Alright guys, we've got **** to do

[~ Gheb ~]

jab > dair is actually a 2008 M2K trick rofl

Then it's probably mad good :3

dash attack vs marth is actually overrated because it loses to his nair, dash attack only ***** marth's that spam fair and nothing else. crouch > dtilt can beat nair landing but only if they're approaching with it because of the obvious lack of mobility that snake has while crouching

But nair is one of Marth's easier moves to Powershield unless he punishes you on reaction [aka you did somethinng wrong] or he only does 1st hit nair. The 2nd move of Marth's nair is probably the easiest of his moves to powershield.

noone should try to rely on powershielding, you'll get ****ed over way too often if you come at marth every attack with the intent of power shielding, its not like they're gonna do the same **** every time, and if they are they're spacing it so that you cant punish it.

It's still a guessing game for Marth. If he does a rising fair you can crouch below it. If he does a fast falled fair you can dash attack him or dacus. If he does a nair you can powershield the 2nd hit.

Also, Snake's bair beats all of Marth's aerial face to face. Having played Leon [best Marth in Europe imo] I learned that good use of bair tremendously helps in that match-up. It flat out beats all of Marth's aerials and his only counter option is very risky [upB]. Airdodge mix-ups into buffered dash attacks [against fair and upB] and full hop bairs [against all aerials] as well as crouching dtilt [against rising fair] and buffered dash attack out of a crouch can cover many of Marth's walling options and keep him in a guessing game.

I believe japanese Snakes like Shuu and Souther to be better than the Snake players from the USA. The better use of aerials is in my opinion a major factor in their game play and it makes Snake look a lot more flexible and versatile than you would think. As long as the opponent is in the air [or on a platform], most of Snakes aerials - at least nair and bair - are great options.

 

[etecoon]

it depends on the MU but I actually think uair is better than nair, too many characters can easily SDI out of nair or in some cases attack you from within it

 

[~ Gheb ~]

it depends on the MU but I actually think uair is better than nair, too many characters can easily SDI out of nair or in some cases attack you from within it

Nair is incredible against enemies on platforms.


Two things that should be interesting:

- It's possible to use regular attacks while holding an item if you keep holding the regular attack input [which is the one that picks up a grenade from the floor]. Why this isn't known to [or at least used by] the Snake mains yet [apparently even the japanese] is beyond me but this seems to give Snake lots of possibilities. Being able to ftilt while holding a grenade potentially makes the move safe on block and being able to throw a grenade right after hitting an opponent could also have its merits. It may even go as far as to "combo" certain characters, which could increase Snake's damage output. However, I don't think that these combos [if there are any] will be practical and during my testings I will mainly look at how you can make unsafe moves safe on block.

The best way to do this is to set a redundant button [like L or R] to regular attack and press it to pick up the grenade. If you keep holding L or R then you can do regular moves with the A button.

- You can drop items upon getting hit. This is relatively unknown and hard to execute. I heard about it from the Diddy boards where they try to use it in order to escape chain grabs while holding a banana. What I'm mainly curious about are the situations during which Snake can drop grenades. If you can drop it during the lag of an aerial it'll make moves like bair, nair and fair a lot more practical against grounded opponents. If you can do it upon getting hit there's a chance that the grenade will greatly limit an opponent's options for follow-up moves, which is one of Snake's bigger issues.

Will test this stuff tomorrow.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

Hmm..I think ill play around with this as well. He does have a point.

And nair is good platform pressure. But straight up I don't rely on it too much. I use ACed Nair for mindgames/gimmicks but as far as direct air to air combat its way too easy to SDI by the 2nd hit and punish Snake. Most people know to SDI out of it so half of the time I don't try to get all 4 hits. Unless you can AC it from that point then you have time to react to a punish (depending on who it is) Light characters get out of it so easy but anyone can get out before than final hit. I still think Nair has more utility than Uair though.

 

[etecoon]

I can't do ftilt while holding grenade with that method, maybe this is something that only works in the european version of brawl? that would explain why you see no americans or japanese using it

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

We can Smash attack with items in hand so I thought about that as well lol. Seems weird that if we had the ability to do that people wouldve thought about trying to tilt also.

 

[RATED]

the thing with grenade in hand, the only thing you can do is Fsmash. I tried the others A moves ( including smashes)

=============

Nair is awesome, just bcuz it can be SDI kinda easily doesnt make it bad.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

As I said I will only get to test this stuff tomorrow. I heard about it at some other character board and figured it would be incredibly useful.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

I'm toying around with all sorts of dumb stuff today out of boredom. Mainly the stuff we discussed earlier. For some reason I did a buffered DACUS out of an ACed Up-air lol I dont think it has any use but it was funny. Threw my opponent off. And the real funny part was I didnt use the C-stick or any other buttons but the control stick and the A button. I was actually just trying to use a buffered Up-Tilt for a quick combo though. I find ACed Up-air (when you dont get that funky get up animation from landing lag) useful sometimes.Trying to see if buffered DACUS has any uses when paired with other moves.

 

[Limeee]

i'm gonna bump this, because we still need to step up our game!

please share ideas, theories or anything you notice in general so we can improve

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

the tech thread needs to be revived. Every known tech needs to be in that thread. We need to know and be able to preform every tech that snake can use and their proper uses. Ran made the thread a while ago about how to be a better snake and we got lazy and ignored the last rule he put on his first post "Get Hungry". snake has been floating comfortably at #2 for a long time and we got lazy and fat. I think we need to adopt the early Ultimate Razer style of making stuff blow up every 3 seconds and learn all the techs. Snake can have 3 to 4 different explosions go off on the field at any time. With all the movement on the screen it can distract people and leave them open to commit mistakes. somebody a while ago posted a vid with snake canceling his down air on a platform on battle field and nobody looked in to it. i visit 5 boards on these forums and this is almost as bad as the CF boards where all they do is spam "willz combo" and "falcon SUX". The most useful poster on these boards is Havok. Look at his posts and check out his blog.

 

[Attila_]

remember how someone said an autocancelled nair gives one a frame advantage? do it on yi/halberd/dephino/ps1 out of a full hop.

 

[phi1ny3]

rofl yeah I asked that before I got good w/ tech chases, which turns out the whole crawl thing isn't really useful.

although it is kinda cool that we can crouch under some character's getup attacks (although the characters are pretty bad lol)

the thing with grenade in hand, the only thing you can do is Fsmash. I tried the others A moves ( including smashes)

=============

Nair is awesome, just bcuz it can be SDI kinda easily doesnt make it bad.

you can dtilt with an item in hand, you have to be crawling first before input though)

it's in the Diddy Kong compendium.

 

[napZzz]

I forgot about the crawling with a nade thing...someone told me about it to use in the falco matchup. Pretty useful (at least in that scenario)

I have no clue what you're talking about shmot : |

 

[RATED]

rofl yeah I asked that before I got good w/ tech chases, which turns out the whole crawl thing isn't really useful.

although it is kinda cool that we can crouch under some character's getup attacks (although the characters are pretty bad lol)


you can dtilt with an item in hand, you have to be crawling first before input though)

it's in the Diddy Kong compendium.

oh yeah I know that. I just call that by a different name. thanks anyway.

 

[lordhelmet]

i visit 5 boards on these forums and this is almost as bad as the CF boards where all they do is spam "willz combo" and "falcon SUX". The most useful poster on these boards is Havok. Look at his posts and check out his blog.

Willz COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[Zeallyx]

Willz COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Willz COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[Player-3]

Willz COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

WILLZ COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOoOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

 

[TommyDerMeister]

Since I second Falcon,
Willz COMBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO



As a Snake main,

remember how someone said an autocancelled nair gives one a frame advantage? do it on yi/halberd/dephino/ps1 out of a full hop.

Full hop nair won't autocancel, it has to be a double jump nair. So a shorthop -> 2nd jump -> nair will autocancel. You are able to get all four hits out on a full hop though.

 

[Attila_]

I have no clue what you're talking about shmot : |

if you fh nair down a sloped area (namely yi and halberd's sloped sections) you can autocancel it. this apparently gives us frame advantage so we can do something else afterward without the opponent being able to do anything.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

if you fh nair down a sloped area (namely yi and halberd's sloped sections) you can autocancel it. this apparently gives us frame advantage so we can do something else afterward without the opponent being able to do anything.

Speaking of which, people need to try to abuse the slopes in stages more often. If you FF an aerial on a slope, your landing lag will slide down the slope. It's super useful for some of his moves like Bair/Uair. There are a lot of slopes to abuse this on. PS2, Halberd, brinstar, lylat, delfino, pictochat, etc.

 

[Attila_]

ff uair into the metal slope on the mountain (i think) transformation on ps1 and you get an amazing sliding utilt. got multiple kos off this one.

 

[Limeee]

maybe infern has got some ideas

infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern

 

[Yumewomiteru]

ff uair into the metal slope on the mountain (i think) transformation on ps1 and you get an amazing sliding utilt. got multiple kos off this one.

lol wtf im gonna try this out.

 

[Infern Angelis]

maybe infern has got some ideas

infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern infern

lol you guys have a power over me

As for snake stuff...ummmmmm hold a grenada and crouch approach a spamming falco. Its not really practical but I find it funny as hell lol

 

[TommyDerMeister]

I think I'll finish that C4/Mine sneakiness guide I was working on before i stopped playing Snake and started playing Falcon.

 

[Limeee]

i'm gonna start doing more b reversal'd c4s

looks sexy
i remember seeing someone stage jumptech the ledge then c4 b reverse to bair

thats nuts lol

 

[theONEjanitor]

i meant without the shield

you can glide toss a grenade into an uptilt.

snakes backwards glide toss has significant enough distance for this technique to be useful

 

[theONEjanitor]

Your a kirby now. Just drop a brick on them.

ive seen Stone clank with tornado before

 

[Tech-Nelium the Shark]

ive seen Stone clank with tornado before

i've seen the aerial DK giant punch full charge clank with nado. I was the mk and i was in disbelief for like 5 minutes

 

[Attila_]

pretty sure grounded nado clanks with ANYTHING if it's grounded. this included full spaced utilt. and he gets the frame advantage.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

No I'm pretty sure that grounded nado gets beaten by strong attacks, maybe that was a REALLLYYYY stale DK punch and rock?

 

[etecoon]

grounded tornado loses to a lot of attacks and it doesn't always leave him with frame advantage wtf

the rules for how tornado works in general are pretty nebulous though, sometimes something works that shouldn't work in general

 

[Attila_]

im pretty sure it doesnt. if it is even slightly off the ground it does, though.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

lol @ Infern. It's fun to summon him on command XD

And I am starting to really enjoy abusing these B-Reversals. Full hop Bair covered by a B Reversaled Nade right before you land seems to throw people off lol

 

[Yumewomiteru]

lol @ Infern. It's fun to summon him on command XD

And I am starting to really enjoy abusing these B-Reversals. Full hop Bair covered by a B Reversaled Nade right before you land seems to throw people off lol

*Takes notes*

 

[Limeee]

can we do fullhop rising bair on someones shield?
i think that would be pretty ****, as a mixup off of ftilt or something

 

[Attila_]

use this to count aerials that hit the back of your shield. its actually pretty legit, and no one ever expects it.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

^ I agree.

And man I've been mindgaming people into Mortars and then grabbing them out of the explosion on their way up lol Its definitely a crowd pleaser. I think theirs some setups for it though. I'm curious as to what people do as far as stage control. I need some new traps.

 

[Attila_]

i was playing today, and accidentally did something that looked like falcon's moonwalk in melee. snake's animation was running forward, but he slid backwards. i wasn't holding nades or on a slope or anything like that. no video unfortunately. any ideas guys?