[WA] Perth Smash Thread

[Pete278]

Anyone got any problems with the stagelist?

 

[Muzga]

Anyone got any problems with the stagelist?

Yeah you have bad taste in stages
But why not pull out all the stops and add big blue to the list? It IS a viable stage isnt it pete?

 

[Pete278]

Anyone who's good at the game got any problems with the stage list?

 

[Trillest]

tbh i dont think you should be charging entry money for that stage list, how bout the winner gets to start in a game of munchkins

 

[Muzga]

Anyone who's good at the game got any problems with the stage list?

Yeah it sucks captain benchmark
Pretend your opinions matter more please
EDIT: You suck at taking feedback. If you dont want it then dont ask for it

 

[Technodeath]

i dont like hanenbow, **** that **** off

 

[Pete278]

I may turn Hanenbow off because Andy's Samus may be too good with it legal.

EDIT: Andre, be a bit easier to troll, please. U mad?

 

[Vlade]

At least I don't have too much to catch up on while I didn't have power on my laptop :D

 

[MTGod]

Wow, check out all the Perth tournaments :D

 

[Mic_128]

Where? What'd I miss? Stagelist?

Man, I really isolated myself during thsi assignment v.v

 

[MTGod]

Check the tournament post 128 ^^

 

[Bsrk_]

Sorry Pete but your list is unacceptable_ I fail to see why it is necessary to allow stages that have otherwise been banned in previous tournaments for obvious reasons_ Keeping a set list of stages across te board is a much more prefferable choice for tournaments otherwise you cause confusion and unecessary debate over something that has oterwise been accepted by the community_

I can understand your choice to attempt making oter stages viable but those stages have been banned for a reason and going into this discussion again is futile_ The starters here once a problem which has found a comfortable solution, now leading to an overall agreeable stage selection list which is deemed as fairer and much more viable than previous iterations_

I won't be attening your tournament as I'll be busy, but personally wouldn't pay to use your suggested stage list_

 

[Pete278]

And yet you either haven't tried the majority of those stages in a competitive environment, or had them banned for a reason that was unacceptable? Change to improve variety isn't bad by default on a small-scale stage like this, and if people did the same thing you're doing now to Trav's tournaments (which are attempting to improve variety), then the stagelist would've stagnated down to a 3-starter list. Could you provide an argument for the stages you find least acceptable? I will, of course, remove any stages with proper backing.

 

[Sinz]

Hey guys, just dropping in to say hello to Caotic and Micky

 

[Hobobloke]

I was on TeamSpeak with Pete when he made the list and personally found no problem with it. I may even adopt it for my next tournament (you know I love trying new things). If you're violently opposed to something then bring forth the points why it should be banned, if you can prove it comprehensively it will most likely be removed otherwise if that does not convince me then abuse it in tournament to the point where I can no longer maintain it should be legal. Remember the burden of proof is upon those wanting to ban something not keep it.

 

[luke_atyeo]

ahh so nice and peaceful around here without gaylzi

oi alzi, if you agree that you're gay and should have your name changed to gaylzi, dont post untill at least tomorrow


if you guys want feedback from people who arnt involved in your smash scene and therefore have no real reason to give their opinion, post up this allerged 'stupid' stagelist

 

[Hobobloke]

Starter:
Final Destination
Battlefield
Yoshi's Island (Brawl)
Smashville
Lylat Cruise
Pokemon Stadium 1
Halberd

Counterpicks:
Brinstar
Castle Siege
Delfino Plaza
Distant Planet
Frigate Orpheon
Green Greens
Hanenbow
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokemon Stadium 2
Port Town Aero Dive
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Melee)

 

[luke_atyeo]

ahh I can see the reason for all the debate... some intresting choices there

 

[Hobobloke]

The idea was to try out all the stages that are often seen to be on the borderline.

 

[luke_atyeo]

that is a good idea, and I can apprciate the thought behind it, however the counter argument of course, is that that idea has been tried out the world over and they've all come to the same conclusion more or less.

yoshi's island (pipes) has never been borderling though, green greens promotes heavy camping and the explosive blocks (and normal ones that you can hit and survive where you would normally have died) are a level of unpredictable luck that adds too much random chance to matches, the apples are the same, but to less of an extent, port town aero dive is too disruptive, again the cars and stage changing (wrong place at the wrong time can easily get you killed) add too much random chance

luigi's mansion has a whole page full of unfair tactics and advantages, although if not abused its not really that bad of a stage, norfair same thing

 

[Hobobloke]

Counter/Banned

Norfair (0-16-10)
Luigi's Mansion (0-11-8)
Distant Planet (0-15-11)
Green Greens (0-6-9)
Yoshi's Island [Melee] (0-10-19)
Port Town Aero Dive (0-12-23)

 

[Pete278]

Pipes was voted counterpick/borderline in the last stage vote, and therefore is borderline. Promoting heavy camping is not a bad thing, as camping/turtling isn't the devil, and is simply the antithesis to rushdown. Not all stages have to be rushdown-favouring, and if FD is banned, the options aren't too wide for non-projectile based camping strategies, which is a bad thing, even if it may make the game more exciting to observers. I don't think Port Town is really viable either, but its worth giving it a shot.

For the last bit, define 'unfair'.

 

[luke_atyeo]

a 0 to high %/death combo

 

[Pete278]

Is it unfair if both players can do it?

 

[luke_atyeo]

no, but that doesnt mean anything

 

[Pete278]

It means that if both characters can do the 'unfair' actions, then they aren't unfair. Majority of characters can abuse the solid floor in Luigi's and the ledges on Norfair, and the ones that can't are already unviable.

 

[luke_atyeo]

you misunderstand, it doesnt mean anything in that its not a solution to the problem, saying that unfair actions arent unfair because the other player 'can' do them (read: just so happens to pick the same character) is silly.

 

[Marteh]

In other news Im here to post

Tails is going to The New Port in fremantle as a going away thing on wednesday, so people who are over 18 should go see him Plus Ill be there!

 

[Hobobloke]

*Grumbles*

 

[Braddles]

il try to make an appearance wednesday =) and Jesse if ur up north anytime during the week im keen for a hit hey

 

[Bsrk_]

Luke has made pretty clear a few arguments that do not need repeating_ I'm in agreement with him on this topic and thanks for clarifying it_ As Luke mentioned, I can also appreciate why you are trying this but it won't prove anything except what's already been proven wrong with it_ The stages have been tried, tested and found unsuitable for tournament use_ I wouldn't be against them otherwise_ If you still require evidence i'm sure posts will be dug up and linked on this, although i doubt the discussion should be taken that far_

Marteh when is Tails leaving_?

 

[Pete278]

you misunderstand, it doesnt mean anything in that its not a solution to the problem, saying that unfair actions arent unfair because the other player 'can' do them (read: just so happens to pick the same character) is silly.

Characters that can't combo off the roof (which are really few and far between) can still use the roof to survive alot longer than they would normally. Its not like only one character can abuse the stage.

EDIT: Also, rabble rabble rabble.

 

[luke_atyeo]

I'm talking alittle more generally then abusing the roof on luigi's mansion (although that is one of the problems)

 

[MTGod]

It means that if both characters can do the 'unfair' actions, then they aren't unfair. Majority of characters can abuse the solid floor in Luigi's and the ledges on Norfair, and the ones that can't are already unviable.

Characters that can't combo off the roof (which are really few and far between) can still use the roof to survive alot longer than they would normally. Its not like only one character can abuse the stage.

So make Bridge of Eldin legal - nothing's stopping both players from picking D3 and abusing the walk off... Better yet, make all stages legal; everyone has access to the same character list and are playing on the same stage, so nothing is unfair...

/sarcasm

And also, because characters are "unviable" does that really give you a right to disregard them when making decisions like this??? Doing so will only make these characters more unviable, so you're essentially making the very problem that you complain about regarding Brawl worse...

Anyway, can't come to the New Port - working league that night TELL HIM TO COME TO FOTO ON THURSDAY FOR AT LEAST A COUPLE OF HOURS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GRAAAAAARHHH!!!!

 

[Pete278]

I'm talking alittle more generally then abusing the roof on luigi's mansion (although that is one of the problems)

Then raise some more points. I can't argue against evidence you don't present.

EDIT: At Jesse, the unviable characters I'm talking about are pretty much unsalvageable in their current states, and attempts to save them would weaken the competitive nature of the game. For instance, there's nothing in the game that could let Zelda win a national, and trying to bend the rules to let her so would be futile. Thus, the best course of action for variety would be to increase the stage list without neutralizing the low tiers that are viable, which the stages that I'm in favour of don't do. For instance, Green Greens, being a bad stage for MK, allows alot of low tier characters to actually counterpick against MK, as opposed to before we're they'd be forced to go to a stage which was easily in MK's favour.

 

[Shaya]

Hanenbow is most definitely a banned stage.
For good reason.

Your stage list otherwise is very liberal and if that is what you are aiming for I am all for it.
Overswarm would be proud.

Except for maybe YI Pipes.

And green greens is a mad legit stage, I so want it back as legal in singles

 

[Pete278]

There's a guy I want to play Samus in singles, because its hilarious and timing people out with a bad character is funny. That's mostly why I'm leaving it for testing, since I doubt anyone here has the guts to abuse it and be punched in the gut by Techno.

 

[Shaya]

Thats an extremely bad way to go about things.

Seriously.

 

[Pete278]

All the people who would abuse it probably won't be able to make it, though, and everyone else here plays with a false sense of honour.

EDIT: Plus, it'll probably be proven broken and dropped anyway. I don't exactly plan on keeping it in due to some sort of nostalgic attachment or some such, don't get me wrong.

 

[Tails.]

Hey guys, as Marty has told you all im having a goodbye gathering in fremantle, 7pm at Little creatures then we will hit up newport till late, all of you are welcomed to come itd be awesome to see you all before I head off, if not all the best guys.