VR Training: A Guide To Using Solid Snake

[ErikG]

@ Smashkng:

Yeah, that might be it! Thanks =) Is there some special trick to doing it? I remember doing some testing prior to posting the question, and simply carrying a nade alone didn't seem to work.

I think you just can't fast fall with the nade in hand. If you land normally with a nade in hand, your shield will go up on the frame the mine explodes (powershielding it). If you fast fall, I believe you suffer a few more frames of lag, and will eat the blast.

 

[AvoiD]

Just for some extra info, I think you should add the possible new textures you can download for Snake off the other sites.

And a section that has videos which shows how a top player is supposed to play the matchup correctly, for each character.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

Good idea Kuro, we should also list the stage textures that camouflage Snake's explosives the most

 

[Berserker.]

Thanks for the idea Kuro

Well, you guys can send good videos and I'll see what I can do. I'll take care of the stage and textures

 

[febs]

for follow ups you can add uthrow -> utilt at low percents 0-3
little extra on dtilt
drop nade, pick it up, press and hold bottom left or right on control stick then press A, and youll do a dtilt with a nade in hand!

 

[jpak]

also drop nade pick it up -> up b then you can do an aerial !
febs was my other act,
you can also do that with other things like nanas, and umm small items too prolly like pokeballs
to perform double c4, you must detonate at the instant before 27. pressing downb on the 26th second works well for me
another interesting thing, if a character is hanging on a ledge, if ure below them and jump on their head as if you are foot stooling them, youll get an extra jump/boost as if you foot stooled them, but they will still be on the ledge. this works for all characters but if you use someone like mk or jiggs you can get the extra jump easier
another thing if nikita lands on the mine it will not blow up.
picking up the nade and holding A then doing dsmash on cstick will make it look like ure doing a crouch or uthrow initially but doesn't go all the way
you can ac uair

 

[Berserker.]

What videos do you guys suggest?

I'm having a hard time deciding. Should we have more than one?

Can't we just look at the video thread Yume and Kuro?

 

[Underload]

@berserker01: If you've forgotten, this is supposed to be the new guide for Snake. That deals with his moveset, and the basic things that newcomers need to know about. What you have right now is a huge cluster****, overly complicated, and would just serve as a huge turnoff for new players.

• Take out the entire section that rips off the frame data thread, I stickied that and EY is going to graciously finish everything for us.
• Take out the stage discussion, Mizu wants more traffic to go to his thread.
• Take out the doubles summaries. If it's ever necessary, somebody can make a doubles discussion thread.
• Take out the matchup summaries. I have a thread for that, having two versions is unnecessary and only gives you more work.
• Take out the AT talk, and link it to my guide instead. Quite honestly, the information in my thread is better than what you have here.
• Take out the edgeguarding talk, and link to Sinz's thread instead.

edit: If you decide to ignore what I just said, I'll just barge in and do it myself. I'm completely serious.

 

[Berserker.]

Well that can shorten the thread.

Sure.

I'm still removing things.

Done, how does it look?

 

[Underload]

It's better. There's still some loose fat in places, but I'm not going to control how you write this thread. Good job overall.

 

[Berserker.]

Thanks for the idea.

I'll try skimming through it again to check for corrections

The title changed. Fine with that :O

-----------------------
Time for my opinion:
All I can say is that the day changes in BF. Turns bright to dark. So the camoflauge mine depends on the day in BF.

Morning:

Pros:

- C4s are best placed on the edge if the enemy should be edgeguarded. The better part of the C4 on the edge is that you can detonate it when you want to.

- Land mine is considered to be the most "camouflaged or unseen" in this part of BF.

Cons:

- The problem with the land mine is that you can't see it that well so you might make a mistake of stepping on it.

How to solve these disadvantages:

- Focus on 3 things: The enemy, C4 and the proximity mine (P-mine). It may sound hard but it actually isn't. Have a good memory and be smart. Don't think slow.

Afternoon/Mid:

Pros:

- You can see all your mines and C4s so no worries about hitting yourself

Cons:

- Your enemy can see your C4 and mine too


(I don't really know much about night part )


Things you should know:

- If you are against characters who can bias BF easily (Marth...) you'd have more disadvantages (Vice versa)

- Brightness and darkness can effect these pros and cons.

That's all on what I can throw out

 

[Hyesz]

This was a good read, I found some of the descriptions/names for grenade tricks funny too.

 

[Underload]

It's good to see people are benefiting from the guide. :D Success, Berk, success!

 

[ErikG]

Btw, you should mention somewhere in the projectile spammers or the campers section that Snake's jab (and all of his tilts) cancel out Pikachu's T-jolts.

 

[Berserker.]

Hmmm.... Good point.

I'll add that when I have the time to do it.

 

[-_skinny_-]

*in a sickly voice*
so much information *cough* can't *cough* move...

 

[Berserker.]

*in a sickly voice*
so much information *cough* can't *cough* move...

Just read what you need to read

 

[g2g4gold]

Hey, Berserker! I was reading through the guide, and you mentioned jab to f-tilt. I think this could be for tremendous for me, as every now and then I'll f-tilt on my opponent's shield and there seems to be a lot of ending lag. Sometimes I'll get punished after the first hit of the forward tilt comes out, rather than after it finishes, and there's not a lot I can do about it after the attack's already come out.

My thought process goes as follows, if I can jab first, I strike faster and avoid that bit of ending lag, and if the first one hits I can follow up with the tilt.

Just one catch, on what characters is jab to f-tilt safe? 'Cause I've been checking out a few videos today (as per your advice in the Q+A thread, thanks a ton, thre's some neat stuff out there), and there's definitely a few times when some of the top snakes pull out jab to f-tilt.

Also, about the whole jab to f-tilt combo in general, I was trying to pull it off about half an hour ago and it's a little bit tricky. Common smash literature holds that I jab, press down on the control stick to break the regular three-hit jab stream thing, then f-tilt. This doesn't work too well for me for some reason, am I not doing it fast enough? Sometimes I'll lie down by accident, and no matter what it doesn't come out as fast as it does in this Youtube vid I'm watching.

 

[Berserker.]

If you don't think the second hit is safe then just do the first hit of f-tilt instead and go away from your opponent.

I think Jab--> F-tilt combo is good cause the damage you deal is massive. Or maybe it's cause of the quick movement of jab followed up to the 1st hit of F-tilt which has good hitsun. Using it depends on the situation. There are better options. That's for sure.

Also, you should know that the 3rd jab of the neutral combo is very punishable.

 

[Snake25]

Great.

best guide i've seen so far...

ur right snakes areials r bad

 

[Berserker.]

Important post:

The info I put in the camo section is only my opinion. Maybe you guys can share you opinion?

 

[Mr.Jake and Skate]

This was a great guide for a beginner like myself!

 

[Berserker.]

Just tell me if there is a problem with the guide. If it's too long or whatever

 

[ErikG]

I believe you have the wrong aerials under momentum canceling. Vertically should be a fast falled Uair and horizontally should be an AD.

A possible thing you could do to the guide is using something like VRI, VRII, VRIII, etc... to start each section so someone can quickly ctrl-f their way to that part.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

ff bair is better for vertical actually, it flattens snake out so hes a lil further from the blastzone.

 

[etecoon]

I tested this and uair lets you live like 3-5% longer on average actually, it makes no sense and it shouldn't be but it is...

 

[Berserker.]

I'll try editing the wrong stuff when I have the time

A possible thing you could do to the guide is using something like VRI, VRII, VRIII, etc... to start each section so someone can quickly ctrl-f their way to that part.

I'm working on that.

Can anyone help me on the crouch list?

 

[ODST01]

just do the basic stuff.

 

[ZTD | TECHnology]

ff bair is better for vertical actually, it flattens snake out so hes a lil further from the blastzone.

Very true. I need to use Uair more when knocked horizontally. I have a tendency of using Dair but it works out very well also.

 

[Berserker.]

just do the basic stuff.

What?

Very true. I need to use Uair more when knocked horizontally. I have a tendency of using Dair but it works out very well also.

I also have the habit to use d-air :/

 

[Sync.]

Wait so Uair is for horizontal and Bair for vertical? I'm a little confused now... I've always used Dair for vertical and Uair for horizontal...

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Wait so Uair is for horizontal and Bair for vertical? I'm a little confused now... I've always used Dair for vertical and Uair for horizontal...

Correct. Uair will cause snake's body to line up vertically, while Bair causes his body to line up horizontal.

If you use Bair when snake is taking vertical knockback, he will live a little longer because his body is going parallel to the blastzone at the top of the screen. The same thing holds true when you use Uair when Snake takes horizontal knockback.

You do not want to use Dair at all because of how long the move takes to finish.

 

[Sync.]

Correct. Uair will cause snake's body to line up vertically, while Bair causes his body to line up horizontal.

If you use Bair when snake is taking vertical knockback, he will live a little longer because his body is going parallel to the blastzone at the top of the screen. The same thing holds true when you use Uair when Snake takes horizontal knockback.

You do not want to use Dair at all because of how long the move takes to finish.

Awesome! Thanks I was doing it wrong :/

 

[Berserker.]

You do not want to use Dair at all because of how long the move takes to finish.

Maybe I should give that warning or remove it

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Maybe I should give that warning or remove it

The key is to fast fall an aerial to reduce knockback. Which aerial you do does not matter except the ending lag. Bair/Uair last around 40 frames and have the advantage of being able to make snake's body frame go parallel with the blast zone. Dair is eaisest because you just slam on the c-stick. You can continue to use it, but dair lasts ~50% longer in ending lag. If you and an opponent both got sent flying from a stray grenade (as happens often as a snake main), then you can occasionally die because you cannot react in anyway to escape (i.e. dodge, jump) because you were stuck in a longer animation. For that reason I say you want to avoid dair. Continue using it if you feel it's easier, but bair/uair are statically the best.

 

[Berserker.]

I just have the habit of using d-air to DI.

But I still use b-air but second to the most is d-air.

I have a terrible habit of using f-air sometimes.

 

[alphabattack]

What is a chuckle grenade? The guy uses the term in the different defense tactics for using nades and it makes me cinfused