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2013 Community Tier List
- Thread starter Fortress | Sveet
- Start date
same here. i put marth at sixth when really i think he is fourth. and i would also put peach at fifth. other than that i stick with my tier list
Senortesta
Smash Apprentice
Personally I think that even though wobblez just placed 2nd at evo, ICs should still remain at 8th. Most of their game is reliant on wobbling and other infinites which come from grabs so just playing hit and run works well against them. Also any projectile is good because since nana shields a bit later, she could still take damage even though popo shields. One of the reasons I think that people loose to ICs is that they are too impatient and rush in to kill nana quickly and then get shieldgrabbed and complain that ICs are broken.
Other people's opinions might've changed after evo buy my opinion stands the same.
Other people's opinions might've changed after evo buy my opinion stands the same.
Deathconsciousness
Banned via Administration
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2013
- Messages
- 826
tier lists only exist to make insecure noobs feel better about the character they "chose" (brainwashed into picking) tbh
Bad Cupboard
Smash Apprentice
your opinion is wrong
Divinokage
Smash Legend
So what character(s) did you choose and why?
Anyone who didn't choose their character because they find them fun to play chose their character for the wrong reason.
imo
imo
BTmoney
a l l b e c o m e $
my list is timeless.
Purpletuce
Smash Lord
My character is timeless.
BL!TZ
Smash Ace
Brainwashed? lmao
Tier lists exist because people like to discuss who is the best and who is the worst.
Tarv
Smash Journeyman
I'd be interested in knowing what those conflicting opinions about Marth are. Unless I'm reading too much into your comment and you literally just meant "one of them thinks Marth is bad, the other thinks Marth is good"
Belgian Warrior
Smash Rookie
Sveet, can you give us an approximation of the date you will release the list ?
Funkmasterblitz
Smash Cadet
Yeah it's been nearly 2 months since the voting was finished.
Bones0
Smash Legend
How does less weight mean less combo fodder? lol
Divinokage
Smash Legend
Well as a IRL fighter, those small guys are really hard to hit and are super fast.. but that doesnt exactly apply to smash because moves apply a set amount of knockback and stun so that kind of logic is thrown out the window for smash at least.
I don't see what the point of this post was.
Fortress | Sveet
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The chances of this project forming an "official" list is very small. I don't think the quality of data is where it would need to be.
What particularly bothers me is how small the variance between lists are. Only something like 3 people didn't have Fox or Falco as #1, which is less than the people who spelled 'Sheik' wrong or wrote 'Gannon'. I think the problem has two faces: one is that not everyone agrees or knows what a tier list is, the other is that "discussion" of each person's list tends to make people post more publicly presentable tier lists even if their true opinion is different.
I'm more than happy to release the results of the calculations, but I am not putting any more effort into the software at this time. However I want the software to remain available to the community to ease the calculation process for tier list production in the future.
What particularly bothers me is how small the variance between lists are. Only something like 3 people didn't have Fox or Falco as #1, which is less than the people who spelled 'Sheik' wrong or wrote 'Gannon'. I think the problem has two faces: one is that not everyone agrees or knows what a tier list is, the other is that "discussion" of each person's list tends to make people post more publicly presentable tier lists even if their true opinion is different.
I'm more than happy to release the results of the calculations, but I am not putting any more effort into the software at this time. However I want the software to remain available to the community to ease the calculation process for tier list production in the future.
Bad Cupboard
Smash Apprentice
That's ALL we want
Divinokage
Smash Legend
It's just that there is SOME logic of fighting applied from IRL to the game but not everything.
Ripple
ᗣᗣᗣᗣ ᗧ·····•·····
- Joined
- Sep 4, 2006
- Messages
- 9,632
weight, like fall speed, affects how well you can combo characters. the heavier they are, the less distance they travel after a hit.
Bones0
Smash Legend
This is pretty much why I can't take tier list discussion anymore. The level of conformity in the creation of lists is laughable, and what's even worse is this is not some recent trend as a result of having a constant list since 2010. The spacies and Sheik have been almost undisputed top 3 since 2002, back before people even attempted to use advanced techs. Just to drive home how bad people were in 2002, watch this.
I doubt people are actually afraid of disclosing their own opinions. Most people seem quite confident in their assertions that FFS are the top 3 and openly mock people who disagree as if those 3 not being the best is some sort of ridiculous opinion. I just think people get it in their heads that certain characters are better and confirmation bias does the rest. It's almost reasonable. Why would a player think Fox, Falco, or Sheik aren't top 3 when such a huge majority of the community says they are and they are extremely popular characters?
I wish we could get the opinions of the tier list from players who are at least fairly experienced in competitive play but who have not been exposed to the opinions of the masses. Obviously it wouldn't say much about what the tier list actually is since no one will get very good without hearing about the tier list, but it'd be funny to see their transformation from a tier list before being exposed to community opinions to their opinion after.
I'd consider being lighter a much bigger detriment when it comes to comboing because you stay in stun longer. You rarely see fatties getting comboed because they don't fly very far since they're out of stun so much earlier anyway. You also get out of throw combos much more easily because of the increased throw lag.
john!
Smash Hero
face #2 can be fixed by either private submission of lists, forbidding tier list discussion in the submission thread, or encouraging more open-mindedness among the community (those worthless one-sentence posts like "marth at #2, really?" should be considered spam)
face #1 can be fixed by discussing what a tier list actually means and how it should be formed. i try to bring this up a lot in the tier list thread but a lot of times discussion doesn't go very far.
feel free to post the data and source code btw, i'm sure some programmers/statisticians on this site will be willing to work their magic
Fortress | Sveet
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S: Fox, Falco, Sheik, Marth, Jigglypuff, Peach, C.Falcon, Ice Climbers
A: Dr. Mario, Pikachu, Samus, Ganondorf, Luigi, Mario
B: Young Link, Link, Donkey Kong, Yoshi, Zelda, Roy, Mewtwo, Game & Watch
F: Ness, Bowser, Pichu, Kirby
Tier Name Translations
S- Viable Tier. All characters in this range are viable for competing.
A- Semi-Viable Tier. These characters have been shown by their dedicated players to have the tools to compete, though it is apparent that they are slightly disadvantaged.
B- Probably Not Viable Tier. Some players have done well with these characters in specific match-ups, but for the most part they aren't viable for winning tournaments.
F- Just Leave Them Alone Tier. Its probably for the best.
Voters: BladeWise, Dart!, Diakonos, Divinokage, Hax, HoChiMinhTrail, hungrybox, HyugaRicdeau, Juggleguy, KevinM, King Funk, Mogwai, Nintendude1189, Paju, Pink Reaper, Pluplue, Redd, Ripple, SleepyK, Strong Bad, SuperMatt, Sveet, SwiftBass, TaFoKiNtS, Tero., The Good Doctor, VaNz, Yeroc
I agree with most of that.
Are you going to release one with EVERY person who posted their tier list being included?
Are you going to release one with EVERY person who posted their tier list being included?
The Business
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Nov 11, 2012
- Messages
- 249
top 6 are to my liking.
john!
Smash Hero
how did you choose the voters?
Bad Cupboard
Smash Apprentice
I want to know this too. Seems a little bit arbitrary. Didn't a lot more people (including good players) vote?
Bones0
Smash Legend
I'm not sure I even want to know. lol
BTmoney
a l l b e c o m e $
My only qualm is that Roy is going to get 100x better when people start implementing pivot fsmashing. But I suppose that'll be for the next list.
I like how that one turned out and I'd call it pretty much right. Marth finally getting his respect.
Upke
Smash Journeyman
He didn't use my list obviously, but I saw it coming. Yoshi's got talent, it's just not easy to tap into.
Dan Salvato
IE
There is more deviation between CF and ICs than between ICs and Doc, so I think ICs should be considered A tier. Also because I do think they're a pretty good step below the top 7, enough to warrant a deduction in letter grade.
D
Deleted member
Guest
at this point with tournament results, i'd say the opposite. falcon can't seem to break into the top placements at the biggest tournaments, while ICs and Doc occasionally do. I'd sooner put falcon into A tier.
however, i also chose not to vote. just verbalizing my thoughts.