Zelda Matchup Thread // OUTDATED

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Which is why I would do it only if they were attempting to follow up. Also, i'm not using dtilt or dsmash OoS unless you mean Out of Spotdodge?

So really if you spotdodge the zair, he retreats and neither of you are punished. Dsmash would only be used to repel a follow-up.

I'm pretty sure a bomb at your spotdodge is unpunishable and has a good chance to connect as soon as you come out

 

[Kaffei]

I'm pretty sure a bomb at your spotdodge is unpunishable and has a good chance to connect as soon as you come out

So you're saying TL's Zair is a very dangerous move because it has so many options?

 

[-Mars-]

I'm pretty sure a bomb at your spotdodge is unpunishable and has a good chance to connect as soon as you come out

Good thing we have Naryus huh? Kaffei did bring up his arrow cancel and yes that would probably outspeed anything you could do , especially Dins.

I guess you could spotdodge and then powershield the arrow-cancel?

I'm just throwing out options here.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

So you're saying TL's Zair is a very dangerous move because it has so many options?

that... and because zelda can't punish it.

Good thing we have Naryus huh? Kaffei did bring up his arrow cancel and yes that would probably outspeed anything you could do , especially Dins.

I guess you could spotdodge and then powershield the arrow-cancel?

I'm just throwing out options here.

you cannot nayru's out of spotdodge quickly enough to punish that. and even if you DO somehow get it out. if it's at your feet reflecting it does nothing. you still get hit, popped intot he air, and and tink's mercy.

 

[RoyalBlood]

Oh yes, i forgot, whoops for me, where do you CP Diddy? <----- means which stage you should choose (for hamster people)

 

[Kaffei]

Good thing we have Naryus huh? Kaffei did bring up his arrow cancel and yes that would probably outspeed anything you could do , especially Dins.

I guess you could spotdodge and then powershield the arrow-cancel?

I'm just throwing out options here.

Yes, I agree.

Zelda also has many options when dealing with Zair approach, but it appears that TL has even more options, especially TL players who are unpredictable.

-If Zelda shields the zair, TL can land & grab.
-If Zelda spot dodges & follows with a Dsmash, TL can retreat & throw a boomerang/bomb/arrow & reset his Zair approach.
-If Zelda tries Din's, TL can out-speed it with Arrow Cancel.

Omfg.... -___________-'''''''

What if she airdodges & follows with a close up Nayru's? AirD>Nayrus has little lag. <~ never mind, if she airdodges, TL can just do a SHFFNair.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Yes, I agree.

Zelda also has many options when dealing with Zair approach, but it appears that TL has even more options, especially TL players who are unpredictable.

-If Zelda shields the zair, TL can land & grab.
-If Zelda spot dodges & follows with a Dsmash, TL can retreat & throw a boomerang/bomb/arrow & reset his Zair approach.
-If Zelda tries Din's, TL can out-speed it with Arrow Cancel.

Omfg.... -___________-'''''''

What if she airdodges & follows with a close up Nayru's? AirD>Nayrus has little lag. <~ never mind, if she airdodges, TL can just do a SHFFNair.

that's my whole point. Tink is a LOT more versitile in the matchup. He has options to get around what zelda can do to him. Zelda has less options for getting around things. Normally if you can beat something she does, you can keep beating it.


oh and the new pit picture is frightening

 

[-Mars-]

I'm determined to find something. Spotdodge the zair and shield the bomb? I wonder if the shield comes up fast enough for that. You then jump cancel the shield and reset your spacing.

I agree Toon Link is a b****. One of the few positives is that killing Zelda is hard for him. Living past 130% is very common in this matchup.

 

[Kaffei]

that's my whole point. Tink is a LOT more versitile in the matchup. He has options to get around what zelda can do to him. Zelda has less options for getting around things. Normally if you can beat something she does, you can keep beating it.


oh and the new pit picture is frightening

Lol@ Pit. o-o'

I guess one thing you could possibly HOPE for when using Din's is if TL screws up his Arrow Cancel.

...

LOLYARITE.

 

[Kaffei]

I'm determined to find something. Spotdodge the zair and shield the bomb? I wonder if the shield comes up fast enough for that. You then jump cancel the shield and reset your spacing.

I agree Toon Link is a b****. One of the few positives is that killing Zelda is hard for him. Living past 130% is very common in this matchup.

TL's bomb animation is too slow to use as a reaction against Zelda's counters, so a good TL would stick with Boomerang & Arrows.

Even if the Shield comes out fast enough after a SpotDodge, TL can still move fast enough to grab immediately upon landing. It really depends on who's the better mindgamer.

I've also noticed that TL can sometimes rely on ledge hogs to win. He can hang onto his hookshot, & if he/she times it right, he can stay invincible using the back>Tether2x so Farore's misses him AND the ledge's sweetspot = drop to her death.

The tech can be seen here at 3:44
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHt0qdXpLvU

 

[RoyalBlood]

oh and the new pit picture is frightening

Lol@ Pit. o-o'

Sorry it's staying ^_^

Stage for Diddy?

New match-up on it's way

 

[Kaffei]

Sorry it's staying ^_^

Stage for Diddy?

New match-up on it's way

I don't hate it.
It's a very good drawing, but the clothes...lololol!

Stage.....Hmmm, I'd say one without much flat terrain to interrupt his bananas.
Um.....I don't know. T.T

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

toon link doesn't RELY on tether hog KOs... it's just yet another tool he has at his disposal

I don't hate it.
It's a very good drawing, but the clothes...lololol!

Stage.....Hmmm, I'd say one without much flat terrain to interrupt his bananas.
Um.....I don't know. T.T

*shrugs* most of diddy's bad stages are bad for zelda too and Zelda's good stages tend to be good for diddy too.

exceptions:

Battlefield
-just as good for zelda as ever. Diddy doesn't hate it, but it's not near as good for him as it is for you.

Norfair
- awful for diddy's banana game and not really a bad stage for zelda at all.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

whats the next matchup thats coming up? and yeah the pit picture is lol XD

 

[RoyalBlood]

Falcon discussion starts...NAO!!

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

okasy first off. explain to me why THIS isn't the pic on the first page

there's not much to say about this matchup. he's too fast for din's to be overly reliable, but that's nto a problem since you outrange and outprioritize him everywhere. and he broadcasts well. As long as you aren't stupidly throwing out random attacks and you actually try to counter his attacks, this matchup is AT LEAST 70:30 in our favor on pretty much any stage that doesn't gimp us.

 

[Kinzer]

This matchup will make things more lively won't they?

Also for the Ike pic no thank you!?

 

[Kaffei]

Falcon is........fast. That's the only problem I see.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

Falcon discussion starts...NAO!!

LOL
10dumbpeachs

okasy first off. explain to me why THIS isn't the pic on the first page

there's not much to say about this matchup. he's too fast for din's to be overly reliable, but that's nto a problem since you outrange and outprioritize him everywhere. and he broadcasts well. As long as you aren't stupidly throwing out random attacks and you actually try to counter his attacks, this matchup is AT LEAST 70:30 in our favor on pretty much any stage that doesn't gimp us.

that kinda expalins everything doesn't it? in the air he can't even get in a sweetspot war cause LK outranges knee. his speed is what really only gives me some problems. hes like a bigger Sonic.

 

[TigerWoods]

DFAADFaDS!! I need to discuss in here more often....

 

[SmashBrother2008]

Bigger Sonic is a lovely discription. I'm sorry if I don't contribute but we all know which way this matchup will sway. As a Falcon main, I don't bother argueing for him anymore, I just play > win > enjoy my glory.


Whatever, though 1:9 Zelda *sigh*

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Bigger Sonic is a lovely discription. I'm sorry if I don't contribute but we all know which way this matchup will sway. As a Falcon main, I don't bother argueing for him anymore, I just play > win > enjoy my glory.


Whatever, though 1:9 Zelda *sigh*

oh gosh 1:9 seems extreme. maybe 80:20, but I question even that

 

[Kaffei]

Bigger Sonic is a lovely discription. I'm sorry if I don't contribute but we all know which way this matchup will sway. As a Falcon main, I don't bother argueing for him anymore, I just play > win > enjoy my glory.


Whatever, though 1:9 Zelda *sigh*

Wait, in Zelda's favor? O.O??

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

well think about that for a second. does the alternative even make sense?

 

[Kaffei]

well think about that for a second. does the alternative even make sense?

..I don't even know.
I've never played against Falcon, & I've never seen a video against him.



:|

 

[Tidycats29]

Well then i suppose i can try and summarize something out for my former main falcon

Well first off zeldas smashes out prioritize every move falcon has
and falcon has no proyectile
so zelda should have no problem aproaching

falcons only reliable move here is his down smash and jab

pretty much falcon has to jab you and grab you then continue with CG if he can
thats pretty much all he has here on ground in this match up

in air is where it might be a little more well not gay for the falcon but its still gay for him

falcon uair is pretty much his safest move and knee
and his up B

as for comboing falcon pretty much literally has to rely on knee and down smash to kill ya
his other smashes arent worth trying seeing as zelda's jab out prioritizes them

falcon has a possible CG on you so watch that
most falcon players will try down Throw to knee
and it works very well so be careful on that

falcon kick is great for mindgames so be on lookout for that

all in all i would go in more detail but zelda is just superior to falcon

this 7:3 zelda

EDIT: if any of you wish to brawl a falcon so you can maybe judge a little yourselves
i am up for brawls just pm me

maybe it can help with the match up

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i think 70:30 Zelda. his speed is his strong point here. you really have to play mindgames to get though zeldas defenses. he sparkilng fortress of beauty and death.

 

[Kataefi]

Awe captain falcon always gets the wrong end of the deal! Does he have any good matchups, except himself? >.>

 

[Tidycats29]

Awe captain falcon always gets the wrong end of the deal! Does he have any good matchups, except himself? >.>

Err ganondorf is pretty even with him

otherwise every other character dominates the falcon

 

[TigerWoods]

If he charges up a falcon punch, don't do anything.

He deserves to hit you with SOMETHING...

 

[JigglyZelda003]

if he does falcon puch im gonna ps to OoS LK lol.

 

[-Mars-]

Well his game is based a lot off of his jabs...........and he won't be getting inside Zelda very often. His grab range is pretty bad, we zone him to death, he has no reliable KO moves, he's the perfect size for bair OoS, he has horrible approaches, no priority, and we have a generally faster moveset.

the only thing he might have on us is offstage play and I would barely give him that.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Very similar to the Ganondorf match-up in that all of his approaches are very punishable by Zelda. However, while dtilt is safe for poking, the range is very short because of the low reaction time required I wouldn't advise forcing Falcon to approach from there using it.

Play projectiles and zone with fair and bair to force an approach when he's below safe Din's range. I believe that ^B to reset spacing (not to attack) is safe in this match-up but don't quote me I don't quote me on that, I don't have FW's frame data.

Overall, 70-30, while she doesn't really have the poke, Zelda's defensive options and zoning more then make up for it in this match-up, she can effectively force an approach just fine, and her punishing options are more then sufficent to consider this a hard counter, especially because of her priority issues (lack thereof).

Err ganondorf is pretty even with him

otherwise every other character dominates the falcon

Eh, not really.

Ganondorf pokes smartly and Falcon is forced to approach, in a match-up where every approach is punishable (even the auto-canceling ones due to lack of range/shieldstun). Add that to the difficultly of countering a predicted dtilt (you have to be exactly right because of Falcon's low short-hop and how high Ganondorf's dtilt extends) and Ganondorf's good punishing and edgeguarding games and it's really not close to even.

 

[Bandit]

Usmash out prioritizes every aerial he has. If he goes airborne, he loses.
LK's are amazing in this match-up. It is so easy to land them on him, and I usually toy with my opponent by yelling out how many sweetspots I have landed against how many knees he has landed. The last match I had the score was 9-1, and I was seriously using about 3 moves.

70-30 Zelda as I don't like to go any higher because any person who plays falcon at a high level (is that possible?) would still know ways to get to you.

 

[-Mars-]

Usmash out prioritizes every aerial he has. If he goes airborne, he loses.
LK's are amazing in this match-up. It is so easy to land them on him, and I usually toy with my opponent by yelling out how many sweetspots I have landed against how many knees he has landed. The last match I had the score was 9-1, and I was seriously using about 3 moves.

70-30 Zelda as I don't like to go any higher because any person who plays falcon at a high level (is that possible?) would still know ways to get to you.

I've seen good Falcons. This one Falcon nearly beat a prominent DDD back in the late summer.

 

[Bandit]

I was joking when I said "is that possible?" but generally no one uses Falcon in tournament unless they are getting their *** kicked or they are destroying people and are sandbagging.

If I am wrong, then I'd be the first to admit it, but there is no falcon in my region other than for the reasons stated above. I saw a teams battle where two guys were getting killed in teams so they went double metaknight and in response, the dominant team went to double captain falcon. The falcons won. It was completely about the player skill there but it was hilarious to watch.

 

[RoyalBlood]

70-30?? >_> <_<
So fast? D:
Stages, stages please ^-^

 

[GodAtHand]

Well, what did you expect?

I say Battlefield, but maybe FD would be better since that way there isn't even the slightest chance of being kneed.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

any stage that isn't bad for zelda works fine. since falcon doesn't have a projectile and shouldn't be approaching from the air, mansion isn't amazing like it can sometimes be. just don't pick a stage that gimps zelda and you're fine.

 

[Lord Yawgmoth]

Well, what did you expect?

I say Battlefield, but maybe FD would be better since that way there isn't even the slightest chance of being kneed.

I agree with Riot on this one,
but what SonicTheHedgedawg said is too true as well.