[Apr 19, 2014] No Johns Monthly! April 19th!! Project M ! (Nanuet, NY)

[CT Chia]

Am I the only one who doesn't understand this??
Why can't [insert player here] beat DJ and Vanz?
That doesn't seem unfair to me...

the only reason im mainly backing up that part of his statement is cause i can think of many players, including myself, who had easier brackets who should be seeded worse than jfox.

even if pools r done, theres still plenty of time for drafts

 

[UltimaScout]

the only reason im mainly backing up that part of his statement is cause i can think of many players, including myself, who had easier brackets who should be seeded worse than jfox.

even if pools r done, theres still plenty of time for drafts

There's only one way to settle this...

Link ditto me on Hyrule for seeding!

Everybody!

 

[Cia]

:o Oh Crap

I Can Understand Why Anyone Would Be Upset When Realizing That They're Receiving The More.. Difficult End Of The Bracket. But You Have To Understand That With Over 85% Of The Entrants Being Decent Competition, The Person You're Paired Off Against Is Usually Not Going To Be A Pushover. If You Hadn't Gotten Me, Or Dj, Your Options Were Reno, Jman, Alukard, Eggm, Scar (was He Thar?), Hazzard, Gcash, Etc. Brutal *** Brackets. Definitely Much More Difficult Than Some Regionals (with All The Brawl Loving Scrubs Weeded Out). I'm Sorry That No Ones Wants To Play Me, I've Done Nothing But Be Nice And This Is What I Get :[. It's Ok Though, No One Might Have To Play Me Now Because I've Been Overwhrlmed With Work Lately And I Just Might Not Come. (70% Chance)

/emo Rant

 

[CanISmash]

100% random seeding is the way to go.

anything else imo is bull****.

why should jfox have to fight vanz and dj
why cant dj fight vanz?
why cant good people ever play good people first.

i dont mind seedings at all. hell i love having amazing people in my bracket its fun. and you get ***** and learn stuff. my only 2 cents is that those who have proven themselves good should not have a stairway to heaven.

 

[R3N0]

100% random is dumb as hell lol. You know why good people can't play good people first? BECAUSE its not FAIR. It's not about by chance if you get an easy bracket or not. It's BY SKILL. If automatically, KDJ + PC had to place FIRST round and then Ken + M2k had to play first round. the brackets would be skewed as hell. AND THEN you have winner of KDJ + PC vs winner of Ken + M2k. the other side (just making a point) would have no namers like XEDFAEFA vs EFAEWFAE and then they make it to the end of winners.. RANDOM SCRUB VS PRO.
O_O?! That makes NO sense.

It's not impossible to beat DJ OR VANZ. You are Johning Jfox, Sorry.
I end up playing HBK almost every tourny he is at, either HBK / JMAN / EGGM. I just take it as another chance to prove myself. (although failing almost every time) I keep trying. **** happens. Deal with it.

Pools are a MUST. To get accurate seeding.. I mean this is only if like.. A LOTTA PEOPLE COME.. If there is roughly 32 people ANYWAY.. .. nvm pools are awesome you know why? melee is a fast paced game. And when we go we're gonna play for the entire day. End pools + have seeding + then go into brackets..

its so basic.
if you dont make it out of brackets.. i mean.. what can i say.. You need to take at least 1 match off of the 1st / 2nd seed. (if its top 3 to make it out)

By someone saying.. OH I CAN'T EVER BEAT X / Y / Z. You're setting yourself up to look like a scrub. Because the accomplished player, will say I'm gonna get better and try.

Anyway in short, I agree with Wife.

 

[Alukard]

ok two things ... i mean ... i ALWAYS had a problem with the stupid seeding that is with smash ... i've played halo and other tournaments b it cards for thousands of dollars but the point is that the best should play the best and win ... not just get a easy yellow brick road to follow because they won last tourney ... i mean thats why its soo mindboggling when someone different gets to the top ... i mean granted scar shouldn't play cactuar cuz they play all the time ... but IMO it should b region ... but w.e ... i'm only ranting on because i agreed with jfox ... and jfox its not my fault i only can go by placings ... i played eggm 3 out of the 5 tournies lol ... i can't help it bro ... its region as well ... i really try to make the brackets as amazing as possible but its difficult =\

but no way to low tier doubles ... scar said it right ... it was joking

but i'm tryin to have draft crews as well as pools ... which sounds hard but imo can really happen ... if everyone co-op with me ... how about if everyone is there given stupid traffic or w.e the reason may be ... with w.e time it starts we decide pools or str8 brackets ...

how about that ?? ... again sry for my ellipsis abuse lol

EDIT JUST SAW RENO ..... no one is talking about lets say m2k vs pc ... but like we have to COMPLETELY SEPERATE M@K PC AND THE REST to play like semis or sumthing stupid ... thats pretty beast lol ... its like i have to feed poor souls to some super huge devouring demon(m2k) lol

i dunno i dont care really cuz i like doubles anyway lol ... but i've been following the smash seeding rules so thats fine with me...

 

[Alejandro_P]

Oh man I wanna come to this, enter singles and get top 3.

 

[CanISmash]

100% random is dumb as hell lol. You know why good people can't play good people first? BECAUSE its not FAIR. It's not about by chance if you get an easy bracket or not. It's BY SKILL. If automatically, KDJ + PC had to place FIRST round and then Ken + M2k had to play first round. the brackets would be skewed as hell. AND THEN you have winner of KDJ + PC vs winner of Ken + M2k. the other side (just making a point) would have no namers like XEDFAEFA vs EFAEWFAE and then they make it to the end of winners.. RANDOM SCRUB VS PRO.
O_O?! That makes NO sense.

lol at something not being fair. but gateway brackets is fair. if you ahve ken and m2k and kdj + pc. then by your logic it should come down to skill. therefore in the end it would be, m2k and kdj playing despite whoever had to work there way through losers. if they dont like the seeding... (like you all say tough, practice and beat them next time) there would be no scrub in the final so iono wtf you're talking about. the only case would be someone good might get last place. this is a lot more fair then someone good getting GURANTEED top 10 because they fought
scrub 1, scrub 2, intermediate scrub, oh **** somebody good lost, oh **** somebody good again lost.

 

[R3N0]

.. you're giving a scrub guaranteed top 3 if you do it that way. its not fair to the people who ARE more skilled.

 

[CT Chia]

how is putting doubles low tiers on the front page and announcing it as the first event a joke? it just simply confuses ppl, and hurts the tourney overall...

and again, seeding still matters a lot because placing even one placement different matters because the points assigned are different

 

[Rain(ame)]

Lol, I come in here and see discussion about seeding and getting horrid people.

My first tournament...I played Swiftbass and then Atomsk right after. Now for someone trying to get into Smash...is that fair? Two ranked players right off the bat?

My second tournament I never made it out of pools. I had VaNz, Treble, Copy Cat, and DCS in my pool. Yeah....my friend had some other retardedly good pool with like Bass and Sensei. That was HIS first tournament (BTW, he doesn't enter anything but teams BECAUSE of that. )

Most of my tournaments consist of outrageous pools. Tunes tournament- Reno, DJ Nintendo, LK, Me, and (not ridiculous, xD) Pikachu noob. Top 3 make it out...I'm sure you can figure out who top 3 were.

It's frustrating, and I'll admit, it's downright unfair. I can't say I wholeheartedly agree with either side. I agree with Wife and Reno...it helps you try and out perform yourself. HOWEVER, it does suck when you get screwed out of tournament chance just because the good people don't have to play each other at the start. I'm not saying make sure that M2K and PC take each other on right off the bat, but be realistic. Don't put them up against Johnny noname and Leon novice (Just examples, but you get the point) right off the bat either.

Ame ranks 3/4 in pools at CoT (pool was Reik, Sneak, Ame and Pancake Emergency)
Ame beats his first round opponentAme loses to Alexander Triad (no biggie)
Chocobo forfeits to a guy that's not even there to get an easier bracket
Ame faces Chocobo....WHAT THE PHAT!?

Ame should have ranked higher in that tournament, but Ame got screwed over 'cuz the good players didn't want the harder bracket. Nothing against anyone, <3 Chocobo and all, but yeah.

You're probably like....what the phat does that have to do with anything?

My point: Good players need to face hardship just like not-so-good players. I think that's only fair. I got matched up according to my pools in the first round, and then got screwed over in loser's for no good reason. Yes for seeding, but make sure it's all spread out. Going random will probably screw some people over. You could be fair and go random, and then change it. Just makie sure that Crewmates don't face each other in the first round.

I don't know how serious anyone will take me, but whatever.... Just don't flame.

 

[CT Chia]

i do like ame's thoughts of good players also having to face the same hardships of lower players, its interesting. i am strongly agsint players doing things like forfeiting to get easier brackets (and most of the time it ends up back firing lol), but the style of best players fighting worst to middle players playing each other is how bracket theory works, and is how the most accurate rankings from last to first are made

 

[R3N0]

I'm sorry I believe that the placements should be how good you are (with minimal margins of error) as opposed to "giving everybody a chance"

Sorry to say this, but once you reach the threshold of getting out of pools, (BY PRACTICING REALLY HARD, pools is probably the only thing I know of that IS a little bit biased. You put 3 pros in a pool top 3 make it out.. maybe put 3 pros.. and top 4 make it out? of 6 of course)

But once you get into brackets, no crying. You PLACED how you PLACED in pools and got this SEEDING. now if you get 4th seed, you play 1st seed. It's just HOW ANY SEEDING IS DONE. You want it to be FAIR to the people who actually are GOOD not accommodating to the not so good so they have a "chance." First major tournament for me was like MLG..

I got in a pool with WarriorKnight, Hazz, Wife, Plank, Silven, Me, Random Marth, Alukard, I think top 2 made it out. HOW **** IS THAT POOL? OBVIOUSLY TOP 2 was WIFE PLANK. =/ No way getting around it, I wasn't known, I wasn't that good. But I still tried my heart out. I went to ALL the tournies I could and get ALL the practice I could.

I had to WORK to get where I am, I don't like seeing people being "I want a chance" you're CHANCE is anytime you enter a tournament. Be the underdog and BEAT whomever you play against. NO MORE JOHNS.

 

[Ryan-K]

just wondering but does is this gonna end before early sunday morning? not asking for like an exact time but just wondering how long they usually run for since this one looks like it may be alot bigger

also yeah i agree with reno work to where you get at, this **** aint brawl you need dedication

 

[Velocity]

what time is doubles starting or expected to

 

[Venom NY]

Bring Setups!

 

[CanISmash]

reno i agree with some of your points, I dont mind playing good people. but i dont think what you've done in the past should give you guranteed top 10.

I'm sorry I believe that the placements should be how good you are (with minimal margins of error) as opposed to "giving everybody a chance"

thats cool its just not fair. random = no biased. play to win, fair. thats all im saying.

It being "Fair" means that you should place appropriately to how GOOD you are. thats FAIR. It may require being a little bit biased in placings, b/c if you don't know who someone is... yeah they're probably a scrub. B/c Smash scene isn't so big. And if they place well, you know for next time. thats all. Plus this is a CIRCUIT event, that means POINTS. You dont give points to the non-deserving lucky ones.

yes fair for placing but is it giving everyone an equal opportunity to win? if it's about placing which it should be since it's a circuit then yes but under other circumstances i'd disagree.

 

[Heart Break Kid]

Lol how bout you just beat whoever you have to play. Or just try your hardest too. I know at Smashtality I had to play Wife 3rd round and then Cactuar immediatly in losers. Sucks for me, but whatever, it was only one tournament.

There have been tons others

 

[R3N0]

It being "Fair" means that you should place appropriately to how GOOD you are. thats FAIR. It may require being a little bit biased in placings, b/c if you don't know who someone is... yeah they're probably a scrub. B/c Smash scene isn't so big. And if they place well, you know for next time. thats all. Plus this is a CIRCUIT event, that means POINTS. You dont give points to the non-deserving lucky ones.

 

[Rain(ame)]

I only brought it up because people keep whining when they're supposed to be GOOD. Yeah, well it happens to people that are still making it, too. Guess what happened to that guy that placed 4th in pools? He took me lightly because he hadn't heard of me before. Guess what happened to him? He lost...he didn't just lose, but he lost Bowser vs. Roy. A match that's in favor of Bowser. Look, I'm not saying I don't try, or train, because I do. Still in all, when you're beat, your beat. I personally don't care, because one day somebody's gonna think they have it easy street and get ***** by me. Simply put. I'm just putting it out there that I don't agree wholeheartedly with either. Because looking at....neither is TRULY fair. I think pools are amazing. I think Death pools suck, though. But whatever. I deal with them. I do, however get pissed when people I KNOW I can beat make it through brackets because they got an easier pool. Why is that? hmmmmm.....conforming to the "good" players. Still in all, if I was that petty I'd never play any game. I just think it's funny how this is an issue right now.

 

[R3N0]

All I have to say now that I think about it.. If you ignore the controversy, I'm sure people with bring it up because its all opinion based of what happened..

Mango beat how many pros to get to first at pound 3?
No death bracket johns
no nothing
mango was just "good" before pound 3. Now hes GREAT.
kthx

 

[Eggm]

Yeah seriously guys bring setups. And whoever took my RF adapter home from the last one bring it, cause theres an extra tv down there we can use if we have it. If not some one else bring an RF adapter please. Yeah, honestly everyone who got to the top went through the same hardships. Feeling like they got unfair brackets and really wanting to prove themselves and feelign like they were cheated. Everyone whose made it to the top has felt that way. Its annoying its super frustrating, and really makes you want to quit. IMO only the people dedicated enough and go to EVERY tournament and try super hard like reno was saying should make it past that level, and should get no shortcuts. I didn't. I used to get super mad and feel like my brackets were super unfair and that I should have been considered higher ranks and stuff. It happens to EVERYONE. Not just you. This isn't directed at anyone in general. Nor do i care about it really, i just want pools at this, because its the right thing to do.

 

[R3N0]

By the way, I think a fun game.. is to predict results.. if you predict correctly top 10 or top 5 or something for each tourny.. ( according to how close you are ) you get like a minimal amt of circuit points.. (OR just side points for funsies)

what do you think =p

 

[Rain(ame)]

*shrugs* It matters not to me pools or not. I think pools would be amazing and the better choice, but I'm not gonna john if it's random brackets and I face Cort and then like Cactuar or something. Well...that's if I make it to the event, lol. I'll feel the same about SPOC6, as well. I've been in a hiedeous rutt since the one Tunes tournaments (death in the family/friends Johns) so I'm really just starting to get my groove back. Otakon woke me up seriously, and No Johns 2 kicked me in the nuts and said get back into shape. Still dealing with mad random deaths, but best believe that by SPOC6, you won't even recognize meh when you play me. ^_^ (can't guarantee that for any tournaments I make before then, though, xD.)

Edit: Reno, that's an amazing Idea

 

[Linguini]

My chances of making this are looking slimmer by the minute, im not down to get lost in a city i dont know at all. Unless someone explains to me how to get to this mofo, or hazzard responds with the ride situation i wont be there *tear*

 

[Cia]

Seeding Should Be Left Alone

The Way Tournaments Have Been Seeded For Years Is The Way We Should Continue It. Manual Seeding Is Made To Ensure That People Who Have Proven Themselves In The Past And Time And Time Again Don't Get Stacked On One Side Of The Bracket. I'm Sorry To Say This, But I Would Be "sick!!!!" If Certain People Placed Above Me Because Their Bracket Was Brawl Nub #s 1, 2, And 3. And Anyone Reading This Would Be Too!!

I Can Understand Why Those Who Still Need To Prove Themselves Would Be Upset. Trust Me, I Went Through 6 Months Of Getting Bum/wes Rds 1 And 2 Every Week. And It Wasn't Until I Started Winning That I Was Seeded To Fight The Strongest Players Later. All I Can Say Is Don't Give Up And Understand Why Seeded Is Done The Way It Is. You Might Think That Your Improvements Are Going Unnoticed, But They Aren't. You Just Gotta **** Who They Put In Your Way.

 

[ZoSo]

The purpose of seeding is to provide accurate results. It has nothing to do with fairness.

 

[R3N0]

The purpose of seeding is to provide accurate results. It has nothing to do with fairness.

QFT thanks

 

[DJ Nintendo]

I'm one of the melee veterans and I've definitely gotten my a$$ kicked for years probably more than anyone, and thats for the simple fact that I main Mario and another horrible a$$ character named Bowser. I never gave up though. My hard work and dedication for years and still going strong has led me to being the best player in the world for Mario & Bowser and being really good at this game. I love my crew and I'll continue to represent them, NY, and my region. If I get my a$$ kicked on Saturday and get last place, oh the f*ck well. I'll be pissed for a bit but then I just have to come back next time and ****. I'm just really looking forward to playing people in friendlies, money matches, and in tournament because mad heads are coming. I can't wait for doubles, draft crews, and Big Apple 3 AM commentating.

To ensure for a person to **** at the tourney, eat cereal, seriously. It helps.

 

[JFox]

Wow, people are so dumb. Do you realize why everyone at the bi-weekly is good? Its because look at the attitude smashers have towards "noobs". Guess who pays your pot money- The little guy. You can't expect people to go to tourneys, get to play two matches where they get *****, and than leave satisfied. If you want big tourney turnouts, you give people some bang for their buck. You don't ask people for $20 and then expect them to come back next time for the same beat horse**** deal they got the last time.

This isn't about me. This is about making a tournament experience good for everyone, not just for the guys who place on top. People wanna see placements turnout the same exact way every tourney, without giving anyone a chance to make an upset happen. The good people get to say "no johns" to the little guy about his bracket, but guess who starts *****ing up a hell storm with they've gotta fight M2k first round. This happens all the time to scrubs, but if it happens to someone good, everyone makes a scene. Wheres your "no johns" motto?

Bottom line- Ya can't seed a bracket based on who you THINK might be good. Its bull**** that people that aren't well known should have a harder bracket. Meanwhile, some guy *cough* makes a combo video and people think hes the sex. OH YEA DIDN'T THAT GUY MAKE A SICK COMBO VIDEO WHERE ALL THE MOVES LINKED UP WITH THE SONG?!?!? OH MAN I LOVE THAT GUY, HE MUST BE A FIRST SEED, DID YOU SEE THOSE COMBOS?!

Fact- Zelgadis lost to Copycat (pound 3). Husband lost to Hax, Starz, and oorah (pound 3), LambChopz lost to random marths and didn't make it out of 1st round of pools in Georgia

Basically, you don't know who is good and who isn't til you give people a chance to show their skill. Stop being lazy and just do pools. Thats the fairest way to seed. Thats what you told people they were getting, so stick to the plan.

 

[JFox]

Oh and someone PLZ help linguini come to this tourney, people are being really flakey by not responding to the guy. Hes from ****in florida, and he is coming, so help the dude out.

DJ, Jman, Alukard- you take the bus, tell em what to do. God****.

 

[Teczer0]

My chances of making this are looking slimmer by the minute, im not down to get lost in a city i dont know at all. Unless someone explains to me how to get to this mofo, or hazzard responds with the ride situation i wont be there *tear*

Can uhh...

Someone help this guy..... plz?

Linguini - Did you talk to Alukard? Maybe people might be able to help you if you know where in New York you will be exactly.

 

[ZoSo]

Let's make Eggm and Jman play each other first round so a whole bunch of people can get knocked out of LB really early even though they should've gotten like, fifth. WHOA UPSET.

And yeah, we can expect people to get two-outed and not complain because we've ALL been through it.

If the seeding isn't accurate, that's a completely different issue. The bracket has to be seeded one way or the other. All we can do is use our best judgement.

The fact of the matter is that in a 32-man bracket, 8 of those people are not going to make it past 2 rounds. So, should it be the people who regularly attend tourneys and might have a chance of going far or the new people who just legitimately aren't that good?

This discussion is stupid.

 

[JFox]

Zoso, I agree with you completely. But the point that I'm obviously trying to argue is that seeding by "skill" isn't as accurate as seeding by pools cuz you don't truly know who is good. No one (except CanISmash) is asking for random seeding, we're lookin for pools.

 

[ZoSo]

OK, I misunderstood.

 

[Linguini]

Can uhh...

Someone help this guy..... plz?

Linguini - Did you talk to Alukard? Maybe people might be able to help you if you know where in New York you will be exactly.

aightt i think i got it, ill be there.

 

[Rain(ame)]

LOL, funny stuff. True, but still funny. I'm honestly not sure of who JFox is talking about though...O.o With the combo vid, I mean, xD. Although...I think I have an idea, xD. *yawns* I'm going to continue my search for a venue. When I find a good one that doesn't want a huge turnout, I'll let you know. Still in all, if ya'll want a decent sized tournament...I know a guy. He even said he'll bring people in. That'd be more people for pools, no? I just feel really bad for the people he gets. Because they're gonna be pissed, unless he knows some good players, xD.

"Crank that Roy"
"Gimpin' is a Habit"

 

[R3N0]

Wow, people are so dumb. Do you realize why everyone at the bi-weekly is good? Its because look at the attitude smashers have towards "noobs". Guess who pays your pot money- The little guy. You can't expect people to go to tourneys, get to play two matches where they get *****, and than leave satisfied. If you want big tourney turnouts, you give people some bang for their buck. You don't ask people for $20 and then expect them to come back next time for the same beat horse**** deal they got the last time.

This isn't about me. This is about making a tournament experience good for everyone, not just for the guys who place on top. People wanna see placements turnout the same exact way every tourney, without giving anyone a chance to make an upset happen. The good people get to say "no johns" to the little guy about his bracket, but guess who starts *****ing up a hell storm with they've gotta fight M2k first round. This happens all the time to scrubs, but if it happens to someone good, everyone makes a scene. Wheres your "no johns" motto?

Bottom line- Ya can't seed a bracket based on who you THINK might be good. Its bull**** that people that aren't well known should have a harder bracket. Meanwhile, some guy *cough* makes a combo video and people think hes the sex. OH YEA DIDN'T THAT GUY MAKE A SICK COMBO VIDEO WHERE ALL THE MOVES LINKED UP WITH THE SONG?!?!? OH MAN I LOVE THAT GUY, HE MUST BE A FIRST SEED, DID YOU SEE THOSE COMBOS?!

Fact- Zelgadis lost to Copycat (pound 3). Husband lost to Hax, Starz, and oorah (pound 3), LambChopz lost to random marths and didn't make it out of 1st round of pools in Georgia

Basically, you don't know who is good and who isn't til you give people a chance to show their skill. Stop being lazy and just do pools. Thats the fairest way to seed. Thats what you told people they were getting, so stick to the plan.

Jfox, Zelgadis lost to Copycat, they're both known. Husband lost to hax, again both known. (maybe not by all but they all have reps) Starz lost to oorah , (That one is a bit.. i mean stars?!! no offense oorah) LambChopz lost to RANDOM MARTHS.

You're contridicting yourself. LampChopz got put into a pool full of seemingly randoms. They PROVED THEMSELVES TO BEAT HIM AND MAKE IT OUT. Anyone in a M2K death pool / bracket is gonna cry. DUH. But to point out your earlier argument, you were upset over Vanz and DJ. (no offense but neither of you are m2k or kdj) You know what I mean?

You don't know how good someone is, and in MOST pools that aren't "DEATH" pools, you'll have people who are MODERATELY GOOD to REALLY GOOD. And if a "nonamer" wants to be considered MODERATELY GOOD, you have to BEAT a MODERATELY GOOD PLAYER. If you get a DEATH POOL, GUESS WHAT?! SUCKS TO BE YOU. EVERYONE HAS BEEN THERE.

You don't ASK people for $20, and it MIGHT be discouraging at first. But if you get discouraged SO easily, then this game ISN'T FOR YOU. It's really for COMPETITIVE players. If you're going to WHINE about being "FAIR" then you aren't very COMPETITIVE b/c COMPETITIVE players would try to GET BETTER.
F.CK this argument is so F.CKING STUPID.


ALSO at pound 3, I didn't make it out of first round pools. DID NOT MAKE IT OUT. What did I do? I bi.tched. I'm not gonna lie, I did it, but then I stopped and played a wholeeeeeee lotta friendlies to get my skill up. And where am I now? (still not THAT much better BUT) NOW people know me, they know how good I have become, they know how hard i've worked. If you get seeded poorly, then make it a goal to do your best every time, and if your best impresses people (even if you don't make it far in brackets) you'll get acknowledgment.
End of story. You have to work. Being a noob and getting a skipped ahead because we're nice and want you to come back and feed the pot over and over again is not an excuse. This game is about skill, it's about hard work and skill. You only get rewarded FOR skill. Seeding + Brackets KEEPS LUCK to a MINIMUM.

Another example. LOOK AT THE RAYS, THEY MADE IT TO THE WORLD SERIES WITH THE REP OF BEING THE ****TEST TEAM IN THE LEAGUE. WHAT THE PHUCK?! THEY WORKED FOR IT. You know what the odds were that Vegas was paying in the bets that people were making for the RAYS? 250:1 Granted they didn't win, THEY won't be **** on so easily anymore.

 

[Rain(ame)]

This argument is getting nowhere. I'm gonna go back to practicing with Fox. *goes off to become the next Aniki* (yeah right, ROFL)

 

[Cia]

I Definitely Think Pools Are A Must. But Understand That Even Pools Would Be Seeded So That First Tier Players Are Distributed As Evenly As Possible. (yes, I Put Players In Tiers.)

R3n0 - I'm Like 30 - 0 Against You In Tournament (literally, Something Very Close To That.) To You, I "am" M2k