Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[Nightshine]

I dont want to sound like im being rude but chances are any answer you get to this question will be useless. This is the case because either a) someone suggests some secondary and you try to use them and you are no good with them at all or b) someone suggests a secondary and you get good with them and you still have problems with some characters anyway.

My advice is to use the characters you like to use. No sense in me telling you "use MK as a secondary" when you hate MK and have no desire to pick him up.

Ah I see ty, btw I like MK I think hes a little ball of badass lol, but I prefer Marth better cuz he's just 2 awesome and I used him in melee lol.

 

[Shaya]

I would say Falco is a very good secondary for Marth.

Unlike the top of top tier whores who'd main/secondary Metaknight/Snake for ultimate coverage,
Marth and Falco is probably the second best ultimate coverage in the game.

Falco covers all your even or slightly disadvanted matchups (DK, ROB, D3, Snake, Metaknight). I also like using Sheik/Zelda, who doesn't do too badly against those chars either (maybe not MK).

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

It all depends with Marth on who you like.

Marth really doesn't have any bad matchups other than MK, (and D3) so you have one to cover unlike most characters. Most characters look for the character who can best beat the characters they lose against, but with Marth MK really has no outright bad matchups so MK is the only one that will deal with your bad matchups. I use Falco DK and Kirby because I like them.


EDIT: as Shaya pointed out, Falco is good in general, but I like him just because I like him.

 

[Freezewish]

It all depends with Marth on who you like.

Marth really doesn't have any bad matchups other than MK, so you have one to cover unlike most characters. Most characters look for the character who can best beat the characters they lose against, but with Marth MK really has no outright bad matchups so MK is the only one that will deal with your bad matchups. I use Falco DK and Kirby because I like them.


EDIT: as Shaya pointed out, Falco is good in general, but I like him just because I like him.

So D3, DK and Snake arent bad matchups for marth? Lol ok.

I agree with falco being a good secondary for Marth and I actually use him myself aswell. Personally I'm more comfortable using Marth vs R.O.B.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Those that you stated aren't bad matchups. DK is even, Snake and D3 are either even or 55:45 favor. Even isn't bad lmao.

 

[Freezewish]

D3 is not even with marth.

Where'd you get that from? <_<

And i say DK is a bad matchup meaning he's a worst matchup for Marth than he is for Falco. .

 

[phi1ny3]

Falco is a really nice option if you don't want to go for the SS/S tier, as he has really good matchups (one of the better ones vs. MK for example). Srsly though, go for the secondary you want to have/feel the most comfortable with.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

D3 is not even with marth.

Woops. Well Falco beasts D3.

 

[phi1ny3]

Woops. Well Falco beasts D3.

So true, being able to chaingrab the kind of CG without him being able to return it among many of falco's other amazing traits in the matchup is pretty good, doesn't he have a 65:35 advantage vs. D3?

 

[dean.]

Sheik/Lucario seem popular choices as secondaries.

 

[ZHMT]

Might as well just pick Metaknight and be happy.....Im just kidding...

But seriously, once you get really good with Marth you dont need a secondary, imo.

He has no hard counters, worst matchups are 40:60, 3 of them, the rest are even or in Marths favor. If you WANT to use a secondary, go ahead, but I feel time to learn a new character in the metagame now is wasted time that can be used to help Marth. Thats just my opinion again.

 

[Steel]

zmt it takes like two weeks tops to make a char as good as your marth

 

[Hype]

zmt it takes like two weeks tops to make a char as good as your marth

I know and I hate how this is true. I can do just as good if not better with D3 and MK because they are so easy to learn.

 

[ZHMT]

The main thing about learning a character imo is learning their matchups. Learning their moveset takes like, the time to read a thread and maybe a day. Learning what moves to use in what situation and relearning matchups for most characters, takes a while though. MK and Dedede and few others have easier learning curves then most (Im agreeing with Hype).

Once you learn the staple of a characters game, DK's bair, Snakes' Tilts, Gnw's bair, exc. Its all experience from there.

An example is, if someone tries to pick up Game and Watch after maining Snake for 8 months. The Game and Watch plays a Falco and gets ***** because he chooses the wrong moves at the wrong time. However the guy 2 stocks the Falco with Snake because he knows exactly what to do at a given time.

 

[Mazaloth]

How do I maximize Marth's grabbing potential?

 

[Remzi]

Those that you stated aren't bad matchups. DK is even, Snake and D3 are either even or 55:45 favor. Even isn't bad lmao.

Look at the matchup thread, its been updated a lot since you've looked from what I can tell.

 

[Pr0phetic]

How do I maximize Marth's grabbing potential?

Learn to Pivot Grab and his best grab range is shield grabbing. So work on those =]

 

[Mazaloth]

Learn to Pivot Grab and his best grab range is shield grabbing. So work on those =]

Right, thanks, I will.

Another question.
I Use Shff-fair, a lot. Sometimes I change it up with a Nair, or add a Dtilt/Ftilt, with it. While weaving backwards after hitting, it is the perfect spacing tool.
Though I find that my friend gets past this too easily, even with the tilts and mixing up.
How often should I use Shff-Fair? And am I spacing it correctly?

Also, I know how to beat my friend, but it would make me to not Shff-Fairs as much and do a more simplistic approach. Should I keep Shff-Fairing to be more techniqual, or just go with the simple way?

Last question...
I am good at ShFair'ing tippers, though it is harder to Ff because of the increased hitlag/stun. Should I always tipper or use non-tippers and exchange between tippers ?

 

[phi1ny3]

Right, thanks, I will.

Another question.
I Use Shff-fair, a lot. Sometimes I change it up with a Nair, or add a Dtilt/Ftilt, with it. While weaving backwards after hitting, it is the perfect spacing tool.
Though I find that my friend gets past this too easily, even with the tilts and mixing up.
How often should I use Shff-Fair? And am I spacing it correctly?

Also, I know how to beat my friend, but it would make me to not Shff-Fairs as much and do a more simplistic approach. Should I keep Shff-Fairing to be more techniqual, or just go with the simple way?

Last question...
I am good at ShFair'ing tippers, though it is harder to Ff because of the increased hitlag/stun. Should I always tipper or use non-tippers and exchange between tippers ?

This question would be a lot easier if we knew:
-How you used it (like a video maybe?)
-Which characters your friend uses/what your friend does in reaction.

 

[Mazaloth]

This question would be a lot easier if we knew:
1. -How you used it (like a video maybe?)
2. -Which characters your friend uses/what your friend does in reaction.

1. I'll try to get one.
2. Marth and Shiek. For Marth, he usually just PS and walks foward into a Ftilt/Fsmash. He really is defensive like.
And for Sheik, he usually SHAD ending in a tilt. Or runs in with a DA. Of course he mixes it up a bit.

 

[Pr0phetic]

1. I'll try to get one.
2. Marth and Shiek. For Marth, he usually just PS and walks foward into a Ftilt/Fsmash. He really is defensive like.
And for Sheik, he usually SHAD ending in a tilt. Or runs in with a DA. Of course he mixes it up a bit.

His Marth should be ****-able then, becaus eif you apply constant pressure an dpick up on his patterns you catch him. Work on your spacing too.

 

[VietGeek]

Steel says I'm boring.

This is true isn't it? <_<

Gah, I wish I was CHEESE-KUN.

 

[Pr0phetic]

Steel says I'm boring.

This is true isn't it? <_<

Gah, I wish I was CHEESE-KUN.

Your not boring lol, where has CHEESE-KUN been anyway? I haven't seen him post...

 

[mikeHAZE]

so apparently mike haze can grab falco out of his sideB

anyone know what frame this is on? or like, what part of the animation you grab on? this can make the matchup MUCH easier, seeing as 99% of the damage i get from falco is from phantasm.

or anyone have tips on timing the jab that interrupts phantasm? i get it only around 40% of the time -.-

noooo idea what frame

 

[Fatalzyntax]

DS to ledge jump, still gets the DS lag when landing... Ive had really dumb trouble just because I thought I could aerial cancel it...

Anyway, is there anyway to stop that from happening? Am I not finishing the aerials?

 

[Pr0phetic]

DS to ledge jump, still gets the DS lag when landing... Ive had really dumb trouble just because I thought I could aerial cancel it...

Anyway, is there anyway to stop that from happening? Am I not finishing the aerials?

Your probably not doing it at the right time. Try mixing up between Fair, Uair, and Nair, they're fast and should cancel DS lag, go practice it.

 

[Brother J]

What are Marth's best out of shield options?

 

[Punishment Divine]

What are Marth's best out of shield options?

Dolphin Slash and Dancing Blade, which are probably among the best in the game lol.

I've found Jab and dsmash aren't bad, either, but very situational

 

[ZHMT]

Cant forget the dtilt, too good.

 

[phi1ny3]

I've fallen in love with dsmash for the first time, it has such a deceptive killing feel to it that doesn't seem as pronounced as fsmash, and makes for a good tipper kill. I also use dtilt like a lot. Oos, I use grab, upB, DB, utilt/usmash sometimes, dtilt, SH nair, and the occasional jab.

 

[ZHMT]

Nair and dtilt mixups are too good.

 

[Pr0phetic]

ZMT got that one on the money. It feels real good to kill an unexpectying opponent at 100%~ with a grab release --> Dsmash

 

[Punishment Divine]

ZMT got that one on the money. It feels real good to kill an unexpectying opponent at 100%~ with a grab release --> Dsmash

I agree. However, you must watch how your opponents react. Many times people will either spot dodge or shield after a grab release, and you must react appropriately, noticing patterns.

 

[Steel]

grab release down smash is bad

 

[Remzi]

grab release down smash is bad

Depending on how you condition your opponent, or what trends you notice, it can actually be used well.

 

[Punishment Divine]

grab release down smash is bad

Nothing is bad in Barlw, Steel, if you catch your opponent doing something dumb

 

[Freezewish]

Nothing is bad in Barlw, Steel, if you catch your opponent doing something dumb

Considering how bad marth's smash attacks are on block, dsmash OOS is potentially devastating for marth if the opponent shields. As bengals said watch how the opponent reacts after the grab release and adjust accordingly. Dont make it a habit. Personally i only use this vs ness and lucas.

 

[Punishment Divine]

Considering how bad marth's smash attacks are on block, dsmash OOS is potentially devastating for marth if the opponent shields. As bengals said watch how the opponent reacts after the grab release and adjust accordingly. Dont make it a habit. Personally i only use this vs ness and lucas.

I said that before BengalZ did >_>

 

[Steel]

grab release down smash is bad

 

[Punishment Divine]

grab release down smash is bad

rage

10rages