Ask KirbyKaze sheik questions (better than mango's)

[NeighborhoodP]

i bet you wouldn't

if only it were that easy

 

[soap]

yo kirbykaze, in sheik dittoes, what are some of the best options after CCing a well-spaced dtilt? Besides for dtilting back, which can also be cc'd.

trying to short-hop space a fair over their dtilt seems to fail if they can react to it.

Dsmash doesn't reach.

im thinking maybe just wavedash back after the cc and get outta there and wait for them to do another move then grab.

 

[NeighborhoodP]

can't you just dash attack since you have no lag

 

[soap]

Is it guaranteed to hit? R u sure it can't be sidestepped in time?

they could just CC that too though. Hopefully boost grab works.

 

[Goon Squad]

if you time it right i don't see why it wouldn't

or couldn't you alternatively just walk forward a little and dsmash

the thing is you don't have to wait for her leg to go back to punish it. it's CCed so there's no lag, so as soon as you get hit you can just run and dash attack. i haven't tested it but i'm almost positive it works if you time it properly. or alternatively you can boost grab.

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

I think dsmash would have just barely enough range to push them away, but then they'd probably just grab you in your lag. Honestly though I've never been in this situation so unfortunately I don't know.

 

[soap]

if you time it right i don't see why it wouldn't

or couldn't you alternatively just walk forward a little and dsmash

the thing is you don't have to wait for her leg to go back to punish it. it's CCed so there's no lag, so as soon as you get hit you can just run and dash attack. i haven't tested it but i'm almost positive it works if you time it properly. or alternatively you can boost grab.

Looks like i jus gotta try this out, i guess i never thought about moving after the cc, i just expect to hit down on the cstick to solve all my problems.

I think dsmash would have just barely enough range to push them away, but then they'd probably just grab you in your lag. Honestly though I've never been in this situation so unfortunately I don't know.

im positive dsmash does not reach. Dtilt has slightly more range. I can try doing a lil walk to dsmash if thats not too slow.

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

That's quite possible considering sheik crouches really low and Sheik's legs on the dsmash go off the ground a bit. I'd probably just run in and grab.

 

[SPAWN]

That happened to me vs M2k in dittos. Him and I just exchanged dtilts... unfortunately I was at a higher percent so I fell to the ground first.

 

[KirbyKaze]

yo kirbykaze, in sheik dittoes, what are some of the best options after CCing a well-spaced dtilt? Besides for dtilting back, which can also be cc'd.

trying to short-hop space a fair over their dtilt seems to fail if they can react to it.

Dsmash doesn't reach.

im thinking maybe just wavedash back after the cc and get outta there and wait for them to do another move then grab.

I despise Sheik dittos.

I play Fox against Sheiks.

But I'm 50% sure you can dash grab someone for that if you've reacted to it really well. D-tilt is supposed to have 20 frames of lag, and dash grab comes out frame 8, so that seems like a pretty large window of error to work with. I doubt a CCed D-tilt stuns you for longer than 10 frames.

 

[TheKneeOfJustice]

David,
what are my low percent (0-36%) on Marth from a down throw? My partner usually di's away, so I can never get more than one hit out of most situations it seems.

 

[Afro_Chris]

KirbyyKaze:

If they DI away?

Like, not behind you, but away? Like horizontal away?

I think you can regrab him.

 

[TheKneeOfJustice]

KirbyyKaze:

If they DI away?

Like, not behind you, but away? Like horizontal away?

I think you can regrab him.

If his DI puts him anywhere near my head, I up smash. If he di's techs onto a platform, I usually waveland tech chase into another grab. If he di's in a way that I can't grab, I dash attack, but I can never really follow it up into another hit. I'm just curious as to what all my options are. I throw in f tilts too, but once again, can never really get a follow up out of it.

 

[KirbyKaze]

This is what I do at low low low percents (0-35) on Marth

If they don't DI: U-tilt (I think you can regrab at exactly 0 if they don't DI but idk how useful that is or if it's even true)
If they DI behind you: turn-around U-tilt
If they DI away from you: regrab (stops at like 30 I think; if they DI away underneath that then F-tilt or Dash Attack or something)
If they DI and hit a platform at that low percent (FoD or Yoshi): I try to land the tipped U-smash or if that's impossible (they tech to the edge of Yoshi's) I SHFFL Fair underneath the platform into F-tilt, another Fair (if I call their double jump) or D-smash and try to gimp them in some way

After that it changes, mostly involving Uair, Fair, and more Dash Attack and other crap.

 

[Lawrencelot]

This is what I do at low low low percents (0-35) on Marth

If they don't DI: U-tilt (I think you can regrab at exactly 0 if they don't DI but idk how useful that is or if it's even true)
If they DI behind you: turn-around U-tilt
If they DI away from you: regrab (stops at like 30 I think; if they DI away underneath that then F-tilt or Dash Attack or something)
If they DI and hit a platform at that low percent (FoD or Yoshi): I try to land the tipped U-smash or if that's impossible (they tech to the edge of Yoshi's) I SHFFL Fair underneath the platform into F-tilt, another Fair (if I call their double jump) or D-smash and try to gimp them in some way

After that it changes, mostly involving Uair, Fair, and more Dash Attack and other crap.

Can you give an answer to the same question, but then for PAL version? Or anyone else who plays PAL

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

Really low %'s or fail DI: forward tilt or dash attack or if it's REALLY fail DI even regrab

Anything else tech chase to anything really. Dash attack, grab, dsmash, usmash, aerials, w/e.

 

[soap]

lol cash mooney goin to europe?

 

[KirbyKaze]

In PAL I'd probably just try to regrab tech chase on Marth until he's in range for a dash attack --> Fair and guess when he's not going to tech and try to U-smash him.

edit: But I don't know anything about PAL.

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

lol cash mooney goin to europe?

Yeah lol. I'm really curious how good he is because I'll be making a lot of judgements about American skill based on him, so I hope he holds up to my expectations.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

LOOL based on cash? i mean he's good but >_>

 

[TheManaLord]

*stalks into topic*

KNEE OF JUSTICE

MM your sheik my falcon $50

 

[TheManaLord]

Yeah lol. I'm really curious how good he is because I'll be making a lot of judgements about American skill based on him, so I hope he holds up to my expectations.

oh my god no. NO. do NOT do that rofl

 

[KirbyKaze]

MM your sheik my falcon $500,000

I'm down :D

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

LOOL based on cash? i mean he's good but >_>

Well, I'll make my judgements based off how hard he gets ***** by what smashers in the US and how hard he gets ***** by what smashers here. I am definitely not equating cash skill and US skill. LOL

 

[Kira-]

what percent does peach/jiggs/samus/marth/luigi die from dthrow > upair

assuming good DI

and is it always possible to dthrow upair on any floaty if you do it fast enough?

 

[soap]

what percent does peach/jiggs/samus/marth/luigi die from dthrow > upair

assuming good DI

and is it always possible to dthrow upair on any floaty if you do it fast enough?

from my experience on FD, an avg of 120-130 for all floaties if they DI away right.

Its not always possible I dont think, If they get good DI away I just go ahead and fair instead of trying to force uair. I used to try uair to guarantee kills on all DI, but I got lazy and don't wana risk the miss

 

[Lawrencelot]

Really low %'s or fail DI: forward tilt or dash attack or if it's REALLY fail DI even regrab

Anything else tech chase to anything really. Dash attack, grab, dsmash, usmash, aerials, w/e.

The problem is that they don't tech. Good Marths DI in such a way (don't know the direction) that you can't dash attack, but they jump instead of teching. They're usually just too far away unless at really low percent. I guess I can try to fair them in those midpercents but then fair is not that useful.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

oh my god no. NO. do NOT do that rofl

you people judge us on 2 or 3 videos tho.... :|

 

[TheManaLord]

I have no judgement whatsoever on Europe. If cash mooney get's close to top 10 then you're bad if he doesn't make it out pools you're all decent to really good (hard to measure)

xxxDDD

 

[Kira-]

What do you do if Peach is floating at you? Her feet are usually at the same level as Sheik's head, although every Peach floats at slightly different heights. Is it possible to attack her or should I wait for her to come down?

 

[TheManaLord]

ftilt .

if she comes down she'll probably do dair dsmash or nair dsmash if she does fair easy shieldgrab

or u can try usmash or utilt depends on where they floating


again why am i in this topic

 

[Egoclapper]

if Peach is floating close to you (or isn't expecting it) just fair

if the Peach likes to dair above you just wait for it and then nair out of shield

if her float spacing is off ftilt **** her

and dthrow to uair is guaranteed if you're fast enough even if they DI away, though maybe not at obscenely high percentages (in which case they'll die to a fair anyway). you can't do the uair when you're under the floaty though, by then it's too slow. you gotta start it more to the side. it's tricky timing.

i am pretty sure plank's guide covers this stuff though. i recall him saying floaties die at 105-110% from uair

edit: nm actually i checked and plank is a noob, he did it on pokemon with no DI lololol

 

[Binx]

I really need to work on using my Ftilt more effectively. Any advice on when I should use it vs Fox and Marth? right now my Marth game is basically grabs needles and fair and bair sometimes but mostly just needles and grabs, vs Fox, its mostly getting shined and upsmashed with an occasional poor edgeguard on my part.

I only seem to hit Fox with forward tilts at 100% during edgeguards where he messes up firefox spacing, then it's ****, I've seen M2K and other sheiks using forward tilts to zone and vs some aerials though. I should prolly just read a sheik guide, are there any that aren't really outdated?

 

[TheManaLord]

late attack shield -> ftilt

basically shine lol but even better

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

I have no judgement whatsoever on Europe. If cash mooney get's close to top 10 then you're bad if he doesn't make it out pools you're all decent to really good (hard to measure)

xxxDDD

wait, is he going to compete in a tournament in every country of europe? holy ****

 

[Kira-]

ftilt .

if she comes down she'll probably do dair dsmash or nair dsmash if she does fair easy shieldgrab

if she fairs how can it be a shieldgrab? it's float cancelled. unless she doesn't fast fall or something

 

[pockyD]

if she does fair easy shieldgrab

wow this is not even remotely close to correct

 

[SPAWN]

She can just slap/dsmash/grab you afterwards. I hate it when they do fc to grab.

Also, against Marth, the spacing of the ftilt is pretty tough/annoying. I usually just use it for when he's coming back down from the air. It's pretty good there. I use it on the ground too... a quarter to half the time I get shieldgrabbed though.

Against Fox... Witchking of Angmar made a really good post on one of my stupid threads. To beat his nair you have to use the little hitbox at the beginning of her ftilt. It's weird I'll find the post later.

 

[TheManaLord]

yeah because moves cant be shieldgrabbed esp in the air atll not even remotely

was talking about falling if she does it late u can grab the startup its **** easy if she does it early its just straight easy

 

[TheManaLord]

wait, is he going to compete in a tournament in every country of europe? holy ****

I have no idea rofl but I think so maybe it's ridiculous he has CASH MOONEY to travel all over the place.