an aerial and samus will just nair you after your fair is over. Stick to sh fast falled single fairs into dtilts since samus doesn't have any options to counter when she's being pressured by spaced fair to dtilt. Mid air also means that you are susceptible to missiles and other bad things.

read the quote of cactuar's post and keep samus at "far spacing" She won't missile, you'll out prioritize everything, and she will feel pressured instead of pressuring you into getting baited.

 

[Dart!]

thanks man ^_^, other than sheik just because of the MU this is the only character i dread facing in tournament because of how little i know about it.

 

[OverLord]

^ junkimchi

and also, you should spam more moves oh her shield and near her

in the first match on FD, you try to hit her with a Nair and then you pull out some random move like Utilt or Fsmash, and most likely get punished cause of the lag.. use more Dtilts and Aerials on stage, they got less lag and Samus can't punish 'em. It's not brawl, you can actually combo, so if a Nair/Fair hits, follow up with others, playing faster will make Samus feel uncomfortable and pressured, don't let her time to think how to bait you

 

[Jun.]

thanks man ^_^, other than sheik just because of the MU this is the only character i dread facing in tournament because of how little i know about it.

sheik is very similar to samus in 2 main ways.

1. If you're standing full screen they have projectiles to force you to approach

2. When you do approach, they gain a high advantage by simply wavedashing back. Sheik more than samus obviously but then again she's the one in top tier.

Both matchups are very just spacing battles instead of the common Marth matchups vs fastfallers that revolve around grab capitalization. Not to downplay grabs in these matchups but they take on a less combo based usage.

Be patient. Don't throw out aerials randomly when they are in reach of reacting. Keep your opponents at cactuar's "far spacing". Take advantage of their repetitive and predictable recoveries and know your options against them.

 

[puff ball]

anyone no of the games i wanna be the guy and i wanna be the fan game.

 

[KAOSTAR]

if you aren't approaching sheiks needles are easy to block.

if you have plats then they suck at times.

 

[Niko45]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stJa9xdNDtU

try this, btw i really noticed that i stopped caring when i got down to two stocks game 2 lol. was playing really salty bad that weekend -_-

Couple of tips for Samus:

The most major thing you're doing is trying to full hop over missiles, powershield missiles, and just in general trying to avoid missiles. Jab her missiles because she wants you to do something uncomfortable in response to the missiles so she can take advantage of you being out of position. If you just hold your ground and jab the missiles, you'll be able to maintain good spacing and pressure Samus into making a mistake (or just simply hit her, she has no answer for dtilt/fair spaced properly).

If you notice that any character is getting back to the ledge on you a lot, it's time to get on the edge and force them on stage to at the very least take more damage. In general I'd edgeguard a bit more aggressively. If you notice he's trying to airdodge -> extender the ledge a lot, take the ledge and bair him away. Keep him guessing as he recovers so that you can force mistakes. If he knows all you're going to do is try to dtilt him, he has all day to figure out what he wants to do.

Samus loves to jump out of Marth's fthrow. Fthrow and wait for her to jump, then rush with fair which should lead to easy damage racking combos/sending samus off stage.

But really, the major thing to do is get comfortable against missiles. Once you get inside Samus you're doing everything right. But full hop non fastfall nair approaches are going to get you hit.

 

[Nø Ca$h]

can u short hop over sheiks standing needle?

 

[Phoenix~Lament]

Why do good marths, in a fairly neutral position, double jump right above the ground to do the flippy twirly thing?

 

[Wenbobular]

I feel it's kinda like why Falcons will double jump knee ...

I think it gets you to the point where you can fastfall faster than a full hop while putting you above where they can reach you with a shuffled aerial

Also you can change the direction you're moving with your 2nd jump

 

[Dart!]

Couple of tips for Samus:

The most major thing you're doing is trying to full hop over missiles, powershield missiles, and just in general trying to avoid missiles. Jab her missiles because she wants you to do something uncomfortable in response to the missiles so she can take advantage of you being out of position. If you just hold your ground and jab the missiles, you'll be able to maintain good spacing and pressure Samus into making a mistake (or just simply hit her, she has no answer for dtilt/fair spaced properly).

If you notice that any character is getting back to the ledge on you a lot, it's time to get on the edge and force them on stage to at the very least take more damage. In general I'd edgeguard a bit more aggressively. If you notice he's trying to airdodge -> extender the ledge a lot, take the ledge and bair him away. Keep him guessing as he recovers so that you can force mistakes. If he knows all you're going to do is try to dtilt him, he has all day to figure out what he wants to do.

Samus loves to jump out of Marth's fthrow. Fthrow and wait for her to jump, then rush with fair which should lead to easy damage racking combos/sending samus off stage.

But really, the major thing to do is get comfortable against missiles. Once you get inside Samus you're doing everything right. But full hop non fastfall nair approaches are going to get you hit.

thanks niko, this is what 0 matchup experience will do to someone at times

 

[Metal Reeper]

anyone no of the games i wanna be the guy and i wanna be the fan game.

I beat the first one, fangame is just too insane, I have vids on my youtube of me playing em, check my sig.

anyway, my fox sucks, cactuar halp ;[

 

[Vonzar the Soulrender]

What's the best way to fight a pillaring Falco with Marth?

 

[Brookman]

wavedash out of shield when you see the shine then tipper the scrub.

 

[OverLord]

^ that's the best way to get a Nair in the face

wavedashing back is good if you predict the first aerial after the lazor's spamming, while you're pressured the best way is Fairing out of shield, or Dairing, it depends on the position of Falco on your shield. Watch out for shield stun and get the right moment to come out with the Fair. Falco is not as fast as Fox, so his pressure is not so difficult to punish, Fox can be a pain in the *** if he's good.

I suggest moving your shield Up-Towards Falco, cause it slows his pressure, and let you a frame window to punish him. Good Falcos are not going to pressure your shield blinded, cause it will get 'em punished, probably they're going to space their aerials to avoid and bait shield-grabs (Mango anyone?). So don't rely on shieldgrabs all the time, it works just when you see the Falco screwed up his pressure.

Light shielding can be good in some occasion. It sends you far and can get you a well spaced Up-B OoS.


anyway Brookman is not wrong, wavedashing back works if the Falco is screwing his spacing. So watch carefully his movements.

 

[Winston]

What's wrong with what Brookman said though?

 

[OverLord]

O_o'

I'll quote myself:

"anyway Brookman is not wrong, wavedashing back works if the Falco is screwing his spacing. So watch carefully his movements"



the fact is, doing wavedash back after the shine doesn't work if the Falco is doing his **** right