Werewolves of Miller's Hollow | Game Over! Who could have possibly won?!?!???!

[#HBC | ZoZo]

I think it makes you... Iunno really, it just bothers me. If you have suspicions because of assumptions you're simply pushing based on practically nothing, it's so unnecessary.
It's also just how you build you posts which bothers me too, making me sometimes skim your posts (yes I'm admitting to that)

Let's take a part of a post you made

I understand the sentiment here, but I don't think you thought that through. In a lylo situation, there is no reason for a wolf to not soft-claim VI. If it's a proper lylo, or even mylo, then we can't have the VI come forward to confirm him/herself because that would tie the scum/town vote. Without the threat of being immediately outed by the existence of a VI, any wolf is free to soft claim. Further, a single soft-claim, as was mentioned before, is unconfirmable. A dual-soft claim is workable, since we can consider the third person that did not soft-claim is at the very least not aligned with the same scum faction that claimed, but that would be banking on a role existing in the game to improve a 1/3 shot to a 1/2.

Let's shorten it with the same information in it:

I understand what you're saying, but in a lylo situation there's no reason for a wolf NOT to soft-claim VI.
If it's a normal lylo, or even mylo, then we can't have the VI come out to claim because that would tie the scum/town vote.
Without the threat of being immediately outed by the existence of a VI, any wolf is free to soft claim.
Also, a single soft-claim is unconfirmable. A dual-soft claim is better, since we can consider the third person that didn't soft-claim is at least not aligned with the same scum faction that claimed, buuut that would be banking on a role existing in the game to improve a 1/3 shot to a 1/2.

Removed fluff words, words that are longer then necessary, exaggerations for no reason when it's already clear etc. I could easily read through my version while having to sometimes read sentences multiple times in your post. Might just be language barrier though.

I don't like 137, how mayling just accepts MK excuse without going in on him not reading at all (antitown imo)
Ah wells.

Coasters should go though yesh, still waiting with voting.

 

[Mayling]

I don't like 137, how mayling just accepts MK excuse without going in on him not reading at all (antitown imo)
Ah wells.

Coasters should go though yesh, still waiting with voting.

...so you really just didn't read? uhh. I thought it was just a guise to get me to talk about mentos. >.>

Metakirby or Today should go toDay if either one doesn't step it up. Reminding me of Mister Eric (for those who are familiar with newbie 3). For now I'm sticking with Today since she has still failed to speak at all.

So saying he should go toDay if Today doesn't is accepting his excuse of not reading?

That's a weird push for suspicion. I don't see at all how you thought I was accepting of the excuse when I said he should die. (not to mention, I'd already said that he should reread to see the case and not rely on others)

Why aren't you yourself getting onto Mk for his lack of reading/contribution? But instead you target me for something I feel is false. Not to mention you dismiss yourself with "Ah wells."

while we're talking about Mk, I thought it was weird he had time to correct his vote to move over onto Today (a reasonable sized bandwagon) but not post anything of substance (again).

 

[Mayling]

So I was lying in bed trying to sleep, when I thought of something.

Lol votes. Pressure votes? Kay.

MK only appears to post his opinions after some votes on piled on him.

So basically my read on Cello is uber weird. First of all, he's trying to fish the hell out of all roles possible. Can't blame him, but then again, it's suspicious and I don't like it. Something I noticed however, is that anyone that was like "OMG VILLAGE IDIOT DONT CLAIM" (including myself) basically pseudoclaimed themselves. Pierre stated that anyone who refers to the power, if they ARE the idiot, gets hit with the consequences. My thinking is: Didn't we all just do that?

Metakirby, you essentially claim here that you have read cello's posts to the extent of being able to comment on his scumminess, which to me you are only now doing because of pressure votes on you. Cello pushed himself onto the spotlight, so it would have been really easy to make a comment about him without really getting any slack.

Once the pressure votes are off, you slip back into the void (btw, Mentos is also guilty of this. Where did HE go?)

Can I ask someone (Mayling/Cello) how they think about Mentos? I'm sorry, I didn't quite read well enough the last few pages and I missed the whole case against him! :O Sorry. What I did realize though, is that half the people are like "Yay lynch" and the other half are like "Oh, no, never I'll never do that".

The funny thing about this is that here you claim to not read enough about Mentos to "miss the entire case about him." Yet, cello was the one putting the case onto Mentos. So... how did you read well enough to comment on Cello's scumminess but miss the ENTIRE case on Mentos?

Vote: Today Pressure vote. Please post something substantial to help us.

Also, funny, is here he says he's placing a pressure vote on Today, criticizing her for something I feel he's guilty of. Don't get me wrong, they're both guilty of it... I just feel that since he got pressure votes on him to speak, he's trying to look helpful by doing the same to her.

unvote: Today

Vote Metakirby

I'm still willing to lynch Today, but looking back at this post, and Xonar hop-skipping over MK's lack of reading and trying to push suspicion on me for it... I not only feel we can gain more from MK's flip than Today's, and also that it made me weary to put Today at L-1 for now.

 

[M.K]

So I was lying in bed trying to sleep, when I thought of something.



MK only appears to post his opinions after some votes on piled on him.



Metakirby, you essentially claim here that you have read cello's posts to the extent of being able to comment on his scumminess, which to me you are only now doing because of pressure votes on you. Cello pushed himself onto the spotlight, so it would have been really easy to make a comment about him without really getting any slack.

Once the pressure votes are off, you slip back into the void (btw, Mentos is also guilty of this. Where did HE go?)



The funny thing about this is that here you claim to not read enough about Mentos to "miss the entire case about him." Yet, cello was the one putting the case onto Mentos. So... how did you read well enough to comment on Cello's scumminess but miss the ENTIRE case on Mentos?



Also, funny, is here he says he's placing a pressure vote on Today, criticizing her for something I feel he's guilty of. Don't get me wrong, they're both guilty of it... I just feel that since he got pressure votes on him to speak, he's trying to look helpful by doing the same to her.

unvote: Today

Vote Metakirby

I'm still willing to lynch Today, but looking back at this post, and Xonar hop-skipping over MK's lack of reading and trying to push suspicion on me for it... I not only feel we can gain more from MK's flip than Today's, and also that it made me weary to put Today at L-1 for now.

It's annoying to hear that people don't think I'm posting enough. What do you expect me to do? I have a packed schedule and I try to post as much as I can. =/ Today hasn't posted in FOREVER. I'm trying to post at least once a day. Big difference.
May, wouldn't it be completely obvious for me to share my opinion when votes are placed on me? I don't know how you can critisize me for this. I've shared my opinion many times in this game with no votes and I did so WITH votes, so that's not a valid argument in the least.
God ****, you assume that I have absolutely no brain for myself. That's annoyingly condescending. I have my own suspicions of Cello, I'm not just "following the spotlight" like you claim. This is your argument:
"Oh, it's easy to see why he thinks Cello is scum, so basically it doesn't really count as an addition to the game."
Yeah, last time I checked, you didn't decide the end all be all lynch for the day; its a group effort, and it should be a group effort to share our thoughts with each other and be straightforward.
I've re-read the case on Mentos. People originally jumped on him because he somehow "knew" there were 3 werewolves (when, in fact, it's stated in the role post). Cello even gets angry @ mentos for ....seeing the obvious. There isn't enough information on mentos at this point, and I myself am getting a town reading on him. Frankly, there is much more reason to lynch either Today or Cello based on these sentiments.
"I'm trying to look helpful"? Yes, I'm making a sincere effort to participate in the game. No, I'm not attempting to "appear" helpful to cast blame elsewhere. I don't understand how you can call me out when 5 other players have their vote on Today for nearly the same reason. The only reason it turned from pressure --> lynch is because she hasn't responded in due time.
Your argument is based on the fact that I'm stupid, unwilling, and unable to think for myself; all of these points are misguided and I would appreciate an opportunity to defend myself without being critsized for "Doing so because of the pressure". Duh I have to respond to the pressure; you can't make that argument.. NOT responding gets you to where Today is currently: L-2.

 

[Mayling]

It's annoying to hear that people don't think I'm posting enough. What do you expect me to do? I have a packed schedule and I try to post as much as I can. =/ Today hasn't posted in FOREVER. I'm trying to post at least once a day. Big difference.

It's not that you're not posting enough. It's what your posts CONTAIN that's the problem.

"Hi my vote is on Today. That is all." =/= not enough.

Btw, hi. nice to see you pop out of your hiding spot when pressure is on you again.

Again, here is the problem. ONLY when I placed pressure on you did you pop out. Yet, you mention in your post that you reread the case on Mentos. Why didn't you let us know that and let us know that you understood the case, and present your own thoughts on him? Especially if you think he's town/

May, wouldn't it be completely obvious for me to share my opinion when votes are placed on me? I don't know how you can critisize me for this. I've shared my opinion many times in this game with no votes and I did so WITH votes, so that's not a valid argument in the least.

Why can't you share your opinions when votes aren't on you?

There's a big difference in your posts when there are and aren't votes/pressure on you.

God ****, you assume that I have absolutely no brain for myself. That's annoyingly condescending. I have my own suspicions of Cello, I'm not just "following the spotlight" like you claim. This is your argument:
"Oh, it's easy to see why he thinks Cello is scum, so basically it doesn't really count as an addition to the game."

Uhm. Well, you DID ask cello/me to tell you the case on Mentos after saying you didn't read. If you have a brain for yourself, can't you read for yourself?

And no, that ISN'T my argument. My argument is "It's funny you chose to target Cello, when he's such an easy target. But mention nothing of Mentos, claiming to not have read."

Yeah, last time I checked, you didn't decide the end all be all lynch for the day; its a group effort, and it should be a group effort to share our thoughts with each other and be straightforward.

I'm not exactly sure where you're going with this? What did I say that implied this?

Btw, if it's such a group effort to share our thoughts with each other and be straightforward... why didn't you update us on the Mentos situation? You're only now saying you read it, when there's pressure on you.

I've re-read the case on Mentos. People originally jumped on him because he somehow "knew" there were 3 werewolves (when, in fact, it's stated in the role post). Cello even gets angry @ mentos for ....seeing the obvious. There isn't enough information on mentos at this point, and I myself am getting a town reading on him. Frankly, there is much more reason to lynch either Today or Cello based on these sentiments.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts to the group.. now that there is pressure on you.

"I'm trying to look helpful"? Yes, I'm making a sincere effort to participate in the game. No, I'm not attempting to "appear" helpful to cast blame elsewhere. I don't understand how you can call me out when 5 other players have their vote on Today for nearly the same reason. The only reason it turned from pressure --> lynch is because she hasn't responded in due time.

Your argument is based on the fact that I'm stupid, unwilling, and unable to think for myself; all of these points are misguided and I would appreciate an opportunity to defend myself without being critsized for "Doing so because of the pressure". Duh I have to respond to the pressure; you can't make that argument.. NOT responding gets you to where Today is currently: L-2.

I don't think you're stupid. >.>

I just think it's weird you appear out of no where only when there is pressure on you.

Which is contradictory to your belief that the group should share their thoughts with each other for communication.

This is twice now. It was a pretty immediate response to pressure. Like you're scared of the littlest pressure on you.

There is just a big contradiction between what you're saying and what you're doing.

 

[Pierre the Scarecrow]

Votecount:
Today (5) NoDAWG, Meta-Kirby, Kirbyoshi, Macman, Cello_Marl
Meta-Kirby (2) KevinM, Mayling
Cello_Marl (2) McFox, Xonar
Xonar (1) Cacti

Not voting (3) mentosman8, Omis, Today

A majority 7 of 13 votes is required to lynch.
The day will end at the latest on Thursday, February 19th, Noon EST.

Chaco has been added to the replacements list.
Cacti has received 1/3 activity prods. If he doesn't respond in 48 hours he will be replaced.
Today has requested replacement, and I have contacted Bunglefever.

@Cello: Lynch majority means majority of players still alive. For example, if someone had been elected Sheriff, the total votes in play would have been 14/13, and if a Village Idiot is revealed, the total votes in play would be 12/13.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

So saying he should go toDay if Today doesn't is accepting his excuse of not reading?

That's a weird push for suspicion. I don't see at all how you thought I was accepting of the excuse when I said he should die. (not to mention, I'd already said that he should reread to see the case and not rely on others)

Why aren't you yourself getting onto Mk for his lack of reading/contribution? But instead you target me for something I feel is false. Not to mention you dismiss yourself with "Ah wells."

Could still be based on other things, or just distancing.

I'm not getting onto MK for his lack of reading/contribution because there are more lurkers/coasters atm, and I agree with NoDawg that we should get them active first. I'm pretty certain of it now.

Unvote, Vote: Today

L-1

 

[Mayling]

Could still be based on other things, or just distancing.

I'm not getting onto MK for his lack of reading/contribution because there are more lurkers/coasters atm, and I agree with NoDawg that we should get them active first. I'm pretty certain of it now.

Unvote, Vote: Today

L-1

Wait. You only join Today's lynch when:

1) you are not the hammer?
2) put her at l-1 without even allowing the replacement to speak? which is funny because you say "we should get them active first."

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

I do not join her lynch.

1. I do not want to be the hammer because it's for pressure.
2. Replacement better be makin' a gewd post.

Who cares if it's L-1? I did not even lynch her and anyone who will is just scum, lol. I don't see the problem with my vote.
I don't see what you're trying to get at here.

 

[McFox]

Unvote

Vote: Meta-Kirb

 

[Today]

Eh-- wow..
Too many posts that went by. But sadly, I won't be able to reread them all. I just now been able to check this thread and the other Mafia thread I'm in. I haven't been able to checked the Mafia boards because something came up with my father and I.. that is really messy and may result in me not having a home. >__<; So I'm sorry for the lack of post. I was planning on requesting a replacement for this game since I haven't been here at all. So if you can get a replacement, great! I'm so sorry, everyone~! I hope everything works out well and I hope everyone enjoy the game!!

 

[Mayling]

I do not join her lynch.

1. I do not want to be the hammer because it's for pressure.
2. Replacement better be makin' a gewd post.

Who cares if it's L-1? I did not even lynch her and anyone who will is just scum, lol. I don't see the problem with my vote.
I don't see what you're trying to get at here.

I don't see the difference in L-1 or L-2, she wasn't answering to either.

By being on her wagon, you're part of her lynch, and only joined when you weren't the hammer, that vote that typically will get analyzed the most.

It's just weird to me you are only subscribing to her lynch because you claim it's for pressure... but she wasn't responding to any pressure.

and why is anyone trying to lynch (which I guess you mean hammer) Today scum? What's the point of pressure votes when you say anyone who hammers is scum? If Today were still in this game, she pretty much doesn't need to have to worry anyone, because anymore who hammers her is going to be seen as scummy.

it's like you're saying the only person responsible for a lynch is the hammer. that's not the case at all

Could still be based on other things, or just distancing.

Also, what other things could it be based on?

distancing implies that MK and I are scum partners. by that, you must mean that MK is scum and I'm trying to distance myself from him by proposing his lynch. so, if you think it's possible distancing, why are you only outing me and not MK?

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Also, what other things could it be based on?

distancing implies that MK and I are scum partners. by that, you must mean that MK is scum and I'm trying to distance myself from him by proposing his lynch. so, if you think it's possible distancing, why are you only outing me and not MK?

I don't know your reasons and I'm honestly not interested in them.
second part: distancing does yeah, but I'd rather ask you stuff as YOU are the one distancing. It's still a 'COULD', you do know that, right? besides, i dislike your posts more then MKs

I don't see the difference in L-1 or L-2, she wasn't answering to either.

rest of post:

I don't see the difference in L-1 or L-2, she wasn't answering to either.

This just makes no sense lol. You're implying she was at L-1 before?

By being on her wagon, you're part of her lynch, and only joined when you weren't the hammer, that vote that typically will get analyzed the most.

I'm part of the pressure for the lynch, yes that's true.
The second part about the hammering thing is just plain ********.

It's just weird to me you are only subscribing to her lynch because you claim it's for pressure... but she wasn't responding to any pressure.

At which point you apply MORE PRESSURE

and why is anyone trying to lynch (which I guess you mean hammer) Today scum? What's the point of pressure votes when you say anyone who hammers is scum? If Today were still in this game, she pretty much doesn't need to have to worry anyone, because anymore who hammers her is going to be seen as scummy.

Like always, plain ********.
Of course I meant 'at the moment', if I'm not mistaken we still have plenty of time before the deadline, so anyone lynching her before that is pretty scummy, especially because she is in the process of being replaced.
Besides, being at L-1 is definitely at least double the pressure of L-2. The power is now given to 1 player to finish it.

it's like you're saying the only person responsible for a lynch is the hammer. that's not the case at all

It is the case if there's plenty of time left before the deadline.

 

[Mayling]

I don't know your reasons and I'm honestly not interested in them.
second part: distancing does yeah, but I'd rather ask you stuff as YOU are the one distancing. It's still a 'COULD', you do know that, right? besides, i dislike your posts more then MKs

Why wouldn't you be interested in them, especially if you feel they make me scummy? So you're saying "There could be reasons why you're doing what you're doing, but I'm not interested in them or going to explain them ... but they make you scummy."

I can't defend against that. That's not fair, and I don't see how that helps town at all.

This just makes no sense lol. You're implying she was at L-1 before?

She WAS at L-1 before I moved to Metakirby. She didn't respond to the pressure.

And it's not a matter of L-1/L-2 that I'm concerned with. It's when/how you placed your vote on her that made me raise an eyebrow.

Could still be based on other things, or just distancing.

I'm not getting onto MK for his lack of reading/contribution because there are more lurkers/coasters atm, and I agree with NoDawg that we should get them active first. I'm pretty certain of it now.

Unvote, Vote: Today

L-1

I think reading this post got me confused on your actions. When you said "I'm pretty certain of it now." I thought you meant of her scumminess... That's why I was like "but you only joined her lynch when you weren't the hammer."

I guess now you meant you're pretty sure we should get them active first? correct me if I'm wrong

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Why wouldn't you be interested in them, especially if you feel they make me scummy? So you're saying "There could be reasons why you're doing what you're doing, but I'm not interested in them or going to explain them ... but they make you scummy."

I can't defend against that. That's not fair, and I don't see how that helps town at all.

Well the biggest problem is that the root of the meddling about this is about you assuming that you saying he should go is not part of my reasoning of you accepting his excuse. I did consider it, but I just never felt like it had any power to it, especially because you're not drawing the line and making your willingness to lynch him seem to not be about his not reading.

I'm confuzzled about the above thing atm though, took me a while to formulate the above.

She WAS at L-1 before I moved to Metakirby. She didn't respond to the pressure.

And it's not a matter of L-1/L-2 that I'm concerned with. It's when/how you placed your vote on her that made me raise an eyebrow.

My bad
@second part
exactly what makes you raise an eyebrow about when/how I placed my vote?
why would that time and way of placing it be scummy?

I guess now you meant you're pretty sure we should get them active first?

Yes

 

[Mayling]

Well the biggest problem is that the root of the meddling about this is about you assuming that you saying he should go is not part of my reasoning of you accepting his excuse. I did consider it, but I just never felt like it had any power to it, especially because you're not drawing the line and making your willingness to lynch him seem to not be about his not reading.

I'm confuzzled about the above thing atm though, took me a while to formulate the above.

I'm getting confused too. I'm sorta lost in what you're trying to say here... but I was concerned about his reading. And when I said he should go if Today doesn't, it was because he admitted to not reading, which to me is admitting to not trying very hard, and trying to rely on others for what to think about Mentos. Which seems like an easy out for scum. Also, my vote on him right now is because he says he wasn't reading, yet could formulate an opinion cello... who made the case against Mentos.

@second part
exactly what makes you raise an eyebrow about when/how I placed my vote?
why would that time and way of placing it be scummy?

the 2nd part was still going on the fact I thought you thought she was scummy... not that she needed pressure

 

[No one agrees with Gheb]

This is actually a good deal of my argument. For this game, he's gone out of his way to make a big point about stepping up his game. But, as you say, he hasn't.

Emphasis mine.
I never said that. I do think that Mentos has stepped his game up.

Unless you're saying that you think he just simply CAN'T play better, but as people have a fairly good opinion of his older town play, I don't see that. Which one was the point that you thought should be raised?

I was asking you too look at his most recent performances as town in Monster Mafia, L4S and SLJ2. This is the way mentos plays and it's not any different from how he plays now - except that this time he's fairly vocal, productive and thus not a contender for a lynch in my eyes.

We share the other opinion. I've stated my own intent in that regard. But, at the same time, when/if our lurkers decide to join this game, I'd like Mentos to be considered. Although, at this point, I'll be focusing more on MetaKirby, since I think there's actually a chance to lynch him.

And why do you think there's not "actually a chance" to lynch mentos? Could it be because your arguments are not strong enough to convince other players to follow you? If you're convinced that Mentos is scum you should make your points clear, ask other players what they think about it and try to get the one lynched who you think is scum.

More after a reread.

 

[Pierre the Scarecrow]

Votecount:
Bunglefever (5) NoDAWG, Meta-Kirby, Kirbyoshi, Macman, Cello_Marl, Xonar
Meta-Kirby (3) KevinM, Mayling, McFox
Xonar (1) Cacti

Not voting (3) mentosman8, Omis, Bunglefever

A majority 7 of 13 votes is required to lynch.
The day will end at the latest on Thursday, February 19th, Noon EST.

Bunglefever replaces Today.

 

[M.K]

It's not that you're not posting enough. It's what your posts CONTAIN that's the problem.

"Hi my vote is on Today. That is all." =/= not enough.

Wow, that's definitely not what I did in the post that I voted Today in. Stop making me seem like a coaster when I'm not. I clearly gave an explanation in Post 129 when I voted Today. It was a vote to warn her of her inactivity and to get her to say something.

Btw, hi. nice to see you pop out of your hiding spot when pressure is on you again.

Oh hi, how are you doing today Mr. Perfect? Would you like a side of modesty with your arrogant fries? Thought not.

Again, here is the problem. ONLY when I placed pressure on you did you pop out. Yet, you mention in your post that you reread the case on Mentos. Why didn't you let us know that and let us know that you understood the case, and present your own thoughts on him? Especially if you think he's town

I'm sorry that I wasn't there to chime in on the argument split-second after you had posted. I'm a springboard diver and I've been getting ready for States all week (tomorrow is the competition) and this has not been one of my first priorities. I'm just now using my spare time to come back and help.

Why can't you share your opinions when votes aren't on you?

Jesus.
****ing.
Christ.
What did I JUST SAY in the part you quoted here.
"I've shared my opinion with NO Votes on me, and I've shared my opinion WITH Votes on me". You must have missed that, I'm sure you must have, because nobody can be this blind.

There's a big difference in your posts when there are and aren't votes/pressure on you.



Uhm. Well, you DID ask cello/me to tell you the case on Mentos after saying you didn't read. If you have a brain for yourself, can't you read for yourself?

Yes, which I did already. I was hoping to get your opinion, but I see now that can't be easily obtained. >.>

And no, that ISN'T my argument. My argument is "It's funny you chose to target Cello, when he's such an easy target. But mention nothing of Mentos, claiming to not have read."

I acknowledge your argument, but I don't really see anything wrong with that. I find Cello scummy, and I hadn't read mentos yet. The fact that Cello is an easy target is SUBJECTIVE to you. I mean, if you are willing to call me out on a Cello vote, you might as well call everyone out on it. And, what defines an "easy target"? By your standards, I should just be following the crowd, right? Wagons are not my cup of tea, I make sure I have reasons before throwin' my votes around.

I'm not exactly sure where you're going with this? What did I say that implied this?

You imply that my comments are negligible because Cello is such an easy target. It's not for you alone to decide the lynch candidate for the day, and that was simply my input. The fact that you dismiss my comments is irritating, because each should have equal worth in a discussion.

Btw, if it's such a group effort to share our thoughts with each other and be straightforward... why didn't you update us on the Mentos situation? You're only now saying you read it, when there's pressure on you.

Already talked about this above. This is not because of pressure. I understand that there were comments about my lack of voting, so I decided to make up for it now, in my spare time. Please understand that my posts were not because of the pressure. They were simply inconveniently placed because of my schedule D:. Sorry.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts to the group.. now that there is pressure on you.

K, thanks for making the same point like fourteen times in one argument.

I don't think you're stupid. >.>

And I don't think you're stupid either. I know that we both have the potential to eliminate scum, and I feel that we're wasting time with a town v town argument here D:

I just think it's weird you appear out of no where only when there is pressure on you.

Which is contradictory to your belief that the group should share their thoughts with each other for communication.

Yeah, I know it's contradictory, and I guess you're right about that part. D: I'm sorry I couldn't chime in earlier; I swear, I would have ! D:

This is twice now. It was a pretty immediate response to pressure. Like you're scared of the littlest pressure on you.

Excuse my hastiness.
This is only my 2nd ever Mafia game. Am I not supposed to respond to everything directed towards me? :O Maybe it's just accustomed for me to respond to all posts that have something directed towards me. I'm not scared of the smallest pressure; I'm just simply trying to clear things up quickly so that we can try and really look into posts to find scum.

There is just a big contradiction between what you're saying and what you're doing.

I know my actions don't really reflect my words as of now, but after tomorrow, I'll have ALOT more free time on my hands to equalize the balance between what I say and what I do.

 

[Cacti]

I don't really think that Cello's supposed rolefishing is scummy, or how he is playing in general. I could see someone coming from the point he is coming from. However, he also admits to posting filler to make his posts look bigger/postcount go up. Not sure about that.

So far, I don't think that there's been a real case on anyone. I don't really get why people are voting/have voted Meta-Kirby.

 

[Cacti]

Also, I don't like how Mayling is scumhunting. It feels like he's just picking people and trying to twist actions to make them look bad, how scum usually plays to get people lynched.

 

[Mayling]

omg it's anudda me

Wow, that's definitely not what I did in the post that I voted Today in. Stop making me seem like a coaster when I'm not. I clearly gave an explanation in Post 129 when I voted Today. It was a vote to warn her of her inactivity and to get her to say something.

Sorry, I was referring to the post where you corrected Pierre. Not your original post.

Yes, which I did already. I was hoping to get your opinion, but I see now that can't be easily obtained. >.>

I thought you asked for my opinion because you hadn't read... not because you wanted my opinion.

I acknowledge your argument, but I don't really see anything wrong with that. I find Cello scummy, and I hadn't read mentos yet. The fact that Cello is an easy target is SUBJECTIVE to you. I mean, if you are willing to call me out on a Cello vote, you might as well call everyone out on it. And, what defines an "easy target"? By your standards, I should just be following the crowd, right? Wagons are not my cup of tea, I make sure I have reasons before throwin' my votes around.

Cello is making himself a provocative lynch target.

I don't expect you to follow the crowd. If I were, wouldn't I have been fine with you targeting Cello, since some heat was coming onto him? My problem was that you apparently had enough to make a judgement call on Cello, but you didn't read about Mentos' case. BUT the person who made the case was on Cello. And you claim to miss the case ENTIRELY. If you hadn't read all the pages, why did you feel you were qualified to make a statement on Cello but not Mentos?

Also, what you said here... you said you "hadn't read mentos yet." Yet, ABOVE that, you say you were asking my opinion.

Which one was it? Did you not read, or did you want my opinion?

You imply that my comments are negligible because Cello is such an easy target. It's not for you alone to decide the lynch candidate for the day, and that was simply my input. The fact that you dismiss my comments is irritating, because each should have equal worth in a discussion.

I'm not trying to dismiss your comments, and sorry if I said something that made it seem like I was. I don't expect to lead the lynch today, or any day. In fact, I'm sorta annoyed by the fact that we have a lot of coasters right now, and want people to speak up (we have ex-Today, Cacti, Kevinm [who might still be v/la, but I dunno], and Mentos, and maybe more depending on your definiteion of coaster).

Already talked about this above. This is not because of pressure. I understand that there were comments about my lack of voting, so I decided to make up for it now, in my spare time. Please understand that my posts were not because of the pressure. They were simply inconveniently placed because of my schedule D:. Sorry.

ok, i'll try to be less tyranty about that then. it just seemed odd at the time

I know my actions don't really reflect my words as of now, but after tomorrow, I'll have ALOT more free time on my hands to equalize the balance between what I say and what I do.

Ok, but I'mma hold you to it.

Also, I don't like how Mayling is scumhunting. It feels like he's just picking people and trying to twist actions to make them look bad, how scum usually plays to get people lynched.

This is so ironic coming from you.

So, I should just lurk like everyone else? At least I'm trying to scumhunt. The only other person to even remotely point a finger and try to make a really good solid case was Cello.

Btw, I'm a girl and would appreciate be referred to as such. ^_^

 

[mentosman8]

Vote Xonar

That vote on Today was extremely scummy. Putting someone at L-1 who has just requested replacement, the main reason for voting was severe lack of activity, before the replacing person is even confirmed none-the-less had the chance to speak up makes me wonder if you were hoping someone would go through with a lynch before the replacement was finalized. Had the posts been closer I would have considered a ninja, but it's blatantly clear that you would have seen Pierre's post before making your own. That alone is probably not enough to actually push a whole lynch, but coupled with your play so far has garnered a vote.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Haha, hoping someone would go through with a lynch before the replacement was finalized...

do you even read what you post before you post it?

 

[mentosman8]

Xonar, obviously it's not highly likely for that to happen, but there is no benefit whatsoever from a townie perspective. Can you honestly give me a single reason why it would help town to place that vote. You clearly knew that a replacement was being put in, what's the point of putting more pressure on someone while waiting for a replacement to confirm/catch up. Town benefit from that vote=0. Scum potential benefit from that move=plentiful.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

town benefit = more pressure = hopefully a better post/a slip up if hes scum

scum benefit = you tell me, mr mentos.

 

[Cacti]

Also, keeping my vote on Xonar because of the L-1 for "pressure", as people have pointed out. It looked like a way for scum to sneak a vote in.

 

[Omis]

While Xonar did act stupid for voting Tobungle (I mean really? He wasnt responding and he had just been replaced. What made you then want to put your vote on when it could have been much more "productive" to do it earlier. I really dont like in general how the entire wagon was his inactivity. I guess Im just forgiving.) it doesnt really deserve that many votes. It doesnt help anyone so it just places him in the categories of lurkers and coasters.

 

[Kirbyoshi]

Unvote Bungle
Vote: Cello_Marl

Not liking the rolefishing AT ALL, nor the fluff-posting.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Alright, what is the problem with Cello's rolephishing? Like I don't understand why everyone's got their panties in a bundle for about it. He's rolephishing for a specific role that might not be in the game and in a way that would make the role stronger.

I'm having trouble getting any scum reads other than today, and I don't like that one because everyone seems to have that read.

 

[Kirbyoshi]

Mac, just because everyone has a certain read, does that mean that read is wrong?

 

[Kirbyoshi]

And imo, every kind of rolefishing is bad. Why would we want to out any PRs toDay?

 

[McFox]

How can anyone possibly have a scum read on Today? She only posted twice before requesting replacement. I understood everyone wanting to lynch her because she wasn't playing, but did people actually honestly think she was scum for any other reason than coasting? Because I never saw that.

Also disagree that figuring out who the VI is on D1 would somehow "make the role stronger".

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Mac, just because everyone has a certain read, does that mean that read is wrong?

It makes me more uncomfortable with that read because if everyone is suspect of someone. That would mean that some scum is also suspect of them.

And imo, every kind of rolefishing is bad. Why would we want to out any PRs toDay?

I don't think it's that black and white. Cello clearly presented a plan that would out a role in a way that would allow the role to have more power attributed to it. Also, usually rolephishing happens in a more underhanded way, Cello would have to have quite the guts if he was scum and was rolephishing so blatantly.

How can anyone possibly have a scum read on Today? She only posted twice before requesting replacement. I understood everyone wanting to lynch her because she wasn't playing, but did people actually honestly think she was scum for any other reason than coasting? Because I never saw that.

Also disagree that figuring out who the VI is on D1 would somehow "make the role stronger".

Today's one post was scummy as ****.

Also, I'm not arguing your last post is wrong or anything. My point was that Cello was presenting a plan that he believed to strengthen the roles power. So I don't seen anything inherently scummy with his actions.

Just like anything in this game, rolephishing is clearly not a black-and-white tell. Clearly you have to look at the circumstances behind something before you can judge whether it is scummy or not. And I think a wagon starting up on Cello for this reason is stupid.

Cello, you better be town.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

Still waiting for Mentos to tell me scum's benefit from the vote.

It doesnt help anyone so it just places him in the categories of lurkers and coasters.

elaborate.

Just for checking, exactly how does it make the role stronger? I thought the only effect was increasing wolf lynch chance because of a mod confirmed townie

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Didn't quite understand that as well Xonar, I don't see how a vote to put me at L-1 right as I was about to be lynched would make him a coaster/lurker.


I see Mento's vote on Xonar really really odd, it's a really weak reason to vote someone on a chance that 'mafia MIGHT be ablet o quikc lynch' before I even get here. He even admits to this being a low possibility, yet he remains adament. It doesn't seem something like town mentos would push for.

vote Mentos for now.

 

[KevinM]

Meta-Kirby got scum on hisa shoes looking like a don over derr, hit em up hit em up.

 

[Pierre the Scarecrow]

Votecount:
Bunglefever (5) NoDAWG, Meta-Kirby, Macman, Cello_Marl, Xonar
Meta-Kirby (3) KevinM, Mayling, McFox
Xonar (2) Cacti, mentosman8
Cello_Marl (1) Kirbyoshi
mentosman8 (1) Bunglefever

Not voting (1) Omis

A majority 7 of 13 votes is required to lynch.
The day will end at the latest on Thursday, February 19th, Noon EST.

 

[Cello_Marl]

Sorry for disappearing for a while.
I'm apologizing up front; this one is fairly long.
unvote vote Meta-Kirby, he needs to die.

@Pierre - Is the Pied Piper unable to fulfill his win condition if he makes himself dance, since it says excluding? Also, I noticed that wolves specifically have to outnumber all other players, yet town only has to eliminate their enemies. Does that mean if PRs would allow the town a chance to kill the wolves, even at the cost of their lives, we would win? Such as Villager and Witch (with Death Pot) versus a wolf. If they lynch the Villager, would that be a win for scum, or would they kill each other at night for a town win?

Bunglefevah! I'd bet money that he's human. Not necessarily town, but human at least.
In any case, if I were a wolf, I'd kill you night 2. Just saying.

Xonar's vote on Today was risky to me, but that's all it was. And even then, I didn't think it was risky at the time. Mentoooo~s, answer Xonaaaaa~r.

@Omis, Kirbyoshi and Cacti Which posts of mine have just been fluff? Keep in mind I used the plural form. Or is the issue that I said that, compared to actually doing it?

@Kirbyoshi Vote for MetaKirby with us.

For anyone in support of lynching an inactive (and to reiterate, I am in support of that), a question; had I remained inactive for another day and a half, would I have been considered a lynch candidate to you (not at large)? Rhetorical, but please consider it.

Let's consider reversing the fishing ideas ascribed to me earlier.
What would happen if we outed Cupido?

Case for outing Cupido and Lovers
------------------------------------------
1. People are worried that if Cupido/Lovers exist, then they are most likely town. But, if they are revealed now, we can test the authenticity of any Cupido claim by asking Lovers to vote each other. If they can, then we can conclude the Cupido is a liar, OR the Lovers are independents/wolves that don't care about breaking the rules. In any case, that scenario allows us to find at least one lying scum. If they are all human, then we eliminate the possibility that the Fortune Teller or Witch wastes a power use on them. The worst possible case is an honest Cupido that happened to target two wolves. But, based on what's happened so far, I do not think that is the case. Even then, such a scenario becomes apparent before it is beyond salvageable, and that reverses the worrisome subject into a 2-for-1 lynch for town.
2. That being said, the far more interesting interactions occur behind the scenes. What wolf group could resist such a juicy target? If a wolf were named, then the wolves would certainly kill the independent group before the wolf Lover fed information to his human Lover to finish off his peers. The independents cannot afford to deal amicably with the wolves; a single night kill will destroy them both, after all. This deals with a headache for both Town and Wolves that is significantly more dangerous to the Wolves, and so would fall to them to deal with since they are at risk at an earlier state. If the Lovers are both human, then this would both deal with the possibility of a town/Piper pair, as well as provide a meat shield for our Fortune Teller and Witch. If they choose to not kill the human pair, then we can assume they are town. If we haven't won when we find three wolves, then we know exactly who must die (since it's a Piper/town pair).

Case for outing the Village Idiot
-----------------------------------------------
1. Read the text after the third break in #107.
2. We wouldn't have to worry about wasting Fortune Teller, Witch, Hunter, or Little Girl ability uses on him/her. Also, scum have a strange obsession with what they see as confirmed townies and wanting to kill them. Meat shield.
3. If we change the way we conduct the VI search from
[everyone say "I am the Village Idiot"] to
[the Village Idiot says 'I am not the Village Idiot'],
then we can prevent the possibility of a scum claiming VI last or close to it.
As I'm reading it, technically only Macman, McFox, Metakirby and myself have broken the outing clause for VI. Dial M for Murder.
4. We're currently relying on the possibility of a VI's existence as a way to swing power back in our favor later on. However, the less people there are, the more likely that scum will "claim" VI, since there would be a lower chance of being caught.

I've changed my mind. I don't want to out VI. But if we do, that's how we should do it.

If everyone thinks that I'm townie (or at least pretends that they think that), then I could play the part of the meat shield. The only problem with that is that it wouldn't prevent an overly paranoid PR from targeting me, but at least it protects them for a turn.

@Meta-Kirby I'll let you know up front; there's almost no chance that I'll change my mind on you being a wolf. Still, a few more points to add onto May's points against you.

First of all, he's trying to fish the hell out of all roles possible. Can't blame him, but then again, it's suspicious and I don't like it.

How is rolefishing suspicious, yet you can't blame me for it?

In #164 you claim to have reread the case against Mentos, but then don't even get the right reason for my attacking him. Why was this?

@Omis I no longer know what you are. But it's simple enough to find out. Sorry, Bungle.

@Kevin I know what you are. I think. And I understand. It'll work out.

If Ghebcus says "merely", I think it's Gheb.

@Ghebcus At the end of your #116, why did you reference my #112? It was apparent that I was speaking to Macman about VI claiming. You just brought up the Witch again, trying to imprint the idea that he/she could confirm the innocence of the Night Kill target, when that is not the case.

In the best case the VI claims in a lylo situation, where a confirmed unlynchable townie can tip the game greatly into town's favour. At the moment it seems pretty worthless for the VI to claim.

This was talked about, but you didn't say anything. Care to explain your thoughts on this? Specifically, how a lylo VI claim is good.

 

[#HBC | ZoZo]

For anyone in support of lynching an inactive (and to reiterate, I am in support of that), a question; had I remained inactive for another day and a half, would I have been considered a lynch candidate to you (not at large)? Rhetorical, but please consider it.

Not so much compared to the rest, but it depends on how people react to your posts, AND if the other inactives are starting to post. Can't say these things for sure.