Social C. Falcon Social

[DuckPimp]

whats with all these random threads about throw into knee this is 2012 people why are we still talking about this ****?

I MISS WENBO AND roneblades and dare i say it 0room :|

and just people who know how to search a thread

 

[Citizen Snips]

hahahah **** i thought u would be an asian dude (unless u were asian i already forgot lol)

===

and that's definitely the first of which I would talk about why people running apex blew. the gay azzz ******* referrees who would not let us play friendlies and make us wait for no fuken reason for an hour. lame as ****.

Coughdm****ingbrandoncough

Seriously, Crush and I were MMing for credit cards, and he still kicked us off. We were playing on the floor because they would see us if we were in chairs. It was like a cop beating homeless people.

 

[Nakamaru]

Yea, s2j i'm not asian. Just some dorky white kid with curly hair. Haha.

I actually learned a lot from playing you in falcon dittos. The next day i didn't lose a single one to anyone i played. *Flex* Felt good, real good.

I wish i could fight foxes like you do though. I am so hit or miss with that matchup.

 

[Deleted member]

hahahah yea my bad, i definitely shoulda asked u for ur tag at the very least

ur pretty **** at falcon dittos too, and that match was funny also

and dm brandon is a ****en **** whos like an uglier, faggier version of cactuar

 

[Juushichi]

lol. could you go down more of what you didn't like about APEX?

I was hoping you'd beat Armada.

 

[leffen]

s2j is the ****ing best


omg
ive never felt so good
when getting so comboed

please never stop playing

 

[Citizen Snips]

s2j is the ****ing best


omg
ive never felt so good
when getting so comboed

please never stop playing

Leffen, you ***, why didn't we play? I wanted- no, NEEDED to get ***** by your Yoshi.

I like Jeapie more than you because of this. I hope you're happy.

<3

 

[Juggleguy]

Johnny, I asked the main TOs (Sheridan, FullMetal) to make a lot of changes to R2 pools and bracket, including you vs Armada for the third national in a row, but I was basically told to **** off =\ was pretty shocked at the lack of cooperation overall.

I ended up having zero input on R2 pools and bracket, I think partly because the schedule was so behind and those two were trying to bust their *** to get things moving, and partly because they put NO emphasis on previous player head-to-head history when creating matchups. They only went by region, and even that failed hard (there were at least 5 brutal in-region matchups during bracket).

I'm glad you think The Big House was run way better... bottomline is, making efficient regional/national tourney schedules is not rocket science, and at the end of the day nobody listened to some of my suggestions (start R1 pools when doubles is halfway done, use both rooms, etc).

 

[Deleted member]

lol. could you go down more of what you didn't like about APEX?

I was hoping you'd beat Armada.

everyone ****ing did. and thats why it was the saddest smash moment for me ever

people who I barely knew walked up to me even before brackets were made and told me that they wanted me to or that I had to beat Armada for them.

I was definitely emo as **** for the rest of my trip. people who i hung out with could sense it too. giawhgo;weaihoagwijdvbdx

==

Apex problems from my eyes:

1. Alex Strife is an IDIOT

-This is probably the biggest problem in all of Apex. I feel that most of the problems were a direct cause of Alex Strife's either incompetent TO-ing and/or his actual lack of taking part of trying to run the tourney.

I'm assuming he did not actually even try to run the tournament and just operated as mediocre hype man or BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD- idea giver that only served to waste time.

Here is a direct quote from Alex Strife post tournament: "LETS GIVE IT UP FOR APEX GAIS WOOOOOOOOO YEAH APEXXXXXXXX"

0 people cheered. 5 minutes later he tried it again like 5-6 times. Alex Strife is a moron. Not only is he a moron but he is a ****ing annoying moron that needs to know when to shut the **** up and not repeat his pitiful cries for hype

At least he is a moron that successfully advertised and made 2nd biggest tournament of all time. But he really coulda made the tournament a lot better. The tournament was only GOOD because of the people there and the game itself, Melee. The actual tournament running aspect was fairly bad at best.

Scar said this all the time that Alex Strife was hella stupid. he's right!

===

I probably shoulda went straight into the problems of Apex but I really had to stress how stupid Alex Strife seemed.

Here they were:

First day of Apex: We had 2 big *** rooms. 1 room used for running the Melee Tournament The other half for Brawl friendlies. What's the point? Why not just use both rooms for running the tournament?

Day 2, this swapped, one room was used for Brawl tourney, and the other had setups for Melee friendlies.

HUGE waste of potiential time. Saturday most people had nothing to do. I initially got extremely high. Then got extremely drunk.

Some wayyyyyyyyyyy better options:

Best option IMO:

Run Melee/ brawl concurrently in each respective room rather than use half the rooms for 2 days. If you used both rooms on the first 2 days we would have double productivity.

Not as good but still good:
Only run Melee hardcore both rooms, then run Brawl hardcore in both rooms next day.

==
2. Alex Strife likes to waste time for no reason for stuff people don't care about

Crew battles- Alex Strife wanted to waste time bringing Isai out of nowhere even though he clearly had no interest and waste time with Captain Jack.

Makes us stop playing friendlies and threatening people with evictions when there is no reason to stop (already discussed)

Repeated stupid attempts to raise hype that works 20% of the time

==
3. Alex Strife wants US to make up for HIS **** UPS! WTF!

- Day 1, Alex Strife made everything take hella long, then demands us to stay till we finish top 8 brackets in singles. We started playing round 2 pools at about 11- midnight and he wants us to stay till 4 am. That's hella whack and rightfully none of us wanted that ****

=
4. other meh stuff
- We finished up to top 9 in teams Day 1 at around 6 pm. Why not just finish teams off at the very least?

5. bad planning (which I blame 95% on Alex Strife's part) in terms of recording and other stuff:

Many many matches were not recorded despite a team assembled to record matches. I blame Alex Strife again of course.


==

So I did not like the tournament running aspect of Apex. Which was extremely bad. Alex Strife may have made it come together but he clearly did not intend on taking part in the actual running. He wanted to be the guy with the mic who hyped us tournament sets (even then, he's still pretty bad)

I also did not like getting ***** by Armada. SIGH

What I loved was the people there, and Melee itself. I'm convinced that this would probably be the worst tournament ever if it were any other video game but the fact that Melee is so **** despite being 10 years old turned an abysmal tournament into a "good" national that, if not planned by a moron, could potentially have been as good as the Genesis tournaments held by DBR/ Juggleguy. Those guys know what they are doing and not an idiot yelling **** into a mic to generate hype.


class soon cya later

 

[Deleted member]

@juggleguy

I place 0 blame on you and the other TOs. I know Sheridan busted his *** off to try to make this horribly run tournament work. I know that Big House had 100 people and this had way more people, but you guys knew what you were doing. And that's why Big House will be very high on my list of best tourneys i been too for a long time.

You guys had to put up with so much bull ****.

I definitely only blame Alex Strife for being an idiot. Anyone with half a brain would not ****ing suck this much **** at running a tournament

 

[iRobinhoood]

Is this a "ask a good Falcon player anything thread"?

 

[Deleted member]

yeah, ask me whatever you want got class very soon though shoulda left like 5 minutes earlier loooool

 

[Citizen Snips]

Glad I'm not the only one who thought that the way this was run was abysmal. I was extremely mad at the room setups, especially the HUGE waste of space in the first room. ****ing lounge chairs? Nobody comes to a tournament to lounge. The only reason people were using them was because there were no setups for their game. It's like they were trying to solve a problem that was caused by said solution.

Also, I really hate when people try and make unnecessary hype. It kills the actual hype.

 

[Deleted member]

also, the water at the venue was horrid. When I couldn't get a hold of a gallon of water after the first day it sucked so much dik

 

[Citizen Snips]

That's why you just drink Crush man.


Crush is the ****.

 

[iRobinhoood]

Everyone who plays this game seems to be lightning fast and fluid. It's discouraging and encouraging at the same time. I think I need more basic advice or maybe I'm just over thinking things.

During a match, I'll find myself utilizing like three basic moves with my Falcon. Dairs, Nairs, and Fairs. Some grabs here and there. And at the end of the match I think to myself, well wow, I didn't jab to protect against being grabbed, I didn't tilt AT ALL, I shuffled ok but didn't follow up with anything.

 

[Citizen Snips]

Everyone who plays this game seems to be lightning fast and fluid. It's discouraging and encouraging at the same time. I think I need more basic advice or maybe I'm just over thinking things.

During a match, I'll find myself utilizing like three basic moves with my Falcon. Dairs, Nairs, and Fairs. Some grabs here and there. And at the end of the match I think to myself, well wow, I didn't jab to protect against being grabbed, I didn't tilt AT ALL, I shuffled ok but didn't follow up with anything.

Despite being fairly low on the technical side, Falcon is not an easy character. He moves ridiculously fast, falls ridiculously fast, and his moveset is extremely hard to use and demands consistent basic technical ability. You need to take him one step at a time and not get frustrated. I find it's best to get his movement down to a point where you are comfortable with wavelands, dash dancing (both the long and short ones), and edgecancels. Once you're comfortable with those you have the basic tools you need to combo.

If you're having trouble following up, just play more. Learn his knockbacks. Experiment on level 1 Ganons or Marths on FD. Play as many people as you can. This will build mental associations with different situations so that you will eventually just know what to do when the time comes.

It's good that you can recognize something like how you're not using your jabs the way you like. All you need to do is focus on doing that until it's integrated into your game.

Hang in there, it's so ****ing worth it.

Also, uair *****. Great move for when they're on plats. Tilts are derp, and I go whole matches without using them fairly often.

 

[ryankam10]

Tilts are derp, and I go whole matches without using them fairly often.

lol bad his tilts are good you just need to know when to use them
like seriously theyre good

 

[Divinokage]

Ya certain tilts can be good. Well, to me it's good to know what move beats what other move. Learning that is pretty important, it falls along with spacing for sure as well... because if you space a tilt badly vs like a Ganon Fair for example then you'll get hit and not counter his Fair when you are supposed to be able to.

 

[Citizen Snips]

lol bad his tilts are good you just need to know when to use them
like seriously theyre good

Yeah, I worded that poorly. I feel like they're the least used part of his moveset, especially against spacies. Dtilt's hella laggy, and utilt is mostly an edgeguarding tool unless you're Hax. Ftilt's nice against people who recover low, but I usually just grab the ledge and get them if they land on the stage =\

I dunno, maybe I should be using tilts more. I'll check them out.

 

[iRobinhoood]

Is there anything more frustrating than learning how to moonwalk with Falcon?

 

[tarheeljks]

johnny f-tilts as much as any falcon i can think of (excluding edgeguards b/c those are a completely different situation), and he doesn't do it that often. tilting is pretty situational i think

also, while falcon is not a space animal, i disagree that he is fairly low on the technical side

edit: if you never tilted as falcon i doubt you would lose much of his game

 

[Citizen Snips]

also, while falcon is not a space animal, i disagree that he is fairly low on the technical side

I was more saying that he doesn't have that vast array of different techskills that Fox and Falco have. That being said, I think that because he gets combo'd extremely easily by pretty much everyone, and because in his hardest matchups every dropped techchase and combo could cost you the game, technical mistakes are much more dangerous for him than for Fox or Falco.

Is there anything more frustrating than learning how to moonwalk with Falcon?

As cool as it is, don't worry about it. You don't need it until you can do cool **** with it. I'm just learning it now, and I've been playing him for about a year now.

 

[crush]

rocky has these really cool combos with forward tilt and theyre even cooler because after u die he drinks some crush

 

[Deleted member]

Everyone who plays this game seems to be lightning fast and fluid. It's discouraging and encouraging at the same time. I think I need more basic advice or maybe I'm just over thinking things.

During a match, I'll find myself utilizing like three basic moves with my Falcon. Dairs, Nairs, and Fairs. Some grabs here and there. And at the end of the match I think to myself, well wow, I didn't jab to protect against being grabbed, I didn't tilt AT ALL, I shuffled ok but didn't follow up with anything.

you didn't really ask a question but the most basic advice I can give is to be able to do whatever you want to do. Simple as that. To me being able to do whatever you want to do 100% makes you the most technical player. Mango is capable of that.

This can be as simple as knowing the opponent will tech to the right after you d-throw them. Make sure you are able to punish that option. If you know they are going to tech to the right but are incapable of punishing that option they can keep doing that every single time and you will never punish them hard out of a d-throw.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgVRBdpou9U
Here is a Northern California match I recently watched. Sparky is extremely bad at covering hydrokirby's tech aways ( i think, haven't rewatched match in a while). Hydrokirby adapts and Sparky almost never does a strong punish again

Most people have the mis-conceived notion that tech chasing is a straight 33% chance to hit because of tech left, tech in place, and tech right so each time they covered an option if they missed they got unlucky. NOPE. Better players will adapt to what you are weak at covering. So if they are good and you suck, your probability of landing a tech chase goes to 10%~

Playing people (slightly) better than you is also important too and forces you to learn/adapt if you want to stop getting owned. Playing someone WAYYYYYY better is not good because you are going to get 4 stocked over and over and not learn anything unless they tell you what you are doing wrong.

I'm not saying you should NOT play people worse than you or treat it as a joke. I have learned many things from players worse than me. Some from playing them and some from just them showing me a cool trick/ movement shenanigans. Gahtzu and Arcnatural showed me some stuff I want to try to implement when I met them at Apex.

In terms of moves, I think every single one of his moveset is usable, some obviously more situational than others

F-tilt is very good. Use it the same way as ganondorf although it is slightly not as good. Some people keep getting caught by it especially since they don't expect it as falcon.

My tips for using it is to try it out and see which opponents it hits a lot and see if they adapt or not. Not bad overall for throwing it out sometimes but it works less, but not NEVER, on good players

Not bad for edgeguarding too in some spots.

=

d-tilt is situationally good too, the old school silent spectre combo was up-throw, d-tilt, knee when they miss tech.

Now, everyone in the world knows about that and most DECENT-GOOD player will NEVER tech in place because they think you are doing one of silentspectre's old trademark combos so they will TECH

If they are worse, they will probably miss tech

==

feel free to post here about questions about moves/ general spots and I'll tell you what I think about them/ what to do. But personally, every single move in falcon's repertoire has a good use.

Be creative and experiment, that's what I do whenever I play and I discover something new almost every time I play

 

[Deleted member]

Is there anything more frustrating than learning how to moonwalk with Falcon?

There is a picture somewhere on the site that shows the ideal method for moonwalking. The key is to NOT go the whole 180 motion but to get to the other side as quick as you can

An easier way is to walk in a direction you want to moonwalk (make sure stick is pressed in all the way to the left or right but do not RUN), then quickly smash stick to other side then swing it around back to the direction you were walking.

What I just typed is Hella confusing so I hope people show you a visual picture of the motions you are supposed to do. It took me a while to be able to do pretty good ones so it does take some practice.

Moonwalks are situationally useful, so its something useful to add to your movement set IMO.

 

[Juggleguy]

If Apex 2012 had this Day 1 schedule (my suggested one) I'm 90% sure the tourney would have finished according to schedule.

11am Melee Doubles
2pm Melee 1st Round Pools (after ~50% of teams are eliminated from doubles bracket)
5pm Melee 2nd Round Pools
7pm Melee Singles Bracket until top 8

By far the biggest scheduling blunder was failing to schedule Melee 1st Round Pools correctly. Anyone who entered Melee Doubles and has common sense can tell you that out of the five hours they set aside for Melee Doubles (11am - 4pm), maybe 10% of that time was spent actually sitting down to play a tourney match. The other 90% could have been spent completing 1st Round Pools, but instead was completely wasted.

There is no reason to not run Doubles and 1st Round Pools at the same time. The Melee room had about 50 setups total from what I could tell, and starting as early as Losers 3rd Round in doubles bracket, only 32 of those setups were needed. By Losers 4th Round in doubles bracket, only 16 (!) of those setups were needed. The others should have been immediately converted into 1st Round Pools setups.

2nd Round Pools would have been a breeze with only four people per pool and enough setups to put each pool onto two TVs. Shouldn't even require one hour, but in my hypothetical schedule I still gave it two hours. Bracket would have had a comfortable 7pm starting time with more than enough time to reach the top 8 by midnight (on Sunday, the entire Melee singles bracket only required about 4 hours to reach top 8, and that's after a ton of people arrived late).

Also, this should give people an idea of how impossible it was to record matches:

For anyone wondering, here are some things we had working against us at the venue, starting from the most annoying:

1. No labels (seriously?) associated with several of the TVs, probably around a third of them, until late in the day on Friday
2. Inconsistent order of label numbers on the TVs that did have them; labels were also so tiny that they were hard to read
3. Very little room on top of tables for laptops to be placed next to the TVs, plus unnecessary coats, drinks, and backpacks taking up space
4. Lack of available outlets, and even when available, power strips dangerously dangling off tables or placed in awful locations
5. Lack of a loud PA system, making it impossible to direct players to the proper setup without hunting them down and dragging them to it
6. Poor placement of TVs in terms of screen size; the bigger and more popular TVs were located in harder-to-reach areas for some stupid reason
7. Several TVs (at least 10-15 of them) had no GameCubes to go with them... I seriously can't comprehend how this even happened
8. Too many people crowding around tables, making it nearly impossible to coordinate a team effort regarding the recording staff
9. Lack of cooperation from TOs regarding the location of recorded matches (not their fault, they had to hustle due to the schedule falling behind)
10. Inability to view bracket on a projector or monitor; people had to crowd around the TO desk and constantly ask to scroll up/down/left/right

 

[Deleted member]

yeah that sucks, I can't understand why they wouldn't take your schedule

ALEX STRIFE SUCKS

 

[ShroudedOne]

I only met Juggleguy last Saturday I think, but he's really cool, and legit, and knows how to upload videos and RUN A TOURNAMENT CORRECTLY.

That is all.

 

[Deleted member]

I was more saying that he doesn't have that vast array of different techskills that Fox and Falco have. That being said, I think that because he gets combo'd extremely easily by pretty much everyone, and because in his hardest matchups every dropped techchase and combo could cost you the game, technical mistakes are much more dangerous for him than for Fox or Falco.


As cool as it is, don't worry about it. You don't need it until you can do cool **** with it. I'm just learning it now, and I've been playing him for about a year now.

interesting thoughts overall

Fox is variable, most foxes will not **** you out of a hit, good foxes have the capability to **** you extremely hard though. You must master your defensive game after getting hit to minimize damage as much as possible through Crouch cancelling, DI-ing (usually down and away), and so forth

Extremely vicious foxes though can **** your entire stock even with great DI/ defensive tricks on your part

Falco is usually very dangerous if they land a single good hit on you. But them getting that hit on you depends on how good they are. Bad falcos struggle to get a good hit on a good falcon. Also, only top-notch falcos are capable of continuing out of the combo with strong DI choices on falcon's part

==

So I feel that Falcon can sometimes drop mistakes and usually survive combo strings. Out of all the spacies I have played, almost none of them have straight up ***** me out of a mistake on my part because of my decent defensive game. Damage control is important after you make that mistake that gets you in trouble.

Only mango made me feel absolutely completely helpless as soon as he hit my SHIELD as fox. WTF?

Fox/falco I feel are more susceptible to getting pwned out of mistakes. Falcon on a non -FD stage can usually live to fight another day(less so vs. strong players but sometimes still), Spacies just plain get *****

==

already said it in an earlier post but moonwalking is something I would learn, but not hurry and learn and implement into your gameplay. Just having a movement option is fairly good IMO.

A practical use of it is to be able to fling yourself off the stage while facing the stage so you can hit them with a back-air/ semi-gimp with last part of up-air. It's good because you can now use aerials that are situationally better than jumping off normally with f-air, n-air. Useful in the doc matchup

 

[Citizen Snips]

... so you can hit them with a back-air/ semi-gimp with last part of up-air

Read: Reverse Falcon Punch

 

[Divinokage]

S2j, since Falcon's Ftilt has weaker knockback than Ganon's.. I'm pretty sure you can catch people doing a DI away if they expect an upair.. possibly forcing a no tech to a free aerial?

 

[Deleted member]

yeah most def, i've pulled it off a few times especially on those who never adapted and kept getting hit

 

[Wenbobular]

whats with all these random threads about throw into knee this is 2012 people why are we still talking about this ****?

I MISS WENBO AND roneblades and dare i say it 0room :|

What the heck where did this come from hahaha
I feel like all I did was give some basic advice and rant about Luigi

Also I feel like if I'd had a pool with a Luigi in it I might have made bracket
As it was, I got an ICs and 2 Peaches and went 1-2 to everyone but MacD

 

[S l o X]

s2j just kind of looked at me like i was ******** every time i would be near him / watching his matches.

sorry i couldn't give you 5$, driver (bolt) had to leave because he was feeling terrible at the end of day 3. (i was the one who asked you and sfat for MM after i mm'd darrell + kage)

i'm dropping falcon most likely. actually, i probably won't because $mike would kill me if i did but i think i'm going to second him.

i felt the same way about apex. it was ******** and honestly, letting people enter as different names causing STUPID upsets is straight ********. wish both rooms were used through the 3 days too. last thoughts on apex: zzz. i had more fun watching people play and at the hotel with pc chris + tfs than at the actual tourney.

 

[Nakamaru]

On marth/med weight chars at low-ish percents you can sh Uair > f-tilt. It is a great way to continue combos if they are good with combo DI. If they survival DI it you'll miss though.

 

[arbustos]

Ah, ****sticks.

Who do I owe $20 to? PM me and I'll paypal it to you as soon as vids/confirmation of some sort comes out.

I don't check this thread often so make sure to message me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCTvgh5mZ8E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kv7tRxrmJN0

That was really for a 100?


other falcon/kage mms there as well

 

[Dan -Zodiac-]

personally ive found the ftilt useful to hit recovering peaches with, but obv it hits them high and not so far, just resets the situation to go for another uair kill lol

S2j, since Falcon's Ftilt has weaker knockback than Ganon's.. I'm pretty sure you can catch people doing a DI away if they expect an upair.. possibly forcing a no tech to a free aerial?

thats how that works! lmao ive been confused since the day i saw that

 

[Divinokage]

Ya I think it only works on FFers at mid % though like.. 60-70? maybe 50?

 

[Deleted member]

s2j just kind of looked at me like i was ******** every time i would be near him / watching his matches.

sorry i couldn't give you 5$, driver (bolt) had to leave because he was feeling terrible at the end of day 3. (i was the one who asked you and sfat for MM after i mm'd darrell + kage)

i'm dropping falcon most likely. actually, i probably won't because $mike would kill me if i did but i think i'm going to second him.

i felt the same way about apex. it was ******** and honestly, letting people enter as different names causing STUPID upsets is straight ********. wish both rooms were used through the 3 days too. last thoughts on apex: zzz. i had more fun watching people play and at the hotel with pc chris + tfs than at the actual tourney.

y would i look at u ******** ROFL

if you feel i did, there's no malicious intent on my part