noradseven
Smash Lord
its super armor startup after that its mad priority.
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ZSS General Discussion
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Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
uggh the priority. It's crazy last tourney Dk spammed it and just kept racking damage. ugh i hate Dk.
I believe the official term for that technique is now called the "Mach Tornado."
It works the other way around, too. He can give his aerial up B super armor... which is just plain silly and makes it impossible to knock him out of it other than with an air grab iirc.
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Wow, that's pretty pimpin.
Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
See this is just bull****. Exactly why Dk shouldn't go to YI xp. Guess i know now huh.
noradseven
Smash Lord
Yeah p. much
This made my day.
Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
LOL mach tornado, bunch bull**** if you ask me.
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
Hi guys. I got my Wii back and I'm back to doing fun things.
OK so if you dash toward and edge and then hit up+b and IMMEDIATELY wavebounce back, ZSS will up+b off the stage and slide safely back onto it, spiking anyone above her without putting you in danger. If done correctly you will not hear the sound effect usually caused by up+b (well sometimes). Zero and I were talking about it on IRC for a few minutes and it seems marginally useful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUR_yUlZVFQ Video
Yes I realize this is the same principal as capedashing but whatever. The more you know.
Up+b also allows you to reverse the jump caused by hitting X or Y on the edge and carries your momentum when you run off platforms causing you to glide to the ground instead of falling.
OK so if you dash toward and edge and then hit up+b and IMMEDIATELY wavebounce back, ZSS will up+b off the stage and slide safely back onto it, spiking anyone above her without putting you in danger. If done correctly you will not hear the sound effect usually caused by up+b (well sometimes). Zero and I were talking about it on IRC for a few minutes and it seems marginally useful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUR_yUlZVFQ Video
Yes I realize this is the same principal as capedashing but whatever. The more you know.
Up+b also allows you to reverse the jump caused by hitting X or Y on the edge and carries your momentum when you run off platforms causing you to glide to the ground instead of falling.
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Wow, pretty cool. Helpful against gimping Falco's.
Salem
Smash Champion
I think I tried that once or twice but ignored it cause I don't see what I can do with such a move.
I'll start implementing that into my game some how.
I'll start implementing that into my game some how.
Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
Now this could be some useful information. A psuedo plasma bounce just epic.
Space-knight
Smash Cadet
Hey whats the best way to implement Zero suit samus's down B move? I've been trying to come up with stuff but I figure somebody has already done that so why not ask?
Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
The down b can be used for various strategical moves. Its best use is the invinci frames you get once first pressed. You can use that for getting out of combos' as well as getting back on stage. In some instances it can be used to spike. Use it mostly to get out of sticky situations.
noradseven
Smash Lord
Yeah p. much this, but watch out it can and will be baited but so can everything.
Space-knight
Smash Cadet
shlike
Smash Ace
i fell in love with nair all over again
noradseven
Smash Lord
me and n-air have been steady for a little under a year now
Xyless
Smash Master
Speaking of nair, that's my least used aerial with ZSS. I need to get around to fixing that.
noradseven
Smash Lord
Even d-air O_o.
Ownasaurus
Smash Journeyman
I've been trying to incorporate it into my gameplay, but even still, I rarely have a good use for it. The only matchup I consistently use it in is vs. olimar, where i use the nair to shake off pikmin without diminishing any other arials. I rarely use it at low percents because I can't seem to combo it to another move, and I rarely use it at high percents because it doesn't kill as well as other arials. Sometimes I use it for its oddly-angeled hitbox, but it is rare.
So I ask - when do you (singular or plural) tend to use nair, and why would it be more effective than another arial in that instance?
Come to think of it, I use dair more than I use nair too....
hmmm....maybe I should fix that too <_<
noradseven
Smash Lord
I am half surprised other people use d-air is part of the thing, I thought I was just crazy.
n-air has better block stun than any other aireal, and functioning hitstun to allow a free combo at low damages, hint hit the center of n-air not the front side. The front/back sides are more for awkward retreating hits not really the other way around. Also make sure you land behind them during the n-air because ya kinda need that +2 more frames.
I basically use it when I am worried about it landing and do it instead of b-air crossup pressure, which is just as effective, in many ways, just this will free combo at lower damages.
Nefarious B
Smash Champion
I must be using it wrong, cause I find nair unsafe against the majority of shields out there.
And dair is good for mixups. Is there any way to stall it on purpose? Like does second jump to dair immediately stall it into the air? Because if you get dair to cancel it can combo into things pretty well.
And dair is good for mixups. Is there any way to stall it on purpose? Like does second jump to dair immediately stall it into the air? Because if you get dair to cancel it can combo into things pretty well.
Xyless
Smash Master
I'm a Peach main. I can't help it. I'm working on it.
(I still accidentally dair off stage every so often)
noradseven
Smash Lord
No it doesn't stall but it stops all momentum too bad the fact that it moves your hitbox down a bit at startup eliminates most uses, normally if Im using it Im TKing it, it pokes low shields like mad and at like 50%+ damage safe and a 100%+ damage(when I normally use it), the oppenent gets place in a favorable position for us.
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
n-air isn't great, except in sitautions where you need the angle. Those do come up, though.
Dair is good in a few rare circumstances, too.
Dair is good in a few rare circumstances, too.
noradseven
Smash Lord
and n-air's priority its good stuff at stuffing u-smash's
shlike
Smash Ace
nair's priority is good???
everything marth does beats it but i dont know about the rest of the cast
everything marth does beats it but i dont know about the rest of the cast
mountain_tiger
Smash Champion
The only time when Dair should EVER be used is if your opponent is juggling you, and you need a way to get back to the ground ASAP. In any other situation, it's much too laggy and risky to be worth it, especially since it doesn't do much damage or knockback.
Dair is probably her worst move, even when you include her throws.
Dair is probably her worst move, even when you include her throws.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Uthrow.
Dair I use a lot more then uthrow, tbh, I think I never used uthrow in a serious match, while I did do so with Fsmash for baiting a roll, lulz.
mountain_tiger
Smash Champion
No I'd say UThrow is more useful. It does the most damage out of all her throws, and people tend to say 'DThrow instaed' because allegedly it's easier to follow up, however even with DThrow your opponent can easily escape any follow-ups if they know what to expect, but your opponent is still in the air,so you can pressure them and try to land a hit that way.
UThrow launches them into the air like DThrow and it does 3% more damage. BThrow could be argued to be worse than Dair, but UThrow most certainly isn't.
#HBC | ZoZo
Shocodoro Blagshidect
Uthrow has too much lag, you can't defend it in any way
Nefarious B
Smash Champion
at lower percents I think your opponent can hit you after you uthrow them, while you're still stuck in the animation.
yeah it's garbage.
If there is a way to consistently use the stalled dair I would use it so much, I was just realizing how well it combos if you can hit them and then cancel right before you hit the ground.
Nair is alright I love how it combos but at the same time I find it really hard to land on a grounded opponent. I feel like I'm not using it right (norad help meh).
yeah it's garbage.
If there is a way to consistently use the stalled dair I would use it so much, I was just realizing how well it combos if you can hit them and then cancel right before you hit the ground.
Nair is alright I love how it combos but at the same time I find it really hard to land on a grounded opponent. I feel like I'm not using it right (norad help meh).
mountain_tiger
Smash Champion
Really? It's never happend to me. I can imagine stall-then-fall moves hitting during the lag, but I can't think of any other moves that could do that; its base knockback seems like it's too high.
Besides, at around 50%+ DThrow has very little chance of getting an initial follow-up, so you may as well go for UThrow then.
On the topic of Nair, it's pretty good, but I don't find myself using it too often. I'm trying to implement it into my game a bit more.
noradseven
Smash Lord
you don't need a direct follow it is easier to do dodge baits off of, though I sometimes do u-throw to change the dodge timing hehe they normally dodge way early.. Also d-air like I said it pokes shields below 1/2 health, and soft spikes on platforms, lol, most the time I d-air its imediatly after a jump,because your at 80% damage, low shield, somewhat near the edge and I want you off the stage. It kinda owns for that.
Anyone who says nair doesn't have good priority is not paying attention. It's basically a mid-air sheild.
That said, even though it's safe on block, it's ridiculously unsafe on PS, and given that there's not much of a window for a falling nair to be useful, PSing it is really easy, since most people with match-up experience will know to expect it.
Nair's good, but not that good.
That said, even though it's safe on block, it's ridiculously unsafe on PS, and given that there's not much of a window for a falling nair to be useful, PSing it is really easy, since most people with match-up experience will know to expect it.
Nair's good, but not that good.
Roxas1988
Smash Journeyman
Isn't accidentally dairing of stage horrible? I do that sometimes when im d-tilting near the ledge and then boom death.
noradseven
Smash Lord
Yep its unsafe on PS this is why I do it right on top of them so most characters at least have to guess, which side I will land on.
But then again b-air is unsafe on PS too so
.