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Which is More Broken? #3

Strong Badam

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I'm going to have to ask for an elaboration on what "Auto-Jump Cancelled" means.
 

Pi

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so auto jc'd aerials as close to the ground as possible while still getting the hit box out?

essentially frame perfect JC aerials?

peach w/ lasers. Zzz
 

Strong Badam

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the bad side of having auto jump-cancel Ness/Yoshi is that after the aerial you're still Ness or Yoshi, and Peach is Peach with Falco's laser.
 

Beat!

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One greatly improves an already good character by replacing a next-to-useless move with the best projectile in the game.

The other one does nothing but make execution of a certain technique easier... for two low tier characters.

Peach with Falco's lasers. No question about it.
 

Bones0

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It's not like DJCing fast is particularly hard. I thought you played Ness, Hbox. >.>

Anyone know how many lasers Peach would be able to shoot per SH/FH? Strong Bad?


You should switch it to Ness/Yoshi with a laser vs. Peach with auto-FCing. I'd still pick Peach though.
 

KirbyKaze

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Peach. Easily.


edit:

Peach has enough air time to SHDL with Falco's laser. That alone is enough. She can also SH > float > laser > FF to do lasers as quickly as Falco.

Peach is a superior character in all the aspects that gaining the auto-DJC. Auto-DJC isn't even that good because not every aerial is good DJCed. Moreover, FCs are inherently better than DJCs because the 1 frame you sacrifice to get into float is made up for by the fact that you have the reduced landing lag (4 frames versus a normal l-cancel time). You don't even "sacrifice" the 1 frame because to DJC you need to spend a frame to DJ anyway. So yeah.

This comparison is horrible because their improvement isn't even that good.

Peach, conversely, gets a tool that cuts into her biggest weaknesses in the current metagame (Jigglypuff's back air, Fox & Falcon's dash dance camp, etc). This comes at the sacrifice of, what, Toad? Okay...

For her other MUs, she gains a second projectile so she has an absolutely stupid camping game (Sheik can't outcamp Falco lasers and turnips at the same time), and it zones characters like Marth (and anyone else that wants to play a distance or spacing game with her). That's incredible. This forces people to shield and jump even more against her, which is great because the latter opens up chances for her to get positioning and beat their air defense (which is one of her main strats anyway). Forcing people to shield with Peach is retardedly good as we've all seen numerous times. This also lets her to help cover up her weakness of being unable to tech chase long distances reactively by simply giving her a means to pressure the opponent if they move away from her as far as they can. Being able to re-lock her opponents is incredible (SHDL them down). When you figure she has multiple projectiles to do it with now, that's crazy.





In general, when making stuff like this, don't try to compare anything to <character> + Falco's laser. You generally have to hand out Rest, Falco's laser, or some amazing trait that covers a ton of weaknesses to make the comparison even worth thinking about. Unless it's on an absolute garbage tier character, like Kirby.
 

Biglard

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My vote is clearly going to Peach with Falco's lasers.

As Strong Bad said, Ness and Yoshi with auto djc would still have obvious flaws. Peach with lasers would be a monster.
 

CloneHat

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DJCing isn't hard anyway, that's like saying, "Falco now SH lasers without having to press jump."

Try other characters.
 

Blistering Speed

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Falcon with Falco's shine or the aforementioned Peach with Falco's lasers?

I can't be bothered to think about and quantify the actual benefits of Falcon with shine, I just know it'd be sexy.
 

Pi

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just add shine in between all of his combo's

dair, shine, knee
uair, shine, knee

knee, shine, knee, shine, knee

his OoS game would be devastating
 

BigD!!!

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i wouldnt know what to do with lasers as peach, it would feel so awkward with such a slow jump

probably still great, i trust kk that the float thing would be fast, but i dont do that claw **** so i cant hold y and hit b at the same time
 

Mr.Jackpot

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There's no point when you can already do near perfect DJC's in normal Melee. Ness does not suck.
 

ShroudedOne

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I just had an image of Peach floating, shooting lasers, while holding a turnip.

Oh goodness.
 

DerfMidWest

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*didn't read any replies, so sorry if somebody posted this*

I'm seeing Peach float-canceling with lasers. just floatin at you with lasers... then you dead.
Or just floating offstage somewhere lasering.
 

KirbyKaze

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Falcon with Falco's shine or the aforementioned Peach with Falco's lasers?

I can't be bothered to think about and quantify the actual benefits of Falcon with shine, I just know it'd be sexy.
It's close, but I think Falcon.

Nair > shine > knee is stupid. Shine oos > knee is stupid. Any opening whatsoever > knee is stupid. Shinegrab > d-throw > shine > knee on FFers is stupid.

It also massively improves his game against crouching characters by being able to beat their relevant options during crouch through a speed deficit and start a combo.
 

Krynxe

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Maybe if you made their auto djc have 0 landing lag, sort of like peach's float cancel, it would be much more useful in this hypothetical situation. Still voting for Peach w\ lasers, cause you're just taking already high tier peach and making her more godlike.
 

The Star King

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Lets talking about floating lazerz.

THATS why she'd be broken.

:phone:
B moves cancel her float IIRC. She still wins this by a mile though.

Blistering Speed should have made this thread, because either one of his two are actually plausible >___>
 
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