Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[Marteh]

Just a quick question about Marth's recovery that I'm sure has been asked a million times.

I'm pretty sure everyone's experienced when you use DS to a ledge occasionally you end up clipping the edge and falling back down without actually grabbing it, I assume this is just caused due to you hit this odd location where you don't quite grab the edge? Is there anything you can do from this except just try to get back up, and does it renew your second jump (never actually thought of that until now).

The other thing is when you're above someone I've seen some people use SB to gain momentum to move from them, I know a fully charged one has alot of momentum but I've seen significant momentum from a slight charge in a video once (believe it was shaya), yet when I try it Marth barely moves, is there anyway to cause more momentum via the SB


...Guess that wasn't a short question.

 

[Blacknight99923]

Is Marth hard to learn?

quick answer, I only have a limited amount of time.....

his design is rather simple, however the amount of nuances marth has is befitting his elegance and grace.


the short answer is marth is hard to learn, but to a degree every character is

 

[Reizilla]

Just a quick question about Marth's recovery that I'm sure has been asked a million times.

I'm pretty sure everyone's experienced when you use DS to a ledge occasionally you end up clipping the edge and falling back down without actually grabbing it, I assume this is just caused due to you hit this odd location where you don't quite grab the edge? Is there anything you can do from this except just try to get back up, and does it renew your second jump (never actually thought of that until now).

The other thing is when you're above someone I've seen some people use SB to gain momentum to move from them, I know a fully charged one has alot of momentum but I've seen significant momentum from a slight charge in a video once (believe it was shaya), yet when I try it Marth barely moves, is there anyway to cause more momentum via the SB


...Guess that wasn't a short question.

First question, what happens is, Marth doesn't sweetspot the ledge, but barely lands on the stage, then falls off again, so yes, your mid-air jump is replenished. So basically, you're recovering again, from a new position, free to do whatever you want.

Second question, what you probably saw was wave bouncing, or shield breaker bouncing (most likely the former). Wave bouncing only works with B reversal. It'll shift your entire momentum in the opposite direction, if timed right. Simply hit B, then hit back on the joy stick. You can try it just by running, jumping and then doing that. If you hit back and release it right before hitting B though, you'll turn around with no momentum shift. . . . . If that's not what you saw, then shield breaker bouncing is when you perform a fully-charged shield breaker in mid-air, then simply perfom another shield breaker at the end of the first and your momentum will continue. This can also be B reversed to carry the huge momentum in the opposite direction.

If it wasn't either of those, it's news to me. A link would be helpful.

 

[Pr0phetic]

I think you meant the latter Rei, sounds like SB Bouncing to me.

 

[Shaya]

sb bouncing:

viable on FD since bardull'09.

 

[Saske Kedari]

i have a question about this ignoreing campy mario its like
the only way for me to keep him off the stage is by fair but even when i do that
he still flags me to death in fludd maybe i need a better way to handle it

 

[Shaya]

Put more attention into not "whiffing" your aerials.

Fludd is a very subpar move against marth if you actually... aren't in lag.
Off stage you have options of bair (****), dolphin slash instant regrab.

 

[Saske Kedari]

is dolphin slash when you jump and hit A?

 

[Blacknight99923]

its where you press up and B

its has several unique properties including a great OoS option and punisher, however with its enormous lag its generally used as a defensive option.

oh and obviously its used to recover

 

[Almo]

edit: nvm blacknight answered it

 

[Saske Kedari]

oh you mean when he poke ppl with the sword
like its the same way as just pressing B except your in the air right?

and also i was looking at mr.R vids in what he did was he
slid a lil bit over to his opponeat in shield poked but thing is he wasnt facing
him how do you do that cause that can help me out alot with my matches

 

[Blacknight99923]

err you run wait 17 frames then b reverse the attack

 

[Saske Kedari]

err lol oh ok i kinda tryed that didnt work but imma get it soon

 

[TRA]

I usually don't post here, but I dont have my wii this summer and thus can't do anything on my own-

I've taken an interest in Platform Canceling.

How many different ways can Marth platform cancel? What are they? Is it even called platform canceling?

Time
Runs
Away

 

[Reizilla]

There are two ways that I know of. If you're passing through a moving platform, hit down on the C-stick as your feet pass through, or hold down while jumping and let go of it as your feet pass through a moving platform.

 

[TRA]

There are two ways that I know of. If you're passing through a moving platform, hit down on the C-stick as your feet pass through, or hold down while jumping and let go of it as your feet pass through a moving platform.

I've heard of the first technique, not the second. Really want to try them right now. I've also heard there is a way to do it by fast-falling an airdodge, or something?

Does it only work on moving platforms?

Time
Runs
Away

 

[Watkins]

So noob question that's no doubt been answered quite a few times already...

The grab release > Dair combo on MK, how consistent is it? I have about a 80% success rate using it on a computer, and the times it doesn't work I'm not entirely sure if it's my fault or the computer choosing the right action to escape.

It's a hard combo to do but I've always been pretty good with Dair, it's tricky but I've managed to pull it off most of the time by using the claw grip which I use a lot already.

But it does seem like a great midpercent combo. Low percents I GR > Nair > Fsmash/Dair, and then just GR > dash attacked but this seems like a good GR for those 50%+s where GR to Dolphin slash won't kill. I think I've seen videos of Mikehaze doing it too, but he missed the combo a lot so I'm wondering if it's a true combo or just depends on the opponents actions after the GR.

When the MK does escape, he seems to airjump out of it.

So anyone have experience with it?

 

[Reizilla]

It's a true combo, but it's basically frame-perfect. Maybe two frames if you buffer a dash. So yea, it works, it's just stupid hard.

 

[Watkins]

Intense stuff, but good to know thanks!

 

[Reizilla]

Oh yeah, TRA, it does only work on moving platforms. Haven't heard anything about airdodging though.

 

[Blacknight99923]

the GR dair has a 4 frame window according to shaya

 

[Watkins]

Plenty of time.

 

[Reizilla]

I swear the number changes every week.

 

[mikeHAZE]

So noob question that's no doubt been answered quite a few times already...

The grab release > Dair combo on MK, how consistent is it? I have about a 80% success rate using it on a computer, and the times it doesn't work I'm not entirely sure if it's my fault or the computer choosing the right action to escape.

It's a hard combo to do but I've always been pretty good with Dair, it's tricky but I've managed to pull it off most of the time by using the claw grip which I use a lot already.

But it does seem like a great midpercent combo. Low percents I GR > Nair > Fsmash/Dair, and then just GR > dash attacked but this seems like a good GR for those 50%+s where GR to Dolphin slash won't kill. I think I've seen videos of Mikehaze doing it too, but he missed the combo a lot so I'm wondering if it's a true combo or just depends on the opponents actions after the GR.

When the MK does escape, he seems to airjump out of it.

So anyone have experience with it?

i dont understand what you're asking

 

[Mr-R]

is it just me or does the grab release to dair on stage require a different timing ?

 

[clowsui]

@ramin
you need to buffer the dash earlier onstage 'cause it's frame perfect
when you do an offstage dair you have 2 frames leeway iirc

 

[C.J.]

I thought onstage was like 2-3 frames mostly because you only have 2 frames to buffer out of a grab(air?) release. When you do it offstage you get however long it takes Marth to jump minus 1 added to the leeway because you get to "hair" the jump so you jump from onstage but the game makes you jump in one frame because it reads it as you being in the air.

Or something like that... idk, Shaya come help us!


Anyways, to answer the original question from Watkins, yes it's real, and if he escapes it's because you messed up.

 

[Pr0phetic]

It's not necessarily a combo, more so a grab release hit. As said, it's a frame perfect stunt, being the timing to land it is strict. If you don't land it, it's cause you didn't dash (which needs to be buffered) in time to pull it off.

 

[Megavitamins]

Grab release dair is dumb...

They can always just SDI / DI the spike onto the stage, and if they tech it, they have a free uair / nair because you're still in the dair animation. =(

and watkinz just because you land it on the computer doesn't mean itll connect vs a human, they can just uair you out of it before you hit, unlike a computer who doesnt do anything til they hit the ground

 

[earla]

i see mikehaze frequently grab release and look for fairs on chars?

why does he go for grab release -> fairs on chars like snake, pika, toon link, diddy at high %'s in particular?

 

[Sovereign]

Hey guys, is Marth a good secondary for a Zero-Suit main?

Spoiler

No, I will not pick up MK instead, because he's my alternate, if my secondary that I finally choose doesn't work out, just like everyone else.

 

[Reizilla]

Hey guys, is Marth a good secondary for a Zero-Suit main?

Spoiler

No, I will not pick up MK instead, because he's my alternate, if my secondary that I finally choose doesn't work out, just like everyone else.

In Nick Riddle's interview, he mentioned trying to pick up Marth because he does well against Falco and Pikachu. Depends on your personal style, probably.

 

[Sovereign]

Well, I do enjoy Marth, and both characters run the practice of spacing, so I'm considering using him as a solid secondary.

And I do recall reading that in Nick's interview.

Fun Fact: Snakeee has picked up Marth, too.

So it seems to me that Marth is a very reasonable second for a ZSS main.

 

[Shaya]

It's a 3 frame leeway for the entirety of it all.

The "hair" version has a 3 frame leeway for the two "major" movements.

Lol, so MK's gonna consistantly SDI onto the stage when you can dair him well off the stage?
!

He's also a lot higher "above" the ground then let's say something like falco's dthrow to spike.

 

[Mr-R]

marth and zss go really well together.
just sayin

 

[Shaya]

Yeah that Zero Suit...

covering marth's bad match ups...
...
.....
even match ups?
...
......
well I guess she can pulverise rob... I guess...
The verdict isn't out on ZSS/Marth v ICs, but I'd say it could be a tad bit easier with her.

But on the flipside for a ZSS main, yes Marth does seem to patch up some nuisance mus.

 

[Mr-R]

ur forgetting mk ( 45-55 )
and ddd ( 60-40 )

 

[Shaya]

Don't expect me to give up marth for the match up I have the most confidence in and feel the latter's is over hyped.

 

[Blacknight99923]

isn't falco or pikachu

 

[mikeHAZE]

Grab release dair is dumb...

They can always just SDI / DI the spike onto the stage, and if they tech it, they have a free uair / nair because you're still in the dair animation. =(

and watkinz just because you land it on the computer doesn't mean itll connect vs a human, they can just uair you out of it before you hit, unlike a computer who doesnt do anything til they hit the ground

who are you and why are you making me lol