Balanced Brawl Standard Release

[hyrulianprincesszeldafan]

by garbage you mean that it didnt connect well in vbrawl. but anyways i think sheik should get a +1% on all her aerials i dunno why but i think it would be kinda fair? ...sheik is already a beast ^_^

oh BTW, for final smash textures i changed the texture for zelda's light arrow, it already came with the name and everything all i needed was to put in my SD card, so if i want to do the same for sheik would i use the same .pac file and change it from "fitzeldafinal" to "fitsheikfinal"?

 

[NovaRyumaru]

Sheik's F-smash was complete garbage in vBrawl.

If you misspaced it the slightest, it would whiff.

It's not the F-smash i care about, never used it any way. It's the otehr BS changes she got.

 

[hyrulianprincesszeldafan]

It's not the F-smash i care about, never used it any way. It's the otehr BS changes she got.

like her f-tilt correct? i luved it too though it was kinda cheap.

 

[NovaRyumaru]

like her f-tilt correct? i luved it too though it was kinda cheap.

Not so much her f-tilt but the actualy nerfs to some potential killing blows and attacks used to create some space/setup for aerial shenanigans, even so wasn't cheap, easy to di out of the tilt juggling unless you were Dedede or another heavy weight.

:shiek:
Dash attack sweetspot knockback (100/50) -> (30/90), angle (60) -> (80)
Dash attack sourspot knockback (100/20) -> (10/80), angle (-) -> (40)
Foward tilt inner damage (5%) -> (7%), knockback (100/20) -> (80/32)
Foward tilt outer damage (5%) -> (7%), knockback (100/20) -> (75/40)
Down tilt knockback (80/35) -> (80/50), angle (70) -> (110)
Forward smash first hit knockback (100/0) -> (50/0)
Forward smash second hit knockback (100/50) -> (90/50)
Down aerial damage (10%) -> (11%), knockback (80/30) -> (30/90), angle (70) -> (75)
Forward throw angle (70) -> (40)
Needles close range damage (3%) -> (4%)

Sure she has great damage output, but she's almost to the point her only kill moves are u-smash or Vanish. D-smash isn't a very reliable killing blow until mid 100's.

What she needs is an aerial finisher, would be excellent to get a buff to her f-air. Or even get some juggling power from melee back on her u-air.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

many of us would appreciate if you did not compare melee characters to their brawl counterparts...

 

[NovaRyumaru]

many of us would appreciate if you did not compare melee characters to their brawl counterparts...

My appologies, but you have to admit, she got hit with the nerf stick... along with the rest of the tree between games, same with Falcon.

 

[hyrulianprincesszeldafan]

Not so much her f-tilt but the actualy nerfs to some potential killing blows and attacks used to create some space/setup for aerial shenanigans, even so wasn't cheap, easy to di out of the tilt juggling unless you were Dedede or another heavy weight.



Sure she has great damage output, but she's almost to the point her only kill moves are u-smash or Vanish. D-smash isn't a very reliable killing blow until mid 100's.

What she needs is an aerial finisher, would be excellent to get a buff to her f-air. Or even get some juggling power from melee back on her u-air.

The thing i like the most is the damage the needles take. its great. but i agree on the fact that she needs an aerial finisher, i prefer her B-air. that kick is one of my favorites and i believe it looks like one of the stongest but its not

 

[Eyada]

My only complaint on Sheik/Zelda at this point is the MK match-up. Overall, I feel like Sheik's match-ups are good (or at least manageable) across the board, and some of her worst match-ups from vBrawl are much more tame.

In exchange for the few small buffs she got, Sheik lost F-Tilt lock and Grab-release-DACUS. F-Tilt lock removal doesn't affect the MK match-up and it doesn't result in Sheik having any obscenely difficult match-ups, but the loss of the Grab release on MK is a big problem. Zelda still gets completely wrecked by any competent MK, so transforming just makes things worse. Granted, grabbing MK with Sheik was never the easiest thing in the world, but the reward from doing so was an important option for a tough match-up.

The match-up was bad in vBrawl, and it's even worse in BBrawl. Sheik has even greater difficulty killing MK, MK still gimps Sheik easily, and Zelda is still a worthless lump of fail against MK. In vBrawl it was 35-65 for Zelda/Sheik, and things have just gotten worse. The only changes I would recommend for Sheik would be ones geared towards helping her MK match-up. (This does not include the return of her F-Tilt lock, since that didn't work on MK anyway. This also does not include buffs to Zelda, since Zelda would need to be buffed a ton to do anything against MK.)

 

[NovaRyumaru]

The thing i like the most is the damage the needles take. its great. but i agree on the fact that she needs an aerial finisher, i prefer her B-air. that kick is one of my favorites and i believe it looks like one of the stongest but its not

Actually, the big apeal to her b-air is the range and priority, comes out fast an outranges Marth.

Excellent for telling people to GTFO or to gimp recovery with due to low lag time after using it, and no landing lag on it so RAR b-air, f-tilt, or pretty much whatever attack you could throw out fast enough to punish them for letting that b-air hit.

 

[hyrulianprincesszeldafan]

XD GTFO thats funny XD it does sound like a GTFO attack, but sheik should definetly get something new. i love it the move is just so beautiful lol. as for match-ups sheik is still beastly

 

[NovaRyumaru]

The knockback on fSmash was nerfed.

Why? So that Zelda doesn't become completely useless.

Zelda is terrible at racking damage, but amazing at killing. If you let Sheik get easy kills, there's no point to Zelda. They are meant to be a team, not standalones, and bBrawl emphasizes that, while making their individuals lower than the rest (to encourage + so that the duo isn't completely broken)

So Sheik being untouched from vanilla (tilt locks excluded)with the tweaks Zelda got would make her a broken character? o_O

 

[Linkshot]

Well, if you put both of them, individually, at the level of one character, they would be too overpowered due to being two characters at once.

The only reason Pokemon Trainer gets a bunch of buffs is the Stamina levelling it out.

Although...it's not like you have instant access to Zelda's kill moves at any time while using Sheik :/

 

[NovaRyumaru]

Well, if you put both of them, individually, at the level of one character, they would be too overpowered due to being two characters at once.

The only reason Pokemon Trainer gets a bunch of buffs is the Stamina levelling it out.

Although...it's not like you have instant access to Zelda's kill moves at any time while using Sheik :/

Bingo. And if that's the concern, why not nerf the crap out of the transformation process so it could be punished hard like in B+?

Also, look at Samus. She got buffed quite a bit and she too transforms, although I don't see why you'd WANT to now.

But yeah, both characters play nothing alike. If you're a Zelda and you're on the offense odds are either you're baiting, or have no clue what you're doing. But yeah, case-in point the vast majority of people that play Zelda/Sheik main only one side of them due to several reasons. I myself prefer Sheik to Zelda as my defensive game is average at best, while my pressuring game is quite excellent.

If you were to balance both of them you wouldn't be making a broken character in the least unless you oevr did it on both ends.

 

[Linkshot]

Samus' transformation:
A) Is not viable to pull off
B) Cannot go back to Samus

 

[NovaRyumaru]

Samus' transformation:
A) Is not viable to pull off
B) Cannot go back to Samus

Point is, both are very good, Sheik/Zelda however, not so much. Zelda has no trouble building damage if you play to her strengths and can even build it better than Sheik. Sheik has damage... that's about it. Not to mention the unnecessary nerf to her dash attack.

It's a simple thing of trial and error. Find someone that can effectively use both as one and use that as the base to adjust from.

Also, a nice buff for Falcon: His sour spot d-air should be an off angle spike with less power, namely because the launch on the the sour spot makes no sense. o_O

 

[Linkshot]

The launch on the sourspot is actually a decent kill move XD So it will probably be kept.

 

[Mr. Escalator]

What.
The transformation is Samus' best move in vBrawl (possibly the best move in vBrawl period).

Though, it's really less rewarding in BBrawl because Samus is better than ZSS. I actually think AA said if they could change the mechanic of the transformation, they would, but I forget the exact statement on it.

 

[NovaRyumaru]

The launch on the sourspot is actually a decent kill move XD So it will probably be kept.

True but tell me that it makes any sense.

But back to the topic of Sheik. Her dash attack, was there any real reason it got nerfed that hard?

 

[Linkshot]

Let's make ZSS true to her game.

She can't do anything at all!

Looooooool

bBrawl has it right, dammit.

EDIT

Sense doesn't matter. If Sakurai made Thunderstomp go airborne, they'd keep it like that for consistency.

They are making vBrawl better, not changing things to look realistic.

 

[ぱみゅ]

Sheik's dash wasn't "nerfed", it was supposed to set up combos... although, i barely can combo it, most characters can make an aerial before sheik hits them...

 

[NovaRyumaru]

Let's make ZSS true to her game.

She can't do anything at all!

Looooooool

bBrawl has it right, dammit.

EDIT

Sense doesn't matter. If Sakurai made Thunderstomp go airborne, they'd keep it like that for consistency.

They are making vBrawl better, not changing things to look realistic.

Makes sense I suppose?

 

[Nitros14]

I just want super armour on Bowser Bomb for Christmas.

 

[NovaRyumaru]

I just want super armour on Bowser Bomb for Christmas.

Heh, that'd be fun.

Regarding Sheik again, I find it odd I'm even complaining since I don't use her much these days. o_O

 

[Mit]

True but tell me that it makes any sense.

Nipple launch, son. Makes perfect sense. Have you seen Captain Falcon? Do you know who you're talking about?

 

[ぱみゅ]

I had to play sheik, since combo is A LOT more effective than soloZelda I like to play with (and we're setting a tournament, and I really want to use them).

I must say that Sheik is pretty easy to use, but I can't find a propper moment to change... anyways, sheik actually makes almost all the job (Zelda just appears, hits and goes again), and btw, Sheik racks up damage so easy that Uair and Fair can be somehow good killing moves (and reaching the 130% or even 180% that Dsmash needs isn't too hard neither). I mean, soloSheik is somehow much more viable than soloZelda, and that's something I can't understand yet.


EDIT:
@ Mit: that makes sense... that makes EVERYTHING sense...


EDIT2:
I've just found this:

I found some more stuff.

06010200: Changes hitbox damage. Has 2 parameters, both of the "value" type. First parameter is the hitbox ID, second parameter is the damage you want to switch the hitbox to. Note that all this event does is change the damage of an existing hitbox.

06030100: Deletes a hitbox. The value you put in is the ID of the hitbox that is deleted.

0A030100: Stop a sound effect. The value you put in is the ID of the sound effect that will be stopped.

0E010200: Add speed. Has 2 parameters of the "scalar" type. First one is horizontal speed, second is vertical speed.

1E000200: Super armor. Has 2 parameters, the first one of the "value" type, and the other of "scalar" type. The first parameter sets super armor off or on (0 = off, 1 = on), and the second parameter doesn't look like it does anything, so just keep that at 0.


And here's some stuff about hitbox angles. There are "special" angles for hitboxes if you set the value over 360 degrees. Here's what they do...
361: "Generic angle", the angle this hits at is dependent on how much knockback the opponent takes from it (increasingly higher angle as they take more knockback). Many attacks use this.
362: It looks like it hits straight sideways, and can't be DI'ed.
363: The attack hits the victim in the same direction the attacker is going. I bet you could use this to get multi-hit attacks to link together better.
364: Appears to be the same as 362.
365: Deals absolutely no knockback, but still deals hitstun like normal. Also appears to "shift" the victim in the direction the attacker is going, kind of like 363. Falco's f-air is the only attack I've found to have this.

I'm new with coding, so I didn't really fully understood it, but there's a super armor code.

I know AA and Thinkaman are just designers, and depends on other people to coding, but may you guys can consider this.

 

[NovaRyumaru]

Nipple launch, son. Makes perfect sense. Have you seen Captain Falcon? Do you know who you're talking about?

Ah of course, how could I forgot the basic Falconisms. It's manly, that is all the sense that needs to be made.

 

[Steeler]

In fact, if Meta Knight tries to do anything and you aren't in range, powershield and punish with jab1. He has absolutely nothing that can even hit a perfect Zero Suit Samus (or Squirtle). It's not going to happen; even the best players are very, very far from perfect.

i can do this

 

[GPEternity]

so various attacks are nerfed/beefed in terms of damage knockback and angle, while keeping brawl's relatively low hitstun.

 

[Zelaurion]

Hey, I just stumbled across this thread, and everything about this hack seems great. I enthusiastically tried setting it up, but it's not working and I have no idea why. If anyone else has successfully set up this hack on a PAL Wii, could you give me a hand?
I'm using a PAL Wii, and I've installed the Homebrew channel on it, I have the Balanced Brawl files unzipped onto an SD card, and the card is definitely compatible with Brawl. I can't figure out how to load the Balance Brawl hack from the Homebrew channel; if I select the SD card on the Homebrew menu, nothing happens. I can't get anything to happen on the Stage Builder on Brawl either. Someone please post and tell me what I'm doing wrong, I'll owe you one.

 

[NovaRyumaru]

so various attacks are nerfed/beefed in terms of damage knockback and angle, while keeping brawl's relatively low hitstun.

Yep. Pretty much.

 

[Stealth Raptor]

did you delete all of the other stages on teh wii and sd card?

 

[Zelaurion]

Yeah I did, I deleted all of the custom stages from my console (including the samples) and the card was clean.

 

[Stealth Raptor]

are you using the pal codes? if you are then idk whats wrong

 

[Zelaurion]

I just re-read the first page instructions, and I noticed something called Gecko was mentioned. I missed this the first time around, is it important?

 

[NovaRyumaru]

I just re-read the first page instructions, and I noticed something called Gecko was mentioned. I missed this the first time around, is it important?

I believe so, as if you're loading via the Stack smash trick you should be redirected to Gecko OS.

And regarding Balanced Brawl, is there a chat like there is for the Brawlplus site?

 

[Stealth Raptor]

if there is enough interest i can make a xat chatroom for it

 

[NovaRyumaru]

if there is enough interest i can make a xat chatroom for it

Sounds great.

 

[Zelaurion]

OK, I downloaded the latest version of Gecko, how do I install it from my SD card onto the Homebrew channel? It still won't let me select my SD card on the Homebrew menu >_<

 

[NovaRyumaru]

OK, I downloaded the latest version of Gecko, how do I install it from my SD card onto the Homebrew channel? It still won't let me select my SD card on the Homebrew menu >_<

What you need to do is make a folder named apps on the root of your SD card, in that folder put the folder containing the appropriate gecko version you're using.

 

[Zelaurion]

OK I created the apps folder, and I pasted the whole Gecko192 folder into it, and still nothing happens. I still can't select my SD from the Homebrew menu either. Is the little gecko-like symbol (next to the globe symbol) in the bottom corner of the Homebrew screen significant?

EDIT: Never mind now, I fished around the Gecko folders and found a Readme that told me what to do, thanks for your help Nova and Stealth ^^