Walgreens Mafia - DRAW game - The mod ****ed up pretty bad...=/

[Kantrip]

JM don't base your read on my role, it should be null. It is not a town role. Give me your read taking my play into account please.

 

[Asdioh]

Twilight is not an option.

rereading now, but I saw this and I wanted to make sure all the fangirls get this through their heads.

 

[Jim Morrison]

So is anyone against me using this on Sokr if he fails to comply with people's requests for him?

Yes just use it toNight, depending on who is lynched, Rajam or Sokr.

In short: I dislike your play Kantrip but you give a townie feel off (you feel a bit like in moderator mafia)

 

[T-block]

to be clear, you're using it at Night, right?

i'm okay with that

 

[Rajam]

Ughhhh okay this is getting too distracting.

I'm not miller.

I do have a reason for claiming it, but I didn't expect there to be an actual miller in this game.

ITT: T-block tries to do too much and everything falls on his head

I really apologize for botching this game up so bad T.T

Wait, where did you get the flavor from then?

rajam needs to answer this. still think he can die



sticking with my newbscum sokr read, although i've never played with him before. someone should verify july's meta on him. potentially of note is how he avoided the rajam push altogether, only giving a weak mention of him in 247.

don't give july a town pass too quickly. she is more than capable of playing like this as scum. haven't seen anything suggesting either alignment for her.

still don't believe kantrip's role, but that's not important. his reasoning for jumping on my wagon was terrible (calling the crumbing scummy, trying to incriminate me for playing being focused on defending myself, etc). coming from kantrip i'm not sure whether it's scummy or just dumb play though. i do think he is caught up and excited to be able to push me, given our history (he'll deny it of course), which would probably tend to push his actions towards what he was doing, even as town. if you get a guilty later, absolutely push kantrip to use his ability - i would not feel comfortable with him in late game.

rr town for miller cc.

mentos, aa, guus leaning townie. aa > guus > mentos for order. need to see more from all of them though. more action from guus.

asdioh is fine. as i said, some of his reasoning looks a little wack (even his reasoning for town read on me looks silly at times), but i've seen it before from him, so null on that. other than that, nothing alarming from him.

gorf's initial reasoning for suspecting me was absolutely terrible, but he's been good lately, okay with gorf as well.

i've gotten a somewhat opportunistic feel from gheb but that might just be because of time zones and the times he posts. null on him.

ok, I saw Gheb's plan, and before saying anything I want to address some stuff:

First, I'm getting very sold on Sokr as newbscum, and I think he's scummier than everything T-block has done

unvote
vote: Sokr

Then, I think Kantrip's suspicion on T-block is legit. I feel/felt the breadcrumb could be used as a scapegoat, and it bothers me that you left a crumb for your proposal in killing me but you didn't leave a crumb for your miller gambit, considering you said you leave crumbs in these kind of cases. Also, I don't know why people are reluctant to believe Kantrip's claim, when it is quite easy to push at times like if we have a cop guilty. I consider Kantrip a strong town read

Kantrip, ask Rockin what happens if you hammer and use your ability at the same time

I'm aware Gheb did a case on Sokr ¿? I'll talk about Gheb's plan once I see the case. I want to evaluate if it could indicate a strong disconnection between Gheb and Sokr.

Also, I strongly think between T-block and Sokr there is scum, but I also strongly consider that T-block and Sokr aren't both scum

 

[Rajam]

ah nvm I'll say this now:

I'm fine with Gheb's plan. I'm quite sure Sokr will flip scum, but regardless of whatever Sokr flips I know people will be on me later, either for distancing or because I'm scummy -_-. I don't care about dying, I'm a vanilla and with Sokr-almost-sure scum flip + my death will occur several things:

1. We already should know by now that RR is like 99% town
2. Sokr mafia => T-block not mafia. I'm pretty sure they're not both mafia and people will find out anyways on a re-read, since T-block was the first in bringing Sokr being newbscum from nowhere, so it was a legit initiative by T-block
3. If Gheb's case is good enough, then Sokr mafia => Gheb not mafia. I have a town read on Gheb anyways
4. Now, the very reason on which I'm ok with dying, besides of getting rid of a scummy slot, is because with my flip
   both Asdioh and mentos should be cleared as town
   . This is important and I'm emphasizing this because I want to be listened from the tomb; my main goal is to clear those two players, and I don't want people later forgetting this and saying "I think Asdioh/mentos is scum"
   

So, with Sokr scum and Kantrip+me dead, clear players should be RR, Gheb, T-block, Asdioh, mentos, leaving remaining scum between Jim Morrison / asianaussie / Gorf (in that order), then one step below July. This is a cool tradeoff and I'm ok if me+Sokr+Kantrip have to die to clear so many players and reducing the lynch pool significantly.

If people are not convinced that both Asdioh and mentos are town in case I flip town (and T-block flips town <=> Sokr flips scum), they should re-read, from my perspective, the moment when Kantrip claimed and T-block pushed for my death. Asdioh asked if the ability could be used at night, hence asking for a wiser use of the ability and stopping the action, when... he just could've remained silent. mentos basically did the same thing when showing the number analysis

So, remember: Sokr scum =>
1.- T-block town
2.- Jim Morrison scummy just because he has been mad scummy so far
3.- aa scummy for not doing anything, but also because he accused Sokr earlier in a very distancing way (I quoted that earlier)
4.- Gorf and July come next by discard since all the others should be like 95% town at least. I think July is townier though so that's why I put her a step below

 

[Jim Morrison]

So, remember: Sokr scum =>
2.- Jim Morrison scummy just because he has been mad scummy so far

Thanks for disregarding my full out post of me essentially committing to killing my scum partner:mistyface:

 

[T-block]

we are not clearing asdioh and mentos based on that alone. that is stupid. anyone could have given those numbers and such.

 

[Jim Morrison]

Oh my god I'm so sorry, I was taking Rajam seriously in my post above. Sorry everyone.

I am 100% disregarding anything you say now until you know what happened in the last few pages.

 

[Asdioh]

both Asdioh and mentos should be cleared as town

dear god what. why are you 100% clearing not one, but two people, halfway through D1? Neither of us have claimed, and etc. etc.
Actually I haven't read the rest of your post but that obviously caught my eye.

I'm still in the process of rereading, but I seem to be taking it way too slowly and apparently am going to write a massive wall with all my reads... and I'll need to trim that down because I don't want it to be too massive.
Also I'm listening to music and that seems to be distracting me, maybe.

Anyway wut

 

[Rajam]

Pick one? What are you even saying? It would be so incredibly stupid to just "pick one" and close my mind of other possiblities. I have two, maybe three possibilites, right now each is as likely as the rest, so no, I'm not gonna pick one.

As for T-Block's unclaim: did I post that post about me thinking he was setting himself up with a backdoor with the joker crumbs and all that? Anyways, this just looks extremely scummy to me. T-Block, please give a more solid verification of why you did this.

Someone asked about me not really posting my thoughts on Rajam. This is because everyone else already said the relevant stuff and anything I said wouldn't spark conversation or provide insights and would only lead to people saying "oh, he's sheeping!"

T-Block's talk of surviving the NK sounds very survivalistic to me. Indy, huh?

So, what's the problem with sheeping? In fact this shows you're too more concerned on your own survivability than being a clear/outloud voice (regardless if it's by sheeping others or not) when pursuing your scumpicks; you're falling into pretty much the same thing you're calling T-block at the end of your post

 

[Asdioh]

On page 7/12. I've decided to ignore most of the posts of a few specific players to increase the speed of the reread, for reasons I will explain in my post. This is still taking too long though.

 

[Rockin]

Day 1​

Rajam (2) - T-block, Asdioh

T-block (1) - Gorf

July (1) - Kantrip

Sokr (3) - Gheb, Jim Morrison, Rajam

Asdioh - Red Ryu

Not Voting - Mentosman, AsianAussie, Sokr, July

With 12 players, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is in Jan. 28th

 

[Jim Morrison]

T-block, does it matter to you who gets lynched Today, Rajam or Sokr? Would you be down for either of them?

Same to Asdioh and Gorf, when he gets back, would you be willing to lynch Sokr at this point?

 

[Asdioh]

Almost done I think.

Not Voting - Mentosman, AsianAussie, Sokr, July

This coincidentally lines up with some of those that I think are either scummy, or excessively inactive/wishy-wasy. You guys should be voting for someone. If your top scumpick is too close to hammer range, put your vote on your second scumpick.

 

[T-block]

yes it does

rajam lynched over sokr

 

[mentosman8]

Lolz0rz at people calling me out for not having put votes. Anyone who knows my meta knows I really don't throw my vote around all that much XD

Gheb's plan is decent, I'm mostly in agreement that Sokr is good chance of being scum, and as much as I hate the risk of using Kantrip's ability, using it tonight would take out 3 big ?'s and would clear the game up quite a bit imo.

I don't post read-lists. You can judge who I'm willing to lynch by what I say, and no one needs to know who I think is town. So there's that.

Like I said I'd be fine with Gheb's plan, Sokr/Rajam lynch would be fine with me at this point and take the other one out at night. ./continue being man of few words

 

[Asdioh]

Starting from the beginning, instead of writing down what happens page-by-page I'm writing thoughts on specific players as they occur.
I stopped partway through page 11, I haven't had time to read the game since that point in-depth, but I'll get to it over the course of the next couple days.



Red_Ryu
The first thing I need to get out of the way with RR is his immediate miller counterclaim. The flavor makes just about as much sense as T-block's did for miller status. The CC and vote on TB make sense in the context of him being a miller. I have a LOT of trouble seeing scum RR counterclaiming miller like he did. Look at the time of the posts, it was about 3.5 hours between T-block's claim and Red Ruy's claim, at the beginning of the game. I would be willing to bet that RR wasn't lurking the thread during that time, thinking "should I counterclaim?" he probably just read what happened and CC'd. That heavily implies no communication with scummates, and I would imagine scum RR would consult with scummates before doing something like that. The fact that T-block later retracts his claim just reinforces the evidence that RR is miller. Is this good enough reason to just label RR as town and set him aside? I don't know, since I noted that his sudden absence during the time that T-block was getting pressure was scummy, though I don't know why he wasn't there.
...Ok, he has a string of posts on page 10. I don't have much to say on them, except that they're obviously catchup-y, and... I don't like them. They culminate in #405 with a vote on me, with little reasoning aside from pointing out a couple of my least helpful (though still amazingly helpful of course) posts and saying I'm noncommital. Overall impression: if it weren't for the claim that seems EXTREMELY unlikely to come from scum, I wouldn't be liking his slot right now. As it stands, unwilling to lynch him toDay, and obviously don't want a Cop wasted on him as it should turn up guilty. Would like to see more from him, including some justification for his vote on me (I'm being uncomfortably reminded of when he was scum in B&H and kept calling me scum, without ever producing his promised case)

Rajam
Getting a read on him is hard because most of his posts have been "out of date." #345 is his first with some substance, and it makes me shudder. He seems to be more caught up and posting more in the past two pages, but I'll see for myself soon enough. In the meantime, his lynch seems good for town.

Sokr
Comes into the thread leaving little impression. Some bickering with Kantrip, which is a bit distracting. As of page 3/12, the most I see from him that I can remember is that he thinks RR's play is town due to meta reasons of scumRR being unwilling to put himself out there. Nothing really "scummy" from Sokr yet. Dislke his #312, think he's been a presence up until that point without actually doing much. His #344 is silly. His #358 is silly. His posts are getting more "Wut" in my eyes. His #365 is an obvious backstep, whereas townSokr from Britches and Hose wasn't afraid to speak his mind. (admittedly, the townSokr I'm thinking about had already proven himself to be the town vig, but still). Overall impression: leaning scum, would have no qualms about lynching him toDay.

mentosman8
He has few posts, so I have to talk about them in some detail, especially since I can't remember what he's done.

I think your interpretation was bad. Even during the RVS people don't just claim stuff for the sake of claiming it, it looks bad and when you admit it's a lie it's not very likely you're going to live. Whether one of their claims is fake for one reason or another(incidentally, Ruy's is more believable simply because it's never worth a 1/1 swap to mafia unless it wins them the game) is yet to be seen, but the chances of them both being fake are very low. I'm not sure about them not being a scumteam just yet, but the only way your interpretation with them both being fake makes sense is if they are a scumteam.

Judging by this, I think it's safe to assume mentos has a townread on RR at this point (as in right now, since T-block retracted his claim)? The rest of his #159 consists of mostly telling Kantrip some general mafia advice, which is a null at best. The rest of his post is kind of wishy-washy, with some dislike of Kantrip and Rajam at the end. Overall, not leaving a good impression on me.

liking Mentos so far because he's yelling at people for doing dumb things.

Mentos, is your vote anywhere? Do you want to put it anywhere?

God dammit, former me. Yeah it's cool that he's trying to stop the distractions, but that's pretty much a nulltell. At least I called him out on not voting I guess?

In his #199, he warns to be careful of Kantrip's power, which I approve of because it made me think of the implications, should the power be misused. He also gives me his current scumreads of T-block and Rajam. His #207, showing more frustration at the possible misuse of Kantrip's role, makes it look like he hasn't considered the possibility of Kantrip's claim being a gambit. It's up to you guys to interpret that as a scummy or townie mindset. Further wishy-washiness on T-block, dislike. Overall impression: not enough from him to decide if he's overall town or scum. Would not lynch toDay, would be a good target for investigation soon.

Jim Morrison
kinda on page 9 and haven't written anything about him yet... time to say "I like him" without justification! Just look at his avatar!
also this is a blatant towntell:

6. adisoh - Aidohs, "Asidoh" Aodhsi,

T-block
I believed his miller claim at first and had a townread on him from the start, and even after he retracted his claim I believe his intentions were townie, even though it sort of blew up on his face. Claims to be fine with a Rajam lynch in his very first post, and even after Kantrip's claim he says he's fine with that. Seems legit. I don't need to write more on TB, I think he's town, and all arguments on how he could be scum have already been made in thread.

Gheb_01
On page 7 and haven't had much to say about Gheb. He's popped into the thread and given some comments that don't generally seem scummy to me. Like his #343 with his willingness to ignore T-block's obvious 'scumminess.' Agree with his #354 on Sokr.

Gorf
Initial impression before really rereading: he's commenting on stuff passively and friendly. I get a ":3" feeling from his slot this game, yet I can barely remember anything he's done, and if past experience is to be listened to, that's a terrible sign. As of #144, a sheep vote that I don't like. That sheep vote is the hardest stance I've seen from him up to that point. His arguments against T-block later on I disagree with. Farther down page 4, he states he is ok with lynching Rajam.
As of the end of page 6, Gorf still hasn't given much in the way of stances, but he posts this http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13949592&postcount=235 which SCREAMS of not wanting to take any blame upon a Rajam townflip. Overall impression: I'm finishing up this post and realizing that based on this post I'm making, Gorf should be at the top of my scumpicks. It's really weird to say that, if I were to go with gut I would say town, but evidence seems to be contrary. I also remember how I've disagreed with him on stances such as T-block. What is the general consensus of Gorf, anyway? Does he need more pressure (whenever he gets back?)

AsianAussie
Getting few vibes from him so far (page 7/12.) His #253-256 are pretty neutral, just speculating on if Kantrip's role could be real and town. Probably the most useful thing he says in there is "RR needs to speak up." Makes some more posts on page 7, states a townread on Kantrip, presses T-block for some info which is good, also decent interaction with Sokr. Like his #362 and 363. Overall impression: why is my summary on AA so short? ಠ_ಠ

Kantrip
I may have to write a lot on Kantrip, since he posts a lot and those posts are long, but I would prefer not to. The first thing to note is his claim, which comes off as townie at first, but could easily be faked or later passed off as a gambit. The problem is that if he proves it, he's dead. So in the meantime, I'll try to get a read on him. Actually JK, I'll do that later. It seems he's going to EXPLOD himself soon so we'll see, I don't want to waste too much time on this.

July
Same with Kantrip, except I think I'm capable of reading Kantrip more accurately, whereas I'll always be suspicious of July. Someone else can get reads on her, my reread will be way too slow if I try. As always, I would recommend an investigative on her, but others may direct it where they think it will do more good.






TL;DR version: read the whole post

 

[Asdioh]

freaking >3 hours I'm out of here for the night

 

[July]

So, July, who do you propose we lynch? Who do you think Kantrip should bomb, if you are of the opinion that bombing toNight is a good strategy?

No need to rush things, we have more than a week left.

Kantrip, you *can* use the power at night, right? PM Rockin and get back to me on this if you aren't sure.



Could you post logs from the QT where people agreed with your insight?

I wasn't online the past couple days but at the time I was looking at Rajam and Jim Morrison. I obviously noticed that both have posted a great deal more since I last posted, and I'm still reading through all of that. I didn't like Rajam's insights so far, even acknowledging that he's still catching up I'm not understanding his thought processes as he's reading or how he's come to the suspicions he has. I'll address that more as I read through and comment. Jim Morrison I didn't like after I saw how easily he was "convinced" by Gheb's case on Sokr and I suspected that it was not genuine and instead opportunistic. However, I saw that he has posted an extensive case on Sokr, which I will address for its own merits but I feel a lot better that he actually justified his place on Sokr's wagon.

So right now I would prefer Rajam over a Sokr lynch and I would like to see the current case on Sokr. The things that Gheb previously pointed out were valid, but did not convince me he was newb scum any more than that he was the same newb town I saw in Britches and Hose.

I am opposed to the idea of Kantrip bombing anyone toNight, it would be nice to at least try and get decisively incriminating information on someone before blowing them up.

 

[July]

July, may I hold hands with you this game?

There is no one I am willing to hold hands with this game, especially not with all the confusion around the miller issue/claims in general. However, I am very much relieved that you are actually here and didn't disappear when asked for content like you did in Britches and Hose.

Unvote
Vote: Asdioh

Yeah that is where I stand atm.

I think I get what T-Block was doing, I think, better not be housepets again so my question from before still stands.

Can you explain your vote on Asdioh more? What do you think of Rajam's case and then anti-FoS thing on Asdioh and mentosman?

Also, you address T-Block here a bit but where exactly do you stand on your read of him?

 

[July]

i came off with a good impression of aa when he was asking questions in the posts around the evening of the 17th. i saw independent thought, and felt he was really trying to figure things out for himself.

jim was over mentos mostly because of activity. there's no reason to give mentos town points for his numbers analysis - it's trivial for anyone, even scum, to churn that out and post it. looking back, mentos should really be null instead of leaning town. jim's been a bit sheepish, but nothing alarming. admittedly, past history suggests i'm terrible at reading him, but i'm fine with leaving him leaning town for now.

counter question: do you agree with my ordering of these three? i get the impression that you think it's odd that i think aa is the towniest? if so, who of the three do you think is towniest, and why?

At the time that I asked the question, no I didn't agree with that order. I didn't think that aa had really gotten involved in the game at that point, although reading back through his posts on the 17th I think that there were some good questions. Still, at the time I probably would have placed him after Jim Morrison and before mentos, mentos being last for the same reasons you stated of inactivity, and Jim Morrison being first because I thought he took a strong stance on the miller issue and was pressing for it to stay relevant and to settle it, which was good because its not something we would want to keep worrying about and speculating about continuing into toMorrow.
SO at that time it would have been Jim Morrison>aa>mentos.

At the time you answered the question, aa would have been the most townie for his recent posts where he's been asking a lot of questions and I actually liked that he didn't vote for Sokr at the time he voiced his suspicions because now he's taken time to ask Sokr questions and not just sheep Gheb's reasons. On the other hand, at that time Jim Morrison moved down to least townie for me because like I said earlier, I didn't like his being so easily "convinced" by Gheb to vote Sokr. mentos was in the middle then, but with aa leaning town, mentos null, and Jim Morrison leaning scum.

NOW...it is back to Jim Morrison>aa>mentos. Jim Morrison for his case on Sokr which explains his vote and takes away my concerns he was sheeping Gheb, aa staying the same at a town lean, and mentos still not swinging either way because he's provided reads, but not much reasoning.

 

[July]

nobody thinks this post is suspicious? i thought it was as legit slip at first, and i'm still wary of his explanation. is everyone okay with his explanation then? (given in 345 fyi).



anyways, i think rajam's catchup is faked:



this question placed in a catchup does not sit well with me at all. looks like he's asking it to be seen asking it (he later gives town reads to asdioh and mentos for doing a similar thing, which is silly in itself, but that's another story).







first post shows he voted without any indication of having checked whether his vote would hammer. if he's already checked, he's read ahead, and then questions like asking whether kantrip's claim ends the Day are definitely faked. if he hasn't checked, then either he didn't think to check or he has someone telling him.

that he has someone telling him is a bit of a reach. second post, however, shows that he IS actively thinking about whether placing a vote would hammer, meaning the possibility that he hasn't checked is unlikely. i think we can conclude from this that he is at least skimming to the end of the thread during his catchup. that brings me, then, to the question: what is his motivation for asking whether kantrip's ability would end that Day, when it's very likely he already knew?

I think that your first point there is the strongest; why would a townie be worried about someone gaining town points by quickly "disconnecting" with them? The only way to gain town points by disconnecting with someone is if the person you are disconnecting with, in this case Rajam himself, is scum.

As for the point about faking his catch-up posts, I think its hard to use that conclusively. It's hard to tell if someone is reading and writing the catch-up post as they go, or have a vague idea of what has happened and what they want to address as they catch-up, or whether they've read, caught-up, and then go through and ask questions/post. As someone who catches up a lot and does all three styles at different times, I take that as null tell.

 

[July]

Also, @T-Block: I can accept that if you are town, you wouldn't have let RR come under too much pressure to preserve your claim. I posted that because the entire situation is still lingering in my head and once again, I'm just trying to understand your intentions.

 

[T-block]

jim, have you played with rajam before? whether you have or haven't, tell me what you know about him.

i'd also like to know your reasoning for asking this question:

T-block, does it matter to you who gets lynched Today, Rajam or Sokr? Would you be down for either of them?

Same to Asdioh and Gorf, when he gets back, would you be willing to lynch Sokr at this point?

 

[T-block]

I am opposed to the idea of Kantrip bombing anyone toNight, it would be nice to at least try and get decisively incriminating information on someone before blowing them up.

do you fully believe kantrip's claim then

 

[T-block]

I think that your first point there is the strongest; why would a townie be worried about someone gaining town points by quickly "disconnecting" with them? The only way to gain town points by disconnecting with someone is if the person you are disconnecting with, in this case Rajam himself, is scum.

As for the point about faking his catch-up posts, I think its hard to use that conclusively. It's hard to tell if someone is reading and writing the catch-up post as they go, or have a vague idea of what has happened and what they want to address as they catch-up, or whether they've read, caught-up, and then go through and ask questions/post. As someone who catches up a lot and does all three styles at different times, I take that as null tell.

i'd like your opinion on two things then:

a) his awareness of the most recent happenings (gheb's plan, my post calling his catchup fake, for example); doesn't it suggest that his understanding of events in the rest of the game would be enough to know that kantrip had already clarified that it ends the Day if town, especially considering how that detail was central to the pressure on me?

b) his 422, where he says he didn't care if his vote on me, supposedly placed without knowledge of the most recent 200 posts, ended up hammering me. do you believe he didn't care? is the statement more likely to be a legitimate explanation of his vote, or is it more likely to be an attempt to keep up his facade of not having read the thread?

(yes, the questions are terribly leading. i'm trying to make a point)

 

[July]

I apologize for the incoming wall, I just SOKR will finally start paying attention to people suspicious of him.

First, back to Gheb's #354, which I agreed with. I didn't think Sokr was all too terrible yet, but what harm can voting him do? It's just pressure. But T-block would be kind enough to call me out on sheeping, guess I'd add some of my own thoughts:

​

First thing that comes into mind when I think of Sokr: "Does this guy even have any reads or targets?". Let's take a second and look back at the vote counts. Sokr has made ZERO votes. Well, his only vote was an OMGUS on Kantrip, and then immedeately unvotes. He hasn't ever felt the need to put pressure on someone (voting him). I thought pressuring someone to get reads was the whole part of scumhunting? Guess you don't hunt scum anyway.

​

Then his stances: Sokr does NOT have stances. Even his first post when the Day started, ugh. "It's way too early to have an opinion". You have an opinion on no-lynch, on claims, etc. the moment you sign up for the game. You always have an opinion.

Next post (#48): He thinks Red Ryu's reasoning of the way T-block claimed was good. Did you honestly think RR had a legit point? No need to answer, because I know this was just opportunistic, judging from your #135.

One of the most striking things was the interactiong between sokr and Kantrip on #106 and #107.



These posts were one minute in a row, Sokr did not magically disappear in a minute.
Kantrip asks Sokr to finally take a stance with a simple yes and no, but as soon as Sokr gets confronted, he chooses to hit the road and not answer the question immedeately. Okay, no problem, he might answer this later when he comes back? No, this question was flat out ignored, never took a stance on Kantrip.

Oh god finally Sokr will take stances!!


Man, two stances. Gheb is looking off and July is town! His Kantrip read is balls. I'm going to assume it was his highest scum read. He never followed up by asking Kantrip questions, placing his vote on him, even acknowledging him. Also, he's grasping at straws on the terrorist, even calling it an Indy role. The whole point of Indy is to survive, duh.


Agreeing hard with Kantrip here. Later, Sokr says each possibility is as likely as the other. Which is stupid because you can't be null on it, always leaning one side.

#360, Kantrip asks him flat out wether he think he is scum or not. No response, would be too much of a hard stance anyway.

Last post was already adressed, seems a lot like backpedalling.

​

Remember how Gheb made good points against him? How I agreed with them? And how Sokr hasn't even acknowledged someone being suspicious of him and having 2 votes on him? I do.
Don't be silly, Sokr has obviously read it, but defending himself would put him in the spotlight and up for more questions. I honestly believe he just tried to ride it out, cast suspicion on someone else and be safe himself.

I could go on about his activity and how he's been active on smashboards but not responding to certain questions asked by Kantrip, but I don't think it's a legitimate point, just something that adds to it for me, personally.

And this is why I think my vote on Sokr is justified, and so is Gheb's!

Damn, kk...this post is pretty legit.

I don't blame T-Block for calling you on sheeping; I had an issue with your vote because you made it seem as if Gheb had convinced you to vote him with his case which I didn't think was enough to convince someone who you didn't show suspicions of before to get on his wagon.

The bolded parts I really liked because 1) I didn't realize he hasn't voted at all, and 2) That is the exact same issue he had in Britches and Hose and I distinctly remember challenging him on that and hoping he become more active and actually pressure people and vote people more.

There are a lot of points there based on actual post numbers that I would also like to look up and check out but at a time that is not 3 am, so I will do that tomorrow or Monday, but based on this post in general I assume they will be legit points.

Now I would really like to see Sokr's reaction to Gheb's case and this one, because there are things here that are definitely important.

 

[July]

do you fully believe kantrip's claim then

I don't fully believe it, but I am willing to give it credence and give my opinion on how his role should be used if it is legit.

i'd like your opinion on two things then:

a) his awareness of the most recent happenings (gheb's plan, my post calling his catchup fake, for example); doesn't it suggest that his understanding of events in the rest of the game would be enough to know that kantrip had already clarified that it ends the Day if town, especially considering how that detail was central to the pressure on me?

b) his 422, where he says he didn't care if his vote on me, supposedly placed without knowledge of the most recent 200 posts, ended up hammering me. do you believe he didn't care? is the statement more likely to be a legitimate explanation of his vote, or is it more likely to be an attempt to keep up his facade of not having read the thread?

(yes, the questions are terribly leading. i'm trying to make a point)

For part a, I think I see what you are getting at. If he is already caught up, his faking that he is not and questioning Kantrip would just be to fake content.

As for part b, I have just gotten to #422, and idk if he really didn't care, it doesn't matter to me, he shouldn't have voted without being aware of the votecount. Regardless of any lingering suspicions of you, I do not think you are the best lynch toDay and its anti-town to be okay with quick lynching someone, especially when he's not even caught up on current events ><

 

[July]

JM, that was a really good argument against me. I'm not gonna try and argue my way out of this scum read of yours, all i have is an excuse. i haven't been that interested in this game. i don't care if you take this excuse or not, I'm just putting it out there.

I really dislike this post, but it's not what I would expect from scum. I would expect defensiveness and at least refuting some of the points, not resigning and moving on. I like some of Jim Morrison's points a lot and I don't think you've played pro-town, but I'm just not convinced this is scum play.

@Sokr: What is the strongest scum read you've had so far this game and what prevented you from voting them?

 

[Kantrip]

Reassessing Sokr. July really is right here. Sokr is playing exactly how he did in Britches and Hose. He is just difficult as town. The whole nonchalant apathy and completely not caring about other's opinions of him is something I recall from past town play. I do not see him playing how he is as scum at all.

Liking July for being willing to go against the grain for legitimate reasons.
I'm calling Sokr bad, unwilling-to-comply town. I still want him to try to cooperate because I have no remorse seeing him go, but I believe he is bored and playing his slot badly.

 

[Kantrip]

Forgot my vote was still on July. It doesn't need to be there.

Unvote

Vote: Rajam

 

[Kantrip]

As scum Sokr would be a lot more scared of making people angry. This is me saying I am pretty sure Sokr is NOT scum. I am opposed to this lynch unless people are damn sure it will yield good information. I could be wrong and Sokr may have just been really bad as scum on facebook, but I can definitely say this is A LOT closer to his [bad] town play than his [bad] scum play.

 

[T-block]

can one of you change your goddamn colour please

 

[July]

How about this: We lynch Sokr toDay, Kantrip drops hammer and in the same post blows up Rajam with his ability? For various reasons, I think it's worth the risk.

I really doubt that there's not a single scumbag between Sokr, Rajam and Kantrip. Rajam's play is 100% unexcusable, Sokr is likely scum and Kantrip's claim is still not confirmed. If it really puts us at mylo toMorrow then eff this game, you can't expect anybody to foresee that kind of ish lol
If Rajam, Kantrip and Sokr are all town ... then we can at least rest assured that keeping them alive would've made the game borderline unwinnable for us anyway. Imho keeping them alive is more dangerous in the long run than getting rid of them soon.

Would rather have the cop clear mentos / July / Asdioh / Ryu / myself than Sokr. Cop needs a couple of people he can trust going into endgame.

@Gheb: Do you believe that if Kantrip's ability is fake/doesn't work, he is definitely scum?

I see where this risk could have some big rewards, but obviously its a big risk and we are putting everything, all of our eggs in one basket based on our D1 reads.

Anyways, that's definitely an extreme situation and assumes Kantrip's ability works, which I'm still skeptical about.

As for the list of possible cop investigations, just remove RR from that list; if he comes up as scum, he's either scum or telling the truth about being miller, and if he comes up town then well...he's lying about being miller, but then he's town lol.

 

[Kantrip]

The cool thing about my ability is if I disagree with the lynch I can totally pretend I'm a governor and just override it. Unless I hit scum.

Rajam over Sokr anyday.

 

[July]

ah nvm I'll say this now:

I'm fine with Gheb's plan. I'm quite sure Sokr will flip scum, but regardless of whatever Sokr flips I know people will be on me later, either for distancing or because I'm scummy -_-. I don't care about dying, I'm a vanilla and with Sokr-almost-sure scum flip + my death will occur several things:

1. We already should know by now that RR is like 99% town
2. Sokr mafia => T-block not mafia. I'm pretty sure they're not both mafia and people will find out anyways on a re-read, since T-block was the first in bringing Sokr being newbscum from nowhere, so it was a legit initiative by T-block
3. If Gheb's case is good enough, then Sokr mafia => Gheb not mafia. I have a town read on Gheb anyways
4. Now, the very reason on which I'm ok with dying, besides of getting rid of a scummy slot, is because with my flip
   both Asdioh and mentos should be cleared as town
   . This is important and I'm emphasizing this because I want to be listened from the tomb; my main goal is to clear those two players, and I don't want people later forgetting this and saying "I think Asdioh/mentos is scum"
   

So, with Sokr scum and Kantrip+me dead, clear players should be RR, Gheb, T-block, Asdioh, mentos, leaving remaining scum between Jim Morrison / asianaussie / Gorf (in that order), then one step below July. This is a cool tradeoff and I'm ok if me+Sokr+Kantrip have to die to clear so many players and reducing the lynch pool significantly.

If people are not convinced that both Asdioh and mentos are town in case I flip town (and T-block flips town <=> Sokr flips scum), they should re-read, from my perspective, the moment when Kantrip claimed and T-block pushed for my death. Asdioh asked if the ability could be used at night, hence asking for a wiser use of the ability and stopping the action, when... he just could've remained silent. mentos basically did the same thing when showing the number analysis

So, remember: Sokr scum =>
1.- T-block town
2.- Jim Morrison scummy just because he has been mad scummy so far
3.- aa scummy for not doing anything, but also because he accused Sokr earlier in a very distancing way (I quoted that earlier)
4.- Gorf and July come next by discard since all the others should be like 95% town at least. I think July is townier though so that's why I put her a step below

That first paragraph is painfully scummy, but not as scummy as you being willing to clear both Asdioh and mentos on a Sokr town flip based on their question about if Kantrip's ability can be used at night/advice on not to use it during the Day. I do think that what they did is pro-town, but there is no way to clear them based off that.

Also please explain the Jim Morrison is scummy "Just because he has been mad scummy so far" read?

Also tbh I forgot that Gorf is in this game, is he v/la?

 

[July]

Ohhh my god Asdioh now I know how it feels for others when I post walls, I'll get to your post tomorrow.

Reassessing Sokr. July really is right here. Sokr is playing exactly how he did in Britches and Hose. He is just difficult as town. The whole nonchalant apathy and completely not caring about other's opinions of him is something I recall from past town play. I do not see him playing how he is as scum at all.

Liking July for being willing to go against the grain for legitimate reasons.
I'm calling Sokr bad, unwilling-to-comply town. I still want him to try to cooperate because I have no remorse seeing him go, but I believe he is bored and playing his slot badly.

I absolutely agree with the bolded:

The cool thing about my ability is if I disagree with the lynch I can totally pretend I'm a governor and just override it. Unless I hit scum.

Rajam over Sokr anyday.

And this.

Vote: Rajam

 

[Jim Morrison]

Jim Morrison
kinda on page 9 and haven't written anything about him yet... time to say "I like him" without justification! Just look at his avatar!
also this is a blatant towntell:

I feel kinda left out :'(

 

[Jim Morrison]

jim, have you played with rajam before? whether you have or haven't, tell me what you know about him.

Nope, never played with him before, all I know about him is that he was scum in Fire & Lightning where he did the exact same thing of lagging behind constantly, which is why I'd be very happy to lynch him as well.

i'd also like to know your reasoning for asking this question:

Because I want Sokr or Rajam lynched and want to know who's down with the crowd.